Devastation of Baal - Guy Haley - Discussion/Spoilers

[Crimson Ghost IX]

Thanks for posting the interview here Palwatch.

I very much enjoyed the read.

 

Detailed ideas... Force for good = awesome.

 

With the rate Primarchs are showing up it would be disappointing if the Greatest Chapter in the Universe ™ is left Primarchless.

The rate? Only one has come back, the other two just got models. They never went anywhere. As far as I’m concerned, Sanguinius died. He’s dead. Dead dead dead dead dead. He lives on in the bodies and souls of his sons, which is more than some of them do. Be happy, scions of Baal!

 

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This doesn't rule out Leman, Lion etc. They are not dead. Guilliman was not either really I suppose.

 

 

Sanguinius is dead, long live Sanguinius in the bodies and souls of his sons.

That was about what I figured, and indeed how things have been for years in my opinion.

 

But I had speculated more and more lately that there was indeed a coming path for Sanguinius to rise again. It looks like that will not happen on a table top near you ever. Which is fine as it seems a very unpopular idea with most fans generally in my experience. Interview puts nail in that coffin pretty finally for me so I will stop yearning for it myself. Thanks for putting that question to him. Seriously.

 

I have seen Red Thirst as the body part passed down and Black Rage a bitter imprint connection to the spiritual side. Looks like that is how Guy perhaps sees it too. I had speculated that if Sanguinius lived on inside his sons he could resurrect, looks like that is not going to be the case. I am looking forward to what happens next from here.

 

Will be interesting to see what they do with the Red Thirst, Black Rage, and especially how it regards the Primaris Marines in this light.

Will be interesting to see how the Sanguinor manifests going forward also.

Will be very interesting to see our apparently large role in things to come.

 

The more I think on it the Primaris being considered not actually of the blood (because they lack thirst/rage) could perhaps be neatly tied up with a visit from the Sanguinor. I think they need to be further ordained somehow myself still from what I have read here. Perhaps that opinion will change when I read the d*mned book soon =)

 

Anyhow, the interview brought me peace of mind after some cathartic reflection. I think I have reached clarity of expectations for what the future holds.

Thanks again.

Edited November 23, 2017 by Crimson Ghost IX

[Panzer]

Yeah it's very very very unlikely for traitor geneseed to be mixed in with BA Primaris. You'd see immediately that something's not right.

 

Also mentioning the Sons of the Phoenix (kind of obvious name btw lol)...I'm kinda sad that they are just a minor chapter that probably eventually gets used to showcase Primaris turning traitor since I really like their color scheme and the conversion with the candles and stuff they've shown. :P

[Panzer]

Sanguinius being dead for good got said multiple times in different interviews by different people by now. Not sure why people are still expecting him to return (as much as I'd love an epic Sanguinius model in 40k....an updated Sanguinor model will have to do I guess).

[Crimson Ghost IX]

Expecting no, more like hoping.

 

Could have been a neat story idea. Apparently a widely unpopular idea tho.

From a gaming point of view. RG is a pretty big deal on the table.

 

It was hope and trying to find a path where one only existed in theory. Yep.

 

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I am still curious how they are going to integrate nu marines to replace the old.

New stories set up and unfold.

For better or worse.

Edited November 23, 2017 by Crimson Ghost IX

[Karhedron]

Well, Sanguinius won't be coming back, according to him. Quite curious actually. Either he is under strict NDA, or maybe Guilliman just came back to play Emperor 2.0 and that is it for the loyalists thus far? Either way, fingers crossed for a LoW Sanguinor

The rumours I have heard are that there will be more Primarchs coming on both sides. Many of the Chaos Primarchs are still active and could pop out of the warp at any time. Several of the Loyalist Primarchs are simply missing rather than confirmed dead and many of them could return "when the time is right". The most reliable rumour I have heard is the Russ will be next, probably in the spring.

 

However the studio has insisted that Horus, Curze, Ferrus and Sanguinius and properly and truly dead and will not be coming to 40K. This is because each of their deaths plays a big role in shaping the narrative of the 40K universe and the character of their sons. In the case of Horus and Sanguinius, there si always the possibility of a newly empowered Abaddon and Sanguinor somewhere down the road to give those armies a primarch-like centrepiece.

[Frater Cornelius]

Well, I have also heard rumours that plastic Sisters were to be release a year ago and we all know how that turned out :P

[Nemisor]

Honestly if you think its beneath GW to bring the dead back in ways that cheapen good lore in order to sell moar plastic mans, then you havent been paying attention.

[Frater Cornelius]

Honestly if you think its beneath GW to bring the dead back in ways that cheapen good lore in order to sell moar plastic mans, then you havent been paying attention.

Dunno, it seems they have been trying to improve. Certainly, it is also because of revenue, but often those two things are going hand in hand. I think it is an overly negativistic view to say the IP means nothing to them. Maybe some fluff does not sit right with some, but that is a very subjective view. Maybe people in the design team liked it. You know what? At least it seems like they are making an attempt and that's cool in my book ;)

[Rafen IX]

Sanguinius wont come back, its a consistent message and doesnt make a lot of sense. HOWEVER

 

Sanguinius does something to Dante, it could be a vision, or it was legit sanguinius in the warp or something like that.

Also interesting that Dante has now decided the vision of a Golden Armoured Astartes defending the emperor is not him.

Actually Dante at the end of the book post Duel is again certain it is him. He doesn't want it to be but he thinks it is. Also interesting how he saw the Emperors sword was gone from the Throne before meeting Gman. This if anything really validates these visions.

[Panzer]

Well, I have also heard rumours that plastic Sisters were to be release a year ago and we all know how that turned out

What are you talking about? We got three plastic Sisters after all! :D

[Blindhamster]

 

Sanguinius wont come back, its a consistent message and doesnt make a lot of sense. HOWEVER

 

Sanguinius does something to Dante, it could be a vision, or it was legit sanguinius in the warp or something like that.

Also interesting that Dante has now decided the vision of a Golden Armoured Astartes defending the emperor is not him.

Actually Dante at the end of the book post Duel is again certain it is him. He doesn't want it to be but he thinks it is. Also interesting how he saw the Emperors sword was gone from the Throne before meeting Gman. This if anything really validates these visions.

Even at the end he isn't sure it's him. Only that he has an important part to play.

[Frater Cornelius]

We all know that it is Ollanius Pius, risen once again to defend the Emperor #keepthelegendalive

[Blindhamster]

I heard it was an Imperial fist terminator #TheTruthIsOutThere

[Panzer]

Inb4 it's a Celestial Lion. Bam! Out of nowhere! :D

[Robbienw]

A custodian, surely :lol:

[Blindhamster]

Dante specifically calls out that it was an astartes, not a human or a custodes. :tu:

[Sete]

Ah nevermind then. Edited November 24, 2017 by Sete

[Jarl Caldersson]

It's actually a Golden Gryphon marine.

 

Note: I am not even sure how I know that chapter. I actually had to look up a source and yet they are in a "how to paint" book I have never seen, wth.

[the jeske]

Yeah it's very very very unlikely for traitor geneseed to be mixed in with BA Primaris. You'd see immediately that something's not right.

 

Also mentioning the Sons of the Phoenix (kind of obvious name btw lol)...I'm kinda sad that they are just a minor chapter that probably eventually gets used to showcase Primaris turning traitor since I really like their color scheme and the conversion with the candles and stuff they've shown.

Bile did it. he experimented with all organs from all loyalists implanted in to csm. Had good effects too, for example some of the glands from SW implanted in to NL made them less prone to paranoia. BA organs were used to stabilise csm with unstable gene matrix.

 

And AL more or less stole every type of gene seed and organ from every legion at some time, and use agents partially implaneted. they were even able to smuggle some among space marine aspirants in mid trails.

 

But who knows maybe the Cawl tech is too perfect for simple apothecaries to reproduce. I still can't get my head around how a normal marine whose skeletons got reinforeced and super hardned by cermite past ingested for 20-30 years, gets to somehow grow taller while being remade in to a primaris.

[Blindhamster]

 

But who knows maybe the Cawl tech is too perfect for simple apothecaries to reproduce. I still can't get my head around how a normal marine whose skeletons got reinforeced and super hardned by cermite past ingested for 20-30 years, gets to somehow grow taller while being remade in to a primaris.

 

They don't, because they can't

[Ishagu]

Didn't Cawl work alongside the Emperor at some point? It explains his expertise of the subject, even though he can't remember how he got it lol

 

I'm sure this lore was mentioned somewhere...

Edited November 24, 2017 by Ishagu

[Panzer]

Didn't Cawl work alongside the Emperor at some point? It explains his expertise of the subject, even though he can't remember how he got it lol

 

I'm sure this lore was mentioned somewhere...

I think that was speculation for the most part. Not sure if in- or out-universe speculation tho.

[Robbienw]

Yep it was mentioned in his write up in the new Mechanicus codex.  It says he was part of the original space marine development project, and assisted the emperor in developing the black carapace membrane.

 

It says at that point his body was largely still flesh.  I think its safe to assume he started out as one of the emperors cadre of terran scientists, before he joined the mechanicus.

[deathspectersgt7]

And he was known as Bob Cawlings of Perth.

[Panzer]

Yep it was mentioned in his write up in the new Mechanicus codex.  It says he was part of the original space marine development project, and assisted the emperor in developing the black carapace membrane.

 

It says at that point his body was largely still flesh.  I think its safe to assume he started out as one of the emperors cadre of terran scientists, before he joined the mechanicus.

Oh nice, I didn't read the Codex fluff yet!