July 2019 White Dwarf: Indomitus Crusade Lore!

[Panzer]

 

Last I checked.. chaos haven't taken terra. They're closer, but the goal hasn't changed...

 

The goal hasn't changed, no, but the tension's all gone. Narratives like 40K's work on the same principles as simple machines. A mousetrap that stops halfway through its arc isn't going to catch any mice. A roller coaster that halts after that first big drop isn't on to an interesting new phase - it's broken. Crews get called, and hopefully no one's lost any feet or family members, but either way the ride is still over.

 

Calling 40K "over" is clearly raising people's hackles, but I dunno what else to call it when a story burns through all the (sometimes literally planet-sized) signifiers of its conclusion and deflates all of the tensions that've been built up over twenty-odd years, then wants to keep shuffling on lifelessly like it's no big deal.

 

 

It's almost funny how the roller coaster for some is come to a halt and is broken while for others it's finally in full ride again instead of being stopped at the top since forever.

Edited July 30, 2019 by sfPanzer

[Lexington]

It's almost funny how the roller coaster for some is come to a halt and is broken while for others it's finally in full ride again instead of being stopped at the top since forever.

 

Well, no, not at all. This isn't a qualitative thing. It's not about if GW should or shouldn't have done this, or if it was good or not. Like, they shouldn't have done it, and it's not good, but that's not really the point. It's about GW setting up all the trappings of a story structure, then going through the motions of its conclusion while still trying to keep the story going.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Lexington

[Panzer]

 

It's almost funny how the roller coaster for some is come to a halt and is broken while for others it's finally in full ride again instead of being stopped at the top since forever.

 

Well, no, not at all. This isn't a qualitative thing. It's not about if GW should or shouldn't have done this, or if it was good or not. Like, they shouldn't have done it, and it's not good, but that's not really the point. It's about GW setting up all the trappings of a story structure, then going through the motions of its conclusion while still trying to keep the story going.

 

 

No, it's about different people having different opinions and there not being a single truth.

[Rik Lightstar]

 

 

 

 

It's almost funny how the roller coaster for some is come to a halt and is broken while for others it's finally in full ride again instead of being stopped at the top since forever.

Well, no, not at all. This isn't a qualitative thing. It's not about if GW should or shouldn't have done this, or if it was good or not. Like, they shouldn't have done it, and it's not good, but that's not really the point. It's about GW setting up all the trappings of a story structure, then going through the motions of its conclusion while still trying to keep the story going.

No, it's about different people having different opinions and there not being a single truth.

Surely the entirety of the 40k "Setting" is actually the whole theme park?

 

There's one of the rides called "The Black Crusade" and that's looking a bit tired these days. But, there's a whole lot of other stuff going on, they've opened up parts of the "Guardians of the Throne" exhibit that have never been seen before, and they completely refurbished "The Infested House of the Four-Armed Emperor" which everybody had assumed was gone for good. They've got a big building project in one corner with a sign saying "Nuns with Guns - Coming Soon" and it's got little windows to peek through.

 

It's also possible that you've grown out of theme parks, which is fine if that's you, but there's no need to go shouting at everyone else that they're wrong for not liking them.

 

Rik

[Panzer]

 

 

 

It's almost funny how the roller coaster for some is come to a halt and is broken while for others it's finally in full ride again instead of being stopped at the top since forever.

Well, no, not at all. This isn't a qualitative thing. It's not about if GW should or shouldn't have done this, or if it was good or not. Like, they shouldn't have done it, and it's not good, but that's not really the point. It's about GW setting up all the trappings of a story structure, then going through the motions of its conclusion while still trying to keep the story going.

No, it's about different people having different opinions and there not being a single truth.

Surely the entirety of the 40k "Setting" is actually the whole theme park?

 

There's one of the rides called "The Black Crusade" and that's looking a bit tired these days. But, there's a whole lot of other stuff going on, they've opened up parts of the "Guardians of the Throne" exhibit that have never been seen before, and they completely refurbished "The Infested House of the Four-Armed Emperor" which everybody had assumed was gone for good. They've got a big building project in one corner with a sign saying "Nuns with Guns - Coming Soon" and it's got little windows to peek through.

 

It's also possible that you've grown out of theme parks, which is fine if that's you, but there's no need to go shouting at everyone else that they're wrong for not liking them.

 

Rik

 

 

That would be a different metaphor but also a fitting one, yeah. ^^

Edited July 30, 2019 by sfPanzer

[b1soul]

"All the tension is gone!"

 

What tension? 40K was getting stale. Failbaddon gonna destroy the Imperium? Yeah, right. Midnight is not threatening if the clock is perpetually frozen at 11:59.

 

Anyway, Guilliman has returned and Primaris are popping up, but half the Imperium is lost and the Eye has grown to the galaxy-spanning Rift. Daemon Primarchs are all lining up to take Guilliman's head, and Abaddon is still leading the Black Legion. We're still at 11:59, perhaps more accurately 11:59:30.

 

I suppose we're missing some sort of climactic conflict like Cadia? GW could easily replace that with some other campaign.

[Marshal Rohr]

"All the tension is gone!"

 

What tension? 40K was getting stale. Failbaddon gonna destroy the Imperium? Yeah, right. Midnight is not threatening if the clock is perpetually frozen at 11:59.

 

Anyway, Guilliman has returned and Primaris are popping up, but half the Imperium is lost and the Eye has grown to the galaxy-spanning Rift. Daemon Primarchs are all lining up to take Guilliman's head, and Abaddon is still leading the Black Legion. We're still at 11:59, perhaps more accurately 11:59:30.

 

I suppose we're missing some sort of climactic conflict like Cadia? GW could easily replace that with some other campaign.

This is a hard core edgy meme take. Vigilus didn’t have any of the gravitas Armageddon, Cadia, and Badab did. Half the Imperium is gone, and yet... nothing has been done with it. There’s no midnight here. If you can’t explicitly state what midnight is, what will cause it, and how it getting closer looks on the ground - it isn’t there. Simple as that.

[No Foes Remain]

I agree with the good Marshal. Reading the first book of Vigilus it just seemed like a bunch of stories cobbled together in one book, lacking the gravitas and contionuity that the Badab War books or Siege of Vraks books had. I was extremly disapointed and didn't bother buying the second book as for something they hyped up to be like the FWs Black Books it.... wasn't.

[Ishagu]

I agree with the good Marshal. Reading the first book of Vigilus it just seemed like a bunch of stories cobbled together in one book, lacking the gravitas and contionuity that the Badab War books or Siege of Vraks books had. I was extremly disapointed and didn't bother buying the second book as for something they hyped up to be like the FWs Black Books it.... wasn't.

You're comparing a GW campaign to the FW campaigns which have always been far better written. Let's wait and see if FW write one up.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

The Badab War books from FW were good. Most of the others were not. Doom of Mymeara was particularly bad not just for the writing but also for the innumerable grammatical errors and other editing issues throughout the whole thing. 

[No Foes Remain]

 

I agree with the good Marshal. Reading the first book of Vigilus it just seemed like a bunch of stories cobbled together in one book, lacking the gravitas and contionuity that the Badab War books or Siege of Vraks books had. I was extremly disapointed and didn't bother buying the second book as for something they hyped up to be like the FWs Black Books it.... wasn't.

You're comparing a GW campaign to the FW campaigns which have always been far better written. Let's wait and see if FW write one up.

 

 

I am comparing because GW did the exact same thing:

 

 

Vigilus Defiant takes everything you love about campaign books and uses it to bring to life the latest thrilling chapter in the unfolding saga of the Dark Imperium. Take the depth, texture and detail of the Horus Heresy campaign books, add themed armies and narrative battling inspired by classics like Codex: Armageddon, throw in an epic story that will change the face of the galaxy and you’ve got Vigilus Defiant.

 

Source.

Edited August 1, 2019 by No Foes Remain

[Ishagu]

They also said that it's their first attempt at something like this and they hope people like it. As mentioned above some of the FW campaigns were of lesser quality too.

[Marshal Rohr]

 

 

 

I agree with the good Marshal. Reading the first book of Vigilus it just seemed like a bunch of stories cobbled together in one book, lacking the gravitas and contionuity that the Badab War books or Siege of Vraks books had. I was extremly disapointed and didn't bother buying the second book as for something they hyped up to be like the FWs Black Books it.... wasn't.

You're comparing a GW campaign to the FW campaigns which have always been far better written. Let's wait and see if FW write one up.

I am comparing because GW did the exact same thing:

Vigilus Defiant takes everything you love about campaign books and uses it to bring to life the latest thrilling chapter in the unfolding saga of the Dark Imperium. Take the depth, texture and detail of the Horus Heresy campaign books, add themed armies and narrative battling inspired by classics like Codex: Armageddon, throw in an epic story that will change the face of the galaxy and you’ve got Vigilus Defiant.

Source.

They really could’ve made Vigilus something special if they had kept it to Imperium vs Chaos. These campaign books should always be Imperium vs. Chaos or Xenos but never mixed together. It dilutes the focus too much. Edited August 1, 2019 by Marshal Rohr

[MARK0SIAN]

 

 

 

 

I agree with the good Marshal. Reading the first book of Vigilus it just seemed like a bunch of stories cobbled together in one book, lacking the gravitas and contionuity that the Badab War books or Siege of Vraks books had. I was extremly disapointed and didn't bother buying the second book as for something they hyped up to be like the FWs Black Books it.... wasn't.

You're comparing a GW campaign to the FW campaigns which have always been far better written. Let's wait and see if FW write one up.

I am comparing because GW did the exact same thing:

Vigilus Defiant takes everything you love about campaign books and uses it to bring to life the latest thrilling chapter in the unfolding saga of the Dark Imperium. Take the depth, texture and detail of the Horus Heresy campaign books, add themed armies and narrative battling inspired by classics like Codex: Armageddon, throw in an epic story that will change the face of the galaxy and you’ve got Vigilus Defiant.

Source.

They really could’ve made Vigilus something special if they had kept it to Imperium vs Chaos. These campaign books should always be Imperium vs. Chaos or Xenos but never mixed together. It dilutes the focus too much.

The funny thing is, in the seminar at the vigilus open day, they even said they felt like previous campaigns like Medusa didn’t work because they were too cluttered with too many factions. Then they did the same thing for Vigilus just leaving out a couple of factions.

 

Campaign books definitely need to be more tightly focussed like Vraks to make them compelling.

[Brother Casman]

Well, since we seem to be done discussing the Indomitus Crusade lore presented in July's WD, I think it's time to button this one up.