Rabidbunneh Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I've got two, they are by no means unusable. The Saggitarum could really do with one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted March 7, 2017 Author Share Posted March 7, 2017 Yeah I wouldn't go that far! They're still a great unit and provide a few cool things for the army: Firepower: While the Basic Blaze Cannon is a little lacking compared to other arms in the Custodes arsenal, it's by no means a bad gun. As is the Lastrum. BS5 TL guns do not often miss. And with AP1 and 2 respectively, you have a really good shot at murdering lighter vehicles, something this can easily get to the juicy side armour of thanks to... Maneuverability: Deep Strike & Outflank built in. Plus it's Fast and a Skimmer. You can go pretty much anywhere, anytime you want. Defenses: What essentially amounts to a (front on) Flying Land Raider for 75% of the cost. With a bigger(?) body to block line of sight to other units or hold choke points. Also Melta-bomb/ Chainfist resistant thanks to Grav Backwash! I'd actually say the fact they aren't an assault vehicle is what balances them - they'd probably have to be at least double the cost for that luxury. Pop some Saggitarum inside, go for that 2nd Turn Outflank/ Deep Strike into a good position and unleash hell, setting up a solid Firebase in your opponents deployment. Sulemain, Withershadow and Black_out 3 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightwrench Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 In both of my games I wish I had one to re-deploy. After deep striking have to retreat to get other objectives was a long process that I couldn't achieve before the game ended. Grant you it ended on turn 5. It is better armed and armored than a predator. Infiltrating one potentially gives you side armor shots on a squadron of Medusas. Black_out 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black_out Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 How do you guys think it would fare with a unit of firepike terminators? Fly up to an objective in terrain, dump out termies, pour on some hellfire and clear the objective. Or are Aquilon better suited to DS/infiltrate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baluc Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I can't think of a scoring unit, that Guardians cannot handle on the charge. Firepikes just like all custodes want to be infiltrating. The way to beat custodes is the same way to win wit custodes. Managing the number of turns that custodes are doing damage. Deep Strike, Reserves, Transports all limit the amount of time your dudes are doing damage. You want 3 infantry units you infiltrate, maybe a 4th you deep strike if you feel you need 4 units, the rest should be jetbikes, and vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baluc Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I can't think of a scoring unit, that Guardians cannot handle on the charge. Firepikes just like all custodes want to be infiltrating. The way to beat custodes is the same way to win wit custodes. Managing the number of turns that custodes are doing damage. Deep Strike, Reserves, Transports all limit the amount of time your dudes are doing damage. You want 3 infantry units you infiltrate, maybe a 4th you deep strike if you feel you need 4 units, the rest should be jetbikes, and vehicles. Basically did this list in 5 minutes on the train to work. Shield Captain Tribune w/ Paragon Spear, Arae-shrikes, Cyber Familiar, Digital Lasers, Praesidium Shield Hetaeron Guard Squad 3x HG w/ Praesidum Shield, Paragon Blade 1x HG w/ Praesidium Shield, Power Gauntlet Arae-Shrikes Guard Squad w/ Arae-Shrikes, 2x Adrasite, 1x Pyrithite Guard Squad w/ Arae-Shrikes, 2x Adrasite, 1x Pyrithite Sentinel Squad w/ Arae Shrikes, Teleport Tansponders, 2x Power Gauntlet Agamatus Jetbike Sqd w/ 3x TL Corve Las-pulser Agamatus Jetbike Sqd w/ 3x TL Corve Las-pulser Caladius Grav-Tank w/ Arachnus Heave Blaze Cannon LoW: Sub-Orbital Wing Primaris Lightning Gw/ Ground Tracking Auguries, Battle Servitor, 2x Kraken Penetrators Its 2363 so still room to play with and optimize, and its already perfectly capable of dismantling my 2.5 SW list I spent 3 weeks tuning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellex_The_Thanatar Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 Can custodes take a sub orbital strike wing? Doesn't that need to be available to the army that takes it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkimaskMohawk Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 Right now RAW, they can't. Their only LOW option seems to be the Psy Titan. There's a lot of things missing from the Talons list, especially like their place on the allies matrix/who can take them, LoW access...wargear profiles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellex_The_Thanatar Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 They can take knights though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkimaskMohawk Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 Uhh, what type of knights are we talking here? Actually, it doesn't really matter, because RAW (thank you terrible inferno editing) they don't have a spot on the ally matrix or a faction designation. This means (RAW once again) you can't ally anything to them since they don't exist on the matrix, and they're not Loyalist so you can't put Knight Errants in the list either. This can be solved with some rather logical house rules that infer their intended place (as in, agents of the emperor). It just gets more and more disappointing on how badly written the Talons list is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellex_The_Thanatar Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I thought knights had their own allying matrix where they can go traitor or loyal regardless of what army in age of darkness they ally with. Could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em_en_oh_pee Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 Considering taking the plunge here because an elite, small-number army with a few vehicles sounds fun to paint. Also, they are "good guys" - which I could use since my primary are Night Lords. Here was my jumping off point: HQ: Tribune Praesidium Shield, Digital Lasers, Cyber-Familiar, Paragon Spear, Arae-Shrikes [277] Elites: (4) Hetaeron Guard 2x Paragon Blades, 1x Solerite Gauntlet, 3x Shields, Magisterium vexilla & Sentinel Warblade, Arae-Shrikes Coronus Grav-carrier Armored Ceramite [528] Troops: (3) Sentinel Guard Squad (Tribune) Solerite Gauntlet Coronus Grav-Carrier [350] x3 Fast Attack: (3) Agamatus Jetbike Squadron Corvae Las-Pulsar [250] (3) Agamatus Jetbike Squadron Corvae Las-Pulsar [250] Heavy: Caladius Grav-Tank Armored Ceramite [215] x3 [3000] I know it isn't exciting or all that interesting... but it is all the stuff from them I like. I have just shy of 15 bodies - so modelling wise I can put some time into each. Though yes, a bit spammy. :/ Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkimaskMohawk Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I thought knights had their own allying matrix where they can go traitor or loyal regardless of what army in age of darkness they ally with. Could be wrong. For either you need to be actively included in the wally matrix somehow. Questoris Knights count as mechanicum so you'd need to line up with them or have an Agent designation. Knights Errant are Agents of the Emperor, so they necessitate a Faction of Loyalist to take. Somehow they missed rules for any of this in Inferno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withershadow Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I know the Sagittarum are viewed as the red-headed stepchildren of the list, but are they actually pretty decent when deep striking with the transport? The S5 effective AP2 shots are good for dealing with Javelins and Rhinos, and then they are positioned aggressively for mowing down infantry and light vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purge the Daemon Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 (edited) I know the Sagittarum are viewed as the red-headed stepchildren of the list, but are they actually pretty decent when deep striking with the transport? The S5 effective AP2 shots are good for dealing with Javelins and Rhinos, and then they are positioned aggressively for mowing down infantry and light vehicles. But why not just take guardians with adrathic spears? Same points cost far better melee and can score. Edited March 8, 2017 by Purge the Daemon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellex_The_Thanatar Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I mean...I know heavy bolters are not godlike but a unit of sagittarum infiltrated on a flank can engage threats from quite a range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withershadow Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I know the Sagittarum are viewed as the red-headed stepchildren of the list, but are they actually pretty decent when deep striking with the transport? The S5 effective AP2 shots are good for dealing with Javelins and Rhinos, and then they are positioned aggressively for mowing down infantry and light vehicles. But why not just take guardians with adrathic spears? Same points cost far better melee and can score. Adrathic spears don't mow down infantry (at least at range :P). Plus trying to tone down the list where possible and you do get an adrathic weapon in the squad on the banner bearer. However you're right, for throwing them in the middle of the enemy, Guardians are probably a better bet, and the Sagittarum are better coming in on the flank or infiltrating into position as a firebase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purge the Daemon Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 I know the Sagittarum are viewed as the red-headed stepchildren of the list, but are they actually pretty decent when deep striking with the transport? The S5 effective AP2 shots are good for dealing with Javelins and Rhinos, and then they are positioned aggressively for mowing down infantry and light vehicles.But why not just take guardians with adrathic spears? Same points cost far better melee and can score.Adrathic spears don't mow down infantry (at least at range :P). Plus trying to tone down the list where possible and you do get an adrathic weapon in the squad on the banner bearer. However you're right, for throwing them in the middle of the enemy, Guardians are probably a better bet, and the Sagittarum are better coming in on the flank or infiltrating into position as a firebase. I honestly don't think they are bad and they are the best units custodes have for fighting militia and warp cults. I just don't know if those armies are a big enough part of the meta to include them. I feel most of the time they will be shooting the adrathic bit anyways, which is unfortunate. Though if there are ever great crusadexperience OrKS they defintely can make a bigger appearance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellex_The_Thanatar Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Daemons are going to get wrecked by then too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted March 8, 2017 Author Share Posted March 8, 2017 I know the Sagittarum are viewed as the red-headed stepchildren of the list, but are they actually pretty decent when deep striking with the transport? The S5 effective AP2 shots are good for dealing with Javelins and Rhinos, and then they are positioned aggressively for mowing down infantry and light vehicles. But why not just take guardians with adrathic spears? Same points cost far better melee and can score. Because the Saggitarum look INCREDIBLE. IronDrake28 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabidbunneh Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 They do look pretty badass. Surely the terminators are our answer to Cults? Infiltrate and burn the masses and s10 to punch through the armour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raktra Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 They're great at it, I think the issue is just that they can only be in so many places at once. Though a couple of three-man units wouldn't break the bank I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChainMachete Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 They're great at it, I think the issue is just that they can only be in so many places at once. Though a couple of three-man units wouldn't break the bank I suppose. Biggest problem with the Terminators is that they are competing with the Hetaeron Guard and the Achillus Dreadnought for slots. And Oblivion Knights once their transport comes out. Won't stop me getting a unit if the models look any good though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted March 8, 2017 Author Share Posted March 8, 2017 Four Elite slots is workable, I'm still under the impression that the Dread getting Deep Strike from Valdor is iffy so it's quite hard to use and keep alive as is, so TDA are probably the way forward. Don't really see the point of the Elite Sisters - they don't offer much over the troops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purge the Daemon Posted March 8, 2017 Share Posted March 8, 2017 Four Elite slots is workable, I'm still under the impression that the Dread getting Deep Strike from Valdor is iffy so it's quite hard to use and keep alive as is, so TDA are probably the way forward. Don't really see the point of the Elite Sisters - they don't offer much over the troops. The elitend sisters wrestling good stuff they have all the addition psychic null rules and with the queen ws5 is nice. But yeah the dreads don't seem really easy to use as I don't believe they deepstrike. Though if they do mane it where they want to go they do unholy loads of destruction . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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