Emperor's Furor Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 This is what I have at the moment the only thing that is missing is the additional wargear for any champions and characters, have 58 points left to play with for that if the points are the correct going by the current codex but with added mark of khorne on top of everything. I was thinking of putting the herald in the unit of cultists as according to the rumours, he's fearless and so he makes them to. Khorne Daemon Prince - Wings - 200 Herald of Khorne - 55 Khorne Bezerkers (9) - 181 Rhino - 35 Khorne Marines (10) - CCWs - 180 Rhino - 35 Khorne Cultists (30) - 190 Khorne Bikers (3) - 2 meltaguns - 96 Khone Forgefiend - 185 Khorne Maulerfiend - Lasher tendrils - 145 Khorne Hellbrute - Twin-linked Lascannon - 140 Total - 1442 Wouldn't it be best to put the Herald with the Zerkers?, so that they benefit from his Locus of Hatred, after all cultists are there to be sacrified, so making them 3x10 would be better. Yeah he can do I guess, I suppose the way I saw it was if you have a big band of fearless cultists then their more likely to attract attention and they won't run away. Problem with cultists is if you split them into smaller groups they actually cost more because you're paying for additional cultist champions. Would you get champions of the berzerker and khorne marine units any weapons or keep them bare? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer le Boucher Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Well personnaly i run them by 8 for the Zerkers and 2 LC's on the Champ, the CSM Champ usually one LC or at least a Combi melta and a power weapon. An interesting addition would be those new Rapiers guns, they're relatively well priced and you can have some serious fire power from them for nearly the same price as one dread, 3 Hades canons or Destroyer Lascans can do quite a number on armored units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Definitely, among other things that could be useful for us in that book. Everything hinges on the allies matrix or counts-as source army or whatever you want to call it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Saturday is when the ebook copies get released so that will be the earliest. With a little bit of luck I'll be able to tell you everything you need to know way before saturday, but I can't promise anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I'm on the fence about this book. I've made no secret I'm not a fan of space hippies in my Chaos Space Marine armies, but they have their uses. That said I've been a sucker for chaos release and stupidly buy everything CSM that's been out for the last 15 or so years. This will be a first for me not pre-ordering, not going full... idiot on the releases. I really don't think I understand this book, and I know some people have it, so maybe someone can fill in the blanks. This Daemonkin book is a full on Codex, not a supplement. So I'm assuming every unit available to it, is in those pages. So it must be missing a ton of CSM stuff? I'm assuming since it's not a supplement it simply wouldn't be amending wargear and Formations to already existing Codexes. This is where I'm confused. What are the new units? Or is this just a smash up of half Khorne daemons and half Khorne Chaos? Could I use Obliterators? Could I use CSM bikes? There must be a lot of stuff the Daemonkin can't access? It mentions stuff like rules for the CSM Khornate warbands... are we talking about Zhufor here? Or just more Space Hippies? I'm really on the fence about this book. On the surface it just feels like a Supplement, that will re-list CSM/ Daemon items with MoK. Am I wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I'm subconsciously hoping that these books will replace the older Chaos Codex, and we'll see the next three in succession over the months. As far as we're aware, it'll operate as a separate Codex with the same (or similar) options as the main Codex. Judging this from the filter on the website for Khorne Daemonkin, which includes all the options from a cursory glance as would be expected... Forge/Maulers, Land Raiders, Heldrakes, Defilers, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Saturday is when the ebook copies get released so that will be the earliest. With a little bit of luck I'll be able to tell you everything you need to know way before saturday, but I can't promise anything.I think I'd rather wait for Saturday so I can just come home from work at 7 AM EST and read it myself. @The Prot: See, that's the thing. Currently all of the information is from one person on Warseer who has said nothing since his first post and has "forgotten" details that were made obvious GW's White Dwarf. So we don't really know what is or isn't there. Which is why I find it a little ironic everyone is treating like it's a new gospel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 This is where I'm confused. What are the new units? no new units. you can't even use the special non stock BT. Or is this just a smash up of half Khorne daemons and half Khorne Chaos? yes Could I use Obliterators? if you take them as ally. but they will not be affected by any of the rules. Could I use CSM bikes? yes. but you will probably want to use dogs instead. There must be a lot of stuff the Daemonkin can't access? define can't access. as ally they can have anything chaos. In the book they can take only khorn stuff+dreads+fiends+khorn LoW[the bad one] and both versions of the defiler[the crap csm one and the ok demon one, although it has to be khorn so being ok could be contested]. But of course GW wouldn't be GW, if they didn't leave some old chaos stuff in and fix some other stuff. For example the rule that made us roll on tthe boon table and forced us to do challanges is gone. Or to be more precise replaced with a rule that forces us to do challanges, but without the boon table for wining. We do get +1blood token for killing opponents in challange though[killing not wounding]. I'm subconsciously hoping that these books will replace the older Chaos Codex, and we'll see the next three in succession over the months. Am sure that would make all the non cult players realy happy about the future of codex. I'm assuming since it's not a supplement it simply wouldn't be amending wargear and Formations to already existing Codexes. Think about the codex as khorn decurion[as in style not effectivness]. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I'm subconsciously hoping that these books will replace the older Chaos Codex, and we'll see the next three in succession over the months. Am sure that would make all the non cult players realy happy about the future of codex. That's why we have Black Legion and Crimson Slaughter! Although, I'm guessing it will ultimately lead to a more unified Codex at the end, these are just the ways to make specific use of the Cults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I would be shocked if we see another of these books this year. We might see a second next year for nurgle, if they bother putting out a new plastic great unclean one. I doubt we will ever see similar books for tzeentch and slaanesh. Well, when you consider how fast GW is pumping out codices since quite some months now and assuming for a moment they're not going to update any of the main codices for some time now (as they're all hardbook now, Necrons was the last softcover book left, never mind Sisters lol)... then I wouldn't be surprised at all actually. It might also depend on how well this codex and the Bloodthirster are selling. (not the choice if they're going to release it, but when) As a sidenote, has anybody noticed that The Jeske his English has improved so much over the years that some people might not notice anymore than he's Russian? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I would be shocked if we see another of these books this year. We might see a second next year for nurgle, if they bother putting out a new plastic great unclean one. I doubt we will ever see similar books for tzeentch and slaanesh. As Zhukov alluded to - it's like a Codex a month currently! All within the realms of possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 This is where I'm confused. What are the new units? no new units. you can't even use the special non stock BT. What? Am I misunderstanding you, or are you under the impression we can't take any of the 3 new Bloodthirsters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Well, turns out the initial leaks were accurate: Via GoonBandito at dakkadakka: I have the Khorne codex in hand, so feel free to ask any burning questions you might have http://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/a/c944477abc92c1c101da485e07ff06d8.gif From a quick glance so far, it appears all profiles and costs of units are the same as Chaos Demon and Chaos Space Marine codexes (with the mark of khorne/demon of khorne upgrades added into the cost if the unit didn't already come with it added in). All units have the Blood for the Blood God rule - this is the Blood Tithe rule that has already been discussed. Note that any units that are summoned via the Blood Tithe table enter play via Deep Strike within 6 or 12" from a friendly unit with the Blood for the Blood God rule, just like how Psychic Summoning works. Yes this means turning your characters (only ones without the Demon of Khorne rule) into Flying Demon Princes or Bloodthirsters is still kinda sucky, since you'll have to wait two turns before you charge... If you turn your Warlord into a Demon Prince/Bloodthirster, it doesn't count as a casualty for Slay the Warlord and you keep your Warlord Traits. Also note that a unit has to have the Blood for the Blood God rule to generate Blood Tithe, so no funneling allied Grots down the grinder lol. Demons do not have the Demonic Instability rule - they instead have Fearless (meaning you can now join Demon and Chaos Marine Independent Characters together) The Champion of Chaos rule is gone... ... only to be replaced with the Skulls for the Skull Throne! rule which does the exact same thing (except you don't even get Chaos Boons anymore). As an added bonus, all Demon characters have it now too! Thanks GW! Skulltaker is the only named character in the book. There are no Demonic Rewards. Loci are available to Heralds, exactly the same as Chaos Demon Codex Chaos Rewards are called Gifts of Khorne, and are the same except that the Gift of Mutation is not available. A Collar of Khorne can be bought for 15pts instead (same as what Flesh Hounds come with) An Axe of Khorne (same as in Codex Chaos Demons) can be bought as a Melee Weapon for 30pts. Heralds of Khorne got dicked on there (they can take it as a Lesser Reward for 10pts in Codex Chaos Demon), but Chaos Marine characters can now enjoy an AP2 weapon at initiative. There is a 50pt Artefact that grants a 3+ Armour Save, Eternal Warrior and Feel No Pain available to Chaos Lords and Demon Princes. Ally Matrix: Battle Brothers: Chaos Demons, Chaos Space Marines Convenience: Necrons, Orks Desperate: Dark Eldar, Tau Come the Apocalypse: Imperium, Eldar, Harlequins, Tyranids The Blood Host Detachment is a Necron Decurion style thing made up of 5 different Formations. The Blood Host detachment gives you 1 free Blood Tithe point at the start of each of your turns. Core: * Slaughtercult: (1 Chaos Lord/Herald/Blood Throne/Skulltaker/Demon Prince/Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury, 2-8 Chaos Space Marines/Bezerkers/Bloodletters in any combination, 1-4 Possessed, 0-2 Spawn, 0-2 Cultists). If Cultists from this formation fail a Morale test, you can choose to remove the remaining models as casualties (thus earning a Blood Tithe point). When spending Blood Tithe points, you can choose a 2nd Reward of lesser value (but not more than 4pts worth) in addition for free. Auxiliary (1-8 choices per Slaughtercult) * Brazen Onlsaught: (1-4 Terminators, 2-4 Bloodcrushers). Units in this formation that are outnumbered in assault gain +1 attack * Khorne's Bloodstorm: (2-4 Raptors, 1-4 Warp Talons, 0-1 Heldrake). Hammer of Wrath and Vector Strikes are +1S. * Gorepack: (2-4 Chaos Bikers, 1-4 Flesh Hounds). Move Through Cover, Preferred Enemy (Psykers), Flesh Hounds gain Hammer of Wrath, Chaos Bikers gain Shred on their Hammer of Wrath attacks. * Charnel Cohort: (1 Demon Prince/Herald/Blood Throne/Skulltaker, 2-8 Bloodletters, 1-4 Flesh Hounds, 1-4 Bloodcrushers, 0-4 Skull Cannons). Counter Attack, HQ can re-roll reserve rolls if in Deep Strike Reserve, All other units do not scatter from Deep Strike Reserve if placed within 6" of HQ, Enemy Units have -2Ld against Fear checks from units in this formation. * War Engine: (1 Helbrute, Defiler, Soul Grinder, Forgefiend, Maulerfiend or Lord of Skulls). No extra special rules Command (0-1 per Slaughtercult) Lord of Slaughter - 1 Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury/Insensate Rage/Wrath of Khorne or 1 Lord of Skulls. No extra special rules. The Bloodthirsters incidentally are the same as the White Dwarf dataslates, with the addition of the Skulls for the Skull Throne! Rule, Fearless instead of Demonic Instability and no options to purchase any extra wargear. Minimum size of Cultist, Chaos Marine, Bezerker and Bloodletter units is now 8. You can still add models up to their previous max sizes (35 for cultists, 20 for the other three). This means the minimum cost for Cultists, Chaos Marines and Bezerkers went up, while the minimum cost for Bloodletters came down by the appropriate points. 1) No Chaos Boons, though you do earn Blood Tithe for killing characters in challenges. 2) You can take 1 Helbrute, Defiler, Soul Grinder, Forgefiend, Maulerfiend or Lord of Skulls as War Engine as part of your 1-8 Formation choices per Slaughtercult. So Yes, you can take them as part of the Blood Host. 3) You keep relics if you become a Demon Prince (and ignore any restrictions of Demon Princes normally having that relic). Bloodthirsters lose them. Also, you can only summon a Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury (the default one with an Axe of Khorne/Lash or Khorne) from Blood Tithe. You earn points when a unit containing at least 1 model with the Blood for the Blood God rule either kills an enemy unit or is completely destroyed and/or when a model with the Blood for the Blood God rule either kills an enemy character in a challenge or is killed in a challenge. What I meant was that you can't earn Blood Tithe from allied units, unless they were allied Khorne Demonkin (ie no running cheap packs of Grots or whatever at the enemy to get slaughtered so you can summon Bloodthirsters). There's 3 relic weapons *+1S AP2 unwieldy axe that gets more powerful the more unsaved wounds it causes (1-2 wounds is +1S, 3-4 is Rampage, 5-7 is x2S, 8+ is Instant Death. All cumulative.) * S User, AP3 sword that generates an extra blood tithe point if you cause at least 1 casualty in an assault phase. * A special Axe of Khorne that in addition turns the bearer into a Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury when he dies, but the Bloodthirster takes d3 wounds (can take Invuln saves) at the end of each turn. It seems any unit from Codex: Chaos Space Marines that had the Demon rule, now has the Demon of Khorne rule. Forgefiends, Maulerfiends and Defilers all went up by 5pts seemingly because of this. Heldrakes are now Demons of Khorne too, but remained the same price (probably because Furious Charge and Hatred: Demons of Slaanesh are useless on a Flyer). Helbrutes have neither the Mark or Demon of Khorne rule. Possessed now have both the Demon and Mark of Khorne rules, for a 4pt increase (they are 30pts/model). Blood Tithe buffs affect all friendly units with the Blood for the Blood God rule (which is every unit in the codex).Automatically Appended Next Post:Oh, something else I just noticed - the minimum size of Cultist, Chaos Marine, Bezerker and Bloodletter units is now 8. You can still add models up to their previous max sizes (35 for cultists, 20 for the other three). This means the minimum cost for Cultists, Chaos Marines and Bezerkers went up, while the minimum cost for Bloodletters came down by the appropriate points (remember to factor in Mark of Khorne costs for the Chaos Space Marine units). You are correct - the relic-axe specifically says the Bloodthirster is summoned when the bearer is removed as a casualty. I suppose technically the bearer could be killed in the enemy shooting phase, Bloodthirster is summoned (ie enters play via Deep Strike in Swoop Mode), is shot at by a different unit and Grounded, meaning it's starting the next turn in Glide mode and therefore able to charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 So, what about the earlier confusion on whether or not all enemy units(when killed) provide Blood Tithe Points regardless of who killed them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 *edit*Whoops that didn't answer your question. One minute. *edit 2*Based on what has been said so far it appears only units with Blood for the Blood God rule generate points when they kill units, or are themselves killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teetengee Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Can we take that brazen onslaught formation outside of the slaughtercult deal? Also, is there anything in particular that requires the butcherhorde to select Khorne Berzerkers and CSM from the CSM codex, or does it just list the units? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 @Malisteen: Teetengee asked why the Butcherhorde takes only CSM and Berzerkers....... @Teetengee: The formation lists that you only take Khârn, CSM and Berzerkers. However, as Malisteen pointed out, unless there is FAQ coming out soon, they will only have the rules and options they have in the CSM Codex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 You can take 1 Helbrute, Defiler, Soul Grinder, Forgefiend, Maulerfiend or Lord of Skulls as War Engine as part of your 1-8 Formation choices per Slaughtercult. So Yes, you can take them as part of the Blood Host. that seems to be the only viable thing coming out of this dex: you may now add as many daemon engines as you like to any battle-forged army. add blood tithe bonus (for them only, so propably nothing at all...) and khorne affiliation only (literally the worst mark for all of them). still, I like the idea of a khornate forgefiend. same with bikers and hounds (half-decent, move through cover is great on bikes). no heldrakes though (+3 crap jump units ...yeah right). :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I read his question where he asks what requires the Butcherhorde to take CSMs and Berzerkers and your reply honestly confuses me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 nvm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 And the part of it afterwards that says "or does it just list them" says what exactly? @Nehekhare: “A Daemonkin warband has two major components – Daemons and mortals –which are organised in various groups across a Blood Host Detachment. The Slaughtercult, for example, is the heart of the army and it’s predominantly made up of Chaos Space Marines and Cultists. Both are available as plastic kits and the Dark Vengeance boxed set is a great place to get your hands on 20 Cultists in one go (not to mention loads of other great miniatures). Add in a few Khorne Berzerkers, a Chaos Lord and a box of Possessed Chaos Space Marines and you’re well on your way to a powerful Khorne Daemonkin army. With the core of your rampaging army established, you can build on it in several different ways. Chaos Terminators and Bloodcrushers make up the hard-hitting element of your army, while Raptors, Warp Talons and Heldrakes form the aerial assault force. Add in a Charnel Cohort of Flesh Hounds, Bloodletters and Skull Cannons, a healthy smattering of War Engines such as the Forgefiend and the Lord of Skulls and a mighty Bloodthirster and you’ve got a legion truly worthy of the Blood God.” Excerpt From: Dwarf, White. “White Dwarf Issue 60: 21st March 2015.” iBooks. This material may be protected by copyright. Check out this book on the iBooks Store: https://itun.es/us/o81s6.l So the Daemonkin do have access to Heldrakes. Which is weird that no one has mentioned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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