Legion Rising

[NemFX]

Why not just use.. Helicopters?

 

For seriously, my Enclave army needed air support, and though my StormRaven / Vertibird project kinda crapped out on me, I do have 9 toy helicopters used as land speeders (with 2x heavy bolters) that are really great standins.

[warsmith]

The plasticard work looks absolutely amazing on those rhino chassis. Not sure if these questions have been asked but would you mind answering/pointing me in the right direction?

 

1. What thickness plasticard are you using for each layer?

 

2. What 'width' is the lower trim layer, and what 'width' is the upper trim layer - they look to be fairly regular in size and I'd love to be able to try and replicate the effect (with some modifications of course).

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Dan

[Subtle Discord]

Your are correct, the 'what thickness is it?' question is common. But it's easy to answer, so it's all good.

Actual 'armour' plates would be done with 1mm or 0.5mm styrene plastic sheet. 'Banding' around the edges are done with 0.4mm layers of styrene plastic sheet. Rivets are 0.75mm diameter styrene plastic rod. Sheet plastic comes as thin as 0.13mm thick (almost like paper), but I find 0.4mm feels heavy enough. I tested with 0.25mm, but it just seemed too thin. If you want a very subtle effect, it would be good, but I wanted more something more striking. I also noticed that the banding on Marine shoulder pads is about 0.25mm 'tall', so heavier seem appropriate for vehicles.

My blog is working its way to showing some of my actual building technique, but right now is concentrating on workspace, tools, and design. When I get there I will talk about things like why I choose certain widths and spacing. Depending on the look I'm aiming for, it can vary.

In this case you're seeing is a 3mm wide 'base' layer, followed by a 2mm wide 'top' layer. I've found that a 0.5mm 'step' produces a nice result. Also, with .75mm rivets, 1mm wide bands 'crowd' the rivet too close to the edge (just 0.125mm on each side) so I aim to give rivets at lease 0.25mm, minimum clearance, on all sides. Most times the thinnest I'll go is 1.5mm wide.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[Subtle Discord]

Quick update to show the Armoured Predator looking 'ugly'.

I played around a little with a different base colour to try to speed up getting the gold to this nice even layer. I used Iyand Darksun Foundation paint, but I found it to be a double edged sword. Yes, it actually matched the Gold quite well, but also changed it to a noticeable brown-gold colour that I wasn't happy with. I found I still had to layer up the gold to get it to the 'true' Gold colour I like as a base. In then end, it seems like a straight trade; 1 layer of Darksun + 2-to-3 layers Gold vs. 3-to-4 layers of Gold.


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Predator_06.jpg
With all that Gold, it's going to look almost obnoxious... in a good way.

It already has many layers of glaze/wash on it, and is coming along well. This Predator has been so long in the making, it's really satisfying to see it with colour, even if it's rough. You build it, and it looks good. You prime it, all the work unifies, and it looks better. But then you paint it, and remember why you put all the effort in to it, as it comes to life.

More progress to show soon.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[DarkVen]

I think with Iyanden Durksun it looks a bit better. Very interesting to see this finished.

Also, kinda question: did you thought about small light-blue oxidation, or fine oil/rusty flowed lines? They make vehicle a bit older.

[Subtle Discord]

Not sure what I'm going to do for weathering and aging. I've seen some really great techniques over the last while, and it's really got me thinking just what I want to do.

Since I'm doing an 'ash waste' basing, in the past I used pale powders to add a dusty ash look to the bottom on the vehicles, and just a simple silver chipped look on the Black. I think I want to keep the dusty ash look, in place of mud/grime, since it works so well on the Black background. I'm still pondering how I want to do paint chipping and something 'more' to, like you said, make them look ancient yet well maintained.

I'll do some more researching. So many techniques to consider, so little time.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[LeeMXT]

This is absolutely incredible work.

 

For one, that havoc Launcher design is great, efficient use of bitz and an exciting design. I'm sure there's more than one person who's seen these and not instantly wanted to thieve that design.

 

Another thing is the playing on the rhino's - as a WE player these look great, I'll be sure to start doing some designs for my rhino's myself.

 

 

 

Inspirational - great work!

 

RD

[Subtle Discord]

Excellent! That's a major motivation behind what I write about and the models I've been showing; Inspiration. I'm glad it's having the desired effect. I know I've gained a ton of insight and ideas from lurking around, I figured it was only fair to give a bit back.

The Havoc Launcher is a perfect example. I know I'm not the only one who's come up with the idea, but I like to think mine is a unique take on it. You get the part with every Rhino, why not make use of it? We can't take Razorbacks? Ok, I'll make my own 'reverse engineered' renegade variant. It's magnetic and a 'standard' size too, so it might find it can become something else with the new codex - whenever that might arrive.

That said, on to a bit of 'bad' and a little 'good'...


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Predator_07.jpg
The Rhino was sooo much faster to do, since it had much less bits, banding, and hardware, but I'm happy with the progress so far.

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Predator_08.jpg
http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Predator_09.jpg
The turret has seen some cleanup, since I wanted to get it together for some painting in the nooks-and-crannies that needs to be done with it assembled.

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Predator_10.jpg
It took a tiny bit of modification to get this hatch to play nice with the added armour plate. A peek inside shows it's magnetic mount.

I've also been finishing little odds-and-ends, like the sponson optics and turret hatch. You are very limited on mounting points on a Predator, due to the turret needing a full 360° to spin. Making use of the turret is very important to me. I'll need to build any gear that will attach to the hatch location with a 'post' to hold the counter-magnet, but that shouldn't be too hard, and it will make them obvious that they go with the Predators. All my Rhino gear magnets sit flush, by comparison.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[Subtle Discord]

Ok, I've got most of the clean-up done on the Predator, so here's a group shot of the first block. The Blue is really contrasting well with the Gold so I will be going with Blue eyes and optics, but I'll add in some Green and the odd Red for variety.

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Block_One_01.jpg

Now I'm moving on to highlights which are going to be a blue-grey ranging from a darkened Shadow Grey to Space Wolves Grey. There's a few highlighted models in this squad, but it was done with a black-grey colour. The change in highlights will be subtle, but it should all help keep the cold feeling.

There will be an Aspiring Champion for the squad and the unit's new Las-cannon (Converted from an old Auto Cannon) is in the bottom right of the picture. This will push the squad over the 10 man limit for the Rhino, but I build squads with a few extra models so I can have options in my lists.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[BloodJunkie]

Has to be said, these are without a doubt some of the best Chaos tanks I have ever seen. Really impressive stuff Subtle, Cant wait to see more!! ;)

[DarkVen]

Would all the armies of Chaos be so cool, we would not need a new dex. We would crush loyalists only with coolness...

 

Black looks pretty nice no doubt.

 

So, what's with next block? What can we expect?

Edited November 29, 2011 by DarkVen

[Subtle Discord]

Funny thing is, for the most part the Black is just Black. I've tired blending Black in many ways, and it does one of two things. Either it turns it to Dark 'Charcoal' Grey, or it's so subtle, it doesn't even register. Either outcome takes more effort then it's worth, in my opinion. I've found Black creates its own perfect blending if you just leave it alone and let real light do its thing. The only thing I do is highlights on edges and some select places. That's the only way I have found that gets Black to 'pop' while not turning Grey.

For now I'm going to get the first block done with highlights and most of the little details. I'll take some tighter photos of that in progress, and also when they're done that step. Hopefully by the time I get that done I'll have chosen what I want to do for my weathering effects. I need to sit down and try a few different things.

I am planning the next block, and doing a bit of work on getting them ready for primer. It's going to be this little group of misfits...


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Block_Two_01.jpg
Here we have a 10 Marine Combat (Assault) Squad, their Rhino transport, plus an Obliterator squad and Dreadnaught for support.

It's going to be a little while before I get to this second block for this thread. They still have some final assembly work that needs to be done while I finish the highlights on the first block. It's good though, it keeps me sane. When I start getting too 'numb' painting, I do a bit of building. Kinda like this...


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Dirge_Caster_01.jpg
I knew I needed to get Dirge Casters on my Predator turrets, but I needed to build a post for their magnets.

Here I took a bit of square plastic tube, glued a back to it, and trimmed it down to make a 'seat'. The magnet was glued into that seat, and then glued on to the post after it was shortened to the right length. From there the post was put in the bottom of the Dirge Caster, and is now ready to attach to my Predator. Neodymium magnets are, hands down, amazing. I keep finding more-and-more places I can put them.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[Watch Commander Danek]

That dread is amazing. Any chance for some clearer shots?

[Subtle Discord]

Funny you should notice the Dreadnaught. It's one of the primary inspirations for the entire look I'm trying to get with all of my vehicles. It's just a stock ForgeWorld Black Legion Dreadnaught, but naturally the ForgeWorld stuff is great, so... yeah... I like him. I'm going to pick up the Iron Warriors Dread at some point (and Black Legion it) to give him a playmate.

The banding was just, right, on this model. I had done a bit of plastic work on vehicles in the past, but this made me want to hug edges, turn corners, and add more points, arrows, and rivets. I started to see how many great lines there are on all of the Human vehicles, and it went from there. This was also the model that got my Gold and Silver techniques much more refined. This time I avoided all dry-brushing or blending, and tried just washes over solid colour. I was still trying to perfect the colour of my wash and my method, so it's good, but not quite as good as I'm getting now.

It's also one of the few models that has any fluff started. I do plan to give a bit of back story and write a little fiction for the army, but that usually can only come once the model is finished, in my opinion. But in this case his name is Tithonus the Unending. It's lifted from a historical myth of a man who asks for, and is granted, immorality. However, Tithonus is cursed in his immortality because he continues to slowly age... but never die. It seemed a perfect fit for a servant of Chaos entombed in a Dreadnaught.

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Dreadnaught_01.jpg
Infused with dark essences distilled from unspeakable rituals that befall the truly unlucky, Tithonus can slow and sometimes reverse the ravages of a millennium. When these essences can not be obtained, Tithonus will be placed within a stasis pocket, lest his hunger push him to irrational actions.
http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Legion_Dreadnaught_02.jpg

He's fully magnetized, so weapon swapping is a snap. I even did his head so it can turn. I am actually considering stripping him down and starting again, just so his gold technique can better match the army and do a change with the gear. With the new theme, I think he might need a Dirge Caster and/or Searchlight to go with that Smoke Launcher. But, I'll think on it some more.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[Watch Commander Danek]

I don't know. Perhaps it's the resin textures but I can't help but feel the silver and gold really pops on the Dread. The cold sterility of the silver compliments the black perfectly, and the warmth in your gold breaks it up just so. The effect is perfect. I also love the work on the skull, and am sure i'm not the only one wanting your recipe there.

 

This is thus far my favorite blog here, and i consider myself a harsh critic of black projects and usually despise Black Legion. Your work though and your approach is very interesting though. Do us all a favor when you can and bring us ground level with some individual shots of your oblits and troops yes? I feel there is alot of subtleties we're missing.

[Captain jOE]

I came over here after you commented on my thread, and wow, just wow... ;)

 

And I thought my conversions were pretty cool. But you just take it to the next level.

 

The Painting is pretty awesome as well. So kudos and keep up the good work!

 

P.S. I normally just despise the look of Chaos marines, but yours are pretty awesome, the first I've seen and actually liked a lot.

Edited November 29, 2011 by Captain jOE

[Subtle Discord]

By popular demand, taken from my blog here at B&C:

Within this simple article you will find the first of the designs I am releasing to the public. There has been one change, however. In order to preserve some of the effort I put into these designs, and make them accessible to everyone, they have been converted in to accurate JPG files.

These are large 2.6MB JPG files (600dpi) that are 100% accurate in scale. These are intended for 8.5"x11" Letter size paper. Be sure to print at high resolution and do not 'scale-to-fit' print margins to ensure accuracy. I can not say how well these will print with Inkjet printers, but a Laser will produce very sharp lines, especially at 1200dpi.

These plans are provided 'as-is', with only minimal instructions. Please keep reading my blog articles to see how I turn plans like this in to actual physical objects. This thread will continue to show progress getting my creations ready for the table.

After clicking a link: To get the full sized 2.6MB JPG be sure to click on 'File' (top left corner of the image) and choose 'Download (original size)'. Otherwise you will only get a scaled down version.


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/From%20the%20Wastes%20Blog%20Photos/Rhino_01_01.jpg
Link - Chaos Rhino Trim Design 1


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/From%20the%20Wastes%20Blog%20Photos/Rhino_02_01.jpg
Link - Chaos Rhino Trim Design 2


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/From%20the%20Wastes%20Blog%20Photos/Rhino_03_01.jpg
Link - Chaos Rhino Trim Design 3


I'll be following up here soon with an entry on my highlighting. This will include some closeup photos of some actual Troops, as well as vehicles.

Until next time, the Dark Gods are calling to me from my painting table. *Eyes glaze over* Must... paint... many... many... highlights...

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[rifter72]

Can't download the file, but I love your work.

[Foxmarine]

Same Here

I like design one and three the most

But they are all amazing

[Subtle Discord]

Strange, they are in a public gallery, there should be no problem. Let me see if I can sort it out.

Edit: Ok, looks like the thumbnail pictures were causing issues with the link. Just click on the photo captions to link to the files.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[LeeMXT]

This has just made my WEEK!

 

Thanks buddy, I'm going to definitely be chopping plasticard this weekend! Been making some attenpts at your havoc launcher design too, its fantastic!

 

Lee/RD

[Subtle Discord]

Highlights... Oh how I hate thee. I can do them, but they are always picky and time consuming. They are also absolutely necessary to make a miniature go from good to great. Even modest highlights add so much to a paint job. For me, the only way I can stand highlighting is to avoid actual blending, and simplify it with simple layering. These details are so small, if you are farther than a foot away from the model, they blend seamlessly on their own.

If I were painting any other actual colour (Black is a shade, not a true colour) I would do at least a little blending on the base colour before adding edge highlighting. But with Black, I find the best results are just to let it be pure Black and natural light will do the rest. This lets the highlights add the desired 'pop' to the miniature, and the base true Black keeps it from looking like really Dark Grey.

If I was painting something to a serious competition level everything would be blended. But good blending takes too much time, and this is a playing army after all. I want it to look kick-ass, don't get me wrong, but it won't be sitting in a display case. So, following my original mantra of, 'Start it messy, then clean it up', I attack highlights like this...


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_03.jpg

Step 1) Choose a side - Rather than trying to paint a perfect width line, just try to have one side 'sharp'. It's easier to 'drag out' an accurate line if you lay the brush flatter. (Just look at youtube video of how a professional 'pin-stripes' paint to get what I mean.) Problem is, many times it will end up making the line too thick, unless you have very good brush control. So, as I said, choose a side to be consistent on, and let the other side be messy. You'll usually do the 'clean' side towards details that would be very hard to clean up in Step 2.

I paint my way up from darkest to lightest, using the lines each time as a guide for the next step. The more steps you do in the colour, the more subtle the effect. (Do enough steps, and it can actually rival blending.) I find 3 steps is the minimum, and 4-to-5 steps is the sweet-spot between time spent vs. desirable effect.

Step 2) Sharpen the messy side - Using the same concept, you can now drag a clean flat brush along side the highlight, cleaning up the messy edge. Since you're just dragging a single smooth line, it's much easier to control, and you can even taper it ever-so-slightly. I usually aim to take a few swipes at a highlight, tapering in ever-so-slightly each time. If you try to get it perfect with just one swipe, you can take too much away. Nothing to do then but start from scratch.

Step 3) Optional clean up - Even if you try very hard to keep one side sharp, some mistakes are going to happen. Using a 000 or 0000 brush with very thinned down colour, you can usually trace a thin line (specially if there's a ridge of some kind) along the 'inside' edge. The thinned paint will want to be pulled in to the edge with capillary action, so you get a clean line, but might need to do a few passes. This takes some practice, but it's worth perfecting.

In my case, I'm lucky to be painting in Black. I do this step with a Black 005 (0.2mm) archival ink pen that I purchased from an art store. Some might call it cheating, but I make use of any tool at my disposal. They are the drop-dead-simplest method I've ever found to 'line' anything. They also do perfectly round eye pupils and can draw great tattoos and/or micro text on scrolls, seals, banners, etc. Just be careful to get the permanent ink variety.

I do eyes (before highlighting) in much the same way...


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_Eyes_01.jpg

Step 1) Base colour - Since I do eyes before highlights, I don't have to worry about any sloppiness hurting surrounding work.

Step 2) Highlight one - Quick and dirty, just try to mimic the shape of the eye along the 'back edge'.

Step 3) Highlight two - Just a quick dash of colour, but make it a bit smaller while still trying to mimic the shape.

Step 4) Clean up - And now go back and 'shape' the eye. Again, you can use the 'flat brush drag' technique much easier from the outside of the eye, making it much easier to follow the eye's line.

Three simple layers will make the eyes pop, without mind numbing effort.

So, let's see this on a few of my Troops. First up, my transition from a neutral Grey highlight to a colder Blue-Grey scheme.


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_01.jpg
Top - My old 4-step range of Grey highlight colours. Bottom - My new 4-step Blue-Grey highlight colours

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_02.jpg
I practice what I preach and test things on spare sprew and miniatures all the time.


In the pictures you can see how the base Dark Grey is actually very close to the old Dark Grey. After that the Blue tint of the new Grey becomes obvious. The new highlights are going to be a bit brighter, but I'm fine with that.


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_04.jpg
http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_05.jpg
Done with the 'old' highlight colours, when you get in close you can see just how straight forward this highlight method is.

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Highlights_06.jpg
Side-by-side view of the 'new' highlights compared to the 'old'.

The miniature with the new highlights in the bottom picture hasn't been cleaned up yet, to give you an idea how this process starts. From there it will be touched up to look more like the one on the right. The old highlights were not bad, but I'm very pleased with the extra punch the new colours have. I also think the colder feel I wanted is subtle-but-noticeable with the new colours.

The funny thing is, up close in the picture the 'new' miniature looks messy compared to the 'old' miniature. But, from just two feet away they almost look the same, even before cleanup. You could easily ignore the final cleanup if speed is of the essence.

My next major update will show the entire squad in 'new' highlight glory, with all the tiny details picked out as well. But, in closing I though I'd toss up a picture of this squad's Aspiring Champion...

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j332/SubtleDiscord/WIP%20Thread%20Photos/Champion_01.jpg

He was started awhile ago, so some details are going to be changed, but nothing too dramatic.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[DarkVen]

Infantry! Finally! ^_^ It looks as good as your tanks.

 

My way of painting has more common with yours - I prefer also to correct mistakes after the main work's done. I think it's much easier to paint playable army this way rather than paint it instantly correct.

 

Very interesting conversion of aspiring champ (and of other marines, I like that mix of 'zerks and CSMs bits). Especially t-l bolter, how did you do it?

[Subtle Discord]

The Champion's Linked-Bolter is from an older metal Chaos Terminator, with a plastic grip taken from a current Bolter converted on, and the bayonet is from the Chaos accessories sprew.

I bulked up with Mega Force and Battle Force box sets over the years, and you always get a bunch of 'Zerkers bundled in. I do plan to field some, but not that many. So, I've gotten quite good at removing and replacing the Khorne symbols, and kit bash the parts in all over the place for variety. I've even started removing the 'fins' on the Khorne helmets so I can add them as just normal Black Legion. Combined with a few packs of Iron Warrior conversion kits I got not too long ago, I can finally add even more variety to the helmets.

I'm never too worried about preserving a certain Mark version on a single Marine. Being forced to use what you can get your hands on for repairs seems to make sense, so some miss-matching doesn't seem out of place.

I'm not aiming to go too crazy on each miniature, but just tweak the odd detail on each one, so the overall force will have a unique look. Just a few simple changes goes a long way to break up monotony. Now, once I get to doing some Chosen Marines, then I'll probably go all-in and take everything I've learned along the way to make them crazy. But before that I'll be finishing some WIP Terminators. So much to do, never enough time...

Edited August 26, 2014 by Subtle Discord

[DarkVen]

Sounds very promising. Are terminators in the next 'block'?