Blurring between Firstborn and Primaris incoming with 10th?

[Orange Knight]

The MkVI start to look off if you give them bare heads. I think the Intercessors are notably better when they have the helmets off.

 

Marines are a funny one because you can argue they aren't really scaled exactly the same way as normal humans.

I think that there is such a thing as "too heroic" however, the old models simply look bad by comparison to the new ones.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

3 hours ago, Blindhamster said:

 

not going to argue too much, but...

taking the walking intercessor from dark imperium as an example, purely because its a pretty neat upright pose so easier for measuring:

height: 4.1cm (my one has the head on a bit of an angle so possibly actually a little taller than that)

top of head to groin: 2.3cm

femur length (based on middle of knee to top of hip as tha is where your femur is lol): 1.2cm

 

that looks roughly correct to me. its not 100% but its pretty  close to what it should be, i don't own any HH marines so can't measure those.

Homie, what?

 

Your Femur’s are longer (the longest bone in your body) than your tibia…

 

These models do not have better proportions. Legacy marines were the same. That’s part of what made them look so terrible.

Edited April 14, 2023 by Bloody Legionnaire

[Blindhamster]

8 minutes ago, Bloody Legionnaire said:

Homie, what?

 

Your Femur’s are longer (the longest bone in your body) than your tibia…

 

These models do not have better proportions. Legacy marines were the same. That’s part of what made them look so terrible.

 

Sorry homie.

 

So, here's a riever (which has the same proportions, but without sticky out bits that obscure things more). I drew the lines roughly where the marines bones would be (rather than notional lines outside the armour that really don't mean anything).

The femur is about right, source (measuring from my ankle to behind my knee is about the same length as behind my knee to my hip, i.e. my femur, whilst my femur itself is longer than any other bone, there are a lot more bones that make up the lower leg, also the way your femur is in relation to pelvis etc means its actually on an angle, not straight, so whilst its longer, that length contributes somewhat less to height). It may be very slightly too short, but if so, it's barely the case. remember that the marines feet aren't on the ground, they're inside armour, at least as thick as the "sole" of the boot.

oh and here's a HH mk6 marine where I did the same:

looks pretty similar to the riever to me...

 

Anyway, we're going off topic, we can both throw around evidence one way or another of our plastic soldiers anatomy, but ultimately they're plastic soldiers that aren't even human, so who knows exactly what is right?

[Robbienw]

Mk VI look better proportioned.  Might also be because they have less extra plating all over them than mkX, more streamlined than mkX.

 

I remember the initial rumours of mkX armour came out around 2014, plus there are jes concept sketches out there of dates 2014 of space marine MK10 armour parts.  No mention of Primaris differential at the time in the rumours or on the sketches.

[Blindhamster]

27 minutes ago, Robbienw said:

Mk VI look better proportioned.  Might also be because they have less extra plating all over them than mkX, more streamlined than mkX.

 

I remember the initial rumours of mkX armour came out around 2014, plus there are jes concept sketches out there of dates 2014 of space marine MK10 armour parts.  No mention of Primaris differential at the time in the rumours or on the sketches.

I think the trim above the knee is a big part of it, really messes with the appearance.

 

I still tend to feel they (mkx) look better and Better proportioned, but having just drawn the lines myself, there really isn’t a fat lot of difference in the proportions of the new mk6 and the mkX, it’s just sheer size really. So I learned something there lol. 

 

[Blindhamster]

On 4/9/2023 at 12:41 PM, Blindhamster said:

I kind of hope it’s just new sternguard, but with some models clearly being mkx

Was correct.

 

I know the amount of pre-mkX parts isn’t quite to @Kallas liking, but I’m going to also predict that the MPK will have more, probably at least one torso, and set of legs that are more blatantly not mkX.

 

It’s also interesting they aren’t called out as primaris, just that they’re in mkX, suspect that will indeed be the norm now, the differentiation will be in armour, not primaris or not.

 

really making me think we’ll see tactical intercessors blending those two units too

[Kallas]

16 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

I know the amount of pre-mkX parts isn’t quite to @Kallas liking

Two bits of non-MkX 

It's a joke that they claimed it's actually mixing them. So stupid.

[Blindhamster]

1 minute ago, Kallas said:

Two bits of non-MkX 

It's a joke that they claimed it's actually mixing them. So stupid.

I imagine there will be more in the mpk set, though I think they’re probably still going to be primarily mkX, hopefully, at least one set of legs with no rim, reminiscent of mk7 and one with no knees like mk6. 

[Kallas]

10 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

I imagine there will be more in the mpk set, though I think they’re probably still going to be primarily mkX, hopefully, at least one set of legs with no rim, reminiscent of mk7 and one with no knees like mk6. 

One would hope so, but I don't suggest holding your breath. 

[Captain Idaho]

The key thing, regardless how GW presents the models (I would prefer on a personal level older armour marks and bits) is to allow us to just take Sternguard. 

 

Finally. We can just use our Sternguard models. I can use my Firstborn and another player can use his Primaris but ultimately it won't matter.

 

That's something GW should have done a long time ago and I think the penny has finally dropped. 

[WrathOfTheLion]

I wonder if the Jump pack lads from SM2 will just be assault marines?

[Captain Idaho]

Mind wondering but I'm certain with the new Sternguard we'll see new Vanguard. Certain.

 

The question is the rules. GW doesn't like to give units options they don't have access to in the boxed set, especially as kitbashing has become less prominent in recent years with the nature of kits. So will Sternguard be limited to purely what we've seen here or will folk be able to take plasma guns, melta, Grav Cannons etc like days of old?

 

That would apply to Vanguard of course.

 

I wait with baited breath on this one.

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 minute ago, Captain Idaho said:

Mind wondering but I'm certain with the new Sternguard we'll see new Vanguard. Certain.

 

The question is the rules. GW doesn't like to give units options they don't have access to in the boxed set, especially as kitbashing has become less prominent in recent years with the nature of kits. So will Sternguard be limited to purely what we've seen here or will folk be able to take plasma guns, melta, Grav Cannons etc like days of old?

 

That would apply to Vanguard of course.

 

I wait with baited breath on this one.

I suspect loadouts will take a pretty large hit. A few Codexes already went through that crucible in 9th Edition, notably Chaos Space Marines/World Eaters.

 

I.e., I wouldn't kitbash a bunch of Sternguard right now expecting a bunch of options, but making most anything from the CSM codex is safe, given the current state of either book.

[Blindhamster]

12 minutes ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

I suspect loadouts will take a pretty large hit. A few Codexes already went through that crucible in 9th Edition, notably Chaos Space Marines/World Eaters.

 

I.e., I wouldn't kitbash a bunch of Sternguard right now expecting a bunch of options, but making most anything from the CSM codex is safe, given the current state of either book.

This

[Captain Idaho]

To be fair, all my Sternguard are bolter armed (so can be 30K Seekers too) and most people did similar with Sternguard anyway, concentrating on standard bolters or combi weapons, so being limited to that will aggravate the least amount of people.

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 minute ago, Captain Idaho said:

To be fair, all my Sternguard are bolter armed (so can be 30K Seekers too) and most people did similar with Sternguard anyway, concentrating on standard bolters or combi weapons, so being limited to that will aggravate the least amount of people.

What you've already got as well is what you've got and made decisions with at the time. The only thing to caution against is building new squads, what're already built are built.

[Blindhamster]

i hope the sergeant gets a melee weapon still personally, I also wonder if this will also show veteran intercessors going to legends.

[WrathOfTheLion]

36 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

i hope the sergeant gets a melee weapon still personally, I also wonder if this will also show veteran intercessors going to legends.

Veteran intercessors were a swing and a miss. I can't even tell you where they go in a DA chapter organization. They're not Deathwing, so can't be in the 1st, they're not on a bike, so can't be in the 2nd, they aren't company veterans either...

[Blindhamster]

1 minute ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

Veteran intercessors were a swing and a miss. I can't even tell you where they go in a DA chapter organization. They're not Deathwing, so can't be in the 1st, they're not on a bike, so can't be in the 2nd, they aren't company veterans either...

I have two squads, one melee and one ranged, so I’ll need to rejig them lol

[WrathOfTheLion]

Just now, Blindhamster said:

I have two squads, one melee and one ranged, so I’ll need to rejig them lol

I ended up not bothering to make any.

 

Now as I think though, updating Sternguard solidifies that units like Sanguinary Guard, Wolf Guard, etc. may see a nice refresh this edition. It's not just a one off for Terminators.

[Orange Knight]

3 hours ago, Kallas said:

Two bits of non-MkX 

It's a joke that they claimed it's actually mixing them. So stupid.

 

I'll be swapping those bits out. The mkX helmet looks a lot better than the MkVII in my opinion.

[Blindhamster]

The mk7 one does look weird, it has a smaller grill than normal 

[Kallas]

9 minutes ago, Orange Knight said:

I'll be swapping those bits out. The mkX helmet looks a lot better than the MkVII in my opinion.

You do you. Just the statement they made that it was incorporating parts from previous armour marks was such a...nothing. One helmet and a not-thought-out inclusion of the Heresy-era studs (on a piece of MkX) is not really anything.

 

If they'd actually gone with proper inclusion of other marks, sure, but this is a nothing burger.

[Blindhamster]

31 minutes ago, Kallas said:

You do you. Just the statement they made that it was incorporating parts from previous armour marks was such a...nothing. One helmet and a not-thought-out inclusion of the Heresy-era studs (on a piece of MkX) is not really anything.

 

If they'd actually gone with proper inclusion of other marks, sure, but this is a nothing burger.

Intercessors have had studded shoulder pads since release to tbf. 
 

i think they’ll be quite selective in which parts they include, but I do think we will see some more in the mpk

[Kallas]

2 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

Intercessors have had studded shoulder pads since release to tbf. 

Oh ok, so it's just the one piece of gear from other marks, that makes it better