Unremembered Empire....initial review

[Emperor's Furor]

Kurze didn't black out, he escaped. He killed his guards before he fought Dorn.

Umm no. Curze awakes from a black out where he's seeing the heresy, the guards find him on top of Dorns blood soaked body, him having fallen into the vision after Dorn verbally reprimanded him for what he told Fulgrim. They Imprison Curze, he then decides to break out, kills some templars and phoenix guard after using an emp blast or something and escapes, he then heads to his fleet and they blow up their home world.

[Wade Garrett]

Curze didn't "fight" Dorn. He sucker punched him by way of having one of his "Little Moments" while the Praetorian was trying to talk some sense into him. (And sucker punched doesn't do it justice, "Sucker lit him up like Floyd Mayweather working combinations on a heavy bag" is closer.)

 

Nor did he beat Corax in any meaninful sense. The Raven decided his priority was getting his sons out of the trap, not slugging it out with Konrad. It's the opposite of how Night of the Wolf played out.

[Greyall]

We won't be able to do any kind of analysis if we wait for every Primarch fight to start with both opponents posturing. It happens, of course. Just not a lot. Usually someone throws the first punch/stab/strike. And it's perfectly normal, I think.

 

Edit: Replaced "keep any score" with "do any kind of analysis", by indication of brother Cormac.

[depthcharge12]

Part of me wants a list of whos a better fighter daddy....

 

 

but part of me wants to just see lorgar make horus his female dog in a fight so we can just lay this to rest and just say it comes down to circumstances.

[Conn Eremon]

Here's a question: Why should we keep score?

[Greyall]

Poorly chosen word. I meant analyse each Primarch's prowess. Not to say sucker-punches shouldn't be noted as such, but they don't necessarily determine a fight's outcome.

[Marshal Rohr]

Im fine with Dorn not being the best fighter of the bunch. He supposed to be a commander, and he commands well (as well as who else, we don't know for sure, but he's up there).

 

 

Angron may have won wars that couldn't be won, Kurze might've scared populations into submission, Lorgar might've been fastest and brightest for 40 years, Horus might've be the most ambitious, etc but only Guilliman, Dorn, Perturabo, Mortarion, and the Lion seem like true soldiers to me. The Lion has some aspects that arguably aren't so much aspects of a professional soldier, but to me each of those legions epitomizes a guy with a rifle in a firefight.

[Wade Garrett]

NO! ABILITY TO WRECK FACE IN HAND TO HAND ONLY MEANINGFUL MEASURE OF PRIMARCH!

 

ANGRON NUMBER ONE! ALL OTHERS NUMBER TWO OR LOWER!

[Greyall]

@Marshal: Agreed. I'd add Horus, though, in spite of his knack for making glorious heroes/corpses out of his first company by throwing them at the enemy leader.

[helterskelter]

We forget Vulkan. What good is it being a good fighter if you opponent can't die?? I put a schitz vulkan up vs angron anyday.

[depthcharge12]

Also,

 

we have to define what a "win" is for a primarch.

 

 

We can establish duels, but when are they ever that? It seems that a marine of sorts will intervene or other shennanigans.

 

 

I can say that yes, Angron would've been able to kill Russ, but Russ would've killed Angron due to 11 million bolters of hell.

 

Corax might've been able to kill either Lorgar or Curze, but at a cost of himself and/or his legion.

 

 

The only real 1 on 1 spars we get are Fulgrim v. Ferrus and Sanguinus v. Horus, where both winners had a daemonic advantage.

 

 

The only absolutes we could really make are fights between astartes, as they've had legitimate duels.

[DuskRaider]

Curze didn't "fight" Dorn. He sucker punched him by way of having one of his "Little Moments" while the Praetorian was trying to talk some sense into him. (And sucker punched doesn't do it justice, "Sucker lit him up like Floyd Mayweather working combinations on a heavy bag" is closer.)

 

Well let's be fair... Dorn was 'trying to talk sense into him', Dorn was berating him and more or less calling him a heretic. Dorn and level headed didn't always go together well.

[Wade Garrett]

Well let's be fair... Dorn was 'trying to talk sense into him', Dorn was berating him and more or less calling him a heretic. Dorn and level headed didn't always go together well.

I just don't see Konrad going "RARHR IMA CRAZY MAN EAT YOUR FACE" in the middle of Dorn nagging him like a stereotypical Jewish Mom as evidence of great badassery on Curze's part.

 

Of course, the only victories the Primarch of my Legion has are moral ones. Moral ones like "Ha ha, Guilliman! I got my blood all over your power fists! Now they're all nasty and covered in blood and you'll have to wash them with bleach! Ha ha ha!"

 

So my judgement may be skewed.

[Marshal Rohr]

 

Well let's be fair... Dorn was 'trying to talk sense into him', Dorn was berating him and more or less calling him a heretic. Dorn and level headed didn't always go together well.

I just don't see Konrad going "RARHR IMA CRAZY MAN EAT YOUR FACE" in the middle of Dorn nagging him like a stereotypical Jewish Mom as evidence of great badassery on Curze's part.

 

Of course, the only victories the Primarch of my Legion has are moral ones. Moral ones like "Ha ha, Guilliman! I got my blood all over your power fists! Now they're all nasty and covered in blood and you'll have to wash them with bleach! Ha ha ha!"

 

So my judgement may be skewed.

 

My legion is famous for dying all the time, and enjoying it.

[TheForgottenAngel]

This argument is so retarded

[Greyall]

We're about to see Khan vs Mortarion, too, and it starts with posturing and boasting, like a proper duel. =)

 

As for those not-so-regulated bouts, we have to draw on whatever bits we can find and, above all, not make any absolute conclusions.

[Marshal Rohr]

Dude, book came out half a month ago, and we all like to banter to pass the time in between big fluff arguments, otherwise there isn't anything to do besides peruse WIP and cry about a)being unable to afford cool models or b) cry about being unable to paint as well as Lorenzen,Heathens,  Heinrich, etc. 

[DuskRaider]

 

Well let's be fair... Dorn was 'trying to talk sense into him', Dorn was berating him and more or less calling him a heretic. Dorn and level headed didn't always go together well.

I just don't see Konrad going "RARHR IMA CRAZY MAN EAT YOUR FACE" in the middle of Dorn nagging him like a stereotypical Jewish Mom as evidence of great badassery on Curze's part.

 

Of course, the only victories the Primarch of my Legion has are moral ones. Moral ones like "Ha ha, Guilliman! I got my blood all over your power fists! Now they're all nasty and covered in blood and you'll have to wash them with bleach! Ha ha ha!"

 

So my judgement may be skewed.

Oh, I definitely agree. I don't see this as a 'fight'... more Curze's condition had begun to greatly deteriorate his mind, Dorn came around and started verbally laying into him, Curze just kind of blacked out and awoke on top of Dorn. He doesn't even know what happened.

[Greyall]

Well, it shows he's massively dangerous if he beat a brother Primarch while not even 'awake'. I still think he might've fought on auto-mode, sort of like when you get lost in thoughts while driving and suddendly realize you got home while driving flawlessly. True, though, the fact that he bit Dorn might indicate otherwise, but Curze is given to those things...

[Wade Garrett]

This argument is so retarded

Ain't no argument, brother. We just got the blues. Yeah.

 

Lorgar can't win a fight,

Ferrous Manus is dead,

Dorn's on Terra sitting tight,

Angron got crazy machines in his head!

 

We got them 30k blues, oh yeah, them ole 30k blues. Man what we gonna do, uh huh, I'm talking to you, got them 30k blues...

 

You feel me brothers? 30k blues.

 

Yeah, uh huh, oh yeah.

[helterskelter]

30k delta blues? Now im gonna have to get my guitar.. I mean sonic blaster

[Conn Eremon]

Noise Marines = Worst Blues Players Ever

[Kol Saresk]

 

 

This argument is so retarded

Ain't no argument, brother. We just got the blues. Yeah.

 

Lorgar can't win a fight,

Ferrous Manus is dead,

Dorn's on Terra sitting tight,

Angron got crazy machines in his head!

 

We got them 30k blues, oh yeah, them ole 30k blues. Man what we gonna do, uh huh, I'm talking to you, got them 30k blues...

 

You feel me brothers? 30k blues.

 

Yeah, uh huh, oh yeah.

The weird part is, my brain translated this into Gajeel's voice.........

[Wade Garrett]

Noise Marines = Worst Blues Players Ever

"This is the most depressing thing I've ever heard in my life. IT'S AWESOME!"

 

Typhus of the Death Guard, listening to the Kakophonii's first and only performance of "The My Legion Brothers Just Left On the Got Betrayed and Virus Bombed From Orbit On Isstvan Train Blues"

[Captain Idaho]

I loved the scene with Eldrad at the bar. Where he freezes time and sits down so nonchalantly like he owns the place.

Knowing Eldrad like we all do, he likely has set up Vulkan to return at a much later date. Whether it heals him ok is anyones guess!