Chapter Focus: The Imperial Fists, Crimson Fists and Black T

[Deadman Wade]

 

 

We're back Boys.Unleash the Tide.

 

Yep, back where we were at the start of 7th ed.

 

A chapter with a melee focus that lacks access to the marine character/unit that could buff their melee abilities better than anything else in a codex/army with sup-par to average melee options and in possession of special rules that do little to nothing to help make the army function as it was seemingly intended.

 

LOL what? Whoever gets charges off right now absolutely obliterates the enemy side. We have free rerolls to all charges for all our Units. And we have REAL anti psychic defense, in an edition where our characters are the BEST by far in the codex for their point costs. And you're comparing it to 7th where we had a chapter tactic that worked once every 100th game?

 

Yeah, I don't get these complaints. Humble Castellan (Captain) now gives re-rolls 1s to hit for ALL UNITS in his aura on top of being much better fighter than in 7th edition, chaplains now have 4 wounds, hit on 2s and give Litanies of hate in EVERY round, we can charge after deep strike and after disembarking from Rhinos. LRCs unleash more dakka than ever. Helbrecht and Grimaldus are just brutal, Emperor's Champion is quite decent. And we re-roll charges.

Our old codex said that BT prefer armored spearhead and orbital assault. Now both vehicles and deep strike lists are better than in 6th and 7th edition (maybe better than in 5th, but it was long time ago, so I barely remember how it was back then).

Not sure what people expect. BT never were top-tier melee army. If you try and go toe-to-toe with close combat specialists like berzerkers, you get obliterated. We are Space Marines with better melee options than vanilla marines, but we're not Blood Angels.

[HenricusTyranicus]

Even if you can only give it to generic characters, we can upgrade a Castellan into a Marshall, and get a 9 inch bubble of rerolling all to hit rolls. Pretty dang swell.

[Firepower]

Well said Wade. No paddlins for you today.

 

That tweet almost got me in some trouble. Not the best time to be laughing at work right now. :P

[Marshal Wolfhart]

 

 

 

 

I laughed. A little too much, perhaps.

 

 That post got overlooked too much i feel. I rarely even chuckle at humor when reading, watching movies etc. Not this time, my wife came in and gave me that look... must have been real bad :D

[Lysere]

It's not all auras. Look closely at the leak. It specifies Rites of Battle and Litanies of Hate.

Rechecked and those are just examples, now we just need to know if Helbrecht can take it because a 9" bubble of +1S would be amazing.

 

Shield Eternal and Teeth of Terra both look solid of course. I have a feeling I'll be using the chapter relics stratagem a lot.

 

Edit: Upon closer inspection it looks like no relics for named characters, no surprise really.

Edited July 21, 2017 by Lysere

[Gendo]

 

It's not all auras. Look closely at the leak. It specifies Rites of Battle and Litanies of Hate.

Rechecked and those are just examples, now we just need to know if Helbrecht can take it because a 9" bubble of +1S would be amazing.

 

Shield Eternal and Teeth of Terra both look solid of course. I have a feeling I'll be using the chapter relics stratagem a lot.

 

Edit: Upon closer inspection it looks like no relics for named characters, no surprise really.

 

 

Not going to use it then  or maybe just on the Techmarine depending on cost.

Edited July 21, 2017 by Gendo

[Banjulhu]

 

 

 

 

 

 

We're back Boys.Unleash the Tide.

Yep, back where we were at the start of 7th ed.

 

A chapter with a melee focus that lacks access to the marine character/unit that could buff their melee abilities better than anything else in a codex/army with sup-par to average melee options and in possession of special rules that do little to nothing to help make the army function as it was seemingly intended.

LOL what? Whoever gets charges off right now absolutely obliterates the enemy side. We have free rerolls to all charges for all our Units. And we have REAL anti psychic defense, in an edition where our characters are the BEST by far in the codex for their point costs. And you're comparing it to 7th where we had a chapter tactic that worked once every 100th game?

Yeah, I don't get these complaints. Humble Castellan (Captain) now gives re-rolls 1s to hit for ALL UNITS in his aura on top of being much better fighter than in 7th edition, chaplains now have 4 wounds, hit on 2s and give Litanies of hate in EVERY round, we can charge after deep strike and after disembarking from Rhinos. LRCs unleash more dakka than ever. Helbrecht and Grimaldus are just brutal, Emperor's Champion is quite decent. And we re-roll charges.

Our old codex said that BT prefer armored spearhead and orbital assault. Now both vehicles and deep strike lists are better than in 6th and 7th edition (maybe better than in 5th, but it was long time ago, so I barely remember how it was back then).

Not sure what people expect. BT never were top-tier melee army. If you try and go toe-to-toe with close combat specialists like berzerkers, you get obliterated. We are Space Marines with better melee options than vanilla marines, but we're not Blood Angels.

Until you mentioned the three special characters nothing you mentioned had a damnable thing to do with being a Black Templar, just a marine chapter that is the source of my displeasure.

 

The chapter tactic is a joke, it impacts most heavily where you don't need it (short range), can not be relied on where you do need it (9 inch deep strike charges), does not actually open up any game style and you could easily play a game where it has no impact. You could quite easily just play a game without a chapter tactic and have nothing change.

 

The IH tactic is also dull as all hell but will be called upon regularly.

 

Psyker defence is nice but not when you get it at the expense of something else because your armies normal defence has been denied to you.

[Arkangilos]

Well I don't know about you, but to me a second chance at a failure is not "nothing". It's also no joke.

 

It's not nearly as bad as you make it sound.

[Gendo]

 

 

 

 

We're back Boys.Unleash the Tide.

Yep, back where we were at the start of 7th ed.

 

A chapter with a melee focus that lacks access to the marine character/unit that could buff their melee abilities better than anything else in a codex/army with sup-par to average melee options and in possession of special rules that do little to nothing to help make the army function as it was seemingly intended.

LOL what? Whoever gets charges off right now absolutely obliterates the enemy side. We have free rerolls to all charges for all our Units. And we have REAL anti psychic defense, in an edition where our characters are the BEST by far in the codex for their point costs. And you're comparing it to 7th where we had a chapter tactic that worked once every 100th game?

Yeah, I don't get these complaints. Humble Castellan (Captain) now gives re-rolls 1s to hit for ALL UNITS in his aura on top of being much better fighter than in 7th edition, chaplains now have 4 wounds, hit on 2s and give Litanies of hate in EVERY round, we can charge after deep strike and after disembarking from Rhinos. LRCs unleash more dakka than ever. Helbrecht and Grimaldus are just brutal, Emperor's Champion is quite decent. And we re-roll charges.

Our old codex said that BT prefer armored spearhead and orbital assault. Now both vehicles and deep strike lists are better than in 6th and 7th edition (maybe better than in 5th, but it was long time ago, so I barely remember how it was back then).

Not sure what people expect. BT never were top-tier melee army. If you try and go toe-to-toe with close combat specialists like berzerkers, you get obliterated. We are Space Marines with better melee options than vanilla marines, but we're not Blood Angels.

Until you mentioned the three special characters nothing you mentioned had a damnable thing to do with being a Black Templar, just a marine chapter that is the source of my displeasure.

 

The chapter tactic is a joke, it impacts most heavily where you don't need it (short range), can not be relied on where you do need it (9 inch deep strike charges), does not actually open up any game style and you could easily play a game where it has no impact. You could quite easily just play a game without a chapter tactic and have nothing change.

 

The IH tactic is also dull as all hell but will be called upon regularly.

 

Psyker defence is nice but not when you get it at the expense of something else because your armies normal defence has been denied to you.

 

 

About deep strike charges, the CT it's free and if that fails you could use a CP to reroll a low dice, overall gives good changes of getting the charge off.

[HenricusTyranicus]

 

It's not all auras. Look closely at the leak. It specifies Rites of Battle and Litanies of Hate.

Rechecked and those are just examples, now we just need to know if Helbrecht can take it because a 9" bubble of +1S would be amazing.

 

Shield Eternal and Teeth of Terra both look solid of course. I have a feeling I'll be using the chapter relics stratagem a lot.

 

Edit: Upon closer inspection it looks like no relics for named characters, no surprise really.

 

I can't make those out. What do they say? Also, can anyone read the Armor Indomitus?

[Banjulhu]

Looks like a 2+ armour save with the ability to make it a 3+ invulnerable save once per battle

[Deadman Wade]

 

 

 

 

We're back Boys.Unleash the Tide.

Yep, back where we were at the start of 7th ed.

 

A chapter with a melee focus that lacks access to the marine character/unit that could buff their melee abilities better than anything else in a codex/army with sup-par to average melee options and in possession of special rules that do little to nothing to help make the army function as it was seemingly intended.

LOL what? Whoever gets charges off right now absolutely obliterates the enemy side. We have free rerolls to all charges for all our Units. And we have REAL anti psychic defense, in an edition where our characters are the BEST by far in the codex for their point costs. And you're comparing it to 7th where we had a chapter tactic that worked once every 100th game?

Yeah, I don't get these complaints. Humble Castellan (Captain) now gives re-rolls 1s to hit for ALL UNITS in his aura on top of being much better fighter than in 7th edition, chaplains now have 4 wounds, hit on 2s and give Litanies of hate in EVERY round, we can charge after deep strike and after disembarking from Rhinos. LRCs unleash more dakka than ever. Helbrecht and Grimaldus are just brutal, Emperor's Champion is quite decent. And we re-roll charges.

Our old codex said that BT prefer armored spearhead and orbital assault. Now both vehicles and deep strike lists are better than in 6th and 7th edition (maybe better than in 5th, but it was long time ago, so I barely remember how it was back then).

Not sure what people expect. BT never were top-tier melee army. If you try and go toe-to-toe with close combat specialists like berzerkers, you get obliterated. We are Space Marines with better melee options than vanilla marines, but we're not Blood Angels.

Until you mentioned the three special characters nothing you mentioned had a damnable thing to do with being a Black Templar, just a marine chapter that is the source of my displeasure.

 

The chapter tactic is a joke, it impacts most heavily where you don't need it (short range), can not be relied on where you do need it (9 inch deep strike charges), does not actually open up any game style and you could easily play a game where it has no impact. You could quite easily just play a game without a chapter tactic and have nothing change.

 

The IH tactic is also dull as all hell but will be called upon regularly.

 

Psyker defence is nice but not when you get it at the expense of something else because your armies normal defence has been denied to you.

 

The thing is that you will fail charges. The more you use close combat units the more you will fail them. Close combat with marines isn't like the orks, where you can fail charge, lose 10 models and try again. It's high risk, and failed charge means that your squad worth 150-200 pts did nothing and died. Without charge distance re-rolls I see no reason to take SM melee squads.

And as far as "being a Black Templar" goes, all other chapter got the same treatment. Old Space Marines are going to get that and nothing more, since all focus is on primaris, who are as bland and generic as possible. Minor buffs is what SM Chapter Tactics is now.

Edited July 21, 2017 by Deadman Wade

[Castellan Doren]

That abhor the witch came out better than expected.

[Ebon Hand]

Actually chapter tactic doesn't impact more heavily on short charges, it impacts more on harder charges.

 

Normal Black Templars

 

6 inch charge: 72.22% -> 92.28% : 20% gain

 

7 inch: 58.33% -> 82.63% : 24% gain

 

8 inch: 41.67% -> 65.97% : 24% gain

 

9 inch: 27.78% -> 47.84% : 20% gain

 

10 inch: 16.67% -> 30.55% : 14% gain

 

11 inch: 8.33% -> 15.97% : 7.6% gain

 

12 inch: 2.78% -> 5.478% : 2.7% gain

 

You see, it's a curve, but when comparing the gains to the original percents for success, you see that at 12 inches your chances of success have basically doubled. Dice math is weird like that.

[Marshal Laeroth]

I won't lie, I laughed out loud when I saw the BT stratagem. In a good way.

[Gendo]

That abhor the witch came out better than expected.

 

Was expecting a 6 up.

[redmapa]

Can anyone make out what the Standard of the Emperor Ascendant does? It might be a good relic to combo with the Crusader Helm.

[Cognative]

Can anyone make out what the Standard of the Emperor Ascendant does? It might be a good relic to combo with the Crusader Helm.

It looks like it gives plus one to the "shoot once more before you die" roll

[gally912]

So if I read the actual book page correctly, you get a relic for free. It says in matched play you pay for the points of the weapon you replace.

 

Does that change anyone's opinion? Maybe the apothecary?

[Kilamandaros]

Lots of complaining as per but overall I'm very happy with the CTs and stratagem - relic is fairly meh as the buffs we'd want to improve are on special characters but may be worth it on a deep striking Chaplain coming in with Assault Termies, the LoH buff will be in range if the termies make their charge but the chaplain fails his - means a lot where thunder hammers are concerned.

[gally912]

 

Can anyone make out what the Standard of the Emperor Ascendant does? It might be a good relic to combo with the Crusader Helm.

It looks like it gives plus one to the "shoot once more before you die" roll

also all marines auto pass morale, and enemy is -1ld.

 

Unfortunately can't be combined with crusader helm cause 1 per char.

[Stemplar]

I can't believe there's still so much of the negative whining!! Not the BT way.

 

Abhor the witch!!! Awesome.

Charging re rolls? Yes please, because as a Templar all I really wanna do is charge in swinging and brutally hack/hammer/punch anything in front of me.

The Helm? Put it on a Marshall and suddenly anything within 9 inches is re rolling failed shooting.

 

I love this!! Can not wait to play with all of that at my disposal.

[gally912]

The reason the 6" heroic intervention was thrown around is because that is the warlord trait for BT

[Acebaur]

Anyone else notice that you can now upgrade your captain to a chapter master for cp? That's pretty sweet for a generic Marshal and doesn't impact your list building

[Ebon Hand]

Wait its for CP? So like a pre battle strategem or something?