General Discussion

[Slips]

When they re-opened Warhammer World a book with the formation only sold there was published.

[Grifftofer]

Ah. Fair enough. I moved away from Nottingham about 2 months before the re-opening or I would have been there. It does kinda make me glad that the 30k 'meta' is so stable though. It just sort of moves along at a reasonable pace with things (seemingly) getting tighter and more balanced overall.

[simison]

Defeat, very slim defeat. We ended a turn early because people were wearing out. No actual score was counted up, but my forces were thinning, even as the Black Templars were resurging.

 

In the end, I fielded 4,500 points with an Imperial Militia ally.

[Sigismund229]

Woohoo! Templars! Purge the Heretic brothers!

[simison]

*snip* Forum Rules *snip*

Edited August 29, 2016 by simison

[Slips]

Going to have to ask you to Repost that without the individual Points Costs, Rules or Stat Lines because thats against forum rules.

[simison]

Going to have to ask you to Repost that without the individual Points Costs, Rules or Stat Lines because thats against forum rules.

 

Ok, give me a moment, internet is slow.

[simison]

+++ BA 1 (4451pts) +++

+ HQ (570pts) +

Legion Centurion ([Jump Pack, Melta Bombs, Power Armour, Refractor Field]
Rules: Consul, Independent Character
····Consul [Chaplain]
····Rules: Zealot
····Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules]
····Rules: Legiones Astartes

Legion Praetor [Artificer Armour, Digital Lasers, Iron Halo, Jump Pack]
Rules: Independent Character, Relics of the Dark Age of Technology Clarification 
····Legion Command Squad [5x Combat Shield, Jump Packs, 4x Legion Space Marine Chosen, Legion Standard Bearer, Melta Bombs, 2x Power Fist, 3x Power Weapon]
····Rules: Chosen Warriors, Retinue
····Master of the Legion [Pride of the Legion]


+ Troops (541pts) +

Legion Assault Squad [12x Legion Assault Space Marines, 3x Power Weapon]
····Legion Assault Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Combat Shield, Melta Bombs, Power Fist]
····Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules]
····Rules: Legiones Astartes

Legion Assault Squad [11x Legion Assault Space Marines, 3x Power Weapon]
····Legion Assault Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Combat Shield, Melta Bombs, Power Fist]

+ Elites (1635pts) +

Apothecarion Detachment 
Rules: Apothecarion Detachment
····Legion Apothecary [Artificer Armour]
········Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules]
········Rules: Legiones Astartes
····Legion Apothecary  [Artificer Armour]

Legion Terminator Squad [Legion Terminator Sergeant, 4x Legion Terminators, Plasma Blaster, 4x Power Fist, Tartaros Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon]
Rules: Implacable Advance
····Legion Land Raider Phobos [Armoured Ceramite, Dozer Blade, Frag Assault Launchers]
····Rules: Assault Vehicle, Machine Spirit

Legion Terminator Squad [Cataphractii Terminator Armour with Combi-bolter and Power Weapon, 4x Legion Terminators, Plasma Blaster, 4x Power Fist]
Rules: Implacable Advance
····Legion Land Raider Phobos [Armoured Ceramite, Dozer Blade]
····Rules: Assault Vehicle, Machine Spirit
····Legion Terminator Sergeant [Power Fist ]

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad [2x Heavy Bolter and Suspensor Web, Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier, 9x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Legion Vexilla, Marksmen, Melta Bombs]
Rules: Implacable Advance, Outflank, Repair, Sniper
····Legion Veteran Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Power Fist]

Legion Veteran Tactical Squad [2x Heavy Bolter and Suspensor Web, Legion Rhino Armoured Carrier, 9x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Legion Vexilla, Marksmen, Melta Bombs]
Rules: Implacable Advance, Outflank, Repair, Sniper
····Legion Veteran Sergeant [Artificer Armour, Power Fist]
····Legiones Astartes [Legion Specific Rules]

+ Fast Attack (570pts) +

Legion Storm Eagle Assault Gunship [Armoured Ceramite, Twin-linked Multi-melta, Two Twin-linked Lascannons]
Rules: Assault Vehicle, Deep Strike, Machine Spirit

Legion Storm Eagle Assault Gunship [Armoured Ceramite, Twin-linked Multi-melta, Two Twin-linked Lascannons]
Rules: Assault Vehicle, Deep Strike, Machine Spirit

+ Legion +

Legion Astartes

+ Lord of War  +

Questoris Knight Warden 
Rules: War Machine Detachment
····Questoris Knight Warden [stormspear rocket pod]
····Rules: Household Rank

++ Imperialis Militia and Cults Army List (Allied Detachment) ++

+ HQ +

Force Commander 
Rules: Independent Character
····The Muster of Worlds [Abhuman Helots , Cyber-augmetics]

+ Troops +

Imperialis Militia Grenadier Squad [Grenadier Sergeant, 9x Grenadiers, Lasrifles, Vexilla]

Imperialis Militia Grenadier Squad [Grenadier Sergeant, 9x Grenadiers, Lasrifles, Vexilla]

+ Heavy Support +

Militia Auxiliary Battle Tank Attack Squadron [Leman Russ Battle Tank, Leman Russ Battle Tank, Leman Russ Battle Tank]

 

That better? Anyway, this is what I marched out with. The second Land Raider was about to face off against the Soul Grinder that destroyed the first one. Meanwhile, the Praetor and his Apothecary were trying to hold off a Bloodthrister. In the air, the Storm Eagles were doing what they can and taking out armored targets. In the last turn, one was stuck in Stun, while the other had taken out a different Soul Grinder. 

 

Anyway, was my list good, bad, or ugly?

Edited August 29, 2016 by simison

[Skalpynock]

Thinking about the Selenar again, have we established which legions take part in the First Pacification of Luna? I'm partial to having the Steel Guard be there, as it would strain the latter relationship between the Gene-Cult and latter Suzerainty, but would make for a great plot point. If it hasn't been established yet, then I propose the following: Morning Stars (switchable with Steel Guard if I find it worthwil), Apostles of War, Tenth Legion (Demus, do the Fire Keepers have a cognomen(prior)?)

[Demus Ragnok]

No.

[bluntblade]

Might the Morning Stars join the Suzerainty, rather than following Icarion into Chaos?

[MikhalLeNoir]

Thinking about the Selenar again, have we established which legions take part in the First Pacification of Luna? I'm partial to having the Steel Guard be there, as it would strain the latter relationship between the Gene-Cult and latter Suzerainty, but would make for a great plot point. If it hasn't been established yet, then I propose the following: Morning Stars (switchable with Steel Guard if I find it worthwil), Apostles of War, Tenth Legion (Demus, do the Fire Keepers have a cognomen(prior)?)

 

I would add the first legion.

 

But the Apostels are keen to slaighter some enemies. Blood for the emperor!!!

[Skalpynock]

Might the Morning Stars join the Suzerainty, rather than following Icarion into Chaos?

I'm not against the idea, but you'd have to convince me.

[Sigismund229]

The Blood Wolves take part in the pacification of Luna to clear orbital defenses through boarding actions. Or at least that's how I wrote their fluff and I'd rather not change.

 

Phantoms also take part as a scouting force

[MikhalLeNoir]

Lets alter the fluff then ^^ :p

[Sigismund229]

So, AO has brought to my attention the fact that some are unhappy/uncomfortable with some of the fluff that I have been writing as I have not run all the details past the community prior to posting it and this leads to legions and characters being changed. For this I apologize. 

 

However, I feel like I should explain why this happens. The way I write is I sit down with a vague idea of an event and then essentially crank out the whole thing in one long burst, filling in details as I go and as they occur to me. This enables me to pump out drafts relatively quickly. However, that's all they are meant to be. Drafts. I post them so that people can voice concern, point out what I got wrong, whatever it happens to be, or parts that they have concerns over. This means that I can get a lot done(I'm impatient by nature) and feel like I've achieved something which I can then change to fit in or debate details of. 

 

So once again I apologize that the way I have written has led to some people being unhappy with the way their legion is portrayed. However, I would like to keep writing at the same kind of pace as I do but that will only work if people point out what I get wrong and where or what doesn't fit with their visions of things etc. So if I could, I'd like to ask if people could do that and I shall do my best not to get carried away by how cool I think an aspect of something I've put in is and to take their suggestions on board. Oh and editing won't always be immediate as I do a lot of this stuff on my phone and I can't edit very well on there so speed of editing depends on whether I have my laptop available to me and also it may take one or two extra drafts for me to get it right

 

As the Space Wolves/Vlka Fenryka say, I see my failings and shall make efforts to correct it. 

Edited August 29, 2016 by Sigismund229

[AlphariusOmegon108]

So, AO has brought to my attention the fact that some are unhappy/uncomfortable with some of the fluff that I have been writing as I have run all the details past the community prior to posting it and this leads to legions and characters being changed. For this I apologize. 

 

However, I feel like I should explain why this happens. The way I write is I sit down with a vague idea of an event and then essentially crank out the whole thing in one long burst, filling in details as I go and as they occur to me. This enables me to pump out drafts relatively quickly. However, that's all they are meant to be. Drafts. I post them so that people can voice concern, point out what I got wrong, whatever it happens to be, or parts that they have concerns over. This means that I can get a lot done(I'm impatient by nature) and feel like I've achieved something which I can then change to fit in or debate details of. 

 

So once again I apologize that the way I have written has led to some people being unhappy with the way their legion is portrayed. However, I would like to keep writing at the same kind of pace as I do but that will only work if people point out what I get wrong and where or what doesn't fit with their visions of things etc. So if I could, I'd like to ask if people could do that and I shall do my best not to get carried away by how cool I think an aspect of something I've put in is and to take their suggestions on board. Oh and editing won't always be immediate as I do a lot of this stuff on my phone and I can't edit very well on there so speed of editing depends on whether I have my laptop available to me and also it may take one or two extra drafts for me to get it right

 

As the Space Wolves/Vlka Fenryka say, I see my failings and shall make efforts to correct it. 

 

I am so happy to see you take it up this well, love to that man. Looking forward to more of your work :)

[MikhalLeNoir]

Hmm. I think the problem here is your working style. It is very good to crunch things, push them forward and get things done. For that you have my deepest respect. But that kind of workstyle has its problems as you self proclaim. Working this way is literally keeping the community out. It is too fast to keep up. Some have a families in real life others succumbed to nerith ahatsoever. As this is a communityproject the Brainstorming phase is imminent important as there you work with the community and after various cycles of discussion where you go more and more into detail and habe all details finally set in stone, you can write. Amd write how it was discussed before. So the community feels involved. The other way it seems as if you are doing your thing and simply ignore the work/ thoughts of others. It wokrs when you work on your own legion history, but as soon as someones other legion is involved you can be sure that there will be beef. Same if some points come up regularily and are dismissed. If critique comes up not for the first time, then maybe there is something you have to change. I mean not throwing the whole concept over board, but maybe work on nuances to make the whole more plausible.

 

The whole process is a refining process.

 

You know, i critizise a lot. But that is because this project as a community project os very important to me nowadays and i like you all, this is a great bunch of creative people with different ideas and backgrounds. It should not be ignored.

 

And of course Gwal is the one who brings balance to the force.

Edited August 29, 2016 by MikhalLeNoir

[Sigismund229]

Painful though it is, I'm afraid I have to agree that I work too quickly and end up leaving stuff behind or missing criticisms(although I try my best not to ignore or forget them). I shall try not to rush ahead although I make no promises(it gets awfully frustrating sometimes waiting for responses to ideas one has had and it gets tempting to simply write it). Which brings me to a roadblock I've run into rewriting the intro to book 3. 

 

I know the broad outline of what happens in between Insurrection and Escalation, traitors expand their realm, get stopped by edict of emancipation etc. However, I don't really have enough to do the full summary section. I(sorry for this) made an attempt at the first years of the Insurrection which came out as this:

 

Conquest

From the minute he had announced his rebellion, some worlds had defected to the Stormlord. Principally these were concentrated in and around the Maelstrom zone, although the Stormlord commanded widespread respect and was the object of much adulation across the Imperium and managed to win over many systems across the Imperium to his cause. However, the overwhelming majority of the Imperium stayed loyal to the Emperor and Warmaster.

 

So it was that the Stormlord sent his legions out from Madrigal to expand his domains within and beyond the borders of the Maelstrom. However, as his legions conquered the Stormlord also put into action a strategy meant to bleed and confused the Warmaster’s forces. This took many forms, varying from raids by the Stygian Jackals and Grave Stalkers upon Imperial shipping to civil uprisings coordinated by his agents working in the shadows and large scale assaults by his more brutal legions, notably the Berserkers of Uran, which annihilated the target world’s defences and left it a blacked husk. Yet however uncoordinated these assaults, raids and uprisings appeared to be they were all part of an overarching strategy coordinated by the Stormlord from his capital of Madrigal.

 

In the opening years of the Insurrection when he utilised this strategy, it was extremely effective. The reports the Warmaster received of traitor movements and numbers were confusing, in some cases contradictory and occasionally defied all logic. While the Warmaster coordinated the Imperium’s defences as best he could, sending out Commissions of Array for the raising of new Imperial Army regiments, he often fought with one arm tied behind his back, blinded by warp storms and the Stormlord’s strategy and with his forces bleeding from a thousand cuts he didn’t know existed. He was further hampered by the way the warp storms wracking the galaxy hampered communication between his forces. Many a time, he issued orders only for them to arrive months late and no longer possible.

 

Because of these myriad causes, the Imperial reaction to the Stormlord’s offensives was often slow and uncoordinated. With every day that this continued, more and more worlds defected to the Stormlord of their own accord, seeking to avoid being destroyed by his forces against which the Imperium seemed unable to give any effective response. In addition to these can be added the worlds which the Stormlord’s armies conquered, through fear or force. Through a combination of these two factors, the Stormlord’s domain steadily grew and spread out from Madrigal.

 

As his insurrection came into its sixth year, the Stormlord could confidently proclaim that he had the allegiance of almost all the systems within the Maelstrom zone and in the central systems of the Imperium that surrounded it. His forces had also made significant inroads into the galactic north east, although they were opposed by the brave sons of Huron who fought them every step of the way, leading to the north east becoming a patchwork of conflicting loyalties, and the galactic south and east, where only a thin strip of Imperial occupied space connected Terra to those Imperial strongholds holding out on the Eastern Fringe.

 

Looking over the empire he had carved off from the body of his father’s Imperium, the Stormlord determined that he was in a strong position. The time was right for the next phase of his plan to be put into action: the offensive against Terra. 

 

 

 

I tried to keep it as general as I could. Here's the idea I had of the first 16 years of the Insurrection that I was working off:

The traitors expand out from Madrigal, taking control of that central swirly bit of the galaxy(or at least a lot of it) and then expand out east. The North East falls in varying degrees, as the Iron Bears and Interex fight to hold it and their success or failure in various systems leads to the north east becoming this patchwork of worlds of different loyalties. Due to this push, Imperial forces along the eastern fringe and the south east get gradually forced back until they're a narrow(ish) strip of strongholds holding out against Icarion, kept in contact with Terra by a narrow corridor that goes from Ionaish to Dhul'Hasaish. 

 

With the east only narrowly held onto by the loyalists or in the patchwork state of the north east, Icarion diverts forces to start an offensive towards Terra spearheaded by the Harbingers. This offensive is what ultimitely causes Alex to issue to the edict of emancipation, halting it on the outskirts of the segmentum solar, creating a kind of bulge between Delos and Ryza where the traitors left places that were heavily defended to try and push further on to Terra. And then that was how the galaxy was in my mental image with the stalemate and Blood Crusade. 

 

Would this work? Or do people not think is how it would play out?

 

Actually, have we even discussed this a lot before?

[Raktra]

Well, I'm gonna take it on myself to bring the mood back up a wee touch after the self-reflection and beating-uppery:

http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_md1cr9CZUu1rey868o1_400.gif

[Nomus Sardauk]

Well, I'm gonna take it on myself to bring the mood back up a wee touch after the self-reflection and beating-uppery:

 

http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_md1cr9CZUu1rey868o1_400.gif

You know things are bad when Raktra of all people is taking it upon himself to cheer folks up. :D

[Kelborn]

Trust in Raktra. If he is able to motivate Khorne, he can do everyone.

"Honey, don't be upset because of the bad humans. I got cookies for you. And Khorneflakes, your favorite ones!" :)

[simison]

"Would this work? Or do people not think is how it would play out?

 

Actually, have we even discussed this a lot before?"

 

Only vaguely. Looking at the map, there's a lot of sense in your descriptions. The East side of Ultima only has one Loyalist homeworld (Dhul'hasa) and two Traitor worlds (Fugion, Uran). There would be a natural advantage for Icarion to push toward the 'softer' East to expand his domain and provide him with much needed resources to tackle the more fortified West. Furthermore, by going East first, that takes the war farther away from Terra, doubling Alex's troubles in trying to organize the Imperial War Machine to defend itself against Icarion. I suspect that the Dune Serpents are the sole reason that the Far East doesn't fall to Icarion with their hit-and-run tactics able to harass and keep the Traitors from securing the East. 

 

On a personal note, I'm surprised we had such a strong East-West dynamic going on in our Insurrection. Who knew. 

Edited August 29, 2016 by simison

[bluntblade]

I guess that puts Azus in a prime position to a) fulfill the Raven Guard/White Scars role and b) show us how morally questionable the Loyalists can get.

[Kelborn]

*raises a hand*

 

The Predators' homeworld is as well in the east.

 

As long as we don't have something comparable to Lorgars Ruinstorm, they could fight in the east as well for the first years or so and still be at Terra for the final betrayal *cough* battle.