Daemons and Planetstrike

[Seahawk]

Oh right. So yea, no daemons would be able to assault then; it can't possibly be up in the air. Not in the entry, no benefits. Man, now it's all sad face. :drool:

 

On the plus side, there are extremely few enemies that could do this against us. IG stormtroopers, CSM obliterators, Tyranid ravenors gargoyles and spore mines, some dark eldar dudes, and I think really that's it. Not that it'd matter; as noted before, our armies won't even be on the table when they're arriving, except for reserves.

 

the 2 of these together make me worry. the real world rich player will have a major advantage against one with low funds

But it's the same worry with armies, and anything else really, thereby cancelling it out. Each box only comes with 1 gun for plenty of defense lines, so I'm sure it won't have that much of an effect.

 

As for death from above...well it's an awesome statement (yes coined by battletech, ahh a classic), and I always use it.

[Vassakov]

-The Defender's bastions and any other defensive terrain piece with built in weapons CAN USE THEM at no point cost, at BS:2!

 

the 2 of these together make me worry. the real world rich player will have a major advantage against one with low funds.

 

 

Ah, but what BoLS have missed is that apparently, each one of these is (a) an objective and (B) cannot be fired whilst held by the enemy (ie they have a model in Base to Base).

 

Also, Daemons can Assault off the Deep Strike, as they use the Deep Strike rule. The only difference is for them, it isn't optional (as normal DS is)

[Seahawk]

Terminators use the deep strike rule, but it isn't in the unit entry. Daemons use the deep strike rule, but it isn't in the unit entry. According to the rumor:

-Attacking units with the Deep Strike rule in their codex unit entry can assault the turn they deep strike

As you can see, so far as this goes, daemons/terminators cannot assault on the DS, as they don't have the DS rule in their unit entry. Whether it's optional for the unit or not doesn't mean anything. Landspeeders, valkyries, stormtroopers, obliterators, ravenors, gargoyles, spore mines, and only a couple others actually have the special rule Deep Strike in their unit entry. So, either we aren't getting the full quote, or it's going to be a rarely accessed extra ability.

[Draeden]

Actually, I just reread the rules on Daemonic Assault. It says at the end "When a unit becomes available, it enters play by Deep Strike"

 

Which to me means, the first wave doesn't get the assault on deepstrike, but subsequent arriving units do. It's up for debate but that's how I'm reading it.

[Captain Malachi]

Seems like people are looking too deeply in to this. This is probably going to be like apoc, i.e. house rules territory. It'll be up to each individual gaming group how they want to play this as it isn't really all that clear.

[Ian Hockert]

Well there are a number of interesting things about Planetstrike (This comes from reading my LGS's preview copy) from a Daemonic perspective. First of all, everything scores in Planetstrike so you don't necessarily have to bring lots of troops if you don't want to, which could have some advantages for Daemons as our troops on the whole are pretty fragile (It should also be noted that there is no contesting in Planetstrike. Defenders only control objectives if there are no attackers on them and attackers control objectives regardless of defenders). Secondly, I'm not sure how the Daemon army will work exactly with deployment in terms of attacking as the attackers force shows up from reserves on turn one (though there were some things in the book that hinted at armies using the planetstrike system regardless of their codex rules, I'll have to take another look at the book). Its also pretty much consensus at my store that Daemons will be able to assault the turn they arrive, but this will still require some good rolling to make it happen for a number of our units, while others can be a little more conservative and still pull it off. Overall, I think Daemons will be one of the premier assault armies for Planetstrike (which they really should be).

[antique_nova]

i know what planetstrike has since i have read the ENTIRE book and played a game last sunday :D

[OwlandMoonGuy]

Did you play with Daemons AN? Perhaps you could give us a firsthand review of how the game plays.

 

Just to warn you, personally I’m pretty skeptical. I played a log of Cities of Death when it came out and never again since. The nature of the game just favored certain armies to an unreasonable extent, IMHO. Apoc was a different breed of expansion but PS seems to look & feel more like CoD to me. I’ll buy the rules of course but I’m not expecting much out of the game.

 

So here’s hoping you can change my mind on the subject.

 

-OMG

[antique_nova]

no, but i will tell you on thing. jsut like apocalpyse there is a special stratigem for each race. for once they have one for sm that ties common sense and rules together.

ig can deepstrike all together, even vehicles. and they can bring on their ENTIRE FORCE in the first turn when they are the attack, they are the only enemy that can have the rule that allows that and guess what.....they roll one dice for it ^^, for the entire army.

ds units don't scatter if i remember correctly

can't remember the rest, but by the time i play it again, the rules would have been released.

the deamons special ability of ds everything is lost. as all armies can now ds in.

The entire rules section is based on either being the attack or defender.

The attacker rules and stratigems benefit any close combat army. and do the opposite for shooty

the defender is the opposite of the attack. they benefit shooty armys and vise versa for close combat armies.

There are also attacker and defender stratigems, the attacker may ONLY choose the attacker stratigems and the defender may only choose the defender stratigems

The minimum requirement for the attacker is ONE hq unit

the minimum requirement for the defnder is as normal.

 

The defender can deploy ANYWHERE on the table and arranges all terrain and objectives and forfeits first turn and there is no such thing as seize the initiative.

 

The defender will roll for which units appear, on a +4

 

the reserve rolls are now

2nd turn +4 3rd +3 4+turn is either +2 or automatic can't remember.

 

There are towers that recieve automatic weapons

all auto weapons are bs2.

There is a monstrous tower that has 4 auto heavy bolter turrets and armour 14 all around and can have shields of armour 12.

 

There are defnder stratigems like any unit within 6 inches gains counter attack.

the clossest unit is fearless.

 

There is also a scenario that you can play. call the flag bearer i think

where the unit that ahs the flag ( any unit may be given this ) gains fearless and feel no pain and as soon as the unit with the flag reaches the enemy stronghold and flant the flag the game is won automatically.

 

The tower thing earlier is controlled by those that are in the tower and the tower CANNOT be assault or entered.

The are barricades that give +2 cover save/

 

attacker stratigems can have the night fight ability

The fire thing bombardment which hurts like hell.

 

That's all i remember, have fun and my rating for planet strike? 3/5. not suited for games that are more than 4000 points and if you place more than that it's usually your beaten or your annihilating the opposition by turn 3.

thanks

antique_nova

[Rahveel]

Fine! ill buy it.... ;)

 

hopefully people will keep posting their experiances with the new ruleset here, its good to read!

 

It should also be noted that there is no contesting in Planetstrike. Defenders only control objectives if there are no attackers on them and attackers control objectives regardless of defenders.

 

now that makes me feel a lot better about some things! namely, the mass number of (aparantly objective) auto-turrets the defender can place.

[antique_nova]

Fine! ill buy it.... :)

 

hopefully people will keep posting their experiances with the new ruleset here, its good to read!

 

It should also be noted that there is no contesting in Planetstrike. Defenders only control objectives if there are no attackers on them and attackers control objectives regardless of defenders.

 

now that makes me feel a lot better about some things! namely, the mass number of (aparantly objective) auto-turrets the defender can place.

no attackers don't control a single objective until they are ON it. defenders get to choose what goes where on the battlefield in cluding the objectives.

thanks

antique_nova

[DuskRaider]

So has anyone heard any definite answers if Daemons can or cannot assault on deep strike? I've heard conflicting answers that no they cannot due to them not having deep strike in their entry, and others saying that since the daemon ability includes deep strike they can, in fact, assault when they come into play. I can see both sides of the argument, but truthfully, if they don't give us that ability then they just gimped an entire army for this expansion.

[Emperor's Instrument]

So has anyone heard any definite answers if Daemons can or cannot assault on deep strike? I've heard conflicting answers that no they cannot due to them not having deep strike in their entry, and others saying that since the daemon ability includes deep strike they can, in fact, assault when they come into play. I can see both sides of the argument, but truthfully, if they don't give us that ability then they just gimped an entire army for this expansion.

I spoke to a stafff member in a GW store and they gave me a definitive yes that daemons can assault after deepstriking. As far as I'm concerned this will be taken as gospel because an employee told me so.

[DuskRaider]

Hey, works for me! I can imagine that Daemons in Planetstrike will be clearing tables Dark Eldar style with this revelation.

[antique_nova]

are you sure not all gws staff are 100% sure about the rules and some will interpret them in a different way, the deamons follow the deepstrike rule and the deepstrike rule clearly states that no unit can assault after deepstriking unless the unit has a special rule that says other wise, like the heroic intervention for the veteran assault marines.

thanks

antique_nova

[stump]

I have a copy of the book and it states can not assault unless there unit entry has deep strike. Deamons don't have deep strike in there unit entry, they have it as an army wide deployment for moving on the board but not as a unit entry.

 

I play Deamons and I would not assault the turn they come in it is to rule in the gray area, that being said there are a couple cool Stragems for us to take.

 

You can hide a unit on the board like a forward observer and all deep strike rolls in line of sight can reroll. And you can pick a turn where all your army gets the night fight rule for that turn.

 

It sounds fun. This is what it is for fun I would not run a torney with the rules maybe a Apox. type game but those are also fun.

[Emperor's Instrument]

are you sure not all gws staff are 100% sure about the rules and some will interpret them in a different way, the deamons follow the deepstrike rule and the deepstrike rule clearly states that no unit can assault after deepstriking unless the unit has a special rule that says other wise, like the heroic intervention for the veteran assault marines.

thanks

antique_nova

 

 

I have a copy of the book and it states can not assault unless there unit entry has deep strike. Deamons don't have deep strike in there unit entry, they have it as an army wide deployment for moving on the board but not as a unit entry.

 

I play Deamons and I would not assault the turn they come in it is to rule in the gray area, that being said there are a couple cool Stragems for us to take.

 

You can hide a unit on the board like a forward observer and all deep strike rolls in line of sight can reroll. And you can pick a turn where all your army gets the night fight rule for that turn.

 

It sounds fun. This is what it is for fun I would not run a torney with the rules maybe a Apox. type game but those are also fun.

Well this is it, all four staff members agreed and only one of them plays daemons. I agree with both perspectives but would obviously prefer the interpretation that favours the daemon player.

The strategems are pretty sweet though. I took 'Scorched Sky' and 'Dawn Assault' in a preview game the other night and can honestly say if you get a big enough number on the dice 'Scorched Sky' is fun fun fun for the attacker.

Saturday is a full day of Planetstrike in my local store so I can give a fuller update either Sunday or Monday. I'll be playing BA but if i can borrow a few more daemons from somewhere will have crack with those as well.

[Draeden]

My local GWS was running a mini-preview game (main preview game is this saturday) for Planetstrike and I was talking about it to one player and a store employee butted in and pretty much stated that daemons can assault.

 

The opinion of my local GWS was basically, if it says they can deepstrike in the codex, they can deepstrike assault.

 

Using the Chaos Marine Codex as an example, Chaos Marines can not deepstrike, but Raptors, Terminators and Obliterators can deepstrike. They have it as codex entries. Then, reading rules for Terminator Armour and Wings/Jump Packs gain Deepstrike codex entry. Thus allowing them to deepstrike assault in planetstrike.

 

Similarly, in the Chaos Daemons Codex, it states in daemonic assault that you're entering play via deep strike (with some modified reserves for first turn). Daemonic Assault is part of the Daemon Rule. ALL Daemons have got Codex Entry Rule Daemon. Thus, all Codex Chaos Daemons have Deep Strike Codex Entry, thus, allowing in planetstrike, deepstrike assault.

[Seahawk]

Have the new WD talking all about it. Of course they get stuff wrong sometimes in there, but they have sample lists: all terminators/drop pod dreadnoughts army that they state can all assault the turns they deep strike. In the batrep they follow this up with DSing Swooping Hawks assaulting when they land. None of these units have DS in their entry, but it is on the equipment they carry, and yet they assaulted.

 

Obviously WD's aren't anything to go by, but still it would support that any unit that can DS normally can assault in Planetstrike.

[Rahveel]

WD is indeed a poor place to look for clarification, but it does lend weight to the veiw that RaI, units that could normaly benifit from deepstrike are able to assault on the turn they do so in planetstrike.

[stump]

Keep this in mind we are a pretty strong army as it stands without the need to assault the turn we come in. This being said there are a couple of things I have not tested the guns that get to shoot you the turn you come in for free. It is BS 2 so they may not hit that much. The availbility to feild lots more heavys for defender. The game is for fun please keep this in mind.

 

We already have a topic of why peaple hate playing us, I want to play this rule set more than 3 times before I hear complaining about Deamons being to strong and etc. etc. we have all heard it.

 

I hope this does rub peaple the wrong way play your game however you like it is your hobby.

[DuskRaider]

The only problem I see is that pretty much everyone will have the ability to deep strike in Planetstrike, which is our big trump card in normal games. We have very little ranged attacks, so you'd think we would have to ability to assault on deep strike to make up for our other shortcomings. Just my opinion...

[Infidel]

The way we have it is that if a unit can enter play via Deep Strike (Termies, Flayed One, Raptors) in any way, shape or form as a part of its standard rule, or was given the ability to do so via additional equipment (drop pods), then they can assult on the turn they arrive. So, every daemon unit can assult because the entire army deep strikes.

 

Which, to me, seems to make sense, now get ready to hear people complain about 12" assaults from fiends/seekers.

[Rahveel]

Dont they already? ;P

[DuskRaider]

People will always complain about the Daemon army because they have to work for a win. QQ