Memento Of Prospero Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 He can make them scoring instead of troops, bump to 10 man and it would respect the 30 man availability in a single detachment. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3562961 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatOneMarshal Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I always thought it would be cool if the sanguinor could be a flying mc. It would justify his points. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563133 Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I wouldn't mind losing 6" to the sang priest if it meant that any unit he joins gets fnp, and +1 S and I on the charge. That initiative boost was key to winning combats, especially over elder and other marines. I think Tychos 3rd company during Armageddon should get special rules to assault out of their rhinos because the fluff indicates that they were the only ones that could move fast enough and attack quickly Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563160 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I wouldn't mind losing 6" to the sang priest if it meant that any unit he joins gets fnp, and +1 S and I on the charge. That initiative boost was key to winning combats, especially over elder and other marines. I think Tychos 3rd company during Armageddon should get special rules to assault out of their rhinos because the fluff indicates that they were the only ones that could move fast enough and attack quickly That's why we have fast tanks? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563215 Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Yes but the fast tank thing is redundant in 6th ed since everyone can do it now sans shooting, but if your rhinos are shooting, your doing it wrong... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563219 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Yes but the fast tank thing is redundant in 6th ed since everyone can do it now sans shooting, but if your rhinos are shooting, your doing it wrong... Not really. BA still have the fastest tanks out of marines. In 5th ed, BA tanks could move 18" in the movement phase, foregoing shooting. Other non fast tanks could only move 12" max, foregoing shooting. In 6th ed, BA tanks can move 12" in the move phase, and 12" flat out in the shoot phase for a total of 24", foregoing shooting. Other non fast tanks can move 12" in the move phase, and 6" flat out in the shoot phase for a total of 18", foregoing shooting. Tycho's company also moved and redeployed fast using fast rhinos, thunderhawks and overcharged land raiders. A rhino being able to move 24"/turn represents this well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563240 Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Yes but the fast tank thing is redundant in 6th ed since everyone can do it now sans shooting, but if your rhinos are shooting, your doing it wrong... Not really. BA still have the fastest tanks out of marines. In 5th ed, BA tanks could move 18" in the movement phase, foregoing shooting. Other non fast tanks could only move 12" max, foregoing shooting. In 6th ed, BA tanks can move 12" in the move phase, and 12" flat out in the shoot phase for a total of 24", foregoing shooting. Other non fast tanks can move 12" in the move phase, and 6" flat out in the shoot phase for a total of 18", foregoing shooting. Tycho's company also moved and redeployed fast using fast rhinos, thunderhawks and overcharged land raiders. A rhino being able to move 24"/turn represents this well. Ok an extra 6"....which is...pretty good I guess I didn't think they could overcharge the land raiders though, something the fluff and Matt ward said they were unable to do. Do any of you guys know the special rule Tychos formation gets in Apoc? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563245 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatOneMarshal Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Yes but the fast tank thing is redundant in 6th ed since everyone can do it now sans shooting, but if your rhinos are shooting, your doing it wrong... Not really. BA still have the fastest tanks out of marines. In 5th ed, BA tanks could move 18" in the movement phase, foregoing shooting. Other non fast tanks could only move 12" max, foregoing shooting. In 6th ed, BA tanks can move 12" in the move phase, and 12" flat out in the shoot phase for a total of 24", foregoing shooting. Other non fast tanks can move 12" in the move phase, and 6" flat out in the shoot phase for a total of 18", foregoing shooting. Tycho's company also moved and redeployed fast using fast rhinos, thunderhawks and overcharged land raiders. A rhino being able to move 24"/turn represents this well. Ok an extra 6"....which is...pretty good I guess I didn't think they could overcharge the land raiders though, something the fluff and Matt ward said they were unable to do. Do any of you guys know the special rule Tychos formation gets in Apoc? Off the top of my head the land raiders get fast but they lose a hp. From the gw website:When Captain Erasmus Tycho was tasked with hunting down Ork raiders on Armageddon, he immediately ordered that the tanks attached to his task force be refitted. Techmarines laboured night and day, modifying engines and stripping out all non-essential systems, all in search of a much-needed speed boost. When the Orks next attacked, Tycho's fast-moving tanks were ready for them. Simply awesome! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563267 Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 See the Blood Angels learned from their enemies that the red ones do go faster. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563273 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 See the Blood Angels learned from their enemies that the red ones do go faster. I remember a time when this was true for close combat, too. Snorri Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563311 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguine Eternal Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Plus we can move our vindi's 12" and still fire at full BS. Vanilla marines cannot. I'd say our fast tanks are extremely useful, especially when it comes down to the short range of the assault cannon, getting it within range as quick as possible is a must. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563326 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverson Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Hi, first time poster here. I'd like to see the following, Dante: either stay the same points but gain eternal warrior and change the turning sanguinery guard to troops to turning 1 squad of them troops. Or make his axe "strikes at imitative and ap3" but retains the sanguinery guard as troops and eternal warrior Astaroth: points remain the same points wise maybe gan a point of toughness (or some other mechanic to make him a little more survivable and not get instant deathed so easily) Or gain around 40 points and also make death company scoring. Mephiston: make his weapn ap2 before he starts to get laughed at by the other insanely powerfull and costed angry people out there (abaddon etc...) restrict his powers the what ever the blood angels phychic powers are but give him knowledge of them all. If for some reason wings of sanguinius then a rethink of Mephiston to a flying monstrous creature with points etc.. To suit tho I don't know why wings wouldn't be in there. The sanguinor: to me this guy was the odd duck out wanting to be a golden Boy like Dante and a combat machine like Mephiston and (to me at least got stuck in the middle, and I'm not fussed on his fluff I think it could of been done better but meh) then I saw a post by someone else on here about making him the upgrade of the sanguinery guard and to me that sounds perfect, I'd drop his eternal warrior and his 3++ to a 4++, reduce him by about 100 points and make him a decent mid pound hq. Corbulo: seems pretty strong as is maybe just bum p him to an hq slot but I'm quite happy as is May gain just a few more points (5-15) Tycho: remain largely the same as I think he does a good job as a fluffy hq for non jump special characters, if anything I would allow him access to 1 fast land raider as his and his squads command vehicle for a considerable points cost (30 pts for the upgrade maybe) Death company tycho: able to join death company and think he is good to go ( not get access to that land raider tho as he has gone bonkers) Reclusiarch: something here to be our main non special character hq over librarian maybe access to artificer armour. SadleryI do not think there is a place for lemartes as thee are just to meny jump pack special characters in our army, the model is nice tho and could obviously still be used as a reclusiarch. Troops: points costs to bring them all in line with vanilla marines and a war gear options Elites: remove our access to stearin guard and vanguard to make us different to c:sm and make tech marines better to suit with the over charged engines maybe give them a jump pack or something to be able to run a mobile tank company Fast attack: our own cheap flyer, Heavy support: leave out flack missiles on devs (because our new flyer would be our anti air fighter) General: points cost reduction to over costed units, a mechanic that limits the casualties before getting into combat ( I like the idea of death masks removing the option of over watch). No assaulting out of rhinos or while deep striking (unless there is a major draw back in casualties like on a 1 or a 2 the model is removed due to a crash landing done for each model in the unit) Just some of my wish listing I guess :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563374 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ixzion Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I would like to be able to disembark after moving more than 6" with Rhinos. Feels a bit pointless to spend 15 points extra compared to vanilla marines for what essentially is an extra 6" flat out... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563412 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 From a previous thread So the tanks in C:DA and C:SM are apparently the same price. If our "fast tax" remains the same then we can probably assume that Rhinos will cost the same number of points but Razorbacks will go up by fifteen! It looks like the Redeemer will go up by five points too. Continuing this trail of thought: Whirlwind to go down by ten, Vindicator down by five, Autolas Destructor to drop by five, Annihilator to drop by twenty and the dakka Destructor would weigh in at ten points more. It's worth adding that the base cost of a Predator in the new Codex is already five points higher than ours, so a base Predator in our new book could arguably be 90 points.I would expect other price decreases too to bring us in line with the other Marine Codices. Techmarines to become a non-force organisation slot (like C:DA & C:SM) would be fantastic, as would our Captains a better choice of wargear and Artificier Armour. Sadly it looks like them having Rites of Battle again is a no as their respective Captain do not have it. My main concern is the potential loss of our own psychic powers list. This would make the Librarian Dreadnought quite useless as most of the BRB powers don't work on them (so perhaps they will get a special one-off power?) but it will also harm Mephiston. To me, Mephiston is fine as he is but if he is not to acquire Independent Character status then would need something like Wings of Sanguinius and perhaps the Smash USR to replace Sword of Sanguinius. I can see DC Tycho going to a supplement but I like having the option there. As fluffy as it is him being without IC status, he needs something of a speed boost or some way of not being isolated. Death Company get altered every Codex so we can probably expect something there, either how they work, their composition or how they are formed. They really do need cheaper Jump Packs though and this I'd expect by the "cheaper prices across the board" comment I mentioned earlier. I can see us not getting Grav weapons nor the two AA tanks or Centurions due to "not all Marine forces use everything" and the AA tanks don't really fit our ethos. It's quite likely that we will get something new and whatever is selling less for us will get a boost in the rules... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563519 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyst Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I would really be surprised if they cut Sternguard, since so many BA players use them and they just released great new kits for them. It wouldn't make any economic sense and would really piss people off. I don't see Centurions fitting in with BA and we're quite bloated at elites anyway (they're elites, right?). Assuming the new book sticks to the rules supportig either jump or mech, I would think we'd see the new AA tanks, since we have very little options for AA right now and more tanks fits the mech build. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563561 Share on other sites More sharing options...
xanthate Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 After having checked the cost of jump packs in the special wargear lists of C:DA and C:SM I doubt that we will see a point decrease of the JP for the DC (same cost in C:DA, C:SM and for DC jump packs). Then again anything can happen. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563592 Share on other sites More sharing options...
d@n Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I don't think BA will get centurions or the new stalker. GW seems to be going in the direction, of making each power armour, army more individual. Back in 3rd or 4th edition dark angels were the only army that could take terminator army's bike army's mortis dread noughts, plasma cannons in tac squads ect and by the time 5th edition came around all those things were options for a bunch of other army's and no one was really using the DA dex .for example If you just have generic models for multiple army's and you want to swap from say dark angels to blood angels or vanilla marines then your not buying new models, you can just re paint your existing army a different colour and get the benefit of the new codex or play counts as. Essentially gw wants to sell you new models so it doesn't make business sense to have models that can be played with multiple army's anymore. As for rules I would like to see BA go back to a more close quarter shooting army then they have been in the currant dex. Tac squads should be able to upgrade there bolters for to angelus bolters, for a nominal cost and also take heavy flamers. Hand flamers and infernus pistols need a big points drop. I assume that tac squads tech marines ect will fall in line with the vanilla and DA codices and I would also like to see death company purchased like command squads and tech marines are. Astoroth the grim and the sanginors fluff needs re writing. Lemartes should get the iwnd rule and be able to take his jump pack off. Gabriel Seth should be able to make death company troops or scoring and Give all blood angels within 12" the rampage rule and maybe crusader. Mephiston needs a new model as does Dante, along with a better rules for his axe. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563610 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindhamster Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I'd love to see some sort of rule that comes into play vs black legion... that'd be awesome. Tycho should grant preferred enemy:orks to a squad or two :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563753 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 After having checked the cost of jump packs in the special wargear lists of C:DA and C:SM I doubt that we will see a point decrease of the JP for the DC (same cost in C:DA, C:SM and for DC jump packs). Then again anything can happen. You're comparing wargear for characters in C:SM to those selectable by rank and file in C:BA. SM jump packs are now 15pts for characters, and 3pts for infantry (tactical 14pts, assault marine 17pts) BA jump packs are currently 25pts for characters and between 3pts (assault marines 19pts, tactical 16pts) and 15pts (Death Co) for regular dudes. Dropping to SM prices would be a good thing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3563958 Share on other sites More sharing options...
xanthate Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 After having checked the cost of jump packs in the special wargear lists of C:DA and C:SM I doubt that we will see a point decrease of the JP for the DC (same cost in C:DA, C:SM and for DC jump packs). Then again anything can happen. You're comparing wargear for characters in C:SM to those selectable by rank and file in C:BA. SM jump packs are now 15pts for characters, and 3pts for infantry (tactical 14pts, assault marine 17pts) BA jump packs are currently 25pts for characters and between 3pts (assault marines 19pts, tactical 16pts) and 15pts (Death Co) for regular dudes. Dropping to SM prices would be a good thing. True, I failed to take that into consideration. Moreover i just saw that in C:SM the jump pack upgrade for vanguard is only 3pts. Fingers crossed :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3564321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Zaius Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 After reading C:SM and C:DA I would expect/wish: - Random psychic powers and cheaper librarians/mephiston. Librarian Dreadnought is a problem because we have a miniature but rules and fluff are problematic - Cheaper Sanguinary Priests: FNP are now +5 and +1I is gone. Or they may have 2 wounds - Assault marines are more fragile due to +5 FNP, so they need cover or other protection. One idea is to give them bolters, bolt pistols and CCW like Grey Hunters without changing their price. - Or maybe Tacticals may gain a CCW, as their Chapter Tactis are Rubbish - Rhinos and other vehicles with only one weapon may be 10points cheaper. 5 points for moving 6'' more instead of firing is fair. - New unit: Personal vehicle similar to a jet bike (Wish-list) - Changes to Death Company composition Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3564334 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafen IX Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 As much as a jet bike sounds great fun to me, I doubt we will get something like that owing to the C:DA flavour that brings to mind. Maybe a BA unique jump pack? :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3564388 Share on other sites More sharing options...
infyrana Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 BA unique jump pack ? Like Dante's original metal one with the insignia on, or Lemartes current one, or the new ones from the BA:DC box and the BA:SG boxes? I think we're the only people to get unique chapter specific JP's except for Raptors :) d@a you mentioned making DC purchasable like Tech Marines and Command Squads, what do you mean by this ? I like them as troops myself as they currently are :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3564496 Share on other sites More sharing options...
d@n Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I mean for every hq you purchase you can buy 1 unit of death company without taking up a force organisation slot Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3564513 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theduke08 Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 I think he means rule specific in relation to the jump packs not actually models for the jump packs. Some kind of special type of jump pack would be cool! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285142-what-2014-will-bring/page/4/#findComment-3564581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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