Desired changes for 10th Ed

[Bloody Legionnaire]

All the salt in here is just making me want to play my Death Guard more next edition 

C'mon guys, it's back to where we were in 8th, all armies are. Yes, it sucks a bit that we weren't as favored as some of the other factions turned out to be, but we KNOW this is temporary.. 

I'm going to game and enjoy the next edition. Hopefully I'll have most of the new units (to my collection) that have been waiting around done to game with. I'm a little bummed out I won't be able to do a blightlord spartan party bus, so I guess 2xLand Raiders it is! 

At least none of us had to pay for these crap rules, they are at least free... 

Edited June 3, 2023 by Bloody Legionnaire

[Plaguecaster]

For now

"Free rules" is a temporary thing until the codex and season books come back again 

[Bulwyf]

Another consideration: we aren't getting a new codex for a minimum of a year AFTER 10th comes out officially. Even if we get a codex as soon as they updated their codex launch calendar that will be a minimum FOUR YEAR wait between our 9th and 10th codexes. 

 

Also to consider: GW has said the codexes are not going to introduce a lot of new rules for that army. Just a few new detachments and lore/fluff. So what we are getting in the index is pretty much what you can expect for DG for the entire run of 10th edition. 

 

People expecting some kind of miracle silver lining for DG are simply setting themselves up for massive disappointment. 

[Bloody Legionnaire]

38 minutes ago, Bulwyf said:

Another consideration: we aren't getting a new codex for a minimum of a year AFTER 10th comes out officially. Even if we get a codex as soon as they updated their codex launch calendar that will be a minimum FOUR YEAR wait between our 9th and 10th codexes. 

 

Also to consider: GW has said the codexes are not going to introduce a lot of new rules for that army. Just a few new detachments and lore/fluff. So what we are getting in the index is pretty much what you can expect for DG for the entire run of 10th edition. 

 

People expecting some kind of miracle silver lining for DG are simply setting themselves up for massive disappointment. 

 

It's a dual edged sword of having an early codex, man.. I know, it sucks.. but it's not like death guard is getting singled out and is the only army this has ever happened to. A four year wait doesn't mean much when it's a new edition. Everyone has to be updated and that takes time. 

As I mentioned earlier, it's encouraging for me to see the knights have a detachment which grants fnp. That's all it would take to give DG the resilience everyone expected. Try to see this is only the beginning, not the end.

 

39 minutes ago, Plaguecaster said:

For now

"Free rules" is a temporary thing until the codex and season books come back again 

 

So I could comeback and say "we have crappy rules until codex comes back again."

 

Things change our time will come around again.

[Rain]

10 hours ago, Bulwyf said:

Also to consider: GW has said the codexes are not going to introduce a lot of new rules for that army. Just a few new detachments and lore/fluff. So what we are getting in the index is pretty much what you can expect for DG for the entire run of 10th edition. 

Where did they say this? The 9th edition World Eaters index was totally different from the actual codex, but obviously that was a bit of a different case. Not doubting that they said something like this, just want to read their wording.

Also, even if it’s the plan, it might morph as time goes on. Vanilla Marines will probably keep OoM and be fairly similar to the index, but we Chaos spinoffs who will get our books in ‘24 and ‘25 might be quite different as design goals and ideas drift. I guess we’ll see more once the books start dropping.

[KingYertle]

Can someone explain to me why Mortarion has 2 less wounds then all the other greater daemons that have been previewed?  I'm ok with the toned down datasheet as I expect he will be much cheaper now, but why does the Keeper of Secrets and Lord of Change have 18 wounds when Nurgle's greatest champion only has 16???

 

Mortarion's Auras actually look pretty decent.  Ignore Negative Modifiers and provides the benefit of cover (including to himself I believe) or reroll 1s to wound.  Re-roll Hits would have had better synergy with all our lethal weapons, but its a nice buff for Deamon Engines.  I wish they were based on Contation range rather then just 6 inches though.  

 

Have they previewed anything that interacts with Contagion Range, other than increasing it 3 inches?

[Guzzlrr]

26 minutes ago, KingYertle said:

Can someone explain to me why Mortarion has 2 less wounds then all the other greater daemons that have been previewed?  I'm ok with the toned down datasheet as I expect he will be much cheaper now, but why does the Keeper of Secrets and Lord of Change have 18 wounds when Nurgle's greatest champion only has 16???

 

Mortarion's Auras actually look pretty decent.  Ignore Negative Modifiers and provides the benefit of cover (including to himself I believe) or reroll 1s to wound.  Re-roll Hits would have had better synergy with all our lethal weapons, but its a nice buff for Deamon Engines.  I wish they were based on Contation range rather then just 6 inches though.  

 

Have they previewed anything that interacts with Contagion Range, other than increasing it 3 inches?

because he's not a greater demon he's a Demon Prince and a primarch

Edited June 3, 2023 by Guzzlrr

[WrathOfTheLion]

49 minutes ago, KingYertle said:

Can someone explain to me why Mortarion has 2 less wounds then all the other greater daemons that have been previewed?  I'm ok with the toned down datasheet as I expect he will be much cheaper now, but why does the Keeper of Secrets and Lord of Change have 18 wounds when Nurgle's greatest champion only has 16???

 

Mortarion's Auras actually look pretty decent.  Ignore Negative Modifiers and provides the benefit of cover (including to himself I believe) or reroll 1s to wound.  Re-roll Hits would have had better synergy with all our lethal weapons, but its a nice buff for Deamon Engines.  I wish they were based on Contation range rather then just 6 inches though.  

 

Have they previewed anything that interacts with Contagion Range, other than increasing it 3 inches?

The Daemon Prince on foot gives a 6+++ to your units in Contagion Range, which I think gives some context as to why there's a thing to bump it up 3 inches, as that would make it worth doing.

Edited June 3, 2023 by WrathOfTheLion

[DemonGSides]

Yeah, finally going to have to invest in a daemon prince. I wish the GW kit was more nurgle-y.

 

I did get my order in for my box of Death Guard blind boxes. Getting the whole thing to guarantee the plaguecaster. 

[Dark Legionnare]

52 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

Yeah, finally going to have to invest in a daemon prince. I wish the GW kit was more nurgle-y.

 

I did get my order in for my box of Death Guard blind boxes. Getting the whole thing to guarantee the plaguecaster. 

The "Medusa 5" (God... I miss global campaigns...) Nurgle DP is still a really, really good model.

[Tokugawa]

Tyranids ripper swarm is confirmed to have OC value of 0. If nurgling also oc0, we will lose an useful allied tool.

[Special Officer Doofy]

4 hours ago, Tokugawa said:

Tyranids ripper swarm is confirmed to have OC value of 0. If nurgling also oc0, we will lose an useful allied tool.

 

It literally makes nurglings a worthless unit then besides something for your opponent to kill when they are running out of targets hahaha

[Special Officer Doofy]

7 hours ago, Dark Legionnare said:

The "Medusa 5" (God... I miss global campaigns...) Nurgle DP is still a really, really good model.

 

I love my two daemon princes, definitely not buying the new one (although it is a good model). Only issues I had with the old ones was the goofy faces, but some defiler heads over their faces as a mask made the difference for me.

 

[Dark Legionnare]

7 hours ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

 

I love my two daemon princes, definitely not buying the new one (although it is a good model). Only issues I had with the old ones was the goofy faces, but some defiler heads over their faces as a mask made the difference for me.

 

Agreed~

 

But at the same time, I have a soft-spot for ol' "Having an aneurysm while REALLY trying to take a dump" face.

[Plaguecaster]

So it could mean nothing or just be an error on gw’s part but the site has been updated ready for 10th now showing stuff like battle line, epic hero etc However there is a few either errors or changes with death guard 

 

*poxwalkers are not in the battle line section only plague marines which will mean since not battle line pox walkers are only 3 units max 

 

*possessed are not in the death guard section at all hopefully it doesn’t mean they can’t be taken anymore

 

*the icon bearer and plague champion with fist are in the character section so does that mean they are seperate characters now, maybe the icon will actually do something but as a character leading a unit 

[Tokugawa]

The keywords sorts are not accurate, e.g. IG ordnance battery is not listed under "artillery", but it is the most typical artillery and clearly has "artillery" keyword printed on datasheet. 

 

However, if a product is not listed under a faction, it's possible really unavailable to that faction. I won't be surprised if possessed gone. 

[Special Officer Doofy]

8 hours ago, Plaguecaster said:

So it could mean nothing or just be an error on gw’s part but the site has been updated ready for 10th now showing stuff like battle line, epic hero etc However there is a few either errors or changes with death guard 

 

*poxwalkers are not in the battle line section only plague marines which will mean since not battle line pox walkers are only 3 units max 

 

*possessed are not in the death guard section at all hopefully it doesn’t mean they can’t be taken anymore

 

*the icon bearer and plague champion with fist are in the character section so does that mean they are seperate characters now, maybe the icon will actually do something but as a character leading a unit 

 

It could be an error. In 8th edition in their store, they had some of the Nurgle daemon stuff on their page but not all of it, and stuff was labeled wrong like not having drones in the fast attack section. 

 

I think possessed is gone for DG though with the new models. Just a hunch.

[Vardus]

2 hours ago, Tokugawa said:

The keywords sorts are not accurate, e.g. IG ordnance battery is not listed under "artillery", but it is the most typical artillery and clearly has "artillery" keyword printed on datasheet. 

 

Further to this Angron is listed in the Leaders keyword section. So the sorting system still has a few anomalies to sort out.

[Bulwyf]

I'll say this as we wait for the 10th release and all the leaks for our army to come out. For my personal games where I play with a few friends they had a hard time dealing with DG in 9th edition. I know DG were not good but they can be a PITA especially when you are playing casual games. For my games in 10th DG being weak actually makes it easier to deal with them which in turn means I can actually use Morty again. I had to stop using him in 9th because he was so hard for people to deal with and I only want to play casual games where both people have fun.

[Special Officer Doofy]

2 hours ago, Bulwyf said:

I'll say this as we wait for the 10th release and all the leaks for our army to come out. For my personal games where I play with a few friends they had a hard time dealing with DG in 9th edition. I know DG were not good but they can be a PITA especially when you are playing casual games. For my games in 10th DG being weak actually makes it easier to deal with them which in turn means I can actually use Morty again. I had to stop using him in 9th because he was so hard for people to deal with and I only want to play casual games where both people have fun.

 

Really? My friends had no issues dealing with my DG. After DR got nerfed from 5+++ to -1D they found the weakness, just spam 1D weapons and MWs. My brother's admech ripped through me. Our Dark Angels player is the one who had the worst feel bads, he shelved his army because of how amazing it was. Our Tyranid players were both monster lists and not hordes and they ran the tables when their codexes came out too. My DG did alright when it's codex came out but it was all uphill battles from there.

 

I won't have games of 10th, I'm quitting for now. Not supporting GW after how dirty they did DG. I'll peak back in when the codex comes out, but I doubt it will bring me back, let alone whenever that is. 9 codexes in the first 12 months is absolutely pathetic for 2023 and a billion dollar company. We all got Diablo 4 anyways, there was not going to be any 40k in our lives the next year anyways haha.

[Tokugawa]

Loyalist index released, we could see the profile of some shared units:

 

basic dreadnought: trash.

predator: 1 twin-linked shot, 2 normal shots. not too good, not too bad. 

vindicator: very powerful gun profile, well…DG can't take it.

[Rain]

8 hours ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

We all got Diablo 4 anyways, there was not going to be any 40k in our lives the next year anyways haha.

 

Yeah, D4 is going to cut into my slow army building process even more. It's so good. I have a buddy to play with, which makes it even better, coop is a blast. I'm kind of shocked by how much I've been enjoying it given my general cynicism and disenchantment with modern games coming from western studios as a whole. It's what D3 should have been.

[Bulwyf]

15 hours ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

 

Really? My friends had no issues dealing with my DG. After DR got nerfed from 5+++ to -1D they found the weakness, just spam 1D weapons and MWs. My brother's admech ripped through me. Our Dark Angels player is the one who had the worst feel bads, he shelved his army because of how amazing it was. Our Tyranid players were both monster lists and not hordes and they ran the tables when their codexes came out too. My DG did alright when it's codex came out but it was all uphill battles from there.

 

I won't have games of 10th, I'm quitting for now. Not supporting GW after how dirty they did DG. I'll peak back in when the codex comes out, but I doubt it will bring me back, let alone whenever that is. 9 codexes in the first 12 months is absolutely pathetic for 2023 and a billion dollar company. We all got Diablo 4 anyways, there was not going to be any 40k in our lives the next year anyways haha.

 

I had some friends that had no issues with DG in 9th especially as the edition progressed but for casual games, yes, it was tough. If they brought too much then it wasn't a casual game at that point. So trying to balance lists was difficult because we always share lists. But for most of my friends, yes, casual DG vs casual other armies was in favor of DG. 

[Bulwyf]

tabletop titans or tactics did a stream today for 10th of DG vs black templars. The BT run in a complete bloodbath. The DG were really weak in comparison to the BT. They have the point values but couldn't share them.  It did not look good at all for DG.

[Tokugawa]

23 minutes ago, Bulwyf said:

tabletop titans or tactics did a stream today for 10th of DG vs black templars. The BT run in a complete bloodbath. The DG were really weak in comparison to the BT. They have the point values but couldn't share them.  It did not look good at all for DG.

Would you please to share their lists?