++ The Brotherhood of Dust - A Thousand Sons Community ++

[Zodd1888]

Flyers are the real weakness of TSons. Mobility cannot go unanswered by a TSons player, especially not flying gunboats or fire turkeys.

 

Looking at all tools available in straight TSons there is only a few options available:

 

Psychic Powers: You have both defensive and offensive options in these.

 

Defense - Endurance (Biomancy),Invisibility (Telepathy), Warp Fate (Sinistrum),

 

Offense - Prescience (Divination), Misfortune (Divination), Scrap Code Curse (Heretech), Earthly Anathema (Geomortis)

 

TSons core units (ie. Rubric and Scarab Occult) only have the Soul Reaper to rely on damaging armor without the use of WC, or a vehicle (which is potentially gone by end of T2).

 

In order to avoid tailoring your list we'll avoid specific vehicles initially.

 

Since TSons are going to be the bulk of the army and Bolters don't break armor we need to look at what we can do to generate use of our troops and maximize effectiveness.

 

If we know we're fighting a lot of armor or a flyer we need Rending.

 

Divination will result in a 33% shot at getting 1 power that is solid against flyers with either rend or rerolls. Unfortunately this does create a reliance on fishing in Divination.

 

Ignores Cover helps in many circumstances, but most specifically if you have a dedicated unit for flyers.

 

Since we're avoiding vehicles atm we look at weapon options. Soul Reaper with Ignores Cover will also work well as it Rends. You'd want IC on which unit is jumping or your vehicle from the Grand Cabal to chase the flyer as necessary. Earthly Anathema allows you to not have LOS also so you can hide and shoot.

 

In my opinion Misfortune is huge for TSons. War Cabal with reroll 1's and Rending on either a medium Sized Occult or Rubric in Rapid Fire range makes it quick work no matter the target.

 

That said decide what powers you need based on opponent as needed. If you get one of the good anti-air while rolling for others you required awesome, if not save some rolls for Divination.

 

Ignores Cover/Rending Forge Fiend is scary to anyone. That said, a Predator with Autocannon and Lascannon/Heavy Bolter is a cheaper option, and with Misfortune has more shots to Rend with.

 

TLDR: Defense is to weak to rely on 16% power to farm for, play strong. Don't farm 16% for Scrap Code curse, it's a trap; especially as Ahriman.

 

Roll Divination at 33% for a universally useful power. Depending on Power go RR/IC on Soul Reaper or Misfortune for Rend on all shots at Flyer and IC if attained.

 

Vehicles with Autocannon or Hades Autocannons are great with or without Prescience but shine with Misfortune.

 

Edit: Apologies for lack of cohesiveness. It's late and my total *Insert Here* have been given for the evening. Time for sleep!

 

Side Note: *Insert Here* is directly correlative to the word I would select to use. Hilarious.

[totgeboren]

Sup guys? I am currently building a small CAD of TS dudes, and so to celebrate this new alliance between my WB, my BL and now my TS, I figured I might sign them up?

Hmmm... background to follow, this is only my second TS model painted, Sorcerer Khonsu, but I thought you might like him?

It's an old 2ed metal Terminator, where I elongated the torso by around 1 cm, built new details (like the tubes), then added plastic GK arms and a converted head from Kromlech.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i95/totgeboren40/Daemons/DSC_0457%202.jpg

 

The familiar is a small homage to Carrie Fisher, and also a way to portray how many TS view the warp. The familiar makes you think of the Force, which isn't that far from how many TS view it. More like a source of power, neither good nor evil, but up to the wielder to decide. It also allows me to give my TS a totally different vibe compared to my WB. My WB sorcerers have familiars in the shape of small daemons, while my TS have gifted children instead.

Also, I'm rather happy with how I figured I would portray the TS sentimentality by giving him a red loincloth with a white hollow chaos symbol. At a glance it almost looks like their old legion colours and symbol.

 

More pics and some limited WIP can be seen here.

 

Anyway, I have a question for you, do you think I should do something more with the base? It feels a bit flat and boring...

[Zodd1888]

There isn't much room left on that base with your good looking models!

 

Adding runestones embeded/levelled into the ground could look good. It'll allow you to add some brighter colors to the base along with some detail. If you don't like runestones you could just carve in some kind of hieroglyphs or something into the ground as if it's appearing while casting.

 

Some kind of lightening/force effects on little Leia to exemplify her attachment to the force could be cool as long as it was subtle. I'd actually recommend getting rid of pupils and go full energy in the eye. If the kids are serving the Rubrics then they are probably more open to the warp and would allow it to take them completely.

 

The last thing you could maybe pull off is some crystals coming knee/thigh height on Leia from an angle as if it was growing towards her. This is probably the easiest option and would leave the models as they are (Little Sister/Big Daddy 40k).

 

I love the vibe.

[totgeboren]

Thanks!

Hmmm... I was thinking more along the lines of some static grass or something! 

But those are some good ideas, I might do something a bit more advanced. Perhaps also changing little Leias eyes to glow blue might be a good idea too.

Thanks for the feedback!

[Kobrakei]

I have a bit of an odd question. I want to paint some Thousand Sons Rhinos, but think the Chaos vehicle bits made by GW wouldn't really fit the aesthetic of the Sons. The tanks are already built, so I wouldn't be able to replace the doors/front armour plate. Does anyone have any suggestions or possibly pictures for making Rhinos fit in nicely? 

[Prot]

I have a bit of an odd question. I want to paint some Thousand Sons Rhinos, but think the Chaos vehicle bits made by GW wouldn't really fit the aesthetic of the Sons. The tanks are already built, so I wouldn't be able to replace the doors/front armour plate. Does anyone have any suggestions or possibly pictures for making Rhinos fit in nicely?

This Predator was already built. I was using it for my Iron Warriors. I chose to use it for my Thousand Sons because it didn't have too much bling. So I didn't want it overly spiky. And my thinking was that the spikes on it, could be ornate, if I did them gold.

The next thought was to cover some of the blemishes with something slightly "Thousand Sons" in nature, but not over the top "chaos". I settled on a banner from the Tzaangor box set. Using Forgeworld decals I came to what I feel is a good compromise from; This isn't a loyalist Predator, but it's not a chaos dump truck either:

I did add dirt, and then 'glowy' runes, dancing on the top hull for added feel.

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

Psychic Rules for 8th ED have been spoiled!

We are back to being able to cast massive amounts of powers!!!

 

Can anyone imagine if we get to keep the "cast 1 above your ML" bonus? :D

[Excessus]

Well, at least the aspiring sorcerers won't be relegated to mana battery duty anymore. :)

 

A sorcerer on a disc though, will be able to choose better what unit smite is cast on...

[Prot]

Psychic Rules for 8th ED have been spoiled!

We are back to being able to cast massive amounts of powers!!!

 

Can anyone imagine if we get to keep the "cast 1 above your ML" bonus?

 

 

I think while this could be true.... we don't know if there's a lot worth casting? Also it looks like Denial by nature is quite a bit easier. In 7th if I wanted to Psychic scream you I only needed one pass. To make it really hard for you to stop it, I'd have Ahriman do it 3 times, trying to get 2-3 passes each.

 

We don't know if Magnus, or perhaps Ahriman's successful casts are harder to stop or not? It will be interesting for sure. They just gave us a very minor piece of this puzzle I feel.

[Panzer]

You guys know what that means? Magnus will actually be useable in a TSons army without eating up all the Sorcerers dice. :)

[Zodd1888]

 

 

Psychic Rules for 8th ED have been spoiled!

We are back to being able to cast massive amounts of powers!!!

 

Can anyone imagine if we get to keep the "cast 1 above your ML" bonus?

 

I think while this could be true.... we don't know if there's a lot worth casting? Also it looks like Denial by nature is quite a bit easier. In 7th if I wanted to Psychic scream you I only needed one pass. To make it really hard for you to stop it, I'd have Ahriman do it 3 times, trying to get 2-3 passes each.

 

We don't know if Magnus, or perhaps Ahriman's successful casts are harder to stop or not? It will be interesting for sure. They just gave us a very minor piece of this puzzle I feel.

Part of the reason why I think we'll keep the extra cast is that it's interesting strategically. This guarantees you always will have one cast that cannot be countered by an equal ML Psyker. This creates a niche for TSons in the Psyker meta. I'm hoping this is a balancing factor since we don't have special weapons that they counted on in 8th.

 

If they were consciousness enough in making that decision then we should get good and interesting results from such deliberate intent.

[Sonoftherubric21]

Fellow sorcerers; While we may, or may not, be keeping the extra cast I think its possible that Thousand Sons will have plenty going for them. I will not make assumptions on the base units for us (Rubrics, Scarab Occult, Tzaangor), nor the formations we may get (if they exist) but I can extrapolate a couple things from what we know so far of the main rules.

 

Lets go off of the basic assumption here that the system will......lets say 85% - 90% mirror "Age of Sigmar" casting....So far it has minus the psychic phase still being a thing, as well as caster level still being extant on a model regarding number of casts and dispel attempts.

 

This is a rather large boon for us.  As Excessus already stated the Aspiring Sorcerer just got far better even if he does stay "the same" (which I sincerely doubt). We gained this additional spell, combined with whatever Lore we get or any innate abilities a sorcerer may possess, also much like age of sigmar it seems as if GW is doing away with the "randomness" as a list building concept. This means our sorcerers will do "Exactly" what we need to compliment our list, supplement our weaknesses and we wont "auto lose" on deployment anymore.

 

Age of Sigmar allows you to pick spells, seeing as how it was about 90% lifted direct from Sigmar we can assume that we will be allowed to pick spells, probably from a base lore for either Tzeentch, or a "Chaos" lore of some variety. (Id be willing to bet that we will receive a generic "chaos allegiance" lore until the thousand sons book comes out in earnest for us to choose from)

 

I will also take another educated guess....for our army to function (especially as its own faction *no allies*) 1 of 2 things must occur; Either we will get a special Force Org Chart that specializes in HQ slots, OR the basic "sorcerer" will be moved into the "Elite" Category on the force org chart. *please bare in mind these are both educated guesses* I also think its possible one of the fourteen (holy crap) force org charts we will get as a "Generic" force org option is an HQ heavy force. 

Some armies function off of HQ's and many are required to function well and truly benefit from added "hero hammer" in this case, and ours most of all of any id wager is near the top of that very list!  So I would guess that our sorcerers would fall into some broad categories and probably will have some nice lore options to accompany us.

 

--- Observation regarding shooting --- I will make the assumption that Warp Flamers and Inferno bolts will still do something similar to what they do currently, perhaps with a -1 mod on warp flamers, and perhaps a -2 mod on Inferno shells..........If so? HOLY CRAP, we just became INCREDIBLY deadly in the shooting phase once you add in shooting from a Soul-reaper we can put out some real damage even on highly armored targets. subtracting armor is a big deal, meaning we could even viably threaten terminators with our weapons if they retain their armor-pen (Again; assumption) This makes us incredibly dangerous in the shooting phase, and given that a lot of AP weapons that are "basic" tend to not have AP value now.....we retain our killiness and it becomes generically useful.

[ronin_cse]

I have a feeling I know the answer I will get on this thread but I wanna ask anyways . I have been kind of obsessed with Thousand Sons lately and keep thinking about them. For some reason despite loving "magic", Egyptian mythology, and deciding that TS were going to be my first army years and years ago which never panned out I have never considered starting a TS army, although I did buy a box of the new Rubrics when they came out but ended up selling them during one of my unopened model purges.

 

Anyways....with keeping all that in mind I have a new Space Wolf Battleforce and a Space Wolf SC! box just sitting in my closet at the moment.....should I just sell those off and use the $$$ to get going with a TS army? Like I said I think I have an idea of the answers I'll get here .

 

Edit: also I'm thinking of switching my 30k legion choice to TS as well....less sure about this

[MoGuy]

 

 

.should I just sell those off and use the $$$ to get going with a TS army? Like I said I think I have an idea of the answers I'll get here .

 

Don't know for what answer you are looking for here. It's your money and your models. So if you want to sell the army and start a new one, go ahead. I would recommend getting the "Traitor Legions" book first to have a look at the units etc.

 

However, with 8th edition being around the corner I would wait until it drops and then decide whether to start a new army or not.

[Prot]

I have a feeling I know the answer I will get on this thread but I wanna ask anyways .

 

Well maybe this answer will surprise you, but there's no way I would buy into Thousand Sons until we know all of 8th. The army relies so much on psychic abilities right now that we are truly up in the air... literally we could fall on either side of this. It could be back to bland and not good at anything, or it could be well balanced (like everything is supposed to be). I wouldn't spend a dime right now. I think GW knows this and I'm sure their bottom line at this time isn't great outside of Shadow Wars sales. I have feeling it won't be long, but really I would wait.

[Archaeinox]

I'm a Tzeentch player in AoS and in Matched Play you can't cast the same power more than once even if multiple wizards know it.

 

With psychic powers seeming so powerful (mortal wounds in 40k yes pls), it would make sense for them to do that.

 

I'm ok with that.

 

The trade off is that we don't have so many powers to keep track of. For example, if you have 2 units of Rubric Marines they probably know Smite by default and get another Tzeentch power. Ok, so what if both can't cast it.. It is probably "ok" AND it's one less thing to write down on some sort of notepad of all the damn randomly generated powers.

 

WIN WIN

[Sonoftherubric21]

I would also wager a guess that powers will be picked, not rolled.

AOS "Competitive" has completely done away with randomness in gameplay such as warlord traits and spell casting. I see no reason to assume that 40k Wont follow suit (Thank. Dear. Sweet. LORD OF CHANGE if so)

 

I would also assume that there will be plenty of options to make sure each sorcerer has something different + smite + Force (if applicable?)

 

Me assuming again....bad habit of that as of late, but with so little info its all I got

 

Added aside; I asked GW on Facebook regarding Rubric marine changes, just the canned response "well no word as of yet, but we heard Tzeentch players Loooooove change......"  Drats GW. Just give us dang faction/unit previews, that alone would help immensely in shoring up peoples opinions.

[Prot]

One thing I wanted to note about a small rule that may keep Magnus alive a little longer... "Fly".

 

I'm not sure where I saw it, but he might be good for hit and run because I'm assuming he will have Fly which allows a model to leave CC and still act normally.

[Panzer]

One thing I wanted to note about a small rule that may keep Magnus alive a little longer... "Fly".

 

I'm not sure where I saw it, but he might be good for hit and run because I'm assuming he will have Fly which allows a model to leave CC and still act normally.

That's definitely the case. Unless a unit has a special rule (like Banshees) units with the <Fly> keyword can't get bothered by getting charged as long as they have room to fall back.

[Sonoftherubric21]

So a legit concern for us folks; Perils of the Warp. 

1 in 18 chance of perils, and if a model thats a psyker dies from perils.....it causes mortal wounds in all nearby (6 inch) squads. OUCH!. 

[Prot]

Yea I saw that and it's so punishing that I have to believe there is a Thousand Sons mechanism to ignore or save it or something. I mean we don't even have brotherhood of Psykers so we would literally have to lose a Psyker on almost every perils. That would neuter us.

 

It also made me think the Culexus even turned down could cause perils on any double. Only Magnus, as we know him, would be safe!

 

In the back of my mind I feared becoming the army that has to spam mortal wounds to compete but this would certainly throw a wrench in that plan!

 

There must be some damage mitigating factor in Thousand Sons.

[Archaeinox]

Look at that freaking Genestealer power..... no overwatch AND - to a stat..

 

These TS powers better be nuts because Smite on an ASP is garbage compared to that genestealer cult power. Most armies wont care that you get Smite off AND it won't even cast anyway with my luck

[Skerr]

It is interesting to see the points and power levels of the Nu marines.

 

Intercessors are PL6 compared to Hellblazers PL8 but HBs are cheaper per model but more expensive weapons.

 

Trying to decern where Rubrics end up points wise.

[Archaeinox]

If they are comparatively lower than they are now in 7th I will be super happy.

[Sonoftherubric21]

Well the Interceptors are so ludicrously expensive that I am curious as to where rubrics end up. 

But being that power level includes the special guns, I still think its logical to assert 130-140 points base for 5 models including aspiring, followed by 20-22 per model after. 

Feels about right given what we have and our new rule. 

Look at that freaking Genestealer power..... no overwatch AND - to a stat..

 

These TS powers better be nuts because Smite on an ASP is garbage compared to that genestealer cult power. Most armies wont care that you get Smite off AND it won't even cast anyway with my luck

 

Right? Granted if we look at average lists, my last War Cabal list I ran was sitting at  about 10 Psykers in a list. 

 

So thats 10 casts of smite + whatever else they give us. I hope its at least 3-6 powers so our exalted dont all have the same dang powers.