Today, the rage stole my sanity !

[Frater Antodeniel]

Ok, i just stopped by the New..etc sub-forums, and readed about the "War Zone Damocles" book.

 

I can only say that GW really hate us, i can feel the work put for the RG and WS (they waited for this rightfull love and i'm happy for them), while i can now clearly feel the DISDAIN put in both the BA: Codex and the Shield of Baal : Exterminatus supplement.

 

I create this topic, for those of our brothers, including myself who would rage and cry into the vacuum of this topic, dedicated to rage-things. (This way, we will not rage on any other topics). Feel yourself at home brother and unleash your rage if you feel the need to do so.

 

Ha and of course, RG and WS have access to 12 Relics....6 of their own and 6 of the SM : Codex. (Can my Blood Angels Captain have the Eternal Warrior/Adamantium Will/3++ Storm Shield ? Oh no, GW know that the Blood Angels never participated at the Battle of Terra...).

[Jolemai]

Seriously, calm down, log off and grab a beer.

[Visitor13]

Seriously, calm down, log off and grab a beer.

 

You might also want to grab Lemartes, just in case.

[Frater Antodeniel]

Jolemai, i never dring alcoohol, i have witnessed the ravage it can do and the drug that it can easily become. So no beer^^, i choose blood !

 

For the Lemartes grap, i think that could be a dangerous idea, since he is not really sane either^^.

 

And for the subjet, i came to compare The White Scars and the Blood Angels, for the two are Assault Legion :

 

Blood Angels : Furious Charge

 

White Scars : Hit And Run, +1 Jinks save when riding bike and +1str of HoW (if my memory is good)

 

Just the Furious Rage vs Hit and Run make me laught, for the two rules are so unbalanced, how can i even compare a weak vs a strong rule....

 

 

Edit : I looked more carefully at the WS relics, for quite the same price as our "honor Edge" the WS got :

 

- S:+3/+1* AP:2/3* Melee, Master-crafted

 

* The Glaive of Vengeance has two profiles for both Strength and AP. The first is used only on a turn in which the bearer charged; the second is used at all other times.

 

VS

 

AP2 Melee "Honor Edge"

 

For 30 points, WS captain/Chapter Master, on foot/bike, can have a nasty blade (And with Hit and Run...putting down even Dante in some fashion), that bring our "Dishonored Edge" that is 20 points to shame. I think i will go painting, better for me to not looking to much on the WS relics/chapters traits/formation buff...etc....

[Jolemai]

All the same, I'm sure you understood my point. Coming onto an internet forum and having a moan is unproductive at best and antagonising at worst. Oh, and typing expletives with asterisks in place of the vowels is against the rules, hence my comment about editting your reply in the NR&A forum...

 

Our Codex is approximately a year old. At the time we had capitalised on the earlier releases of C:GK and C:SW to bring us in line with the current standard, remove the Wardisms and better yet, given sixteen Formations to play around with as GW were experimenting with campaigns and whatnot. Whilst not perfect, arguably we were in a good place.

 

However, like the Dark Angels before us, we were used as a test bed for Formations (meaning things were obviously going to get better further down the line) and this, coupled with a design change (i.e. the Decurion style army build) has left us behind. Yes we have lost out on some buffs (notably the Tactical Doctrines) and some freebies but that doesn't in any way, shape or form mean GW hate us.

 

We were never going to be out and out OP. Never going to get to the point where we only needed tweaking going forwards; things will improve eventually and there's no need to be envious over the current books. I really don't see the point.

[Frater Antodeniel]

Their is one thing that i envious about :

 

The Relics and Chapters Doctrines ==> Explanation ===> I always play using the Flesh Tearers Detachment, 3/4 using Seth as LoW within. And when i want to choose relics, well, i can only say that my apothecary is perma-immune to poison and have a good relic bolter. But this two relics apart, nothing, the relic for the Dreadnought is off-game and is purposely created for the unique Supplement campaign. (But most of the time i use the Blood Angels relics).

 

Why did GW didn't give the Flesh Tearers 6 REAL relics, what hold their hand from doing it ? We already have 2 real relics, usefull in many situation, even for the Poison-immune armour...that is quite restrictive and could have been 2+....

 

And the Chapters Doctrines already existed when the Blood Angels Codex and Flesh Tearers detachment were publish, so why deny us Two chapters doctrines ?

 

Was it really hard to wrote "Blood Angels Chapters Doctrine : Blah Blah Blah.... Furious Charge special rule + "XYZ"special rule" and "Flesh Tearers Chapters Doctrine : Blah Blah Blah.... Rage special rule, or +1 attack if already under rage effect" ?

 

I think that there is two explanation :

 

GW teams actually lack of vision/ideas for Blood Angels....that can happen...maybe they don't know what kind of rule/ advantage could fit the Blood Angels and successors without un-balancing the whole game....maybe they fear for rhino becoming assault vehicles....

 

GW teams made the Blood Angels codex/ Exterminatus supplement kickly without taking care of what they were working on...

[Xenith]

Get a grip.

 

Go to the chaos forums, and then you'll feel happy with what you have right now.

 

If the rules really, really mean than much to you, then use the other rules with your Blood Angels.

 

The WS rules could very easily represent the Blood Angels 8th company, or a bike mounted tactical company.

 

GW Didnt "deny" us anything. They gave us exactly what they wanted to give us at the time. It's just now, they decided to give codex marines a lot more.

 

And why not? 3rd ed SM were pointess to play, as BA were them plus 100, same in 5th ed.

[Jolemai]

We got six Relics in our campaign book, however, it was a 50:50 split between that and the Archangels. The campaign book wasn't C:FT, it was a book focused on all of our Chapters, hence the focus not being solely on the Flesh Tearers. Conversely, as already mentioned, this was arguably a test bed for forthcoming campaign books; perhaps if we'd have the release now we'd see more or perhaps if GW focused on a campaign that was all about the Flesh Tearers then you would.

 

At least you're not a Lamenters player. What did they get? See C:BA for your rules.

 

As for why we got what we got and why, say Salamanders, got their unique rule plus the Doctrines is anyone's guess but this is likely down to the design change as it fitted well with the Gladius set up. Certainly us receiving FC is more in line with what C:GK and C:SW have - which was the design process at the time.

 

Finally, a see little point in trying to second guess reasons as to why we got what we got. Productive is forming a rules errata, getting to community to contribute and posting it to GW when all avenues have been explored. Imagining negative explanations as to why a publication a year later is better than mine isn't.

[Frater Antodeniel]

You know what Jolemai ? i will continue working on the Errata, even if it is a vain effort, a pointless one, since GW team clearly disdain the player community/custommers, but i will persist in the effort...lamenting like a lamenters about the inequality that our brotherhood is victim, and hope for better days.

 

(Edit : I stil thinks that a Raging Topic is a good idea for people to cry into the void.)

[SnorriSnorrison]

Mate, at the time published, our rules were dope and a serious improvement over the 5th edition codex. What's been the problem is that the codex was written for 6th edition, and not 6 months later, the new SM codex came around with a new edition and we were thrown back to the state the 5th edition codex used to be in 6th edition.

 

I know that I like to whine here and there about how we're supposed to have better rules representing our chapter on the tabletop, but then I'm German, that's what we do - complain about first world problems. All in all, the codex was solid. It's just a sad joke that GW published it when the rules it was written for were to be changed again soon.

 

Maybe take the advice of Jolemai, and grab a cold beer(of proper size, perhaps a litre) and chill. Have some fast food, watch the footie and remember that it's a game of plastic miniatures after all(that's coming from me haha :D), lest the rage might actually take you. ;)

 

 

Snorri

[Xenith]

 

 

(Edit : I stil thinks that a Raging Topic is a good idea for people to cry into the void.)

 

Well, so far it's just you ;)

[Phiasco]

 

 

 

 

(Edit : I stil thinks that a Raging Topic is a good idea for people to cry into the void.)

Well, so far it's just you ;)

Actually, I find this to be a fairly healthy idea. We're all going to have frustrating, irritating, RAGE inducing days. Having a place to go vent doesn't seem like bad thing. Personally I feel that same frustration, like we all do, at GW for their horrendous practices. Their stupid way of releasing rules and models is designed pure and simply for profit. GW would have us look to, and buy, other rules sets, other models, etc, while waiting for blood angels to be viable, dare I say even fun?, to play again. Now that I've got that off my chest I can browse and comment in other threads with that much more enjoyment having vented my irritation.

[Arkangilos]

But that's not what we do, Phiasco. We keep it bottled up, inside. We fight the rage, and fight letting go of it. For to do so would be to lose ourselves completely. Do you want to think you are Sanguinius fighting Horus and just murder everything? NO! You want to keep yourself in check! 

[Aqui]

(Edit : I stil thinks that a Raging Topic is a good idea for people to cry into the void.)

Well, so far it's just you

Actually, I find this to be a fairly healthy idea. We're all going to have frustrating, irritating, RAGE inducing days. Having a place to go vent doesn't seem like bad thing. Personally I feel that same frustration, like we all do, at GW for their horrendous practices. Their stupid way of releasing rules and models is designed pure and simply for profit. GW would have us look to, and buy, other rules sets, other models, etc, while waiting for blood angels to be viable, dare I say even fun?, to play again. Now that I've got that off my chest I can browse and comment in other threads with that much more enjoyment having vented my irritation.

There was once such a topic in the Chaos forums. It was closed for a good reason. And there hasn't been such a topic in any forum since because of it.

I don't have any authority here in the BA forums, but I don't see a topic like that being likely.

[Terrahawk]

That's classic GW for you. However it is nothing personal, they just have a habit of changing design direction on the fly, causing discrepancies in army books. This is most obvious when comparing different Marine codices.

But rather than focus on what we don't have, I recommend focusing on what we do have. What other Marine Chapters have access to in no way invalidates the stuff we have. Perhaps we are not the most tournament-friendly Chapter at the moment, but we have a lot of cool stuff that we can claim our own. The novelty value of the new Marine rules will wear off within a a month or two.

And anyways, as long as we have the fracking Death Company I don't care how much slinking in the shadows the birds do, or how many motorcycle stunts the Scars try to do.

[Phiasco]

But that's not what we do, Phiasco. We keep it bottled up, inside. We fight the rage, and fight letting go of it. For to do so would be to lose ourselves completely. Do you want to think you are Sanguinius fighting Horus and just murder everything? NO! You want to keep yourself in check! 

 

I literally laughed out loud at this. Thank you for giving me a laugh and a smile today :)

[Morticon]

*peeks mod head in to check on Rage*

[Arkangilos]

*peeks mod head in to check on Rage*

We should call our mods Wardens or Chaplains now.

[Servant of Dante]

I vote reclusiarchs for mods

[CaptainHelion]

We already have a Reclusiarch, and he's unconnected to the Mods Team.

[LutherMax]

Mods should be Chapter Masters :)

[Sans Mercy]

Sanguinius stepped up to Horus knowing it wouldn't be a fair fight, and that he'd die in battle. Such is our our cross to bear these days.


Now if you'll excuse me, I've got some Eldar Xenos to make extinct.


* I can agree to a lot of recent developments being infuriating, FC on Dreads instead of 4 base attacks being one of them, and the flat-out refusal to release any errata being another.

[Omega-soul]

I fell into  black rage after eldars came in, and  theni was  dead  at SM release.

 

Now I just watch at measly 30pt cost for  a banner that make every frecking space  marine  a bloodangel in12inch. with fleet.

 

So it's all your cost folks - 30pts.

 

SM  vanguard  now  can charge after deep strike with options for no scatter - Archange-hucking-what-you-say?

If only game designer team could see  that SM vanguards could charge after deepstike... oh wait our vanguards done that before.

 

I  clearly see that our 7 ed. codex  was written for 6 edition, but had delayed. And then they look up - hey we have semi-sm codex - let's try new  formation things - and we can see - that "new" teminators  is the old space hulk bits, and new tactical squad is modified death company/SG kit. If you look at photo of BA units (baal predator with THAT gaps!!) you'll see that it  was made in big hurry.

And  the final - point prices  - codex made in 6ed SM-era, equalised for 6-th edition, not 7th which came out just after 6th month!

 

As for me - I would better played with 5 edtion codex with ridiculous prices -  but at least with uniqe competetive  rule-set!

 

And our  "artifacts" in Exterminatus - is a junk even playing with a tyranid player.

t4 HQ Model in 3+ ignoring  poison it's not even funny

[The4thHorseman]

I fell into  black rage after eldars came in, and  theni was  dead  at SM release.

 

Now I just watch at measly 30pt cost for  a banner that make every frecking space  marine  a bloodangel in12inch. with fleet.

 

So it's all your cost folks - 30pts.

 

SM  vanguard  now  can charge after deep strike with options for no scatter - Archange-hucking-what-you-say?

If only game designer team could see  that SM vanguards could charge after deepstike... oh wait our vanguards done that before.

 

I  clearly see that our 7 ed. codex  was written for 6 edition, but had delayed. And then they look up - hey we have semi-sm codex - let's try new  formation things - and we can see - that "new" teminators  is the old space hulk bits, and new tactical squad is modified death company/SG kit. If you look at photo of BA units (baal predator with THAT gaps!!) you'll see that it  was made in big hurry.

And  the final - point prices  - codex made in 6ed SM-era, equalised for 6-th edition, not 7th which came out just after 6th month!

 

As for me - I would better played with 5 edtion codex with ridiculous prices -  but at least with uniqe competetive  rule-set!

 

Pretty much it the nail on the head. So it seems that we can all agree on one aspect or another that given the current state of play we have the short end of the stick. So lets be postive. One way is to make our stick longer by tying a bunch of other sticks to it.

 

I tried the Shadowstrike Kill team formation from the Ravenguard, the one where vanguard charges from DS, paired that with Blood Angels CAD and a Sang Priest and it actully didn't do half bad, Barely made it at 800 pts but I feel theres room to improve.

 

So lets find ways to synergse with the new units and formations while we wait for an 8th ed Pure BA list to be competitive.

 

Maybe a Tactic Post like we have for BA Units, but with Pairing other SM Formations and Chapter Tactics?

[Frater Antodeniel]

RAGE OF THE DAY :

 

I DEFY ANYONE : When comparing the Kauyon book and the SoB book, i defy anyone to say that the same amount of work have been put into the two. Such a thing is for me impossible to imagine. The New Kauyon book is clearly a finished product while the SoB is only 75 %....but they are at the same price...

 

By Comparing the difference of treatment between WS/RG and Flesh Tearers/Blood Angels, i can easily argue the those of GW that made the rules parts of the book clearly wanted to do something else....it is the kind of unfinished work that i hate in worklife. When you work on something, then at least you try to do something good, even if you dislike what you do.

 

I'm Enraged !