BSB Speculation

[ERJAK]

 

 

Except at the end of the day, you're still shooting multimeltas. They could have a 900" range they still wouldn't be great.

What suddenly makes multimeltas bad?

 

Multimeltas have always been bad. They're extremely expensive for a single S8 shot, AP-4 is irrelevant because you're bouncing off on invuls on the majority of things you want to shoot at and the melta rule, while nice is usually impractical.

 

I will concede to a degree of hyperbole, but multimeltas have never and likely will never be a particularly efficient option. Even what was described earlier is 2 CP, a specific chapter tactic and a miracle dice to be...roughly as good as a lascannon.

 

It might be the best we got now that the exorcist seems fairly overpriced and dominions are gone but if you're relying on multimeltas to be your big hitters the army probably isn't in a great place.

 

WIth inferno pistols now being fire-able out of deepstrike, it looks like seraphim are our best melta option. Out of deepstrike once per turn.

Edited November 17, 2019 by ERJAK

[Servant of Dante]

I'm watching tapping through the fluff section of the GMG review, and each of the 6 Orders Majoris have a "parrish" in the Imperium they watch after (~16 min in) with EC around terra, etc. except for Argent Shroud because apparently they've been almost annihilated after the eruption of the great rift across the stars. Thought any AS players around here might want to know :D

[Slasher956]

Also means that canoness can't take a storm bolter as well.....

[Interrogator-Chaplain Ezra]

Games Workshop giveth, Games Workshop taketh away.

 

Business as usual.

[dracpanzer]

Grading GW's response to the Beta feedback is, well, sad.

 

Erjak, you might be filming me setting plastic on fire.

Edited November 17, 2019 by dracpanzer

[Closet Skeleton]

Holy trinity is still there so but a combi-flamer or combi-melta in with your retributor superior to melt pretty much anything.

 

Valorus heart can ignore ap-2 and sit in cover, they might be the most durable army in the game now.

 

Yeah, it's not totally undoing it, but that move from S3 to S4 (S6 to S8 for repentia) is massive due to the wound charts. Imagine Zephyrim wounding Marines on 4+ rerolling. I shudder.

 

They get a veterans of the long war for melee which is better than +1 strength even with a cp cost. It means Zephyrim are wounding knights at -4 ap on 5+ with rerolls.

 

You also get the -1 ap on all pistols which is very thematic with seraphim.

 

Also imaginifiers hand out +1 strength to every order anyway so you've lost nothing and one the melee order isn't a total no brainer for repentia.

 

It's also a bit disappointing that canonesses have lost the eviscerator. I'll still be using the index option as long as possible, though. The Battle Sanctum, yeah, it's a building, but it offers a lot of miracle dice for 50 points.

 

Bloody Rose will just want their chainsword relic instead, eviscerators and blessed blades were too similar anyway to be worth it as a option.

 

It sounds like you can only use one miracle die per phase. That... isn't great

 

5 point simalcrum on pretty much every squad lets units use two.

Edited November 17, 2019 by Closet Skeleton

[Ficinus]

Those are all valid points, my main issue with the Bloody Rose strat is that, by nature of it being a strat, it can only be used once per phase. If I want to charge my whole army in, only one unit can get that. Imagifiers can give the buff, but it's sort of worse to pay points for what used to be free. That said, the strat is super good.

 

Now, the AP buff replacing it is also good. Against a standard marine, the odds of a hit from a standard sister causing a wound is the same with Beta Codex and Codex Bloody Rose. But against Guard and Orks and stuff, the strength is more valuable. That said, the AP buff is always one. And, I'll be honest, AP-1 hand flamers may be very worth it. I hadn't thought much about how that buffs pistols (especially for Seraphim).

 

I'll also admit, I just want eviscerators. They were originally designed for the Sisters and other ecclesiastic forces. If Space Marines can have power fists, chainfists, and thunder hammers (all basically the same), we can have blessed blades and eviscerators! And while they're not very different at S3, at S4 they're quite different. I want to wound knights on a 3+!

Edited November 17, 2019 by Ficinus

[Commander Dawnstar]

Don't forget that Bloody Rose units can also now benefit from exploding 6s to hit through Sacred Rites to give them a little more punch on top of that, something they're better positioned to take advantage of than everyone else thanks to their Order Conviction.

[Banjulhu]

I think my only major worry now is once again the utter lack of options for the Troops slot, especially given that Sacred Rites are going to be keyed into there only being SoB and Adeptus Ministorum in the whole army.
 

[Commander Dawnstar]

I'm tempted to say that missing out on Sacred Rites isn't a massive loss unless you're either wanting to play a melee-centric list or really need that +3 to Deny. The rest of Rites offer benefits that are either relatively small, somewhat unreliable or that are just outweighed by the rewards of bringing other factions to compensate for your weaknesses.

[hhhdan]

I think my only major worry now is once again the utter lack of options for the Troops slot, especially given that Sacred Rites are going to be keyed into there only being SoB and Adeptus Ministorum in the whole army.

 

Yeah they definitely missed the opportunity to make a cheap ministorum troops unit.

 

But BSS is a good troop choice. For the points they are efficient especially as valorous heart. Min squads and big squads are both great. (The big squads have hospitaller strat to not care about morale)

[tvih]

 

Multimeltas have always been bad. They're extremely expensive for a single S8 shot, AP-4 is irrelevant because you're bouncing off on invuls on the majority of things you want to shoot at and the melta rule, while nice is usually impractical.

But by these standards basically every single heavy anti-tank infantry weapon the Imperium has would be more or less bad, being single-shot and not bypassing invuls. In fact there's only terminators with their very overpriced Cyclone Missile Launchers for "multi"-shot that I can think of. I wouldn't really count heavy bolters or assault cannons as anti-tank (unless it's like IF's juiced up HBs).

 

At the end of the day it's all a bit academic since it's not like we have much in the way of other options for heavy AT. I'm in fact finishing up my two multimelta sisters currently!

[CaptainMarsh]

Anyone else a little surprised we haven't seen more reviews?

[Atrus]

Little bit. I was half expecting Alexis to come out with one, but she might not have been one of the lucky ones to get advance stuff.

[Banjulhu]

I assume the usual crowd are just in a post Marine info dump fugue especially given that it looks like beyond kick-ass models the SoB wont be shaking up the meta anytime soon.

[Lemondish]

Anyone else a little surprised we haven't seen more reviews?

Not really. I imagine the other reviews will end up spending a bit more time on presentation and a lot less time on forgetting random things, quick edits, and getting basic 40k 8th edition concepts wrong every three minutes ;)

[tvih]

I guess they ran out of review copies...

[Osteoclast]

There anything like Successor Chapter tactics for anyone who wants to roll their own order minoris?

[Interrogator-Chaplain Ezra]

There anything like Successor Chapter tactics for anyone who wants to roll their own order minoris?

Doesn't look like it, no.

[Ezr91aeL]

There anything like Successor Chapter tactics for anyone who wants to roll their own order minoris?

 

 

 

There anything like Successor Chapter tactics for anyone who wants to roll their own order minoris?

Doesn't look like it, no.

 

Actually it makes sense lorewise: minor orders are still linked to their original order since a Major Order Canoness of grade equal or greater than a Minor Order Canoness can give her orders and act like her Sisters are under her jurisdiction (that is the opposite of what could do Chapter Masters.).

[Slasher956]

So its been over 3 weeks  since 28th Oct and the comment of  "But before we end with our climactic final instalment in two weeks’ time, " at the start of part 19  which means that either the 'beyond the battle box' was the last BSB OR GW really cant read a calendar :p

[ZaelART]

Or some eavy metal painter is being whipped to finish painting a Triumph of St Katherine model as we speak...

[Banjulhu]

Something which is definitely a little odd for new codex release which is really making this feel a lot more rushed out than usual is that apparently a number of the units in the new codex do not have photos of their models.

I wonder if this is going to be the first release we have seen for a good few years where you will not be able to get a way to represent every unit in the book within the first few weeks of launch.

[Fire Golem]

Something which is definitely a little odd for new codex release which is really making this feel a lot more rushed out than usual is that apparently a number of the units in the new codex do not have photos of their models.

 

I wonder if this is going to be the first release we have seen for a good few years where you will not be able to get a way to represent every unit in the book within the first few weeks of launch.

The Space Marine codex already had units that didn’t have models for a few months (Impulsor and Incursors).

[Lemondish]

 

Something which is definitely a little odd for new codex release which is really making this feel a lot more rushed out than usual is that apparently a number of the units in the new codex do not have photos of their models.

 

I wonder if this is going to be the first release we have seen for a good few years where you will not be able to get a way to represent every unit in the book within the first few weeks of launch.

The Space Marine codex already had units that didn’t have models for a few months (Impulsor and Incursors).

 

 

Exactly this. The only difference being that the Codex did include pictures of said models, but I find that distinction being used as primary evidence of some sort of 'rushed release' pretty thin.