skarn Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 5pts more than draigo who beats him in cc 10 out of 10 times... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waking Dreamer Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Yeah, if he doesn't come with that silver bullet, I'll be right with you.. my initial reaction was like.. "That's it!?"... shoot, I'll prob nerdrage all the way to Nottingham on foot if he doesn't have something awesome lol but to be fair, I'm very curious what his master crafted hammer is going to do, as they called it a "conduit for his powers". As a side note, if he is given explicit access to the AoD powers that would also be a welcome option for him. Imagine him with Might of Heroes in CC... lol obnoxious!! Grey Knights can already use AoD powers though. Unless you are hoping that he comes with preset AoD powers. Some players dont recognise AoD powers officially accessible by GK models blah, blah, etc (no debate allowed here). So for it to be explicitly connected to Voldus as usable it makes him more flexible compared to our regular GK libbys for some players. 5pts more than draigo who beats him in cc 10 out of 10 times... As mentioned AoD powers like Might of Heroes can make him beastly in CC, while Electro-displacement can add movement utility, but then that's not a sure thing as Draigo's Hammerhand and GoI. It is probably too early to start making lists for Voldus to be in, but thinking out aloud, I'd struggle having both Draigo and him the same army list, so it may come down who does what better between them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyzariel Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Yeah, if he doesn't come with that silver bullet, I'll be right with you.. my initial reaction was like.. "That's it!?"... shoot, I'll prob nerdrage all the way to Nottingham on foot if he doesn't have something awesome lol but to be fair, I'm very curious what his master crafted hammer is going to do, as they called it a "conduit for his powers". As a side note, if he is given explicit access to the AoD powers that would also be a welcome option for him. Imagine him with Might of Heroes in CC... lol obnoxious!! Grey Knights can already use AoD powers though. Unless you are hoping that he comes with preset AoD powers. Some players dont recognise AoD powers officially accessible by GK models blah, blah, etc (no debate allowed here). So for it to be explicitly connected to Voldus as usable it makes him more flexible compared to our regular GK libbys for some players. Not trying to start a debate here but I am genuinely curious how can this even be a debate? The deck of psychic cards containing the AoD powers (aka Adeptus Astartes Psychic Powers) produced by Game Workshop explicitly said GK (as well as every other Space Marine chapter) has access to them. Also, if these are really the rules to Voldus, it is another unfortunate evidence that GW really does hate GK. And I'm starting to become as jaded and cynical as some of the posters here.... I guess we can still hope for good formation rules. The reason why I am implying Voldus is terrible rules-wise is due to the following: 1. Daemon hammer that strikes on initiative is gimmicky as heck. Draigo can already do this with hammerhand and he cost cheaper, and comes with a storm shield to boot. 2. ML3 for being the Psyker of Psykers? Wow. And as a consolation prize, they allow him to take an extra Sanctic spell... Big deal. A normal libby can already do that with the relic for cheaper. The only sliver of advantage I can see here is that you can sort of bring two of those relics if you field Voldus. However, GK are not hurting to have more spells. Between two libbies, GK will most likely have every single Sanctic spell anyway. What we need is more Warp Charges! Or a more reliable means of harnessing them! 3. Currently I am assuming he has a GM statline, which TBH is kinda moot as most players prefer their libbies to be support characters rather than a melee beatstick (we have Draigo for that). His GM statline is only useful if he comes with Eternal Warrior which I don't think he does, does he? As it stands, Voldus' psychic potential is only about as good as a standard libby, and his melee prowess is worse than Draigo. But he costs more than either. The only thing that can save him now is the rumoured GK formations that can be found in GS3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waking Dreamer Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Not trying to start a debate here but I am genuinely curious how can this even be a debate? The deck of psychic cards containing the AoD powers (aka Adeptus Astartes Psychic Powers) produced by Game Workshop explicitly said GK (as well as every other space marine chapter) has access to them. Check out this thread here and read the dilemma for some: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327147-grey-knight-1850-itc-tournament-list/?do=findComment&comment=4648377 On topic, does anyone know if Voldus' Daemonhammer is MC too? Based on the quick description posted earlier about his Hammer be a conduit for his psychic powers, maybe it can also buff his harness of the warp to a 3+..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyzariel Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Not trying to start a debate here but I am genuinely curious how can this even be a debate? The deck of psychic cards containing the AoD powers (aka Adeptus Astartes Psychic Powers) produced by Game Workshop explicitly said GK (as well as every other space marine chapter) has access to them. Check out this thread here and read the dilemma for some: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/327147-grey-knight-1850-itc-tournament-list/?do=findComment&comment=4648377 On topic, does anyone know if Voldus' Daemonhammer is MC too? Based on the quick description posted earlier about his Hammer be a conduit for his psychic powers, maybe it can also buff his harness of the warp to a 3+..? Thank you for the link! As for the Daemonhammer, I think there's no confirmation if it is MC or not. However, I reckon most people assume it is... I still think he is terribly-costed for what he does though. He makes Draigo look cheap in comparison... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 This topic is prohibited by the GK mods. If you'ld like to discuss it the or has a few threads in this issue. Edit. Shoddy wifi this morning. Ninjad by waking. :) So no one's seen cypher yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyzariel Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 This topic is prohibited by the GK mods. If you'ld like to discuss it the or has a few threads in this issue. Edit. Shoddy wifi this morning. Ninjad by waking. So no one's seen cypher yet? Noted. Apologies. Unaware of that and I have already read the posts found in the link given above and stopped discussing it. Was merely curious that's all. And said curiosity is sated. As for Cypher, I reckon he should be similar with his old incarnation. I think at this point what we really want to know is the formation rules... I'm sincerely hoping that Voldus is part of some GK librarius conclave that allows him to harness spells on a 3+, regardless of discipline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myunch Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 https://spikeybits.com/2017/03/hammer-time-grand-master-voldus-rules-spotted.html So this post pretty much confirms what was said so far, except he's 5 points LESS than Draigo, his WL trait essentially seems to be Loremaster... Also has explicit access to the AoD powers (nice)... However I'm really hoping to see some sort of psychic buff somewhere... This can't be all of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 https://spikeybits.com/2017/03/hammer-time-grand-master-voldus-rules-spotted.html So this post pretty much confirms what was said so far, except he's 5 points LESS than Draigo, his WL trait essentially seems to be Loremaster... Also has explicit access to the AoD powers (nice)... However I'm really hoping to see some sort of psychic buff somewhere... This can't be all of it. So Voldus is a named GM version of the standard Librarian build we all take. And he's Mordrak without the cool rules. Gad GW went with something "original" this time! SJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Until I see the official rules I'll take all the above with that very large pinch of salt that it should be taken with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newdigitalGK Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Daemonic Adversaries – these special rules allow you to field Grey Knights against enemies that are not necessarily Daemonic in nature, meaning your Grey Knights can be fielding without breaking narrative The reason we feel the way we are is this from gw's view of what gk are. Nothing more. They are forcing the narrative down our throughts which can't blame them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 I kinda like that. Feels kinda weird to have GK fighting Tau and Orks. It's a waste of their "talents" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newdigitalGK Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 I kinda like that. Feels kinda weird to have GK fighting Tau and Orks. It's a waste of their "talents" The only issue is you only collect gk it means you only fight deamons. Which for a 'stand alone ' army sucks. Also try to convince a deamon player saying hey i got an army who's sole purpose is to kill deamons lets play! In a shoebox that usually doesn't work. But it does reinforce that greyknights are an ally army. Meaning you only take them as an ally. Or in some narrative format. And even then the sad part is there are better allies even when facing deamons. But this is a rant getting way off topic. Still gonna get the box and will most likely a decent formation but i don't expect anything near what gk's need or want. Imo of course Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 So the greatest librarian of the Imperium's most powerful psyker army is no more powerful than Mephiston, Loth or Njal and weaker tyhan what Eldar and Chaos can put out. GW really have decided that the GKs are not an army for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duz_ Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 Unfortunately it appears this GK GM isn't actually for GKs, but to buff other imperial armies (assuming he can be taken as a HQ for other imperial factions) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Lord Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 So the greatest librarian of the Imperium's most powerful psyker army is no more powerful than Mephiston, Loth or Njal and weaker tyhan what Eldar and Chaos can put out. He's not a Librarian himself, but a Grand Master - he's Warden of the Librarius, not Chief Librarian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 No. The gk do not just fight daemons. We should all stop the propagation of this 'class fantasy' and stop the narrowing of imagination. There were many reasons given why the gk would fight other armies in a 'narative' given way back in the old daemonhunter codex. Embrace that. Not some ill thought notion that your gk should only come out to play if you opponent fields any daemons... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 5, 2017 Share Posted March 5, 2017 As for voldus, I guess the greatest of the all psyker army didn't actually mean best psyker after all And Draigo would like to see Voldus claims at being greater than him... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waking Dreamer Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 As for voldus, I guess the greatest of the all psyker army didn't actually mean best psyker after all And Draigo would like to see Voldus claims at being greater than him... Well, technically he is the "best" psyker GKs have given he has "official" access to AoD powers, and has the guaranteed WT Lore Master.Better than Tigurius? Probably not. I also read Draigo, momentarily pops out of the Warp to acknowledge him as the new GM, but I dunno if that was joke. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 So the greatest librarian of the Imperium's most powerful psyker army is no more powerful than Mephiston, Loth or Njal and weaker tyhan what Eldar and Chaos can put out. He's not a Librarian himself, but a Grand Master - he's Warden of the Librarius, not Chief Librarian. When someone is introduced with the tag line "Of a chapter of psykers, he is the greatest of us" I find his abilities underwhelming to say the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartali Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 Indeed. Tiggy and Loth are still top of the imperial psyker tree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newdigitalGK Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 Well I'm over my original disappointment, I mean really he's not bad as a GM and Libby all in one. Could have been better especially for his point cost. (I think GW over compensates for psychic powers or psychic ability) But still not horrible. I'm now hopeing that the rules for the detachment are better. But I know I'm setting myself up for disappointment. Actually looking back... Some of the assumptions I would have Grand master as well as Librarian, so 4+ invul save (Iron Halo) Libby with possibly 3 wounds (sanctuary giving him 3+ save) - This is most likely a guarantee but could be better basically I can see him as a Grand Master Statline librarian best of both worlds I would assume he would come as stock ML3 Psyker possibly ML4 but doubtful Hammer will most likely be master crafted 150-200 pts most likely 200 pts However I could see this going as high as 250 pts I could see him being the mirror of Ahriman via Wrath of Magnus (can't make comparisons if any I don't have the WoM book) 1 unique psychic power to him 1 Unique Formation with him to use with Grey Knights However before I get excited I would almost certainly expect this to be a very expensive formation pt wise to field. With is I would lean for it being more psyker friendly over deep strike friendly IE casting on 3+ when generating powers etc. I actually wasn't wrong ... It's pretty much exactly as I predicted minus the hammer swinging at init and the mirror comment but I kind of just threw that in there. And you could say the "free psychic power" is his uniqueness. Now just have to wait and see what the new GK formation will look like. Also kind of wonder what the new Daemonic Adversaries thing is going to be like? Unless someone already knows... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myunch Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 Well I'm over my original disappointment, I mean really he's not bad as a GM and Libby all in one. Could have been better especially for his point cost. (I think GW over compensates for psychic powers or psychic ability) But still not horrible. I'm now hopeing that the rules for the detachment are better. But I know I'm setting myself up for disappointment. Actually looking back... Some of the assumptions I would have Grand master as well as Librarian, so 4+ invul save (Iron Halo) Libby with possibly 3 wounds (sanctuary giving him 3+ save) - This is most likely a guarantee but could be better basically I can see him as a Grand Master Statline librarian best of both worlds I would assume he would come as stock ML3 Psyker possibly ML4 but doubtful Hammer will most likely be master crafted 150-200 pts most likely 200 pts However I could see this going as high as 250 pts I could see him being the mirror of Ahriman via Wrath of Magnus (can't make comparisons if any I don't have the WoM book) 1 unique psychic power to him 1 Unique Formation with him to use with Grey Knights However before I get excited I would almost certainly expect this to be a very expensive formation pt wise to field. With is I would lean for it being more psyker friendly over deep strike friendly IE casting on 3+ when generating powers etc. I actually wasn't wrong ... It's pretty much exactly as I predicted minus the hammer swinging at init and the mirror comment but I kind of just threw that in there. And you could say the "free psychic power" is his uniqueness. Now just have to wait and see what the new GK formation will look like. Also kind of wonder what the new Daemonic Adversaries thing is going to be like? Unless someone already knows... Is the Daemonic Adversaries a rule set? I assumed it was simply a fluff thing that's thrown in to explain certain battles against non-Daemons... which I believe someone posted earlier that there have already been good reasons for GK fighting non-Daemons in the codex and other books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newdigitalGK Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 Is the Daemonic Adversaries a rule set? I assumed it was simply a fluff thing that's thrown in to explain certain battles against non-Daemons... which I believe someone posted earlier that there have already been good reasons for GK fighting non-Daemons in the codex and other books. We have no idea what Daemonic Adversaries is. It could be an in-book mission, some fluffy thing that says "oh yea and it's totally ok for GK's to face more then Daemons" or some kind of new rule. However fluffy reasons for GK's to face other armies is not the issue, the issue is that GK's are so over costed that unless you are playing Vs Daemons you will most likely have a bad day or to some degree CSM. Fluff great do what you want, Random pick up game with some dude at game store, or in more extreme setting Tournaments, GK's are just not a viable fun option. And by fun option I mean play and feel like you are not putting down models just to get tabled most games. I have yet to hear a player say "Oh GK's this should be a challenging but fun game", my buddies mostly go "Oh GK's well looks like I have this one in the bag." Hence I've branched out and started playing other armies just so I can have a win now and then. /Rant /soapbox /offtopic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 Folk need to embrace 9 ndk lists! In all seriousness, all we can hope for is 8th. Whatever that will bring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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