[HH1.0] Raven Guard Tactics

[Tiger9gamer]

Finally played my first game and after a few hiccups it went alright. I had a stunning loss to a codex space marine list but I got some valuable intel...

 

1.) never leave home without an apothecary for a big squad

2.) always bring some anti-armor

3.) never outflank a nuxio-vox behind a building

4.) Make sure you infiltrate well

5.) make sure you explain Nex and all moritats with absolute detail.

[defl0]

 

 

My tactical interrogations mainly touch on the Mor Deythan once again, mainly 3 questions :

 

1) Is it really worth it to put anti-tank (combi-meltas) on the Mor Deythan ? I don't feel they have enough firepower to fully justify the use of anti-tank weapons on them, compared with other options.

 

2) I've read that a few peeps have tried Sniper Deythans. How interesting are they ? My main worry is that because they aren't scoring, is there really a point making them long range ? I was thinking about a 5 men unit with 4 Sniper rifles and 1 Missile Launcher (With Krak firing normally and Frag when using the Fatal Strike).

 

3) Regarding closer ranged Deythans, combi-flamers seem like the option with the most potential. Has anyone tried throwing a Volkite Charger for good measure ? It seems interesting for when you need that extra Fatal Strike but you're 12" of the enemy and the flamers won't hit. Also, being an Assault Weapon, you could get the charge when firing the flamers.

 

1. IMO Mordeythan excel at infantry killing. The value comes from making poor AP weapons rending. So there is nothing wrong with mor deythan tank hunters, it's just not amazingly point efficient. That said, You only get one turn of rending and the squad lets you mix combi and non combi assault weapons. So in larger games I equip them with combi flamers and a couple melta guns. The flamers erase units and then the melta make the squad still a threat in later turns. The last thing to think about is the fact that rending meltas or plasma are pretty good at tank hunting units with ceremite armor. But I don't think they are considerably better than something like seekers that are similarly armed.

 

2. So first off they are scoring. It's in the FAQ. Second, snipers are very thematic. They can do well in an army built around being at range and maxing stealth, but the reason you don;t see them that often is opportunity cost. Mor Deythan with flamers are just sooooo good. 

 

3. Volkites are very good. The way to think about it is that Volkites excell at shooting something like a unit of 2 castellax. Flamers are better against big units. 

[GreyCrow]

Thanks for the comments man !

Combo-flammes are indeed the weapon with the most potential :) I'm still on the fence to start 30k and hesitating between 3 Legions so far, but I postes a RG list I'd like to play (and would love if you could take a look) that will definitely have one squad of Deythans with combi-flamers and a Volkite on the Shade !

 

The logic was that if I'm facing a Tank Heavy list, I'd Outflank them and get the rear Armour of tanks using the rending if I have no better option. And also the fact that rending deflagrate could be fun on infantry :D

[Monkeychunks]

How do players balance out their FOC slots? Both Elites and Fast Attack seem full of necessary units, and only 1 Heavy is going to go quickly. I'm struggling to plan an army out simply because I'm totally out of slots past 2000pts.

 

Elites

Mor Deythan seem fantastic and I want to make the most of the unique stuff, so they're in. Combi-Flamers and some form of Transport, probably a Rhino to ease pressure from the Pod Assault and make use of Scout/Infiltrate instead.

With the lack of Heavy slots, Rapier teams seem absolutely vital. Infiltrated heavy weapons to pull apart any interceptors or anti-air, plus one of the best anti-Spartan pieces. So going in for 2 units, either graviton or mortars as needed.

After that, we only have 1 slot left. Dreadnought talons seem useful as a combination of gravitons and tarpit and really benefit from all the Drop Pod support on offer. Deathstorms seem really fun to use and lend themselves to the 'Turn one Armageddon' style of the list. Finally Destroyers seem fluffy and Scout is fantastic in conjunction with Infiltrate.

 

Fast Attack

Seekers seem to play into the Drop Pod assault, offering precision shot removal of Apothecaries and HQ instead of squad-deletion like the Deythan.

Land Speeders and Javelins both seem great, offering Deep Strike graviton and spammed S8/AP3 respectively. Both really benefit from Maun's accurate Deep Strike game to get into flanks or play the range game to avoid retaliation.

The Primaris-Lightning looks like it can just about one-volley anything in the game with Kraken missiles and our infiltrators can peel out any pesky Deredeo's that might be a threat.

Finally, Dark Furies are a Tactical-sweeping nightmare and probably the best horde-removal tool we have outside of Corax.

 

Heavy Support

Nice easy one here, I want a Scorpius. Briefly considered a Fire Raptor but this one is set in stone for me.

 

 

The problem is 2-fold: I am running out of FOC-slots to take everything I want, and I am running out of them before I hit 2000pts. It means that anything after that is simply going to be more Tactical Pods, or allied Mechanicum.

Any input from the veterans on this one?

[Sheesh Mode]

 I'm currently planning out a Raven Guard Orbital Assault list led by Alvarex Maun. It relies heavily on drop podding support and destroyer squads along side two blocks of tactical marines. It looks pretty dirty, see for yourself: 

 

Alvarex Maun

Legion Tactical Squad (20) - Combat blades/chainswords - Legion Vexilla - Sergeant w.Powersword (Joined by Alvarex)

Legion Tactical Squad (20) - Combat blades/chainswords - Legion Vexilla - Nuncio Vox - Sergeant w/Powersword 

Legion Support Squad (5) - Melta Guns + Drop Pod

Legion Support Squad (5) - Melta Guns + Drop Pod

Legion Support Squad (10) - Plasma Guns + Drop Pod

Apothecarion Detachment (2) - 2 Power Swords (Join Legion Tactical Squads)

Legion Destroyer Squad (10) 2 Missile Launchers w.Suspensor Web and Rad-Missiles - Sergeant w.Infravisor - Phosphex Bomb + Drop Pod

Legion Destroyer Squad (5) 1 Missile Launcher w.Suspensor Web and Rad-Missiles - Sergeant w.2 Phosphex Bombs + Drop Pod

 

Personally I think this list is more versatile than what we can do with the Decapitation strike because it lets Destroyer Squads make nearly anything vulnerable to Tactical Squad bolter spam. 

[GreyCrow]

Unfortunately, with Orbital Assault, you have to have your units start in Drop Pods. Which is why the Decapitation Strike allows for both Pods and Infiltration :)

[Sheesh Mode]

Woops. Thanks for the heads up Greycrow.

[GreyCrow]

Woops. Thanks for the heads up Greycrow.

 

No worries, the limitations aren't crystal clear after re-reading it though. I thought it said : Units must be deployed by Deep Strike. But actually it says, units that can't be deployed that Deep Strike. You could argue that Tacticals with a Pod could be deployed by Deep Strike but chose not to :p

[Tiger9gamer]

So, any new victories?

[SkimaskMohawk]

I havent gotten to test the list, but here's what I want to run next time I use my raven guard. 2000pts, not a lot of aa but theres very few flyers in my area, sniper mor deythan are just for the fun of it

 

 

Legion Centurion (372pts) [Artificer Armour, Boarding Shield, Bolter, Cameleoline]

····Castellax Class Battle-Automata Maniple [Enhanced Targeting Array]

········Castellax [Darkfire Cannon, Two Power Blades]

········Castellax [Darkfire Cannon, Two Power Blades]

····Consul

········Praevian [Cortex Controller]

 

Strike Captain Alvarex Maun (175pts) [Legion Drop Pod]

····Master of the Legion [Decapitation Strike]

 

Legion Tactical Squad (210pts) [Legion Drop Pod, 9x Legion Tactical Space Marines]

····Legion Tactical Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]

 

Legion Tactical Squad (210pts) [Legion Drop Pod, 9x Legion Tactical Space Marines]

····Legion Tactical Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]

 

Legion Rapier Weapons Battery (225pts)

····Legion Rapier Weapons Battery [Graviton Cannon]

····Legion Rapier Weapons Battery [Graviton Cannon]

····Legion Rapier Weapons Battery [Graviton Cannon]

 

Mor Deythan Strike Squad (175pts) [Artificer Armour, 5x Combi-Flamer, Melta Bombs, 4x Mor Deythan]

 

Mor Deythan Strike Squad (150pts) [4x Mor Deythan, 5x Sniper Rifle]

 

Mor Deythan Strike Squad (175pts) [Artificer Armour, 5x Combi-Flamer, Melta Bombs, 4x Mor Deythan]

 

Legion Javelin Attack Speeder Squadron (95pts)

····Legion Javelin Attack Speeder [2x Hunter-killer Missiles, Multi-melta]

 

Legion Javelin Attack Speeder Squadron (95pts)

····Legion Javelin Attack Speeder [2x Hunter-killer Missiles, Multi-melta]

 

Legion Whirlwind Scorpius (115pts)

[Hesh Kadesh]

 

 

Woops. Thanks for the heads up Greycrow.

No worries, the limitations aren't crystal clear after re-reading it though. I thought it said : Units must be deployed by Deep Strike. But actually it says, units that can't be deployed that Deep Strike. You could argue that Tacticals with a Pod could be deployed by Deep Strike but chose not to :p

Drop Pod assault requires you to deploy in the transport you bought.

 

However, Terminators can be deployed via Deep Strike, but aren't required to.

[Sanct]

Drop Pod assault requires you to deploy in the dedicated transport you bought. 

 

 

fixed it for you

[Tiger9gamer]

 

I havent gotten to test the list, but here's what I want to run next time I use my raven guard. 2000pts, not a lot of aa but theres very few flyers in my area, sniper mor deythan are just for the fun of it

 

 

Legion Centurion (372pts) [Artificer Armour, Boarding Shield, Bolter, Cameleoline]

····Castellax Class Battle-Automata Maniple [Enhanced Targeting Array]

········Castellax [Darkfire Cannon, Two Power Blades]

········Castellax [Darkfire Cannon, Two Power Blades]

····Consul

········Praevian [Cortex Controller]

 

Strike Captain Alvarex Maun (175pts) [Legion Drop Pod]

····Master of the Legion [Decapitation Strike]

 

Legion Tactical Squad (210pts) [Legion Drop Pod, 9x Legion Tactical Space Marines]

····Legion Tactical Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]

 

Legion Tactical Squad (210pts) [Legion Drop Pod, 9x Legion Tactical Space Marines]

····Legion Tactical Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]

 

Legion Rapier Weapons Battery (225pts)

····Legion Rapier Weapons Battery [Graviton Cannon]

····Legion Rapier Weapons Battery [Graviton Cannon]

····Legion Rapier Weapons Battery [Graviton Cannon]

 

Mor Deythan Strike Squad (175pts) [Artificer Armour, 5x Combi-Flamer, Melta Bombs, 4x Mor Deythan]

 

Mor Deythan Strike Squad (150pts) [4x Mor Deythan, 5x Sniper Rifle]

 

Mor Deythan Strike Squad (175pts) [Artificer Armour, 5x Combi-Flamer, Melta Bombs, 4x Mor Deythan]

 

Legion Javelin Attack Speeder Squadron (95pts)

····Legion Javelin Attack Speeder [2x Hunter-killer Missiles, Multi-melta]

 

Legion Javelin Attack Speeder Squadron (95pts)

····Legion Javelin Attack Speeder [2x Hunter-killer Missiles, Multi-melta]

 

Legion Whirlwind Scorpius (115pts)

 

 

I like the looks of that! quite a lot of AA and anti-infantry... also excited to see how the sniper squad and the rapiers do!

[SkimaskMohawk]

Snipers are what I have the biggest doubts about, the wound on a 4+ really sucks when there's mainly only marines. The nerf to snipers in 7th also hurt them with their lessened ability to kill vehicles  

[Nusquam]

I keep thinking I'm posting in this thread and getting mindwiped after due to your profile pic SkimaskMohawk ha.

 

The wounding on a 4+ is great against AdMech automata.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Woops, well just putting it on the record that I'm not trying to impersonate a mod 

 

There's no ad mech players in my meta, at most is a few units of thallax and one guy who wants to start up soon with deathguard who wants to get castellax and a thanatar, but right now they dont have a place as much

[Nusquam]

I didn't think you were ha. I just kept going "Wait... Did I really post in the 30k forums earlier?"

 

What I really like about the sniper rule is picking out enemy IC and them getting PE for the wound roll.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Yea Precision Fire is a rule that always slips my mind, especially since they axed it from most things in normal 7th; I always forget it on my seekers and terror marines when I use them, in fact I usually forget the preferred enemy IC too as there's a lot to keep track of for me (my more fun lists have nex and seekers and the RoW so there's so many special rules it tends to get lost in the back of my head) 

[Hesh Kadesh]

You still get Look Out Sir vs PrecShot that which incredibly annoying tho.

[SkimaskMohawk]

You still get Look Out Sir vs PrecShot that which incredibly annoying tho.

 

For sure, and that adds to the reason why people forget to use it. Like you hit them on a 6, wound them and then they just go "bounce it on a 2+" which kind of ruins the immersion of your people sniping their leaders. 

 

However with Preferred Enemy you simply get a better chance to wound, who cares if they dump them onto the squad afterwards?

[Hesh Kadesh]

That is a very fair point. It is helpful for taking out special weapons in Veteran Squads though.

 

Although I will never forget that one time when I managed to Precision Shot Rend and see the Look Out Sir fail on my opponents Praetor.

[SkimaskMohawk]

For sure, its just harder for me to remember since so few things have had it since they took it away from characters in 6th (not in the context of 30k), snipers are the only thing that get it and they got nerfed too so why bother; having the synergy will remind me to use it all the time 

Edited June 11, 2015 by SkimaskMohawk

[GreyCrow]

Brother Crows, I send this message from 10.000 years in the future.

 

I am curious to get your feedback on the potency of an infiltrated 10 men squad with boltguns ? How do you play them, how do they fare ?

As Scout Squads got a buff in the grim darkness of the far future (spoiler alert, Sanguinius dies) with a Marine statline and BS/WS 4, I'm doing research as on whether they would be an effective replacement for the Tactical Squad in RG armies with the new Codex.

 

Since they have Infiltrate and mainly Boltguns, I suppose the 30k tactical squad was an appropriate point of comparison.

 

Cheers and thanks a lot !

[Hesh Kadesh]

They get deployed last ensuring that the enemy has the least possible lines of sight to their objective. They don't deploy closely. Or, they Outflank as a result of the Infiltrate rule and then proceed to use their Fleet run to contest/secure an objective late game.

 

Edit; although you may want to ask that in the appropriate rules forum. 

Edited June 16, 2015 by Hesh Kadesh

[Komrk]

10 Mor Deythan w/ Combi Volkites in a Darkwing.

Optional Additions:

Beat Stick Praetor

Primus Medicae

 

Darkwing comes in zooming, shoots stuff (make sure to place it near a high value unit you want to make sure is dead)

Next turn, drop it into hover, disembark, use their Combi-Volkites and the once per game special rule (can't remember the name right now)

Unit you want is dead 9/10 times, if they aren't you assault and are next to guaranteed to wipe them out.

 

Works for me every single game.