== Martian Death Ray Club ==

[Slips]

Variable Strength could be the better option and not too finicky since you can only ever have one on a Warlord. However, I'd possibly make the Ap 1/2/3

 

S:D With Volkite gets wonky with deflagrate in the mix and makes us, like in the case of the Ultra-Dense Beam, have to come up with a special and specific wording for how to resolve it that starts to weigh things down; especially when you get into the realm of "Does every wound caused by a D Hit trigger deflagrate?"

 

Its why I'd Rather S10 as a cap for Volkite.

 

So, we could drop it down to: S10/8/6 Ap1/2/3, Apocalyptic Blast (10"), Primary Weapon 1, Deflagrate, Ignores Cover, Armourbane

 

With the 5" Center Marker being S10 Ap1, 7" Ring S8 Ap2, 10" Ring S6 Ap3

 

Possibly with the stipulation that Deflagrate  Wounds cannot spillover to units outside the final placement of the Template and/or Super-Heavies/Gargantuans being hit D6 times by the weapon.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[Shaolin_Monkey]

Variable Strength could be the better option and not too finicky since you can only ever have one on a Warlord. However, I'd possibly make the Ap 1/2/3

 

S:D With Volkite gets wonky with deflagrate in the mix and makes us, like in the case of the Ultra-Dense Beam, have to come up with a special and specific wording for how to resolve it that starts to weigh things down; especially when you get into the realm of "Does every wound caused by a D Hit trigger deflagrate?"

 

Its why I'd Rather S10 as a cap for Volkite.

 

So, we could drop it down to: S10/8/6 Ap1/2/3, Apocalyptic Blast (15"), Primary Weapon 1, Deflagrate, Ignores Cover, Armourbane

 

With the 5" Center Marker being S10 Ap1, 10" Ring S8 Ap2, 15" Ring S6 Ap3

 

Possibly with the stipulation that Deflagrate Wounds cannot spillover to units outside the final placement of the Template and/or Super-Heavies/Gargantuans being hit D6 times by the weapon.

Great points on the Str:D and a good reason to avoid it for Volkites. Agree completely.

 

Typically the Apocalyptic blast is just the 10" template that has the 5" and 7" rings on it as well isn't it? Making it into a 15" and bigger blast will definitely make it finicky as there is no standard blast marker to cover it. Would need to individually measure each model from centre of blast.

 

Stipulating models outside the blast can't be hurt is on a similar vein to stipulating how D & Deflagrate combine. Best to avoid I feel.

That said depending on how many hits we are proposing (started at 5, 3 been thrown around) and with the lowered Str/AP it doesn't feel too out of place for Apocalypse battles. It SHOULD be able to wipe squads off the board after all.

[Slips]

Hmmmm thought it was 15" for some reason. Screw that business then! 5"/7"/10" is better.

 

Edited Previous post for it; Kinda want to keep Primary Weapon 5 though...

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[Olis]

Current stats:

 

 

Beam Mode (Demi-Carronade):            Range: 24" - 100"    Strength: 10    AP: 1   Type:  Primary Weapon 1, Deflagrate, Haywire, Ignores Cover, Ultra Heavy Beam

Eye of the Emperor mode (Eradicator): Range: 24" - 100"     Strength: 10    AP: 1   Type:  Primary Weapon 5, Deflagrate, Ignores Cover, Armourbane, 7" Apocalypse Blast

 

* May only take one per Warlord Titan

 

Proposed changes:

 

 

Beam Mode (Demi-Carronade):             Range: 24" - 72"     Strength: 10          AP: 1         Type:  Primary Weapon 1, Deflagrate, Haywire, Ignores Cover, Ultra Heavy Beam

Eye of the Emperor mode (Eradicator):  Range: 24" - 72"     Strength: 10/8/6    AP: 1/2/3   Type:  Primary Weapon 2, Deflagrate, Ignores Cover, Armourbane, 10" Apocalyptic Blast

 

* May only take one per Warlord Titan

 

Do we want Primary Weapon 1 or 3? I have 1 in the stats atm because 3 15" Apoc Blasts seems a little... overkill.

 

Changes applied.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Olis

[Slips]

Yeah, no, drop it to 10" Maybe Primary Weapon 2?

 

...Still want PW 5 though since its supposed to be an Eraser-of-a-gun.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[Shaolin_Monkey]

It needs to be Primary Weapon 1 just because the wording meaning how many shots it fires and you don't want it to be able shoot more than once a turn. Then you just give it a "Concentrated Beam" special rule that mentions how many times a model under the template is auto hit which is still floating between 3 & 5

[Slips]

Sure, Concentrated Beam making every model under the template get hit [3-5] times would work.

 

...and give us another Beam Rule...

 

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[GhostMalone]

What if you did Str and hots on percentage of the unit covered the more models under the template the more devastating the effect.

 

This would make it not worth firing at say a 5 man support Squad but those 20 man despoilers or 10 man terminator squads just got priority to turn to ash?

[Shaolin_Monkey]

Yeah, no, drop it to 10" Maybe Primary Weapon 2?

 

...Still want PW 5 though since its supposed to be an Eraser-of-a-gun.

Just still feels too overkill a bit. Something in the middle will get 5 auto hits at 10/1 and then if they survive 5 more of the same. Vehicles will all get 5 auto hits at 10/1 with Armourbane..... It may as well just be a Str:D "remove under the template" run of the mill kind of weapon then.

[binary]

Since we're going with the 10" rather than the 15" why don't we make it primary 2?

And while we're at it, would primary 2 mean 2 separate templates or 2 hits for everyone under the template?

[Olis]

Post tweaked.

 

What if you did Str and hots on percentage of the unit covered the more models under the template the more devastating the effect.

This would make it not worth firing at say a 5 man support Squad but those 20 man despoilers or 10 man terminator squads just got priority to turn to ash?

 

I'll be honest, that sounds like too much work for your average player. We don't want them to be math hammering for each shot made.

[Shaolin_Monkey]

Since we're going with the 10" rather than the 15" why don't we make it primary 2?

And while we're at it, would primary 2 mean 2 separate templates or 2 hits for everyone under the template?

2 seperate templates which is what id like to avoid. Rather a rule saying they all get hit X times. Firing it multiples seems harsh and doesn't fit with the "Focussed Death Ray" fire type.

[Slips]

 

Yeah, no, drop it to 10" Maybe Primary Weapon 2?

 

...Still want PW 5 though since its supposed to be an Eraser-of-a-gun.

Just still feels too overkill a bit. Something in the middle will get 5 auto hits at 10/1 and then if they survive 5 more of the same. Vehicles will all get 5 auto hits at 10/1 with Armourbane..... It may as well just be a Str:D "remove under the template" run of the mill kind of weapon then.

 

It is a Warlord gun though.

 

I dont expect a vehicle that isnt a larger Super-Heavy or Titan to survive.

 

Would be pretty wonky if a Rhino survived through whatever means outside of rolling 1's for days.

 

That and you can only ever have 1 on a Warlord Chassis which is already going to be a gigantic target.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[Shaolin_Monkey]

A thought. Is this gun going to be a single barrel? Or a multi barrel Death Ray of Doom?

 

If the latter then using the Apoc Barrage rule could work better and allow it to be a Primary Weapon 5 weapon without the varied Str/AP.

[Slips]

I kinda went that route with the Reaver Version.

So we could just upscale that...

[Olis]

A thought. Is this gun going to be a single barrel? Or a multi barrel Death Ray of Doom?

 

If the latter then using the Apoc Barrage rule could work better and allow it to be a Primary Weapon 5 weapon without the varied Str/AP.

 

I was picturing it as an enlarged Carronade, so one barrel, imo.

[Shaolin_Monkey]

 

 

 

Yeah, no, drop it to 10" Maybe Primary Weapon 2?

 

...Still want PW 5 though since its supposed to be an Eraser-of-a-gun.

Just still feels too overkill a bit. Something in the middle will get 5 auto hits at 10/1 and then if they survive 5 more of the same. Vehicles will all get 5 auto hits at 10/1 with Armourbane..... It may as well just be a Str:D "remove under the template" run of the mill kind of weapon then.

It is a Warlord gun though.

 

I dont expect a vehicle that isnt a larger Super-Heavy or Titan to survive.

 

Would be pretty wonky if a Rhino survived through whatever means outside of rolling 1's for days.

 

That and you can only ever have 1 on a Warlord Chassis which is already going to be a gigantic target.

Even rolling 1s that rhinos days are numbered. its gets penetrated on a double 1 and will be wrecked at a minimum from three hits due to hull points.

[Shaolin_Monkey]

It's also at a point where if you compare it to say the Mori Quake Cannon (another Apocalyptoc Blast warlord weapon) there isn't really any reason not to take this one, it's vastly superior even before factoring in the alternate fire mode.

[Slips]

Rhino was possibly a poor example since it is paper-armored and we're talking Titan Guns.

 

The Mori Quake Cannon has the benefit of 360" of Range and on the Apoc Tables I play, 100" isn't enough sometimes...

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[binary]

I think it should be a multi barrel in the style

of the colombiad, so the barrage template would be a better fit. Though could we use the rules we've got and the 10" template for the beam, and the barrage template shape for the focused?

Keep it primary weapon 1 and add "deathray X" where X is the number of hits each model takes.

[Shaolin_Monkey]

Rhino was possibly a poor example since it is paper-armored and we're talking Titan Guns.

 

The Mori Quake Cannon has the benefit of 360" of Range and on the Apoc Tables I play, 100" isn't enough sometimes...

True enough. But that is one small benefit over a vast amount of negatives. And this is without the alternate Beam firing mode too don't forget.

I think it should be a multi barrel in the style

of the colombiad, so the barrage template would be a better fit. Though could we use the rules we've got and the 10" template for the beam, and the barrage template shape for the focused?

Keep it primary weapon 1 and add "deathray X" where X is the number of hits each model takes.

10" template for the beam and a "death ray X" rule is wayyyy overkill I feel. It's basically then a "remove that half the board" option.

[GhostMalone]

Post tweaked.

 

 

What if you did Str and hots on percentage of the unit covered the more models under the template the more devastating the effect.

 

This would make it not worth firing at say a 5 man support Squad but those 20 man despoilers or 10 man terminator squads just got priority to turn to ash?

I'll be honest, that sounds like too much work for your average player. We don't want them to be math hammering for each shot made.

Fair enough I just like the idea of not needing multiple templates and just going on a 25/50/75/100 ruling.

 

That way as slips mentioned about Tanks it could be a concentrated pulse of choom to take out vehicles, im looking at this as a really intense concentrated microwave beam so in theory the more direct the more damage.

 

But that's only how I'm looking at it, game wise you guys seem to gave it close to balanced

[Shaolin_Monkey]

And as for the rhino being paper armoured if it's a 5 hit weapon then a Land Raider only fails to get at least glanced 3 out of 36 times (1.1,1.2,2.1) with five hits meaning it's pretty well just wrecked regardless of rolling. Same would go for pretty well any non super heavy vehicle due to Armourbane and high Str.

 

Not saying it can't be 5 hits but if so it needs a large points hike.

 

Post tweaked.

 

 

What if you did Str and hots on percentage of the unit covered the more models under the template the more devastating the effect.

 

This would make it not worth firing at say a 5 man support Squad but those 20 man despoilers or 10 man terminator squads just got priority to turn to ash?

I'll be honest, that sounds like too much work for your average player. We don't want them to be math hammering for each shot made.

Fair enough I just like the idea of not needing multiple templates and just going on a 25/50/75/100 ruling.

 

That way as slips mentioned about Tanks it could be a concentrated pulse of choom to take out vehicles, im looking at this as a really intense concentrated microwave beam so in theory the more direct the more damage.

 

But that's only how I'm looking at it, game wise you guys seem to gave it close to balanced

The benefit of the Apocalyptic Blast type is that it is only one template, it just has three rings each one closer to the centre receiving more damage output.

[Slips]

Beam should be kept as-is.

 

Might just make the concentrated beam/barrage/bombardment S9 Ap1 Apocaplytic Barrage, Primary Weapon 5, Deflagrate, Ignores Cover, Armourbane for simplicity's sake.

 

Either you vape a singe straight line, or you nuke a concentrated area.

 

Have Range of Concentrated be: 24-84"

 

Have Range of Beam be:  24-96"

 

Still, a Warlord is already in the Range of 3k+ points and I did state that this thing would add on ~200+ to be taken. Land Raiders would also get nuked, true, but a Flare Shielded Spartan would turn that S10 Blast (if its not barrage) so S8 A1 Armourbane if it gets caught just right and might actually survive.

Edited March 28, 2016 by Slipstreams

[Shaolin_Monkey]

Beam should be kept as-is.

 

Might just make the concentrated beam/barrage/bombardment S9 Ap1 Apocaplytic Barrage, Primary Weapon 5, Deflagrate, Ignores Cover, Armourbane for simplicity's sake.

 

Either you vape a singe straight line, or you nuke a concentrated area.

 

Have Range of Concentrated be: 24-84"

 

Have Range of Beam be: 24-94"

 

Still, a Warlord is already in the Range of 3k+ points and I did state that this thing would add on ~200+ to be taken. Land Raiders would also get nuked, true, but a Flare Shielded Spartan would turn that S10 Blast (if its not barrage) so S8 A1 Armourbane if it gets caught just right and might actually survive.

All fair points. Maybe just leave it at the Apoc blast as above with varying Str/AP make it auto hit 5 times at +200 pts and see how it goes in some play testing. Given that only the inner 5" ring is at Str10/AP1 it may not actually be that bad in game as it seems.