Warhammer30k Astartes MKVI Assault Marines

[Robbienw]

The sprues are fantastic, would have liked a power sword and axe in the set, but otherwise perfect.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Robbienw

[Matrindur]

1 hour ago, Robbienw said:

The sprues are fantastic, would have liked a power sword and axe in the set, but otherwise perfect.

I'm sure they could have reduced the number of pouches and grenades to fit those on there but I at least hope they will come with the plastic melee weapons on the roadmap

[WrathOfTheLion]

2 hours ago, Marshal Rohr said:

That’s awesome, can’t wait to start knocking these guys out. 
 

Does the new website still put things up for PreOrder in the US at 10am EST?

It should still be 1 PM EST/10 AM PST.

[01RTB01]

2 hours ago, Matrindur said:

I'm sure they could have reduced the number of pouches and grenades to fit those on there but I at least hope they will come with the plastic melee weapons on the roadmap

I really don't understand why the melee weapons in plastic weren't released alongside the assault marines.

 

Yet again I have the choice of 3d printed special melee weapons or wait until spring to finish building/ painting the new stuff.

 

I appreciate they can't release all at once but this really is ridiculous. They managed to knock out heavy and special weapons sets when the base tac marines dropped. This is another cockup to add to the list.

 

Note as well they still haven't show the rear of the assault marines assembled and painted as there's no 360 view. Numpties.

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 hour ago, 01RTB01 said:

Note as well they still haven't show the rear of the assault marines assembled and painted as there's no 360 view. Numpties.

I don't understand that one, I think the jump packs look a lot better when you see them in totality. From the images we have seen of the back. You'd think they'd want to give them a nice presentation.

Edited December 2, 2023 by WrathOfTheLion

[Nephaston]

13 hours ago, Matrindur said:

Also it does seem like the jumppack sprue doesn't have anything on there needed for the bodies, same for the other way around so it might be possible that they also use this jumppack sprue for destroyers in the future? 

 

I absolutely love how the 30k sprues are set up with other kits in mind. Absolutely stellar in regards to foresight and efficiency from the vehicle sprue to the special/heavy weapons, and now with the jump packs.

We might even see alternate jump packs for Mark agnostic use.

 

Makes me wish the 40k marines were set up that smart.

[m0nolith]

11 hours ago, Robbienw said:

The sprues are fantastic, would have liked a power sword and axe in the set, but otherwise perfect.

I’m gonna be they’re going to release a CC weapons set with exactly those things. 

[Ahzek451]

I didnt realize this kit with 10 models is $70. Am I missing something, I mean...why?

Edited December 3, 2023 by Ahzek451

[Mogger351]

4 hours ago, Ahzek451 said:

I didnt realize this kit with 10 models is $70. Am I missing something, I mean...why?

It's a lot of plastic and chaper by a large degree than any other assault marines have been before? Better question is, why would you expect them to be cheaper?

[lansalt]

21 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

It's a lot of plastic and chaper by a large degree than any other assault marines have been before? Better question is, why would you expect them to be cheaper?

Maybe because it has half the sprues than any of the legion tactical squad kits and previous plastic assault kits had more weapons and the option to be build without jump packs.
But as we all know, the price of GW kits owes more to novelty, perceived game value, and distribution costs, than the actual amount of plastic inside.

[Halandaar]

 

5 hours ago, Ahzek451 said:

I didn't realize this kit with 10 models is $70. Am I missing something, I mean...why?

 

Yeah you're missing that these are the cheapest (per model) Assault Marines that GW has released since the first plastic ones in 3rd Edition and that is not an exaggeration. 

Edited December 3, 2023 by Halandaar

[01RTB01]

6 hours ago, Ahzek451 said:

I didnt realize this kit with 10 models is $70. Am I missing something, I mean...why?

The old 5 man assault squad was £35.

The 5 man primaris jump squad is £37.50.

The 10 man heresy squad is £42.50.

 

This has been raised and explained on previous pages... The number maybe bigger but proportionately it's the cheapest.

 

My only gripe is they haven't released the plastic cc weapons alongside it but, they will arrive in spring at some point.

[lansalt]

I'd say that comparing them to previous Assault Marine kits is precisely the "perceived value" GW counts on.
If you compare this kit to other recent kits with similar amount of sprues and models (Hearthkyn Warriors or even Assault Intercessors), it's clear that GW puts a premium on jump packs for their in-game value.
Anyway this is just me mumbling while I'm already planning to buy 2 boxes

[Halandaar]

On 12/3/2023 at 1:33 PM, lansalt said:

I'd say that comparing them to previous Assault Marine kits is precisely the "perceived value" GW counts on.
If you compare this kit to other recent kits with similar amount of sprues and models (Hearthkyn Warriors or even Assault Intercessors), it's clear that GW puts a premium on jump packs for their in-game value.
Anyway this is just me mumbling while I'm already planning to buy 2 boxes

 

Okay but it's pretty well established by now that number of models, number of sprues and "in-game value" have pretty much no bearing on the price of a kit.

 

As you say, 10 Hearthkyn Warriors use the same amount of frames as the Heresy Assault Squad (3x A5 sprues), but cost less. Terminators are the same kit size (3x A5) and priced in between the other kits, but for half as many models. An Intercessor Squad has an extra sprue (4x A5), but costs less than the Terminators and Assault Marines. An Avatar of Khaine, which is the smallest kit of the lot at 1x A4 frame is the most expensive by a significant margin. 

 

The design, tooling and manufacturing costs probably don't vary by all that much, the only real variable is how many kits GW thinks it can sell each player. The average Eldar collector for example would probably buy 2 or 3 Guardian boxes, but wouldn't ever buy more than a single Avatar. So in order to make back their investment on design and production, and to hit the desired level of profit, the kits that they sell less of naturally have a higher price point. 

 

Look at this way, if I book a venue and a band and that costs me £10,000, and I reckon they'll draw 500 people, I need to charge £20 per ticket just to break even on those initial costs, before i make any profit. If I think they'll bring in 750 people, I could charge £14 a ticket and still cover my costs. 

 

GW kit pricing is basically that; "If we think we'll sell more units, those units can be less expensive even if it's the same amount of raw material, and we still make the target profit we want over time."

 

So based on that, comparing similarly sized kits (either in model count or raw plastic terms) is not anywhere near as useful as a comparison against a unit with a similar role, and although Heresy Assault Squads vs 40K Assault Squads is itself not a true like for like comparison (because Heresy armies typically field more max-size infantry units than 40k ones), it's probably still the best comparison available to us. 

 

At £4.25 per model the Heresy ones compare very favourably against their resin predecessors (£9 per model), the new Jump Pack Assault Intercessors (£7 per model) and even the 2016 Firstborn Assault Squad (£5 per model on release)

 

 

Edited December 4, 2023 by Halandaar

[lansalt]

16 minutes ago, Halandaar said:

The design, tooling and manufacturing costs probably don't vary by all that much, the only variable is how many kits GW thinks it can sell each player.

Fair enough, although I would say that falls under the meaning of "perceived value" I mentioned.

[Antarius]

I don't really think older assault marines kits could be assembled without the jump pack. I mean, sure, they could but they didn't come with alternate chest (or even backpacks iirc), so you'd have guys with straps for jump packs on their chests running around.

On the value-for-money front and GWs pricing policy, I guess we'll just have to accept that there's a little bit from column A and a little bit from column B. Because yeah, amount of sprues and expected sales clearly means something, but at the same time, I can't believe that they expect to sell less of the Warhammer 40.000 Assault dudes than the HH assault dudes, so they clearly also price things according to what they think they can "get away with" (I really don't want to get into the "are GW prices ok?" debate, just saying there's clearly some nuance to it).

[Waaagh?]

11 minutes ago, Antarius said:

I don't really think older assault marines kits could be assembled without the jump pack. I mean, sure, they could but they didn't come with alternate chest (or even backpacks iirc), so you'd have guys with straps for jump packs on their chests running around.

On the value-for-money front and GWs pricing policy, I guess we'll just have to accept that there's a little bit from column A and a little bit from column B. Because yeah, amount of sprues and expected sales clearly means something, but at the same time, I can't believe that they expect to sell less of the Warhammer 40.000 Assault dudes than the HH assault dudes, so they clearly also price things according to what they think they can "get away with" (I really don't want to get into the "are GW prices ok?" debate, just saying there's clearly some nuance to it).

 

The old Assault Marine kit did come with alternate chests and normal backpacks bud. 

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

On 11/26/2023 at 7:04 PM, Burni said:

Those transfers are great. I hope they price them sensibly. Can see myself using them for 40K.

 

Edit: No Foes Remain makes a great point though. 

I expect them to be in the same price range as the Legion specific transfers. 

[Dr. Clock]

On 12/9/2023 at 2:22 AM, Antarius said:

I can't believe that they expect to sell less of the Warhammer 40.000 Assault dudes than the HH assault dudes, so they clearly also price things according to what they think they can "get away with"

Warhammer 40,000 as a rules and model line anticipates smaller armies on the whole, so the basic pricing framework is 'Battlelines are in 10s, specialists in 5s, heavy/mounted in 3s'

 

Heresy basically defaults to 'Battleline are in 20s, everything else in 10s'. What it also has is the expectation that 'upgrade sprues' will be added to the basic boxes, so some variants are going to be more expensive if you have any desire for things like support squads, to say nothing of legion heads or whatnot.

 

This is a pretty clever marketing strategy as it gives them a line that appears cheaper to enter, even though as soon as you budget for any of the upgrade/alternate sprues or obviously forgeworld, they end up being basically the same price.

 

This is also pretty much why the rules divide between 40k and Heresy is so strong internal to GW: they know that the Heresy kits would be priced higher if they were just released into 40k. At the same time, 40k kits are designed to make full use of CAD sculpting on an individual model basis, while Heresy kits are more constrained in essentially needing to adhere to the legacy level of modularity and poseability.

 

It does not escape me at this point that people who never took the Primaris pill, and who may continue to gripe about the difference in design ethos of contemporary vs OG kits are essentially still being served by the Heresy line... but only if they actually value the modularity (and occasional economy) over the more diverse and distinctive posing you get in 40k... Oldmarines really are alive and kicking!

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

 

[Scribe]

1 hour ago, Dr. Clock said:

but only if they actually value the modularity (and occasional economy) over the more diverse and distinctive posing you get in 40k... Oldmarines really are alive and kicking!

 

By diverse and distinctive, are you referring to the CAD mono pose, jigsaw puzzle build models, in comparison the the multi-pose kits of old?

[Marshal Rohr]

59 minutes ago, Scribe said:

 

By diverse and distinctive, are you referring to the CAD mono pose, jigsaw puzzle build models, in comparison the the multi-pose kits of old?

Even I’ve got to admit the new sprues are definitely better models than the old sprues after building so many of the new mark 3. No need to extend their legs, proportions look better (except everyone’s weird neck), arms fits easier. I’ve been using resin warder parts on them and them look rad. 
 

I’ll send you one of those tamiya Gundam saws so you can swap the torsos as a Christmas gift. 

[Scribe]

I'm not questioning the quality of kits but the jigsaw puzzle mono pose builds really suppress my joy.

[Dr. Clock]

 

1 hour ago, Scribe said:

By diverse and distinctive, are you referring to the CAD mono pose, jigsaw puzzle build models, in comparison the the multi-pose kits of old?

Yes. I think it's important to focus on the positive features of both paradigms - I don't think one is 'just better' than the other, even though many people will ultimately end up preferring one to the other.

 

34 minutes ago, Scribe said:

I'm not questioning the quality of kits but the jigsaw puzzle mono pose builds really suppress my joy.

It is known. Kitbashing is alot harder or at least laborious these days in 40k, but there's also generally less in-game reward for it... Which is entirely my point - that Heresy is actually aimed at people who prefer more modularity in models and rules, even if many of that target audience would otherwise wish that modularity had remained more core of the mainstream offerings in 40k.

 

TLDR How I learned to stop worrying and cross the streams.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

 

[MoriyaSchism]

1 hour ago, Dr. Clock said:

It is known. Kitbashing is alot harder or at least laborious these days in 40k, but there's also generally less in-game reward for it... Which is entirely my point - that Heresy is actually aimed at people who prefer more modularity in models and rules, even if many of that target audience would otherwise wish that modularity had remained more core of the mainstream offerings in 40k.

 

TLDR How I learned to stop worrying and cross the streams.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

 

What do you mean by modularity in terms of models? Do you mean the special weapon upgrade kits? Most of the new plastic infantry releases for Horus Heresy don't have that much variety in terms of bits compared to the classic Marines. It's all the same helmet and chest plate for the most part just like most Primaris kits. I mean you can still swap arms and weapons on modern 40K models if that's what you mean by modularity.

[Noserenda]

3 hours ago, Scribe said:

 

By diverse and distinctive, are you referring to the CAD mono pose, jigsaw puzzle build models, in comparison the the multi-pose kits of old?

Yeah a thread on the modern 30k plastics really isnt the place to slam Primaris for being monopose :D