Potential Codex Space Marine Leaks

[Mogger351]

There's been a leak of some details, compiled by the ever helpful and calm Auspex Tactics:

 

Link to text

[MithrilForge]

Thanks for that 

 

M. 

[Brother_Angelus]

Anyone got a text source?

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

I do feel that if OoM is going to hit rolls only some serious balancing needs to come with that change. OoM is currently the main source of power in space marines.

 

Very curious how they will handle divergent chapters as they need to keep the index alive for them in theory. That was not mentioned in the leak for my divergent brethren who can't spare a moment to watch.

[Dark Shepherd]

The Stormlance Taskforce aka White Scars detachment looks like it could be fun for Thunderwolf Cavalry heavy armies due to the mounted keyword

[Kastor Krieg]

 

Sad face. I guess my Sniper Scouts will become not-Eliminators then. Womp womp woooooomp :|

[Kastor Krieg]

Oath getting nerfed to "hits only", and to wound only for First Company is a boo-hiss moment. The dex didn't really need that nerf.

[Lord_Ikka]

Interesting to see the condensing of characters, no more splitting of Primaris/Firstborn Captains/LTs/etc...- that does clear up a little bit of the bloat, as does removing some of the older characters. 

[Emperor Ming]

Good, reroll hit and wounds was crazy

[L30n1d4s]

Anvilus Siege Force looks powerful for gunlines... Heavy Weapons getting +1 to hit and +1 to wound if they stand still basically gives them a (slightly worse) version of Oath of Moment for free (well, except for giving up mobility). Add in a Dread for rerolls of all 1s to Hit and infantry units like massed Intercessors, Heavy Intercessors, Hellblasters, Devastators, Eliminators, and Desolaters are going to make quite the Fire Base!

Edited September 16, 2023 by L30n1d4s

[Kastor Krieg]

Heh, so kinda as I suspected - Primaris is getting rolled back, Firstborn are "out" but effectively not at all - there's no reason most of our Firstborn models cannot be used as "Scouts" or "Intercessors" and others.

7 minutes ago, Emperor Ming said:

Good, reroll hit and wounds was crazy

Lol, no it really wasn't. Vanilla Marine dex had 52% wins.

[Zoatibix]

16 minutes ago, Emperor Ming said:

Good, reroll hit and wounds was crazy

I think it was okay on a single target unit.  I play Drukhari and can hand out to hit RRs on several of my units per turn. 
 

[Kallas]

17 minutes ago, Kastor Krieg said:

Firstborn are "out" but effectively not at all - there's no reason most of our Firstborn models cannot be used as "Scouts" or "Intercessors" and others.

Except for the various models that don't have direct analogues, and the Aspect Warrior Primaris units being of different make up, but yeah sure.

 

26 minutes ago, Emperor Ming said:

Good, reroll hit and wounds was crazy

It is really strong into some armies (Knights), really meh into others (GSC). Honestly, I hope they reduce its direct, single-target power and make it a little bit wider in application. Not sure how they'd do it though.

[jimbo1701]

Sniper scouts gone was inevitable following the reveal and actually makes eliminators have more of a defined role so I think it’s a decent move. 
 

With the changes to characters now all being generic and not segregated I do wonder if this edition will see the tactical and devastator squads swansong. Clearly some units like land raiders are staying and it makes me wonder if some of the other tanks will stay too and perhaps get a new cupola sprue so they have primaris crew etc. 

 

The detachments are a great way to allow subfactions for all armies to be represented but not restricted and I welcome this move. Maybe some white dwarf potential further down the line, but in general it looks as if each faction will have a vanilla all round option (from the index) plus more specific ones, which is great. 
 

OOM change I’m split about. It wasn’t as overpowered as people thought it would be and the win rates are testament to that. It didn’t score very well at different point levels though. 

[Petitioner's City]

I guess a lot of things aren't "gone" per se, depending on how legends and index cards count going forth? Will scout sniper squads still be a card in a pdf? Will the split officers be the same on cards too? Will the legends/non-core cards be radically altered given these changes?

[LostTemplar]

I noticed that the primaris captain and captain now became fused in that leak. I hope they don't forget the heavy bolt pistol and that the trueborn and primaris LT datasheets also become merged.

[jimbo1701]

For units that convey the same bonus and have the same armour type it makes sense to condense. I also think now that the term primaris is disappearing firstborn players can simply run their older models as slightly different units easily enough with a few weapon swaps / proxies. Ie outriders / atv for bikes / attack bikes, land speeders for storm speeders, sooner scouts for eliminators, assault squads as AIwJP etc. obviously the firstborn characters / neo-units (terminators / scouts / sternguard can just be a direct swap. 
 

in finding the new streamlining a bit silly though as who is going to take a lt with power sword and bolt pistol over the lt with storm shield / power sword and neo volkite for example. Points granularity was a key part of the game for me. 

[Subtleknife]

Whelp as expected, first founding chapters (bar those who get special attention) are losing a lot of flavour and uniqueness. I had so much hope after 8th, this is just dissapointing. Not very happy with GW. Each first founding should have equal treatment.

Edited September 16, 2023 by Subtleknife

[Iron Father Ferrum]

1 minute ago, Subtleknife said:

Whelp as expected, first founding chapters are losing a lot of flavour and uniqueness. I had so much hope after 8th, this is just dissapointing. Not very happy with GW.

 

. . . GW literally said this was the path moving forward.  It should come as no surprise.

[quasistellar]

It just seems like they separated the chapter rules from the chapter, but you can still make your chapter have its traditional flavor. It's just that now you can, say, make an ultramarines task force that specializes in bikes or whatnot. I don't see any problem with this.

 

This lets me keep adding cool models to my Iron Hands army and not be an efficiency waste. I can just run a different detachment.

 

Seems like a smart sales move IMO 

Edited September 16, 2023 by quasistellar

[ShibeKing]

I like the idea of detachments a lot. I had this unrealistic wish for this codex to follow the 30k set up though. Have a bunch of generic Rite of Wars every chapter could use, but giving each First Founding Chapter their unique Rites of War.

 

Again. A wish I knew would never come to pass since GW wants to streamline. I also feel like if we SM players got this, there's a chance GW wouldn't do the same for CSM.

[Mogger351]

My main concern is that it doesn't sound like there's much support for jump troops in the brief summary given, which my raven guard has more of than sneaky bois, so I was hoping to get thrown a bone somewhere.

[Alternis]

I’ve gotta say, storm lance detachment sounds very tasty with blood angels. 

 

Advance & charge AND fall back & charge? 
 

stratagems for reactive 6” move and deep strike turn 1?
SIGN ME UP. 

however that Oaths nerf is a concern.

I am wondering if GW are going to do something silly like change Guilliman’s ability to give Oath re roll to wounds, and take away the 2 oath targets, so only ultramarines have access to OG oaths, but everyone else has a lesser version?

[Marshal Reinhard]

Haven't watched the video. Is the nerf to OoM in a vaccum of other changes? Does the codex not provide a slew of other buffs? Feel like that's how the codex releases typically go

[Iron Father Ferrum]

The "leaks" are thin on specifics -- they cover a few things, like the Detachment names and a couple special rules, but overall don't provide *that* much data.