State of the Union (Heresy)

[bushman101]

If out of stock products are any sign, I'd say the state of the Heresy in the U.S. is going strong. The amount of products that have gone from "available to order" to "no longer available" or "out of stock" just this week has been pretty astounding.

 

 

On a related note, it does seem that MKIV Assault sets for one thing are vanishing across the board.

 

 

Oh, sorry. That's just me building my IX Legion 

[SkimaskMohawk]

All aside, my only major gripe is channels like Outer Circle and Race for Terra seem to be pushing more of a negative narrative in the last year or so, rather than focusing on the positive aspects of the community and what they are doing to keep the hobby alive.

Don't watch outer circle really, when I do I tend to get frustrated by the hypocrisy of not knowing what he's talking about while blasting forgeworld for it. Race for terra just seems to spam non heresy models in Facebook groups for his many different tank weathering tutorials lol.

[Darkwrath121]

Huh....erm...

 

Im seeing that even alot of Primarchs are entering 'Sold Out' rather than 'Out of Stock'... has that happened before? I cant recall it and its mildly concerning lol.

Stock and listings on both GW and FW sites are extremely unreliable lately. Combo of IT trouble behind the scenes, and them being unsure when they'll be able to restock certain things due to COVID restrictions, so they just mark it as unavailable, apparently. It's been happening like this for months now. All the Primarchs are still available to buy here in Ireland anyway, so it's a regional stock thing for now.

 

People LOVE primarchs, they're almost certainly safe from removal from sale! :)

Edited March 31, 2021 by Darkwrath121

[LameBeard]

People love primarchs, but moulds don’t last forever. Can they create new moulds from the original assets or does it need a re-sculpt? Seems a shame if the earliest go out of production before the last one is done, but it would be a good excuse to have them all done again gradually in a different pose. I know plenty of you would shell out again, and then there’s the variants that didn’t get their model also, like Corax fighting without his wings ...

[Hfran Morkai]

I'd love to see alternates pop up.

 

I'd definitely grab Russ with his spear (I don't know if he actually uses it as I'm yet to read Wolfsbane, I know he didn't like it).

[WrathOfTheLion]

There's a large reboxing or something going on right now for some reason, so things are moved to NLA and then moved back in. I wouldn't be too worried about the things marked as such right now.

 

I don't know why they're doing that sort of reboxing work, but perhaps related to the rumors of 2E mentioned before now.

[Darkwrath121]

To take a stab at tying those rumours in with a more hopeful perspective on the weird site nonsense. Important to remember the mysterious 'Horus Heresy' and 'Warhammer Forge' (https://www.games-workshop.com/en-IE/Warhammer-Forge, not a 404 error, so it's a real page GW are holding back for some reason. So probably the same for the Horus Heresy one) pages that appeared on the GW site very briefly a couple times last year during presumed maintenance/work. I could (theoretically) see some product reshuffling now that FW and GW share account systems.

 

People love primarchs, but moulds don’t last forever. Can they create new moulds from the original assets or does it need a re-sculpt? Seems a shame if the earliest go out of production before the last one is done, but it would be a good excuse to have them all done again gradually in a different pose. I know plenty of you would shell out again, and then there’s the variants that didn’t get their model also, like Corax fighting without his wings ...

I'm certain there's a proper (metal?) master of each primarch's handsculpted original from which they can make new moulds if needed. Shouldn't be as much of a long term issue for lower quantity kits like that (as far as I'm aware).

 

They actually did mention alternate primarch loadouts and versions a few years back at a Weekender or a similar event. Russ with spear would definitely fall into that category. However, I'd say there's other things in 30k which need attention first in my opinion!

Edited March 31, 2021 by Darkwrath121

[StrangerOrders]

In terms of attention I would say Plastic Breachers and Assault Marines are a plus.

 

If we want to talk about growing the Hobby, then I would definitely say that at least having the core troops at a 'cheap' plastic price is a good move. I for one do not think I would have grown past one Legion if Tacticals hadnt made the transition.

 

Otherwise you do sort of drastically alter the opportunity cost of wanting to roll any core that isnt Tactical at its core.

 

A good plastic core to draw people in and then bleed them dry with the marvelous resin stuff seems like it should be the priority imo.

[MegaVolt87]

I mean, if it's in the end too much bother for GW to fix HH, 15mm epic HH in plastic would be most welcome. Anyone familiar with flames of war will immediately appreciate how good that could be as a specialist game.

[Gederas]

In terms of attention I would say Plastic Breachers and Assault Marines are a plus.

 

If we want to talk about growing the Hobby, then I would definitely say that at least having the core troops at a 'cheap' plastic price is a good move. I for one do not think I would have grown past one Legion if Tacticals hadnt made the transition.

 

Otherwise you do sort of drastically alter the opportunity cost of wanting to roll any core that isnt Tactical at its core.

 

A good plastic core to draw people in and then bleed them dry with the marvelous resin stuff seems like it should be the priority imo.

Honestly.... I feel that Breachers should either be a resin upgrade kit, or stay resin. There's already plastic Assault Marines. Mainly because of the cross-compatibility of the plastic kits for 30k and 40k (see: Mark III, Mark IV, Cataphractii and Tartaros) and plastic Breachers would likely mean they'd be added to 40k.... Which with how they're pushing Primaris, that ain't happening :lol:

[WrathOfTheLion]

 

In terms of attention I would say Plastic Breachers and Assault Marines are a plus.

 

If we want to talk about growing the Hobby, then I would definitely say that at least having the core troops at a 'cheap' plastic price is a good move. I for one do not think I would have grown past one Legion if Tacticals hadnt made the transition.

 

Otherwise you do sort of drastically alter the opportunity cost of wanting to roll any core that isnt Tactical at its core.

 

A good plastic core to draw people in and then bleed them dry with the marvelous resin stuff seems like it should be the priority imo.

Honestly.... I feel that Breachers should either be a resin upgrade kit, or stay resin. There's already plastic Assault Marines. Mainly because of the cross-compatibility of the plastic kits for 30k and 40k (see: Mark III, Mark IV, Cataphractii and Tartaros) and plastic Breachers would likely mean they'd be added to 40k.... Which with how they're pushing Primaris, that ain't happening

 

Plastic assault marines in a mix of MK VI and MK VIII is not okay for heresy, they need something in the MK II - V  in plastic. Pure MK VI would even be okay, but the current plastic kit can only make 1 actual plastic MK VI assault marine, which is not okay for $50 in the US.

 

I don't think making these kits in 30k means they will exist in 40k. They might, but for what it is, 30k can support the sale of these kits itself.

 

To me, the big thing is they need to find a kernel of kits to make in plastic. The legion specific kits, characters, etc. are totally fine in FW resin, but preparing MK IV assault marines and deimos rhinos in resin is a complete pain in the :.

Edited April 1, 2021 by WrathOfTheLion

[Gederas]

In terms of attention I would say Plastic Breachers and Assault Marines are a plus.

 

If we want to talk about growing the Hobby, then I would definitely say that at least having the core troops at a 'cheap' plastic price is a good move. I for one do not think I would have grown past one Legion if Tacticals hadnt made the transition.

 

Otherwise you do sort of drastically alter the opportunity cost of wanting to roll any core that isnt Tactical at its core.

 

A good plastic core to draw people in and then bleed them dry with the marvelous resin stuff seems like it should be the priority imo.

Honestly.... I feel that Breachers should either be a resin upgrade kit, or stay resin. There's already plastic Assault Marines. Mainly because of the cross-compatibility of the plastic kits for 30k and 40k (see: Mark III, Mark IV, Cataphractii and Tartaros) and plastic Breachers would likely mean they'd be added to 40k.... Which with how they're pushing Primaris, that ain't happening

 

Plastic assault marines in a mix of MK VI and MK VIII is not okay for heresy, they need something in the MK II - V  in plastic. Pure MK VI would even be okay, but the current plastic kit can only make 1 actual plastic MK VI assault marine, which is not okay for $50 in the US.

 

I don't think making these kits in 30k means they will exist in 40k. They might, but for what it is, 30k can support the sale of these kits itself.

 

To me, the big thing is they need to find a kernel of kits to make in plastic. The legion specific kits, characters, etc. are totally fine in FW resin, but preparing MK IV assault marines and deimos rhinos in resin is a complete pain in the :.

It's Mark VI and Mark VII actually. There's not any Mark VIII in the kit (all Mark VIII plastics are either the chest piece for the Sergeants in Tactical squads, or the Deathwatch Kill-Team).

 

But I hear your point. A Mark IV or Mark VI assault squad in plastic would be nice.

[Darkwrath121]

Other specialist games don't need to justify their plastic kits with 40k viability. It's simply THEIR core range, and GW seem perfectly able and happy to support them with plastic kits, and turn a profit. So in the case of 30k, any plastic kits having any 40k crossover (if even for bits) is enough of a leg up over Titanicus, Aeronautica, and a lot of Necromunda stuff. No need to judge it by GW's attitudes to firstborn in standard 40k. Edited April 1, 2021 by Darkwrath121

[StrangerOrders]

Other specialist games don't need to justify their plastic kits with 40k viability. It's simply THEIR core range, and GW seem perfectly able and happy to support them with plastic kits, and turn a profit. So in the case of 30k, any plastic kits having any 40k crossover (if even for bits) is enough of a leg up over Titanicus, Aeronautica, and a lot of Necromunda stuff. No need to judge it by GW's attitudes to firstborn in standard 40k.

Glances at WB Praetors in all of their Chaos Lord-y glory.

 

I... I don't think GW is too worried about their models being used in 40k.

[Indefragable]

I think for any part of GW/FW's portfolio to stand on its own, the products designed for it need to be made for it and not assumed that customers will source from elsewhere (like the 40k range). It's one thing to have a kit with both  kits deliberately in mind (plastic Contemptor, Tartaros, Cataphractii, MkIV/III, etc...), it's another thing to be like "yea, if they really wanted to they can always take the hammers from stormcasts and the flying sharks from the sea elves." Like, the ability to creatively do that on your own is awesome, but if they officially want a flying shark to be part of HH, then they need to either make a HH-specific flying shark or officially slap HH on the flying shark box (no, I am not actually advocating for a flying shark in 30k). 

 

 

...that's my way of saying that plastic 30k assault marines should be a thing, and not assume that every customer will cannabalize the 40k Assault Marine kits (even if they do). 

Edited April 1, 2021 by Indefragable

[WrathOfTheLion]

 

It's Mark VI and Mark VII actually. There's not any Mark VIII in the kit (all Mark VIII plastics are either the chest piece for the Sergeants in Tactical squads, or the Deathwatch Kill-Team).

 

But I hear your point. A Mark IV or Mark VI assault squad in plastic would be nice.

 

You're definitely right, I meant MK VII but mistyped. I won't go back and fix it, because that would invite confusion. Still my point is that you can't use the 40k assault marine squad to do anything useful for HH without pillaging your wallet, it just simply isn't economical with only 1/5 being directly usable.

 

Some usable mark assault marine would be fantastic. I've done some of the current MK IV in resin, it's just a complete pain to handle with cleaning the resin, removing mold slips, etc. I just don't care to do that for assault marines beyond the 10 I've done, would rather assemble a plastic kit.

Edited April 1, 2021 by WrathOfTheLion

[StrangerOrders]

 

It's Mark VI and Mark VII actually. There's not any Mark VIII in the kit (all Mark VIII plastics are either the chest piece for the Sergeants in Tactical squads, or the Deathwatch Kill-Team).

 

But I hear your point. A Mark IV or Mark VI assault squad in plastic would be nice.

 

You're definitely right, I meant MK VII but mistyped. I won't go back and fix it, because that would invite confusion. Still my point is that you can't use the 40k assault marine squad to do anything useful for HH without pillaging your wallet, it just simply isn't economical with only 1/5 being directly usable.

 

Some usable mark assault marine would be fantastic. I've done some of the current MK IV in resin, it's just a complete pain to handle with cleaning the resin, removing mold slips, etc. I just don't care to do that for assault marines beyond the 10 I've done, would rather assemble a plastic kit.

'Glances at three 20 man squads and cringes with trauma'

 

Yeah... those are sadistic to assemble.

 

But they are also a really cool idea that is super evocative and a requirement for alot of cool things, not to mention super thematic for a number of legions.

 

Not exactly the unit you want alot of players to either see as prohibitively expensive or just plain grueling to work with.

[Gederas]

It's Mark VI and Mark VII actually. There's not any Mark VIII in the kit (all Mark VIII plastics are either the chest piece for the Sergeants in Tactical squads, or the Deathwatch Kill-Team).

 

But I hear your point. A Mark IV or Mark VI assault squad in plastic would be nice.

You're definitely right, I meant MK VII but mistyped. I won't go back and fix it, because that would invite confusion. Still my point is that you can't use the 40k assault marine squad to do anything useful for HH without pillaging your wallet, it just simply isn't economical with only 1/5 being directly usable.

 

Some usable mark assault marine would be fantastic. I've done some of the current MK IV in resin, it's just a complete pain to handle with cleaning the resin, removing mold slips, etc. I just don't care to do that for assault marines beyond the 10 I've done, would rather assemble a plastic kit.

I mean... That kit could work for Siege of Terra Blood Angels/White Scars/Imperial Fists because Mark VII was rolled out there :lol:

 

But yeah

[WrathOfTheLion]

But yeah, there's everyone else that doesn't play BA/WS/IF :D

[Taliesin]

 

When did Dimi go back to FW? I thought he left years ago?

 

What was he before, writer? Painter?

 

 

So we have some WHC content today. A DA showcase.

 

https://bit.ly/3u86rUg?fbclid=IwAR04VmN06j1hQtgmCQIuGrq98lYwlShSgxBgacRJnRW-UQjoiXgVikgBkPg

 

This made me happy. It doesn't have to be all crunch and releases, even just giving us some time on WHC to show off some glorious collections indicates to the users that the system does still have merit.

 

This is beyond huge, cause it looks like that Dimi is Anuj's replacement. According to his LinkedIn he started in November, just before Anuj left.

So Neil isn't alone with Heresy after all (and never was, really).

 

 

Do we know what Andy Hoares' involvement is? I thought he was the new lead, could have sworn I recall an article late 2019.

 

 

 

From the Warhammer Open Day 2019 Report:

 

 

As part of the re-structuring, Andy Hoare (ex-Heresy rules writer and head of Specialist Games) is now manager of the Specialist Games Studio and the Age of Darkness studio

 

How this ties into Tony Cottrell's role is unclear to me.

[Darkwrath121]

 

 

Other specialist games don't need to justify their plastic kits with 40k viability. It's simply THEIR core range, and GW seem perfectly able and happy to support them with plastic kits, and turn a profit. So in the case of 30k, any plastic kits having any 40k crossover (if even for bits) is enough of a leg up over Titanicus, Aeronautica, and a lot of Necromunda stuff. No need to judge it by GW's attitudes to firstborn in standard 40k.

Glances at WB Praetors in all of their Chaos Lord-y glory.

 

I... I don't think GW is too worried about their models being used in 40k.

I wasn't saying they worried about that. My message was more a response to the idea that we won't get something like breachers because they don't have a 40k equivalent :)

[Hungry Nostraman Lizard]

To take a stab at tying those rumours in with a more hopeful perspective on the weird site nonsense. Important to remember the mysterious 'Horus Heresy' and 'Warhammer Forge' (https://www.games-workshop.com/en-IE/Warhammer-Forge, not a 404 error, so it's a real page GW are holding back for some reason. So probably the same for the Horus Heresy one) pages that appeared on the GW site very briefly a couple times last year during presumed maintenance/work. I could (theoretically) see some product reshuffling now that FW and GW share account systems.

 

People love primarchs, but moulds don’t last forever. Can they create new moulds from the original assets or does it need a re-sculpt? Seems a shame if the earliest go out of production before the last one is done, but it would be a good excuse to have them all done again gradually in a different pose. I know plenty of you would shell out again, and then there’s the variants that didn’t get their model also, like Corax fighting without his wings ...

I'm certain there's a proper (metal?) master of each primarch's handsculpted original from which they can make new moulds if needed. Shouldn't be as much of a long term issue for lower quantity kits like that (as far as I'm aware).

 

They actually did mention alternate primarch loadouts and versions a few years back at a Weekender or a similar event. Russ with spear would definitely fall into that category. However, I'd say there's other things in 30k which need attention first in my opinion!

 

OOoh, alternate poses for Primarchs would be cool. Sort of like the Krieg troopers of old, we could have "advancing" (action pose) and "at ease" (self explanatory). Most of the primarchs fall into the "advancing" currently, with minus maybe Lorgar and Dorn. 

 

I think it would be cool to see, say, a Guilliman in armor, data slate in hand, holding onto his master crafted "Legatus" (i think it was) bolter. His scenic base, assuming the trend were to continue, could him being suited up. Sanguinius's at ease could maybe have him being preened by attendants? Just spitballing.

 

In terms of attention I would say Plastic Breachers and Assault Marines are a plus.

 

If we want to talk about growing the Hobby, then I would definitely say that at least having the core troops at a 'cheap' plastic price is a good move. I for one do not think I would have grown past one Legion if Tacticals hadnt made the transition.

 

Otherwise you do sort of drastically alter the opportunity cost of wanting to roll any core that isnt Tactical at its core.

 

A good plastic core to draw people in and then bleed them dry with the marvelous resin stuff seems like it should be the priority imo.

It then boils down to what people think is core, yeah? We have the terminators, we have two marks of tacticals. Breachers and assaults in plastic would be nice, definitely - but Scars and Dark Angel players would argue that plastic Outriders is also necessary, I think. 

[Noserenda]

Plastic breachers need to be for two clear reasons: 
1. They are a troop choice
2. Resin shields are a massive pain in the backside for warping

Plus if they stick with mk3 theres a whole bunch more kitbash parts, or if they use Mk2/5/6 theres a backdoor tactical squad.

[Cadmus Tyro]

Plastic breachers need to be for two clear reasons: 

1. They are a troop choice

2. Resin shields are a massive pain in the backside for warping

Plus if they stick with mk3 theres a whole bunch more kitbash parts, or if they use Mk2/5/6 theres a backdoor tactical squad.

Even a single additional sprue to add to the existing Mkiii kit would be fine. X10 shields, new arms and heads....how hard can it be ;)

[infyrana]

 

Plastic breachers need to be for two clear reasons: 

1. They are a troop choice

2. Resin shields are a massive pain in the backside for warping

Plus if they stick with mk3 theres a whole bunch more kitbash parts, or if they use Mk2/5/6 theres a backdoor tactical squad.

Even a single additional sprue to add to the existing Mkiii kit would be fine. X10 shields, new arms and heads....how hard can it be

 

Yep, I'd like to see plastic MkIII Breachers as well as full CCW arm sets, I hate that there are only 3 CCW MkIII arms in the existing box.  I would be happy with an additional sprue pack or something to make this happen (they don't need to include the bolters but they could add some more melee weapon options).  I'd also like to see the missing armour sets all done in plastic too and at least one of them as assault marines with full CCW arms - sure, you can't/won't please everyone unless you do all options, but every extra option is a bonus.