Slayer le Boucher Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Why would they? Because the only options we have sucks bulls balls. And those assassin rules are ridiculous... Its like each tim, i'm convinving myself to try and play 8th, some ridiculous thing comes out the very next day, and i'm like "no, not even gonna bother", because i know i will have to face this bullcrop with the kind of players we have... Oh well more reasons for me not to spend a dollar on models/paint for the next 5 months... I Bet even Angron will not have rules as ridiculous as the Vindicar, :cuss: ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gederas Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Those look awesome. The vindicare can now finally possibly kill his target in one hit now! And with the double tap he can even go for seconds. Also loving the idea of the 1CP where you leave 85 points on the table, so you can option select whichever assassin works best! Imma need to get my some assassins to play with now...mind need to get more vindicares though...could be fun to dump 3 of them on someone... Actually, is it possible to break the "rule of 3" by using the stratagem. Bring 3 vindicares then use the 1CP strat to bring a 4th? Or is there something that prevents that? I know it isn't exactly something we would see too much of but still, is it possible? Rule of 3? A Van. detachment is min 3 up to 6 max, right? You could take 6 without the strat. could you not? You'd have to take 4 (1 of each) to get the +1 Command Point. The rule of three: Rule of three is a suggestion, not a 100% mandated rule. People seem to forget that and act like it's sacrosanct. It's not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkimaskMohawk Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Chaos gets these and their strats from a detachment with cypher as warlord and fallen lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interrogator Stobz Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STTAB Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Thanks for clarification. *Tries to make lists 1915 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Rule of three is a suggestion, not a 100% mandated rule. People seem to forget that and act like it's sacrosanct. It's not. Weird time to soapbox. The original quote was asking if the stratagem would get around the rule of three, so obviously, that "suggestion" was in play for the poster's question. --------------------------------- I think the rules are cool, the stratagems are fluffy, and the new data sheets seem good, though my KFF-toting Big Mek is terrified of that Vindicare. And yet, I don't like it. The Imperium, and the "soup" lists that are the center of many player's frustrations, doesn't need yet more flexibility and options. Whereas before an assassin at least forced the use of the limited number of detachments, now, the opportunity cost is a single CP and 85 points. Cool stuff, though. Nice to see the newer version of White Dwarf really working to make itself relevant. This made me get a subscription today, even if I'm not a fan of these rules. There's going to be relevant rules in WD, so I want it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fierce Bear Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Didn't a single Assassin always cost 85(ish) points and -1 CP as an Auxiliary Detachment? But now you don't need to use a detachment slot... I run Assassins almost as 'distraction carnifexes'... 85 points to watch an entire turn of an opponents fire is a fascinating thing. Fantastic to 'hunt Ahriman' with two Culuxes and a Vindicaire! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Didn't a single Assassin always cost 85(ish) points and -1 CP as an Auxiliary Detachment? But now you don't need to use a detachment slot... I run Assassins almost as 'distraction carnifexes'... 85 points to watch an entire turn of an opponents fire is a fascinating thing. Fantastic to 'hunt Ahriman' with two Culuxes and a Vindicaire! That and you had to take it in your list. The detachment was really restrictive, as you only get three, and if you took an assassin with IG and a Knight, you couldn't also take Custodes/BA/Deathwatch/whatever. Now you can fit all the imperium soup your heart desires, and still have the flexibility to take an assassin tailored to your opponent. It's certainly cool and fluffy, but from a competitive balance viewpoint, I'm a little apprehensive about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurricane Chuck Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Assassins seem way too good for their extremely cheap price but what do you expect from imperial pick and mix factions they also have damn good stratagems which will benefit massively from imperial CP battery armies greatly as usual Sure is nice being an imperial player as usual Cheers , very kind of you. As an owner of 15 plus assassins of all generations and varieties it’s great to get some flavour for my army. I'd love to pictures of your collection. I actually have the Eversors out , working on the bases, I’ll throw you a pic later if I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olsol Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Probably been posted but... https://imgur.com/a/kgH6ycq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OttoVonAwesome Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Oh wow they are dirty. No way I could in good conscience use these in casual game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Oh wow they are dirty. No way I could in good conscience use these in casual game. My sweet summer child... do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H311fi5h Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 You can use "during deployment" strategems multiple times, can you? Maybe it would be worth considering to keep 170 reserve points (at 2000). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scammel Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Well, Assassins just became much more boring. Not because of what they actually do on the tabletop, but through inevitable ubiquity; you're just going to take one every time. These guys are potent and ridiculously splashable… yawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Oh wow they are dirty. No way I could in good conscience use these in casual game. Not at all. Now they're actually usable. Finally! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy-inquisitor Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 You can use "during deployment" strategems multiple times, can you? Maybe it would be worth considering to keep 170 reserve points (at 2000). The stratagem says once per battle, so no point having more than 85 reserve points. I think that is a good balance restriction, it makes assassins really flexible but it cannot be abused to the point of being a win button. They each have a distinct role so being able to pick the one you want for a match-up is a bargain for 1CP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dis_Interested Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 As I think some previous people have pointed out: you only get the stratagems by having an assassin detachment. So, you don't get the 'spend 1 cp and 85 reserve points for an assassin' strat if you, at minimum, take ANOTHER assassin as an auxiliary detachment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 As I think some previous people have pointed out: you only get the stratagems by having an assassin detachment. So, you don't get the 'spend 1 cp and 85 reserve points for an assassin' strat if you, at minimum, take ANOTHER assassin as an auxiliary detachment. And as others have already pointed out, you get access to these Stratagems simply by having an IMPERIUM detachment in your army. Actually reading the leaks helps a lot. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dis_Interested Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 As I think some previous people have pointed out: you only get the stratagems by having an assassin detachment. So, you don't get the 'spend 1 cp and 85 reserve points for an assassin' strat if you, at minimum, take ANOTHER assassin as an auxiliary detachment. And as others have already pointed out, you get access to these Stratagems simply by having an IMPERIUM detachment in your army. Actually reading the leaks helps a lot. ...my apologies. like an idiot, I did not read the first line of the stratagems section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taikishi Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Chaos gets these and their strats from a detachment with cypher as warlord and fallen lmao Yeah, but then are you Battle-forged since your detachments don't share keywords in common unless you ONLY take Cypher, the Fallen, and Assassin Detachments? The moment you start taking any other Chaos units you cease to be battle-forged, correct? If so, then at that moment you lose out on the 3 CP for being Battle-forged, your relics and your stratagems since they require the army being Battle-forged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OttoVonAwesome Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Oh wow they are dirty. No way I could in good conscience use these in casual game. Not at all. Now they're actually usable. Finally! They seem too cheap and the vindicaires headshot rule ouch. Seems cowardly to field him casually lol. The eversor seems like a barrel of laughs though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waaaaghlord Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Cypher and Fallen have both IMPERIUM and CHAOS. What they don't have is ADETUS ASTARTES or HERETICUS ASTARTES. They need to be in their own Vanguard detachment to comply with Battle Brothers as they all have the FALLEN keyword. So long as your other detachments have CHAOS the army is battleforged and so long as Cypher is your warlord you have access to the Assassin strategems due to him having IMPERIUM. You couldn't take any Assassins on your roster without breaking the battleforged nature of the army since they themselves don't have CHAOS but you can use the strategem and reserve points to add a single Assassin to a Chaos force. Unless they have once again forgotten to take Fallen into account with rules writing and others FAQed later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waaaaghlord Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Actually I'm wrong way around, warlord opens up the detachment of 4, IMPERIUM detachment opens up the strategems. Whole army wouldn't share CHAOS if taking the detachment though so that would lose you ALL your battleforged bonuses. Fallen detachment opens up the strategems and allows you a single operative without breaking battleforged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chapter master 454 Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 As per my question, you can bypass the rule of 3 with the stratagem. That is kinda humourous. 4 eversors running around or 4 vindicares sniping fools. And since they are added at deployment I believe they won't interfere with your armies CP as you have kind of already "paid the check out" by the time they arrive. You can't lose CP while deploying. Just by having an imperium warlord/detachment you get access to the stratagems and do note that if you take the execution force it doesn't remove the 1CP bonus from vanguard (though it does require EXACTLY 1 of each). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnkyHamHam Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 As per my question, you can bypass the rule of 3 with the stratagem. That is kinda humourous. 4 eversors running around or 4 vindicares sniping fools. And since they are added at deployment I believe they won't interfere with your armies CP as you have kind of already "paid the check out" by the time they arrive. You can't lose CP while deploying. Just by having an imperium warlord/detachment you get access to the stratagems and do note that if you take the execution force it doesn't remove the 1CP bonus from vanguard (though it does require EXACTLY 1 of each). As the proud owner of 6 Vindicaire assassins, this pleases me greatly. I even have 4 unique poses! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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