8th Edition & BA

[durdle-durdle]

Swords have -3 ap? -swoon-

 

Now I really want to see lightning claws. I really hope they differentiate them enough that each has a good niche. But even with no +strength, I think I like the swords most.

[vahouth]

Now Mephiston will be a lot better!

[Charlo]

If we keep our +1 Strength on the charge, swords are going to be incredible for us. S5 -3AP is tasty, wounding anything T9 or less on a 5+.

 

Mauls are in a weird place now, because it's much harder to wound things on a 2+... They only give benefit when attacking T3 -T6 models, anything else a sword will have been just as good or better because of the -3AP.

 

If Mephiston keeps his "My S is now 10" power then HOOO BOY.

[NTaW]

I imagine Mephy's sword will have its own rules, since it is a named relic in the books surrounding him.

 

Sure seems like every unit/model is going to be more what it "should" be in 8th. I expect fun things for everything since GW wants their products to be wanted by consumers; if Formation taught anyone anything it's that a good way to get people buying models is to make them useful or needed in the game!

Edited May 11, 2017 by NTaW

[Frater Antodeniel]

So, by looking at the Datasheet :

 

If the Thousand Sons.... :

 

- Warpflame Pistol = 6" Range / Pistol D6 / Str 3 / AP -2 / D1

- Warpflamer = 8" Range / Assault D6 / Str 4 / AP -2 / D1

 

So the Blood Angels... :

 

- Hand-Flamer = 6" Range / Pistol D6 / Str 3 / AP 0  / D1

- Flamer = 8" Range / Assault D6 / Str 4 / AP 0  / D1

- Heavy Flamer = 10" Range / Assault D6 / Str 5 / AP -1  / D1 OR 10" Range / Assault 2D6 / Str 5 / AP -1  / D1

- Flamestorm Cannon = 12" Range / Assault D6 / Str 6 / AP -2  / D1(2?) OR 12" Range / Assault 2D6 / Str 6 / AP -2  / D1(2?)

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I wonder if we will also lose relics. Been thinking about the fury of Baal lately.

[Damon Nightman]

Yeah, I'm thinking my D.C. Chap in that relic armor is kinda useless now... probably will need to convert the model to something else unless we get an articifer armor upgrade for them...

[Xenith]

If it's anything like the AoS books, battleforged armies will get a certain amount of relics according to the army comp. It might be something like 1 relic per 3 command points granted by army comp, or summat. 

[Panzer]

I'm pretty happy that I planned to focus on Vanguard Vets/Command Squads with Power Sword + Storm Shield. Shredding all the armor while (probably) staying on a fix 3+ save sounds sweet :D Edited May 12, 2017 by Jolemai
Swear filter dodge

[vahouth]

The Eldaeri Faction focus is out, and I'm already getting bad vibes.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/11/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-eldar/

 

Initial impressions

• multiple units getting inv save
• too many units dishing out mortal wounds (Asurmen, psychers, striking scorpions, maybe even some wraith constructs etc) 
• and the Avatar sounds brutal.

Edited May 11, 2017 by vahouth

[Panzer]

You are late. We're already pretty much done talking about it over in the N&R section. :D

 

The one thing one shouldn't forget while reading those changes is that they also mentioned that all Eldar will get their points adjusted. I believe no one is dumb enough to forget Eldar in their balance play testing. ;)

[9x19 Parabellum]

All these faction focus things are starting to read the same: lamenting the absence of such-and-such a unit, and playing coy about acknowledging that the reason no one takes them (and the reason they consistently take other stuff) is because of the massive imbalances that you guys (read: GW) have baked into codexes over the last couple editions. 

[Panzer]

Well what else to say without practically revealing the whole faction rules early?

[vahouth]

You are late. We're already pretty much done talking about it over in the N&R section.

 

The one thing one shouldn't forget while reading those changes is that they also mentioned that all Eldar will get their points adjusted. I believe no one is dumb enough to forget Eldar in their balance play testing.

The only mention about point adjustment is for the Phoenix Lords, and only to make all their choices more appealing. 

[Quixus]

If it's anything like the AoS books, battleforged armies will get a certain amount of relics according to the army comp. It might be something like 1 relic per 3 command points granted by army comp, or summat. 

Does AoS have units that come with relics, like Dante? What happens to them?

[Panzer]

 

You are late. We're already pretty much done talking about it over in the N&R section.

 

The one thing one shouldn't forget while reading those changes is that they also mentioned that all Eldar will get their points adjusted. I believe no one is dumb enough to forget Eldar in their balance play testing.

The only mention about point adjustment is for the Phoenix Lords, and only to make all their choices more appealing. 

 

Fair enough. However they already said before that they are looking into the point cost of every unit so it was redundant information anyway. ;)

[vahouth]

I hope you're right Panzer. ;)

[Xenith]

<p>

 

The Eldaeri Faction focus is out, and I'm already getting bad vibes.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/11/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-eldar/

 

Initial impressions

• multiple units getting inv save
• too many units dishing out mortal wounds (Asurmen, psychers, striking scorpions, maybe even some wraith constructs etc)
• and the Avatar sounds brutal.

Don't panic.

 

1) multiple units Only get free invun if they stand next to asurmen.

2) eldar seers have always had invulnerable saves

3) Marines still have greater access to invun overall, with storm shields.

4) direswords have always been able to inflict instant death. It's their thing

5) marines have ready access to mortal wounds through smite

6) the avatar should be brutal. Wait til you see Dante.

[Quixus]

Did they already tell us how mortal wounds work? Do they remove invulnerable saves? In previous editions the thing about invulns was that they can't be removed, at worst you had to reroll the successful ones.

[Panzer]

 

6) the avatar should be brutal. Wait til you see Dante.

 

More than Dante i'm actually looking forward to seeing the Santuinors rules! Imagine him actually becoming a beast like the Avatar for once! :o

[NTaW]

Pretty sure Mortal Wounds ignore all saves, including invulnerable ones. Not 100% though.

 

EDIT: we know this, from the WC site:

 

"Mortal Wounds are a new mechanic too – these cannot be saved by any means and punch straight through thick armour and even invulnerable saves! Ouch."

Edited May 11, 2017 by NTaW

[Xenith]

Only thing is they mentioned somewhere that certain models have the ability to ignore mortal wounds. That's annoying.

[vahouth]

 

5) marines have ready access to mortal wounds through smite

 

 

Eldar have that as well. Every psycker has access to smite by default, and Eldar already have more psyckers that most factions.

Not only that, but Striking Scorpions will dish out mortal wounds at the start of the fight phase, and I think it's safe to say that they won't be the only ones.

I can definitely see all the Phoenix Lords, wraithguard-lords-knights, harleys or snipers do that as well. Though that's pure speculation from my part, I wouldn't be surprised if they will indeed dish out mortal wounds.

[Red-beard]

Did they already tell us how mortal wounds work? Do they remove invulnerable saves? In previous editions the thing about invulns was that they can't be removed, at worst you had to reroll the successful ones.

 

From what I'm hearing, the invulnerable save will stack with the armour save modifiers. It's no longer a separate save.  Mortal wounds disallow the save. 

 

So it could work like this:

 

If you have a 3+ armour save and were hit with an AP -2 weapon, you would save on a 5+. If you have an invuln bonus of 1, that means you'd save on a 4+. Then, a mortal wound makes it so that you don't get a save. 

Edited May 11, 2017 by Red-beard

[vahouth]

 

Did they already tell us how mortal wounds work? Do they remove invulnerable saves? In previous editions the thing about invulns was that they can't be removed, at worst you had to reroll the successful ones.

 

From what I'm hearing, the invulnerable save will stack with the armour save modifiers. It's no longer a separate save.  Mortal wounds disallow the save. 

 

So it could work like this:

 

If you have a 3+ armour save and were hit with an AP -2 weapon, you would save on a 5+. If you have an invuln bonus of 1, that means you'd save on a 4+. Then, a mortal wound makes it so that you don't get a save. 

 

I think you are confusing inv saves with cover saves.

GW said that cover saves will become the armor modifiers.  In the Rubric Marines Datasheet, inv saves are not described as modifiers, but as a 5+.

Edited May 11, 2017 by vahouth