Horus Heresy releases we know about but what next?

[bluntblade]

Drawing blood is a fine achievement, I'd say, considering some descriptions we get of Primarchs just shredding even elite formations.

[b1soul]

Yeah...10 AL almost killed Roboute in the same book

[Legatus]

Forget the Space Wolves, they have been completely and utterly screwed in this series to the point they are no longer salvagable. I don't want to see more of them unless Abnett writes it, which isn't very likely. I'd much rather see legions we haven't heard from for quite some time like DG, SoH, IW etc.

But just about every legion also has awesome moments and actual victories that they can point to. The Wolves have none of that.

Well, not every Legion has awesome moments.

Get back to me when the Space Wolves' one big victory of the Heresy got turned into a success for the other side. When Leman Russ is repeatedly hospitalized by lower class opponents, like a squad of Iron Warriors or something. When for the remainder of the Heresy the Wolves are described as not just ineffective but counterproductive to the Imperial effort. When Leman Russ is given some silly and senseless nickname, such as "Mysterious Son" becuase he never told anyone about the Wulfen, and that nickname is used in earnest by other characters from that point on. And when BL has turned the Space Wolves into what their haters had allways accused them of being, rather than of how their fans had liked them.

And then, to top it all off, maybe Forgeworld will describe their totally ineffective combat doctrines. Perhaps they will tell us that the Space Wolves were such a small Legion and had such a low number of compliances because they allways suffered the most casualties out of all the Legions, and that most of their biggest victories were won when another Legion was present to help out. Maybe their one "exemplary battle" in the Forgeworld treatment will then describe how the Space Wolves were almost beaten back by the human resistance on a world they tried to conquer, but then the Dark Angels arrived to save them.

When BL and FW have done all that to your Legion and Primarch then you can come back and complain that the Space Wolves are not treated that well. Until then you can enjoy the Legion's newly gained status as the most brutal and feared out of all the Legions.

[bluntblade]

I'm actually at a loss to work out which Legion you're comparing against the Wolves.

[Runefyre]

I'm actually at a loss to work out which Legion you're comparing against the Wolves.

Same. and ironically enough a crazy amount of what Legatus described has happened to the Wolves

In Unremembered Empire, the SW watch pack was positively heroic when it faced Curze...no sarcasm on my part

I rooted for them 100% and they acquitted themselves as well as a hamdful of SM could against a primarch

While that may be true, what was the true point of the Watch-packs then? It's not like they even remotely helped warn the Emperor of signs of betrayal. I honestly don't know what purpose BL had in mind when they created them. The stated description doesn't match what actually happens at all.

[Legatus]

Huh, considering how many threads got shut down as soon as I started rambling about the treatment of my favourite Legion I thought people were more aware of that issue. But then perhaps my perception was a bit subjective. Admittedly I in turn do not pay as much attention how other Legions such as the Iron Warriors or the White Scars are portrayed, and am heavily focused on my own favourite most of the time.

 

I didn't want to go into specific descriptions of my favourite Legion's portrayal because that might make people nervous again, so perhaps just be assured that the Space Wolves are not treated worst out of all the loyal Legions.

[HeritorA]

I think Graham McNeill coined the idea of the wolves here because of his old studio ties, so maybe he's writing it.

Nope - he spend a lot of time trying to finish Crimson King. It's humanly and LOL (league of fething legends) impossible for him to write another book so quickly.

I'd suggested elsewhere I think 43 and 46 should have really awesome covers with great titles and subtitles, but with the content completely absent. Just well made, but blank, 400page hardback notebooks.

Deliberately blank so you can add in your own HH content.

Amazing idea - just imagine 400 pages of your Beta-Garmont, Lunar Bases, Yarant, Solar System

'I didn't want to go into specific descriptions of my favourite Legion's portrayal because that might make people nervous again, so perhaps just be assured that the Space Wolves are not treated worst out of all the loyal Legions.' - ohhhhh Legatus you can't even imagine how right you are

[Marshal Rohr]

I don't think any legion has be portrayed in a way that their old guard fans have liked with the exceptions of all the ADB Legions and Alphas.

[Legatus]

That is probably true. I suspect that perhaps BL is intentionally dumping on the loyalists for the majority of the Heresy so that their eventual comeback will be all the more climactic. A few years ago A D-B had hinted that in one of the BL meetings supposedly some future major awesome moment for the Ultramarines had been discussed (and that he would have loved to have been picked to write about that, but someone else was). I am still waiting for that, and am curious what that might be.

[Marshal Rohr]

I believe it's called the Scouring, when the Ultras singlehanded save the Imperium ;)

[IronDrake28]

That is probably true. I suspect that perhaps BL is intentionally dumping on the loyalists for the majority of the Heresy so that their eventual comeback will be all the more climactic. A few years ago A D-B had hinted that in one of the BL meetings supposedly some future major awesome moment for the Ultramarines had been discussed (and that he would have loved to have been picked to write about that, but someone else was). I am still waiting for that, and am curious what that might be.

Know No Fear was pretty awesome. :P

 

Maybe it was Imperium Secundus they were alluding to?

[Legatus]

God, I hope not.

[b1soul]

When Leman Russ is repeatedly hospitalized by lower class opponents, like a squad of Iron Warriors or something.

What? Get outta here...

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

 

When Leman Russ is repeatedly hospitalized by lower class opponents, like a squad of Iron Warriors or something.

What? Get outta here...

Legs is referring to Unremembered Empire when 10 Alpha Legion assassains pose as Thiel+friends and get the drop on an unarmed, unarmored Guilliman

[Mellow]

Considering some Primarchs can be shot and not seem to notice their wounds I would say 10 Astartes almost severely hurting Guilliman is a bit ... odd.

[Runefyre]

Considering some Primarchs can be shot and not seem to notice their wounds I would say 10 Astartes almost severely hurting Guilliman is a bit ... odd.

Primarch power levels change drastically from book to book and author to author. That said Guilliman wasn't wearing armour at the time yet he still got off pretty good imo.

 

And honestly I'm not sure why Legatus thinks that his chosen legion (Ultramarines apparently) are treated poorly (especially when compared to the Wolves or Raven Guard). I love the imperium secondus arc, and a huge Ultramarine fan too boot. I think given the circumstances Guilliman was in he did what was best. If he's talking about a different legion then I apologize.

[Legatus]

Legs is referring to Unremembered Empire when 10 Alpha Legion assassains pose as Thiel+friends and get the drop on an unarmed, unarmored Guilliman

 

And before that in 'Know No Fear' Guilliman is psi-slapped around and brought to his knees by Kor Phaeron. But when the latter has him on the ground and the opportunity to kill a primarchs with his cursed blade he hesitates. Kor Phaeron figures that it might be much more of a triumpth to turn Guilliman instead of killing him, and starts to try to talk him into it. That gives Guilliman the opportunity to come back and take him out.

 

Then in 'Betrayer' Guilliman wasn't really doing too well fighting against Lorgar. Eventualls Angron joins in, and I am not complaining that Guilliman loses against him, but before that it was a pretty even fight against Lorgar. Lorgar.

 

Then we come to 'Unremembered Empire', where Guilliman is hospitalized by a squad of Alpha Legionnaries, while Curze in a mirrored encounter effortlessly dispatches a squad of Space Wolves. Guilliman was unarmed and unarmoured, but somehow that is not much of a relief, after his portrayed performance in the earlier mentioned books.

 

 

And honestly I'm not sure why Legatus thinks that his chosen legion (Ultramarines apparently) are treated poorly (especially when compared to the Wolves or Raven Guard).

 

I would love go and list all the slights against the Ultramarines corresponding to the list of hypothetical Space Wolves slights I had proposed earlier, but that would absolutely derail this thread and get it closed. Suffice it to say they were treated extremely poorly in 'Know No Fear', 'Betrayer' and the 'Imperium Secundus' plot in general, and then the Forgeworld treatment in their 5th Horus Heresy volume 'Tempest' was absolutely atrocious. (Though the Space Wolves have not had their FW treatment yet, so that might be disappointing as well.)

 

But as I said earlier, perhaps the loyalists in general are up to this point fare poorly on purpose, to then make a glorious comeback at the end of the series (though that wouldn't explain the poor FW treatment). There is still the hope that some "awesome moment" for the Ultramarines is coming up as the series continues.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Legs actually made an important point:

 

"absolutely derail this thread and get it closed."

 

I'm as guilty as anybody, so let's try to stay on topic now

[Legatus]

I tried to twist it into the OP direction, even though I couldn't resist replying to the tangent of particular Legion treatment. What will the Horus Heresy series bring in the future? Hopefully the Space Wolves will get their moment just as much as the other Legions. Canonically their next known engagement is liberating beset Imperial worlds on the journey back to Terra. Their biggest "awesome" moment only really comes during the Scouring, where they pursue the traitors into the very Eye of Terror. I wonder if BL will include the Scouring period, as it is somewhat anticlimactic. Though that is of course where the Ultramarines shine as well.

[bluntblade]

Can I just point out that by Betrayer, Lorgar is not the same man who took such a mauling from Corvus? He does endure a direct plasma hit from a Titan, after all.

 

If anything, Guilliman does seriously well in that book. Takes out the WB flagship, his forces nearly take the Conqueror and having fought Lorgar, he retreats with dignity when Angron goes full daemon.

[deepsix81]

There's some artwork for Binaric Succession in the 2017 Horus Heresy calendar. This may be one of the unnamed mystery novels. As an aside, this may be one the handful of best cover pieces I've seen. Sorry, can't post because I'm an idiot.

[DukeLeto69]

There's some artwork for Binaric Succession in the 2017 Horus Heresy calendar. This may be one of the unnamed mystery novels. As an aside, this may be one the handful of best cover pieces I've seen. Sorry, can't post because I'm an idiot.

No this is an audio drama. It is in the coming soon section on Blacklibrary.com

[HeritorA]

I believe it's called the Scouring, when the Ultras singlehanded save the Imperium

Heretek!

When Leman Russ is repeatedly hospitalized by lower class opponents, like a squad of Iron Warriors or something.

What? Get outta here...

Brother :)

Can I just point out that by Betrayer, Lorgar is not the same man who took such a mauling from Corvus? He does endure a direct plasma hit from a Titan, after all.

If anything, Guilliman does seriously well in that book. Takes out the WB flagship, his forces nearly take the Conqueror and having fought Lorgar, he retreats with dignity when Angron goes full daemon.

Losing more than a dozen capital ships of the line with SM on board (they weren;t able to deploy) in the process. And achieving what? Nothing. Seriously well is totally overrated here.

There's some artwork for Binaric Succession in the 2017 Horus Heresy calendar. This may be one of the unnamed mystery novels. As an aside, this may be one the handful of best cover pieces I've seen. Sorry, can't post because I'm an idiot.

Tis an audio drama for March release - it is already on pre-order.

[Taliesin]

From reading Laurie's interview at Track of Words, it is interesting that when asked about upcoming things, he mentions not just Ruinstorm and Old Earth, but also that the Space Wolves are taking a real sidestory now which we 'll see , and he also mentions the continuation of the Jaghatai Khan storyline.

 

Though I would doubt that Wraight has another White Scars novel coming up soon.

[Wulfburk]

I guess the Scars for now have teammed up with the Imperial Fists and will have something that portrays their coordinated defence of the solar system or raids out of it here and there and linking up with the ending of Ruinstorm with the Blood Angels arriving. I certainly want to see Dorn and the Khan working together!