Back to Black

[Sception]

Wednesday progress

 

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl17_zpsnjc61czn.jpg

 

 

 

Dirge casters recovered.  Painting the panels grey took considerably longer than budgeted, though overall it was still faster than painting the black first and then being careful with the trim.  The vehicles are 'done' (again, tabletop standard, not chosen standard, that will come later) apart from a black wash to add some depth to the back, and maybe picking out the missiles in silver (though I'm not sure on that, haven't decided yet what final color I want them to be).

 

Belakor is... well, he's started.  I have the reikland flesh base coated in a couple thin layers on the areas that I want to do the purple daemonic flesh thing like on parts of the chosen.  Those are his main colors - that purple (with some reddish/pinkish maybe), bleding into black w/ shiney black armored plates.  We'll see.  I'm already very much wishing I had left him separate from his base orb thing way back in the before times when I reposed him.  The purple bits have the most to do - at least five or six different color applications.

 

Right now things are really coming down to the wire.  I'd rate my chances of completion at around 50%, especially since I've been called in to work tomorrow morning.

[Augustus b'Raass]

You shall finish them, or at least call them finished. You've come too far and they're already good enough for most people.

 

Or else I'll call Khorne and have him prank call you by Bloodthirsters for eternity.

[Sception]

The vehicles are maybe good enough already,   The wash into the resexxes won't be more than maybe an hours work, tops.  Frankly, that can be safely left to tomorrow without risk of going over the deadline.  Be'lakor, however, is nowhere near good enough for anybody yet, he's just two solid colors.  Lotsa work to do there, but I can't start yet.  Just got home from work, and I'll need a nap before I'll be functional to paint anything.

[Soldier of Dorn]

So, since the Dreadclaw's out of the bag, can I mention some of the others... ;)

[Sception]

No, because the main other big thing is on hold now, and may not be happening until next years ETL.  There are a few other smaller but quite significant things that I didn't mention to you that may show up before then though.

 

Oh, and I'm done.  Picks to follow shortly.

[Sception]

It is finished.  First, the transports:

 

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl18_zpsogmc57bq.jpg

 

I don't know why I even bothered with the black wash in the recesses, you can't even see it in this picture.  There's some more I'd like to do with these eventually - a couple more color applications, darken the hull a bit, edge highlighting, the fancy flying stand for the claw, but these are certainly tabletop ready, and I'm happy leaving them as they are for the moment.

 

 

 

Of course, that's pretty much unchanged from yesterday.  The real question was Be'lakor.  Again, remember I'm only aiming for tabletop quality here, he's not up to par with the chosen.  After all, I sunk at least 120 hours into them over the course of June and July, while Be'lakor was done in six hours this afternoon / evening.  Still, while I might go back to him in the future, I'm pretyt happy with how he turned out for the moment:

 

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl19_zps0iwn7dbm.jpg

Be'Lakor the Dark Master, with chaos marine for scale

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl20_zpszlvl76kh.jpg

 

Here he is emerging from his orb.  Downright regal, really, though at some point he might get an extra highlight or two on the skin.

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl21_zpspy0eu3qr.jpg

 

A face only a mother could love.

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl24_zpsrspaq9ga.jpg

 

I like how the wing membranes turned out.  Of all the model, that's the bit I'm actually pretty satisfied with.

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl22_zpsj5m20eda.jpg

 

I kind of want to do something more with the sword eventually, particularly the runes, but I'm not sure what yet.

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/etl23_zpsxtaqcxdp.jpg

 

Base is pretty fancy, although the edges of the orb bother me now that I'm looking at them, since without even thinking about it I did that stupid backwards fire thing.  Plus, it's just too much yellow, looking at it now. It lost the smokey/oily/shadowy feel.  So maybe the yellow swirls will be redone in purple or something.  Anyway, it's not terrible at all, but even so the base, more than anything else, will drive me to go back and touch up this model a bit in the future.  For now, however, 'done enough' is done enough.

 

 

 

 

Whoooooooo, that was a nightmare.  Once again, I have defeated my hated rival Forté, although once again the victory is soured by the corners cut to obtain it.  Perhaps next year his defeat will be more definitive.  In the mean time, I have thoroughly hobbied myself out, and will once again be returning to the shadows.

 

 

Though perhaps not for quite so long this time.

 

 

 

 

We'll see.

[Forté]

Well done. Shame about the cut corners (none of which I took :P ) but you've got a lot finished :tu:

[Sception]

Well done. Shame about the cut corners (none of which I took ) but you've got a lot finished

(none of which I took )

I finished the Vindicators a few days back and did them...wait for it...at a more gaming standard than my usual fussy painting.

[Forté]

Did them to gaming standard...dammit.

 

Reckon I made up for it on the Lords though ;)

[Sception]

Oh, certainly, certainly. Just as I did on my beloved chosen.

[Augustus b'Raass]

Congrats mal. And your rivalry with forte is hilarious.

[Midnightmare]

Nice work man, congrats on finishing your ETL. They all turned out great :)

[Forté]

And I've just realised you beat my total. By less than 100 points. But still beat it. That now means I'm going to have to put up with your gloating doesn't it.

[Excessus]

Well, everything looks nice! :)

 

Those chosen are really awesome, and it's always good to see another player with a Dreadclaw, hehe

[heavens henchman]

Awesome Be'Lakor. Reminds me of Diablos from FF8

[Sception]

Awesome Be'Lakor. Reminds me of Diablos from FF8

There's a reason for that.

 

 

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Master_Creatures2_DIABOLOS_zps366e8c7f.jpg

 

 

 

I only repositioned him into a slightly more upright position and added a sword.  If you like him, he's in stock for a reasonable price at toy wiz:

 

http://www.toywiz.com/ffmmc2diabolos.html

 

Although, fair warning, painting over an already painted pvc model isn't the funnest experience, even if the model is cool enough that I still feel it was worth it in this case.

 

 

 

EDIT: also, I still owe this thread some better pictures of the chosen.  I'm going to try to get around to it next week, but no promises.

[heavens henchman]

Sweet baby Jeebus! Thats sooo cool. Thanks for sharing the info! You've  got some really amazing Black Legion, almost tempts me to do some myself. Though I must say my painting is nowhere near your level.

[Sception]

You don't have to paint super well or use tons of layers or whatever to play black legion.  Here's a pretty straight forward tutorial I really like:
 

 
 
 He uses a fair number of highlight layers, especially on the gold, but even before he begins highlighting, you can see that with a clean, careful paint job the model already looks very good.  So yeah, don't be intimidated, just go for it!
 
My own paint scheme is full of compromises (the round eyes I use as legion icons are because I couldn't free hand the standard black legion symbol).  Even if you're just spraying black and picking out silver trim and red eyes (or blue, or whatever), you'll still do fine, and as your skills improve you can go back to add things like edge highlighting.  Just don't add too many different colors.  I used to be concerned about the black and gold/silver paint scheme being too dull, so I added all sorts of color.  Purple soft armor, red-orange eyes, bright red wires, blue power weapons, green plasma coils, etc etc.  It was garish, and ruined the sombre menacing feel that black armor is supposed to have:
 

 
I wish I had picks of my entire old army together, the garish, distracting nature of the too-colorful color scheme really shows better in group shots.  As it is, I'll have to make due with these examples:
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/abaddon01_zpsbb2bcbef.jpg
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/TermNew1.jpg
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/DPClose.jpg
 
And worst of all (at least, worst of all those the examples that I still have pictures for:
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/Mojo.jpg
 
So old!  That is, in fact, a kai gun converion, and the chainsaw arm coming off of the backpack is to represent 'daemonic mutation', back when that was a +1 attack in close combat upgrade.  And the wacky grey/black patterning on the armor was meant to represent 'urban camo', for the 'infiltrate' veteran skill.  This model no longer exists, but it's head has been transplanted onto my warpsmith!  I really should get back to that one day.
 

 
The point isn't that those things were 'badly painted', but rather that a stronger overall effect can be achieved by keeping your overall palatte of colors more limited, which in the process makes your paint scheme faster and easier (or, well, easier at least, painting anything at all takes me forever regardless):
 

 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/Warband03_zps143c6462.jpg
 
The power weapons and plasma coils are red-orange now, just like the eyes.  And the purple used in the soft armor and daemonic flesh is much less saturated (a pastel purplish grey rather than a distractingly strong royal purple).  Even the yellow tassles are more subdued than they used to be.  And the overall look is so much more cohesive!  Wow!  Look how they're actually sombre and menacing now!
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/Warband04_zps88ee5870.jpg
 
You know, I really regret selling that forgefiend.  What was I thinking?  I don't regret or miss the plaguereaper at all, but that fiend....  Oh well.  No sense crying over spilled milk.
 

 
So yeah, the point is, with a paint scheme as dark and dull as the black legion's is by default, a little bit of spot color goes a long, long way.  Get decent at painting the trim, and maybe one spot color, plus maybe some cloth and bone, and you're good.
 
As for the black armor...  Well, the thing that made the biggest difference for me was edge highlighting, and that is a super pain.  I mean, it's totally worth the effort:
 

Old scheme vs. new, showcasing both the more neutral purples I'm using now and the difference edge highlighting makes:
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/csm05_zps41c03270.jpg
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/csm06_zpse1fffd83.jpg
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/csm07_zps4e0bed83.jpg
 
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Malisteen/Black%20Legion/csm08_zps518ccf45.jpg
 
As you can see, I edge hilghilght more than the linked video above does - in particular I hilghlight the inside of the trim, wich is very painful and time consuming, and honestly probably not worth doing.  Edging just the un-trimed black edges is faster, easier, and probably just better altogether.

 
But while edge highlighting makes a big difference, especially with black armor, it's difficult and time consuming to do.  But fortunately, it's also something that you can always leave till later, going back and adding it to models you've already painted once you feel more confident about them.  I mean, that's what I did.
 
 
So, anyway, yeah, don't be intimidated, start a Black Legion army.  Don't wait, don't think about it, close your browser and head to the store to pick up some chaos marines and black and gold paint.  Do it.  DO IT.  DO IT NOW.  GO.  CLOSE YOUR BROWSER AND GO NOW.
 
It is not wise to keep the Despoiler waiting, Heaven's Henchman.

and if the Black Legion isn't black enough for you on its own, the Black Shrine is always looking to spread the faith.

 

[Dragonlover]

Got any tips for converting DV Chosen? I'm planning on making an army out of them, so I need to do a lot of weapon swaps. Even stuff like 'don't bother using model X for a ranged weapon, the angles never work right' will help.

 

Dragonlover

[Forté]

Corner cutter ;)

[Sception]

Corner cutter

I'm sorry, did someone say something? I sometimes find it difficult to make out the jealous bleats of sore losers. t(UmUt)

Got any tips for converting DV Chosen? I'm planning on making an army out of them, so I need to do a lot of weapon swaps. Even stuff like 'don't bother using model X for a ranged weapon, the angles never work right' will help.

For bolter-sized ranged weapons (plasmagun, meltagun, etc), the standard bolter guy is the best bet. You need to replace the left hand - the one cradling the gun - but that's not too big a deal.

More generally, I recommend starting with at least two sets of the DV guys, if not three. Decide which ones you want to keep their heads, and assemble them normally. The rest, cut or dremmel the deads away until you've got a normal style socket to put other heads in first, then assemble.

Because the models are wonkily split over weird pieces, where sometimes part of the trim for one piece ends up on another or whatever, I generally find it works best to assemble the models normally (minus the backpacks, leave those separate), then saw away the arms/shoulder pads you want to mess with with a jewelers saw. For shoulder pads you want to swap out or duplicate, you'll want to separate them completely. This is generally two cuts, one separating the shoulder pad from the body, and then another, somewhat perpendicular cut separating it from the arm (particularly on the holding the bolter guys, where the arm below the pad is still attached to the body. The shoulder & arm will then need to be rebuilt with greenstuff before putting the new shoulder pad on). Take a couple of the more simple shoulder pads (the smooth ones, or with just one or two simple horns that stick more or less straight out, not the complicated ones with faces) to make re-usable molds of for various arm swaps or replacements. This is because, if you look closely at them, the chosen shoulder pads have a very distinctive shape to them, and chaos pads from other models will look wrong. The forearm and knee armour is also unique to the chosen, but this is less noticeable, so I wouldn't worry about it as much.

I recommend buying some 'magic mold' or 'instant mold' or whatever to make the press molds - those clear sticks that become soft when placed in hot water, that you then press a piece into and allow to cool to make greenstuff press molds. Take your liberated shoulder pads, and dremmel the shoulders out of them to leave just the pad - test fit on a normal marine to make sure it will fit on your arm swaps. Once the pads you want to duplicate are free and cleaned, press the soft instant mold around the outside of the pad, and allow that to dry, and then while it's still on there press a new patch to the inside. Once that dries, you should be able to pry the pieces apart and pull the original shoulder pad out.

Make several molds per pad, both to let you make more in a single batch and because it won't be clear until you start using them whether they're any good. Use grey stuff (try gale force nine) instead of green stuff when making your extra shoulder pads. It dries harder, and is easier to clean. If you're like me, you maybe get two or three usable shoulder pads out of each batch of 6 or 8, but so be it.

So you've got your extra shoulder pads, next is replacement arms and heads. I recommend using plastic raptor bits. They don't perfectly match the chosen style, but I find that, apart from the shoulder pads, they're close enough. That gets you sufficiently fancy special weapons, melee arms and helmets. The basic cSM pack can provide some extra holstered pistols or spare bolters if needed. Then just pay attention to what models already have bolters or pistols (holstered or in hand) so that you can add holstered pistols to the ones that need them, and use the chosen packs with the bolters on them for models that aren't carrying those. I mean, if you're being a stickler for wysiwyg, which I kind of am.

The backpacks are especially nice, honestly DV chosen go for pretty cheap (being a starter box unit, and not a very good one on the table), you might consider picking up extra sets just to have the backpacks to use for conversions. Or, if you go in for fancier mold making than I do, you might make molds of the packs to duplicate them as desired, but the magic mold green stuff press molding stuff isn't really sufficient for those kinds of pieces.

In the end, I find swapping the backpacks, heads, shoulder pads, and weapon arms around is enough to get the set up I want and break up the chorus line effect without trying to separate upper from lower torsos swap them around, though I've seen that done too.

As for your specific comment about ranged weapons - chosen breastplates are wider than those of basic chaos marines, and they angle differently - they're wider on bottom than on top, insead of the usual completely vertical / parallel surfaces. Because of this, arms you add from other models will stick out further than they otherwise do (often necessary given the cables that run under the arms on these models), unless you make some modifications to those arms before attaching them.

Either way, though, you're not really going to be able to get the 'two hands holding the bolter/pistol/whatever' pose going without crazy amounts of effort, apart from on the chosen that are already holding their bolters with two hands (and if you look closely, those ones are 'cheating' the cables to do it). So you either use those bodies to hold all of your bolters or special weapons, or you pretty much have to 'true grit' them on other models (ie, have the weapons held one handed like pistols, generally by arms that were otherwise carrying pistols before swapping the weapons out).

I haven't tried to do a chosen heavy weapon yet, but I imagine it would be very difficult. As a Black Legion player, I kind of want to do a couple '5 chosen with one lascannon and nothing else' squads which are... ok on the table. For black legion only. But I have no idea how I'd convert them, and have no desire to convert more of these chosen in general. I might do some alternative arm and weapon options, since several of my models are magnetized, but they were, all in all, a royal pain, and I won't be doing any more whole models this way.

[Dragonlover]

Cheers malisteen, that was pretty much exactly what I was after. I have no problem going 'true grit' with special weapons, so that's fine, and a lot of what you said lined up with how I was planning on doing things anyway. I've got 5 sets to mess around with thanks to a lot of scrounging, so I've got room to mess up.

 

As for heavy weapon Chosen, either the power fist or power axe guys look like your best bet. I'm just skipping that whole concept and jumping to Cyclotrathe Conversion Beamers. Much easier, at least once Subtle Discord gets his cast up.

 

Dragonlover

[Sception]

Yeah, I got a pack of the dark mechanicus tank guy servitors to use their lower torsos with spare forgefiend autocannons to make some rapier platforms, but after seeing discord's designs, I'm waiting for him to put those up for order, and I'll probably use the servitors as the basis for some obliterator conversions instead.

 

Speaking of... Hrm.  I'm starting to recover a bit from ETL burnout, and working on fluff revisions over in the other thread is starting to pick up my 40k spirits a bit (which would otherwise be sinking into a nine month hobby motivation coma.  I kind of want to do some cleanup work on the last ETL vow.  Darken the black down a bit.  Pick out some more highlights.  Fix Be'lakor's base a bit, and paint the flying stand for the dreadclaw.  See if maybe I can order some grey stuff to maybe fix the connector so it will stay on there without gluing it permanently.  And after that... I don't know?  I have a couple different projects I'd like to work on for this warband.  Then again, classes are starting soon....

[Forté]

Nice write up on the DV Chosen. Been trying to work out gun swaps on the Bolter ones :tu:

[Augustus b'Raass]

Nice DV Chosen tut, mal. 

 

Also:

Hidden Content

And I've just realised you beat my total. By less than 100 points. But still beat it. That now means

I'm going to have to put up with your gloating doesn't it?

Can't wait for that!