++ The Bringers of Despair - A Black Legion Community ++

[Sception]

Big obsec tzeentch termi block with coven attached for mobility and a challenge blocking beatstick lord / abaddon?

[Sception]

Looking through the Black Legion formations in the traitors hate book, they are all copy-paste from the supplement.  No changes or updates at all.

[Midnightmare]

Yeah, I think that was always going to be the case. I do find it funny that the Tormented is not part of the Decurion? No great loss I guess. The fact we gained anything at all was a surprise to me. Genuinely gappy about the Troop Terminators and the über Hatred.

 

Also, as my book has not arrived yet :( , I take it the Black Legion Warband is not ObSec?

 

Also, any new fluff at all?

[Judgethunder]

Yeah, I think that was always going to be the case. I do find it funny that the Tormented is not part of the Decurion? No great loss I guess. The fact we gained anything at all was a surprise to me. Genuinely gappy about the Troop Terminators and the über Hatred.

 

Also, as my book has not arrived yet , I take it the Black Legion Warband is not ObSec?

 

Also, any new fluff at all?

 

They aren't obsec, but we get our other benefits.

 

The Hounds of Abbadon is also a Core choice.. 

[Midnightmare]

The Hounds I quite like, I think it may work well with first turn deep strikes of the Speartip. I use a lot of MoK anyway. Unless I am going to be trying that, I think I will be using a Black Crusade Warband or straight up CAD.

 

Still looking forward to getting my book though!

 

Also, and I notice this with the Black Legion paperback supplement, Spineshiver Blade now Spineshard Blade? I had thought it was a typo last time :D

[Dallas Drake]

From a competitive point of view not having obsec on the warband kinda sucks. I can't see much use for the CSMs it forces us to take. Add to that need for bikes/raptors & helbrutes/havocs and it all feels a bit meh to me. Sure, the lords terminators will DS in turn 1 and they might get to re-roll 1s but I'm not sold that it's worth it.

Hounds is less of an investment but I don't own any Berzerkers and don't want to, so it looks like a CAD is the best bet. A CAD with terminators as troops might work although I'm envious of what death guard got, relentless, fearless marines & havocs with fnp look a super cool idea.

[Midnightmare]

I think everyone is a bit envious of the Death Guard. Well apart from that smell.....

 

You are right on with the cheaper investment on the Hounds - I only have one squad of 'zerks but that will surface - it's just hard for me to look past ObSec bikes/havocs/Abaddon etc of the Warband in a world full of ObSec Demi Co. and the boon thing is pretty decent.

 

EDIT - I should add, I am thinking of using some sort of Terminator list also, led by the Despoiler himself, using a CAD, just haven't decided on specifics yet. Mostly for a fun project as I have been enjoying painting my Terminators for the Call of Chaos.

 

EDIT 2 - I NEED TO FINISH MY CALL!!!

[Dyemor]

Am I right in thinking that the Chaos Bikers in the Hounds of Abaddon can't make use of the Let Slip the Hounds rule?

I've put a query up on the 40k Facebook page. It seems like the intention is that they can turbo boost then charge, which would be great, but it specifically says RUN. 

[Midnightmare]

I would say no, RAW. However an FAQ may reveal otherwise if they ever do one? Got a link to your FB query?

 

It would be pretty good if true, really

[Dyemor]

I think this takes you to it. It's just a comment on the announcement page: https://www.facebook.com/1575682476085719/photos/a.1576243776029589.1073741828.1575682476085719/1736383660015599/?type=3&theater

 

Like the comment if you can so it get's more attention.

 

Yeah, if it works, it would turn a fairly ok formation into something pretty awesome. You would have a CSM and Bezerker tax, but 3 unit's of bikers with a Juggalord moving 24" then charging would be really strong.

Couple it with a Raptor Talon doing turn 1 charges and some terminators, it would be a lot of fun.

[Midnightmare]

I think this takes you to it. It's just a comment on the announcement page: https://www.facebook.com/1575682476085719/photos/a.1576243776029589.1073741828.1575682476085719/1736383660015599/?type=3&theater

 

Like the comment if you can so it get's more attention.

 

Yeah, if it works, it would turn a fairly ok formation into something pretty awesome. You would have a CSM and Bezerker tax, but 3 unit's of bikers with a Juggalord moving 24" then charging would be really strong.

 

Couple it with a Raptor Talon doing turn 1 charges and some terminators, it would be a lot of fun.

Done and commented

 

I would love to see this true, I use Khorne Bikers anyway and the free MoK is good, turbosboost then charge would be awesomez! The marine/Berzerker tax is not to bad really due to the small numbers, Raptor Talon and Termies would make it really fun

[Sception]

Remember that the run & charge can't be done first turn anyway, and bikes generally don't need the extra movement to charge on the second turn, so I don't consider it that big a deal either way.  Regardless, I expect the answer will be 'no', but it would be nice to get clarification.

[Dyemor]

Ah... well spotted, you can't use the Let Slip the Hounds rule first turn. Never mind :)

[Sception]

@Insane_Psychopath:  Please update my warband's entry in the first post roster.  The Chaos Lord's name is Hamal Vhilgraf, and the link should point to my warband's fluff thread rather than the outdated hobby thread:  http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/283056-the-black-shrine-homebrew-fluff/

 

...............

 

Alright, trying to throw together a list highlighting the first turn deep strike from the speartip formation.  Here's the best I've come up with so far:

 

Core: Hounds of Abaddon

Lord, MoK(free), axe of blind fury, sigil, juggernaut

5 Bikes, MoK(free), icon of wrath, 2x meltagun, combi melta & power fist on champ

5 Berserkers, icon of wrath, combi melta and lighting claw on champ, rhino with dirge & dozer

5 CSMs, MoK(free), icon of wrath, meltagun, combi melta and lightning claw champ, rhino w/ dirge & dozer

 

Aux: Raptor Talon

Lord, MoN, jump pack(free), power fist, lightning claw, sigil

5 warp talons

5 raptors, 2x meltagun, champ with combi melta, lightning claw, meltabombs

5 raptors, 2x meltagun, champ with combi melta, lightning claw, meltabombs

 

Aux: Terminator Annihilation Force

Sorcerer, MoTz, lv3, spell familiar, terminator armor (free), combi bolter, force axe, last memory

3 terminators, 3x combi melta, 2x power axe, fist on the champ

3 terminators, 3x combi melta, 2x power axe, fist on the champ

3 terminators, 3x combi melta, 2x power axe, fist on the champ

 

Warlord is whichever of the jump lord & termi sorcerer you want to guarantee a first turn deep strike on

Total: unless I'm messing up somewhere, 1850 on the nose

 

 

Thoughts/suggestions?

[Dyemor]

I like that.

My friend plays an Imperial Fist list which often has a ton of Landspeeder Storm's which mess with the deep strike, but apart from that list, it looks like a lot of fun :)

[Midnightmare]

I like it, it's the sort of thing i have been thinking and I would enjoy playing. I would possibly put combi-plasma on at least one squad of Terminators as you have a lot of melta, though that is personal preference :)

 

I was also thinking of fitting in an Aegis Line with a comms relay, though you would probably have to tone down your Sorcerer to afford it and he looks so damn fun! That is one of the main problems with the CSM formations, they usually need an HQ.

 

But yeah, I like this list a lot, Mal :tu:

 

EDIT - Insane Psychopath - my boss man has been retconned back to a Lord, he becomes a Daemon Prince during the Black Crusade (as in, not happened yet) :)

 

Khargor Bane, the Fell Reaver of Makan, Lord of the Black Harbingers

 

Cheers!

[Dallas Drake]

With Hatred (everyone) the Hand of Darkness becomes An option IMO. If you stuck it on your Raptor Lord he could really threaten MCs turn 1. Plus it's pseudo (better) powerfist - Sx2, armourbane/fleshbane.

[Judgethunder]

Hold up why can't I let slip my bikes? Because they aren't infantry?

[Midnightmare]

Unfortunately, bikes can't 'run' :(

[Iron-Daemon Forge]

List updated to this point, if there any mistake or missed out anything please let me know.

[Gosford]

Here's my Hounds of Abaddon list I've been working on.

 

COMMAND

Khorne DP - Power Armour, Wings, Black Mace, Gift, MoK

 

CORE

Hounds of Abaddon

Chaos Lord - Gift, MoK, Juggernaut, Axe of Blind Fury, MB's, Sigil

03 Chaos Bikers - MoK

01 Biker Champion - Gift, PF

 

09 CSM - MoK, Plasma Gun, Meltagun, 

01 Champ - Gift, MB's, PF

Rhino - Dirge Caster, Dozer Blades, Combi-plasma

 

07 Khorne Berzerkers - x7 Chainaxes

01 Zerker Champ - Gift, MB's, PF, PP

Rhino - Dirge Caster, Dozer Blade

 

AUXILIARY

Raptor Talon

Chaos Lord - JP, MoK, Spinshiver Blade, BP, MB's, Sigil

 

07 Raptors - MoK, x2 Meltagun

01 Raptor Champ - Gift, PF

 

07 Raptors - MoK, x2 Meltagun

01 Raptor Champ - Gift, PF

 

07 Warp Talons - MoK

01 Talon Champ 

 

-------

2000

[Sception]

Are you absolutely committed to MoK on everything?  Remember, Black Legion are one of only two legions with the freedom to bring whatever mix of alignments they feel like.  In particular, we are renowned for bringing out the right specialists for any job.  The 'right' specialist for mace prince is nurgle, and the 'right' specialist for raptor talon is really anything but khorne, given that, if everything goes right, they'll be making disordered charges the turn they deep strike and thus won't benefit from Rage.  That said, theme and aesthetics can't be disregarded, if not for that we'd all be playing Death Guard, if we were playing CSMs at all, so if it must be Khorne then so be it.

 

Regardless, I would swap the CSM squad's plasmagun for a second meltagun.  With their free MoK, you'll likely want to be charging with them anyway, or at least keep that open as an option, so sticking to assault weapons seems the better call.

[Charlo]

Slaanesh is probabl pretty good for Raptors, that extra initiative is handy.

 

If not Nurgle are the obvious power game choice.

[jumai]

Slaanesh is also kinda iffy for warp talons, what with them being too cool for grenades and all.

[Sception]

Khorne is iffy for all of them.  Slaanesh works fine for raptors, but is iffy for the talons, but that really depends on the terrain cover on your boards.  And with fists on your raptor champs, MoS is probably not the best choice there, either.  Tzeentch is the other way around, being an alright choice for warp talons if you know you'll be facing a lot of AP3 or better attacks, but is a terrible choice for raptors, as it is for most units.  Nurgle is ok for either, but is kind of pricey.

 

Honestly?  IMO, all of the marks are a bit overpriced on our jump troops, if you're not getting the extra freebies that come with the aligned legions.  I'd field them markless in a Black Legion list.  But that's just me.

 

Again, overall the list looks fine to me if a Khornate subtheme is an important part of your aesthetic.