Firstborn Templars

[Brother Christopher]

On 10/19/2022 at 10:39 PM, DaBoiKyknos said:

Nice customisation on the Redemptor! 

 

Thanks a lot!

 

On 10/20/2022 at 3:35 AM, Razblood said:

Spent the past couple of days reading through this thread, can't believe I've never come across it before!?!

 

Excellent work all round and I respect your resistance to the primaris scourge, having done a primaris army I can honestly say that firstborn are just way more fun to work with.

 

Thank you, Brother! I am honoured that you decided to spend your time and browse through my work. And special thanks for a bit of a cheer to my efforts no to include Primaris infantry! At this point in my life, I wouldn't call them a scourge - I learnt to live with them and persuaded myself that my Crusade can be set in an era prior to the destruction of Cadia and introduction of Primaris. Also, while I like the better proportions of the new models, they don't do it for me in terms of 1. overall aesthetic (I share the sentiment that while they remain distinctly Space Marine, many a model - a Redemptor included - lean more and more towards generic sci-fi) and 2. the way models are divided for assembly.

 

Could you share a bit more with regarding your experience of working Primaris v. Firstborn armies?

 

***

To be honest, progress is disappointing and this conversion project starts to grind me down. This state of affairs probably has something to do with expectations. I expected that the shoulder guards will be ready and I'll be left with doing some details. Unfortunately, I spent the last two hobby sessions on the shape of the shoulder guards and on fixing some issues that popped along the way and, thus, am behind the expected schedule. My inexperience with modelling putties is quite painful. But I want to get things done right, so... I'll need another session with Miliput or green stuff to get things finished.

 

Work in progress shots:

 

Some details on the shoulder-weapon joint:

 

I also reinforced the inside part with plasticard to extent the armour a bit:

 

I also have one more vital decision to make. While I intend to keep the weapon arms movable (the Dreadnought CCW and Gatling/Plasma guns are magnetised), I don't want to fiddle with a twisting torso and want to glue the torso and legs together. However, having messed things up in the past, I'm anxious about a seemingly minor thing: whether the model should be facing left or right.

 

I ask for your insight, Frater! Please bear in mind that the arms and weapons will remain pose-able (hence the two examples of poses for each variant) and the most important thing in question is the direction in which the torso turns:

 

Variant A:

example 1:

 

 

example 2:

 

 

Variant B:

example 1:

 

 

example 2:

 

 

I am aware that these are minor things and extremely nerdy in nature :)  I think I'm leaning more towards Variant B. It should allow me to better exhibit the Maltese cross on the added leg armour (something I'm particularly proud of) and seems more... deliberate? aggressive? Variant A seems a bit more surprised/defensive. 

 

[Razblood]

1 hour ago, Brother Cristopher said:

Could you share a bit more with regarding your experience of working Primaris v. Firstborn armies?

 

 

Building a primaris army is very modular, mainly due to their wargear options. So you have to approach the army on a unit by unit basis with few methods of stamping your own identity onto the list.

 

Conversely, building a firstborn list is a lot more granular, choosing from a good selection of options that just aren't available to primaris in a lot of cases.

 

This allows a firstborn army to be individualized a lot more than a primaris army can be.

[Brother Christopher]

Update. The model is mostly finished. Finally... I should be able to finish it over the next two sessions.

 

I has been an arduous journey but the end is in sight. I hope you'll enjoy the progress report.

 

Front view:

 

Hull-weapons (this section of the model is most butchered, but I hope that paint will cover most of it up):

 

Side views:

 

 

And the parts I'm most proud of: greebles on the back:

 

 

 

And a view of the hull from the bottom:

[Majkhel]

Stellar work, brother!

I'm almost certain you will regret magnetizing the waist  at one point in the future 

Edited November 1, 2022 by Majkhel

[Brother Christopher]

Thank you, brother!

 

22 hours ago, Majkhel said:

I'm almost certain you will regret magnetizing the waist  at one point in the future 

 

How come? Is the magnet problematic? I think I'll just pick the angle I like better and glue the model in place. Forfeiting pose-ability for the extra sturdiness seems like a good trade - I don't like magnets and tend to use them only to be able to swap weapons on certain models or make transporting models easier (and I don't think that a Redemptor is that big of a model to justify the need to transport him in parts).

 

***

Whew. It's done. The 'conversion' stage of my Redemptor Dreadnought conversion project is finally finished.

 

 

 

More photos, including side-by-side comparisons can be found in my new blog.

Edited November 2, 2022 by Brother Cristopher
Progress update

[Majkhel]

Ah, I assumed you meant to leave the waist rotatable but if you glue it stiff, then it's fine. 

I've had bad experiences with magnetized waists left to move around freely   

[Brother Christopher]

On 11/3/2022 at 4:23 PM, Majkhel said:

I've had bad experiences with magnetized waists left to move around freely  

 

Thanks for that - your experience somewhat confirms my concerns so I'll glue the torso in place.

 

I also just realised that I didn't updated this thread with the painted legs.

 

 

 

And some close-ups on some free-hand details from an earlier stage:
 

Spoiler

 

 

 

I made further progress and managed to get the torso done. After taking the photos, I noticed that there are one or two minuscule things I'll need to touch up but apart from that, it's done and done to a surprisingly high standard.

 

 

 

 

 

[phandaal]

Incredible work! Very cool.

[Brother Carpenter]

Really doing the model justice with your paintjob. Love to see it completed!

Edited November 13, 2022 by Brother Carpenter
typo

[Brother Christopher]

After a month and a half of disassembling, building, converting, toiling, sculpting, sanding and painting (as well as photographing and spamming the forum with progress pics), I hereby declare that the model is painted. Sure, there are things that I could still improve but I managed to successfully combat these urges and leave it as it is.

 

Overall, despite that the project turned out to be a bit overwhelming, I am very happy with the final model.

 

First, the weapons:

 

 

 

And the whole thing:

[Bouargh]

What do you foresee for the base? Something industrial/administratum sector, or rumbles or a lowland grass?

[Brother Carpenter]

Very well painted and converted Dread. 

I absolutely love the checkboard on his shoulder.

Kudos 

[Brother Christopher]

A fresh batch of painted models warrants a photo update. Here are some of the more special pieces in my collection, minus the random heavy-flamer guy.

 

 

OOP Metal Terminator Chaplain

 

 

 

 

I am very happy how this one turned out. Not sure about the base, though - but I got some a set of fancy 40mm bases way back so I figured I'll use them for my Terminator Heroes / Command Squad.

 

Random Heavy Flamer Guy:

 

 

Black Templars Marneus Calgar power first brawler or perhaps count-as gravis character (?):

 

 

 

And Black Templars Captain Lysander Thunder Hammer dude number eight:

 

 

 

 

[phandaal]

I see Terminators, I like. Great work, looks awesome!

[Brother Christopher]

OOP Metal Chaplain Grimaldus

 

After around 5-6 years of waiting in the migrating pile of shame, when the character model for the game got obsolete, replaced by the larger plastic kit, I finally got to paint my Chaplain Grimaldus.

 

He turned out to be an amazing model. I never really appreciated how detailed and cool it is until I discovered the different small details here and there. I absolutely enjoyed painting him. I also tried to keep my version close to the old GW's paintjob from Codex: Black Templars: hence the black handle/grip on the crozius or the body of the plasma gun. Also, the pose has grown on me. I have kinda always found it to be a bit... awkward. Now, I think it's pretty unique: like he's standing and reciting some rites of march while the ranks of black Templars move onto transports, ready for war.

 

In terms of self-criticism, I'm mostly angry with myself for missing some mould lines / flash on the helmet which deformed one of the eye lenses. It's something I can live with and at the stage of painting I discovered the defect, it was too late to make any real attempts to fix that. If that was even fixable in the first place.

 

 

 

 

 

[Brother Carpenter]

I hear you brother. I finished mine scant months before the rubiconned Grimaldus appeared. I absolutely loved painting him and his servitors. Did all you candle flames survive?

I lost a flame from the banner servitor.

 

Nice paintjob!

[Brother Christopher]

Thanks mate! I think that we're not loosing out on much. I prefer the old rendition of Grimaldus, TBH - even with it's clunky crozius and squat-marine proportions. The new version is less than the sum of its parts: it has better proportions, better-defined details and some cool gimmicks/touches here and there, but there's something wrong with the pose, which isn't particularly interesting and the way he strides makes him look a bit catwalky.

 

Regarding candle flames, all but one survived - incidentally, it was the banner servitor's! I tried to 'fix' it and it snapped. However, I should have it so I should still be able to glue it in place.

 

[Brother Christopher]

The last of my 2022 models:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In terms of self-criticism, I'm not happy with the mould line seam on the cape (it didn't appear to be as big of a deal) and the helmet. So, the front of the helmet is my best attempt at sculpting. It's not great but it's serviceable from a normal viewing distance.

 

Magnetised Power Fist guys:

 

 

 

And a heavy flamer guy:

 

[Brother Christopher]

Redemptor Dreadnought:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is a "rushed" model, i.e., I gave myself 5 painting sessions to finish him and - with some regret - stuck to the deadline. While there are things I'd like to improve, I think that I want to get through my backlog even more. Regrettably, given the size of my collection and my life situation, I am convinced I can't afford to paint models to a higher standards. The primary goals I want to achieve are: to have a nice-looking army in a display cabinet and to start playing with my models. As such, I think that I can cut some corners in an attempt to have a tabletop + standard.

Edited January 9, 2023 by Brother Christopher

[Firedrake Cordova]

He looks good, @Brother Christopher  Painted models always look better than "miniature factory grey camouflage" 

 

I suppose if there's bits you're not happy with and you're pushed for time, you could come back when circumstances are different and correct them?

[Brother Christopher]

Thank you, Brother!

On 1/10/2023 at 11:50 AM, Firedrake Cordova said:

I suppose if there's bits you're not happy with and you're pushed for time, you could come back when circumstances are different and correct them?

 

You're right - I might come back and redo some of the models in the future. However, my mindset recently changed a bit and I want to focus on painting the models now and finally start using them as gamin pieces. That is why I want to 'rush' things. But I should also note that the meaning of the word 'rush' is very personal and nothing like the dictionary term :D I know that I won't paint as fast as most people in the hobby who have managed to complete multiple armies in the time I painted 20 models (that's my 2022 tally!). By 'rush,' I mean try do find the self-discipline and motivation to find the time to paint every other day and don't get too bogged down by details.

 

I find myself too obsessed about my paint jobs (sloppy lines, missed edges when highlighting) while I don't have the skill nor the resources to properly elevate my overall painting output. With a backlog of ~80-100 models, I intend to focus on getting them table-top-ready and to match the style/aesthetic of the ~200 models I've already painted. That's why I can't or don't want to try new techniques (regrettably, including airbrush!) and am stuck with optimising the quality-to-tame ratio in the framework of my earlier standard. I just want to spend not more than 1 or maybe 1.5 hours on an infantry model.

 

Speaking of time, time also helps fix some of the issues I have with my models when painting them. When I'm focused on painting a model, I tend to see all defects, uneven lines or whatnot. Luckily, after that finished model sits on a shelf for some time and I reinspect it, I find the paint job to be better than I expected and not requiring a redo. I think this is also the case with this Redemptor. Since I submitted it for the 12 Months of Hobby event, I had to base him and retake photos - now it appears to look way better than a couple of days ago. Perception - it's a weird thing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Brother Christopher]

In my recent attempts to make painting my Black Templars more pleasurable and quicker (I really want to finish painting my army), I embarked on a introspective journey. I did some reviewing of my approach to painting and thought about the target 'general aesthetic' of my army as a whole. Considering the size and timespan (over 10 years! I sometimes find it hard to believe it's been so long!) compromises have to be made in terms of quality. Instead of having a uniform paint style for all of my models, I think I have to set the 'general aesthetic' as a target.

 

The models in the photos below are arranged chronologically, from my first ever model on the left to my current approach to painting and standard on the right.

 

 

 

 

 

My first ever model that I'll preserve for posterity:

Also, a rare representative of Gen. 0 of my minis. Notice the very dark edge highlights (a mix of Chaos Black and Skull White - back then, on a limited budged, I couldn't really justify getting a grey paint! lol... so sad :D).

 

Gen. I of my minis - notice that I got a proper grey paint to 'edge highlight', but the lines are quite sloppy. Also, I didn't shade most of the other details (notice the flat parchments).

 

 

Gen. I.I of my minis - A refined version of Gen. 0 and Gen. I being slowly introduced after I developed skills for Gen. II. Since I did most of my best gaming with the Gen. 0 and Gen. I miniatures (ah, the fond memories of the 5th edition battles), stripping the models and repainting them felt really dishonest or even disrespectful. I must admit that I toyed with the idea of starting from scratch but luckily I didn't. As you can see, more edges are highlighted, as well as some depth was added to other colours.

 

 

 

Gen. II of my minis - my go-to formula if I had more time or less models to paint. I consider this to be the peak of my painting skills and determination. The models don't look particularly well in the close-up photos but are really cool 'in person'.

 

 

 

And, finally, Gen. III of my minis - examples of implementing my current 'streamlined' formula: grey edges dry brushed and refined, extensive use of washes on other colours - generally speaking, this approach is slightly more time-efficient compared to the 'benchmark' Gen. II but is way more relaxing and way less straining. Also, I think that the finished models roughly match the aesthetic of Gen. II. It could be argued that the edge highlights of Gen. III are better - they are slicker and more natural, even though (or because!) I no longer aim to hit all the possible edges.

 

 

 

***Please disregard the specks of dust and/or varnish in some photos.***

 

What do you think? When viewed side-by-side and from a distance (like in the group photo), there isn't that much of a difference between Gen. II and Gen. III, right? As a part of a whole army, in a display cabinet or on a tabletop, the entire army should look more-or-less as an aesthetically uniform force - would you agree?

[Firedrake Cordova]

Looking good to me. 

 

As you're talking about streamlining your processes, have you seen Juan Hidalgo's "'Eavy Contrast" series on YouTube? He hasn't done Black Templars, but he has done other examples of black armour (Sisters of Battle, Black Legion, etc) - I don't know if it'd be of help or not 

[Brother Christopher]

Thanks mate!

 

2 hours ago, Firedrake Cordova said:

s you're talking about streamlining your processes, have you seen Juan Hidalgo's "'Eavy Contrast" series on YouTube? He hasn't done Black Templars, but he has done other examples of black armour (Sisters of Battle, Black Legion, etc) - I don't know if it'd be of help or not 

 

No, to be honest I'm not familiar with any YouTubers and/or tutorials. I am that detached from "the hobby" (apart from reading B&C) that painting tutorials are effectively non-existent, i.e., I know that there is a dynamic, ever-growing group of people who create this sort of content but I somehow am not interested in it. I might be afraid to learn something new  or find out that I've been doing something wrong for so many years ;)

 

Having said that, thanks for the recommendation - it'll definitely check it out.

 

Once again, thanks for the comment.

[Firedrake Cordova]

2 hours ago, Brother Christopher said:

No, to be honest I'm not familiar with any YouTubers and/or tutorials. I am that detached from "the hobby" (apart from reading B&C) that painting tutorials are effectively non-existent,

Ah, that's a shame - there's masses of wonderful content on there, from beginner-level stuff up to Golden Daemon winners like Richard Grey and Trovarion. Although, I'll admit it's easy to spend 10 hours watching tutorials and 0 minutes painting because of it..! 

 

As well as Juan Hidalgo's content (which is Contrast with edge highlights), Duncan Rhodes has a Black Templar tutorial - don't know if it's any help/of interest. 

 

2 hours ago, Brother Christopher said:

I might be afraid to learn something new  or find out that I've been doing something wrong for so many years ;)

"Right" is whatever gets you the results you want . It's only "wrong" is when you're not getting the results you want.