BSB Speculation

[ZaelART]

Damn, it's a shame about the battle sanctum but the rest seems pretty good.

 

I hope forgeworld can step up and bring us the flying monolithic battle church we all deserve.

[Ficinus]

It's also a bit disappointing that canonesses have lost the eviscerator. I'll still be using the index option as long as possible, though. The Battle Sanctum, yeah, it's a building, but it offers a lot of miracle dice for 50 points.

[taikishi]

It offers 1 extra miracle die per battle round. The GMG review misread the entry by saying it gave a Miracle Die to each unit. I had to pause the video and read the entry for myself.

 

Exorcist:

Two turret options (buy one or the other):

* 3d3 S8 d6 damage -3 save

* 3d6 S5 1 damage -2 save

 

The hull mounted heavy bolter on the Exorcist and Immolator are not optional and cannot be upgraded.

[Banjulhu]

Of course it would be mandatory. You can have people legally fielding their old models when you want to sell them new ones.

[Mekhitar]

Yikes, Exorcists went from 125 to 168 for the exorcist missile launcher.

[Slasher956]

Yikes, Exorcists went from 125 to 168 for the exorcist missile launcher.

So it’s gone up by 43 points and lost 1 ap for changing to 3d3 shots.....

[Mekhitar]

I’m hoping my fuzzy brain just Mathed wrong, I’m going to go back and re-check.

[taikishi]

Also, Argent Shroud Retributors... *drool*

 

Ignore penalty for moving and shooting heavy weapons

+4" range on heavy flamers

(Conviction): May advance and shoot as if they hadn't advanced

 

Power axes and eviscerators are no longer listed as melee options

Hand flamers are listed as pistol options for non-Canoness models

Inferno pistols are now a pistol option for all models that can take a pistol (so Superiors)

 

Missionaries went up in points

Arco-flagellants went down

Celestians went down

Imagifier went down

Geminae went down

Preachers went up

Dialogus went up

Repentia now have a minimum squad size of 4 but went down in points

Rhinos went down

Immolators went up before adding the Heavy Bolter

Penitent Engines went down significantly

Similacrums went down

Exorcist went up on both builds (even before adding in the heavy bolter)

Immolator went up slightly before adding in the heavy bolter

[taikishi]

 

Yikes, Exorcists went from 125 to 168 for the exorcist missile launcher.

So it’s gone up by 43 points and lost 1 ap for changing to 3d3 shots.....

 

 

It went up more than that. Exorcist with launcher and heavy bolter is 170. Exorcist with conflagration rockets and heavy bolter are 140.

 

Rhinos, Immolators and Exorcists also now have Acts of Faith and Sacred Rites, so can use Miracle Dice, etc.

[Mekhitar]

Yeah, I thought 168 because I was using the Guard value of 8pts for the heavy bolters instead of the Sisters value of 10. Did the missile launcher at least get the melta rule? It looks like there is some text on the right.

 

ETA: I’d be ok with the price of existing got 2 profiles on their launcher, choose which you want. :/

 

 

If the zephyrim cost of 13ppm does not include wargear, they are 17pts each... not so sure I’ll be fielding those, actually.

 

Rets ignoring the move and shoot penalty is fantastic.

 

Pengins dropped to 5w; now that they aren’t so ITC BGH vulnerable I might field them again? They’ll give up gang busters in squads though. They also lost fight twice, but the anti horde option is cute.

 

It seems like sisters old anti tank (exorcists and pengine double attacks) really took a hit, but we gained a bunch of anti horde / anti elites with the alternate exorcist and alternate engines.

 

Given how much sisters CC suffered (losing all the fight twice abilities really), I may have to go for the order that can ignore -1 or -2 AP. Since marines are everywhere.

[Banjulhu]

What do Celestians do these days?

Are they still just overcosted battle sisters in an overcrowded elites section??

[ZaelART]

Some quick Qs... No Jacobus datasheet, is it possible to field his model at all? Is there a shotgun missionary? Is there any point to the Echlesiarchy battle conclave?

[Ficinus]

Yeah, the exorcist going up so many points just... why? It's still not as good as a Leman Russ tank commander. Why... why...

[Mekhitar]

The reading wasn’t thorough enough for me to tell if all the shield of faith buffs applied only to infantry (like the warlord trait does). Losing out in tank survivablity, too, really pushes me towards infantry hordes.

[Ficinus]

Is the GMG review the only one up?

[Slasher956]

Some quick Qs... No Jacobus datasheet, is it possible to field his model at all? Is there a shotgun missionary? Is there any point to the Echlesiarchy battle conclave?

Re jacobus....ironically it means he’s gone back to his index entry and cost :p ...until they release the legends datasheets

[Ficinus]

It sounds like you can only use one miracle die per phase. That... isn't great.

[Slasher956]

Yeah, the exorcist going up so many points just... why? It's still not as good as a Leman Russ tank commander. Why... why...

To make exciting players change our lists of course.... my 2k list will require a full re write not just tweeks...

 

In other news - old saint + 2 Gemina + 2 seraphim sups (no + pwr swd) = new unit :p

[tvih]

So they had finally managed to make Exorcist at least reasonably good in the beta dex, only now to gut it with a crazy points cost increase?

[taikishi]

You get one Act of Faith per phase.

 

You get a maximum of 1 MD per phase using the core methods to do so (Valor, Purity, Sacrifice, Vengeance)

 

Performing Acts of Faith: Before making a roll with a unit with the Acts of Faith ability, you can replace one or more dice with dice from your Miracle Dice pool before rolling. Miracle Dice pulled from the Miracle Dice pool cannot be re-roll (so you can re-roll the initial roll with a CP, but once it's set it can't be re-rolled when pulled from the pool)

 

Miracle Dice can be used on Advance rolls, Charge rolls, Deny the Witch rolls, Hit rolls, Wound rolls, saves, damage rolls and Morale tests.

[Slasher956]

So MD of 1 ...= not very useful...

 

Any way of rerolling MD?

[Slasher956]

Qq - can vehicles benefit from convictions?

[Servant of Dante]

This is not at all what I was expecting, should be exciting to read some new rules, but I'm concerned about the Exorcist change. I mean it'd be nice if they were more of a centerpiece model (ie higher point cost by a bit) but that change to the launcher doesn't sound like too much of a buff. I suppose the average number of shots is 6 now, so maybe it'll be good enough to justify the cost.

 

At first I'd assumed Miracle Dice would be something in addition to more traditional Acts of Faith, but it looks like I was wrong on that count. :D The limit of using 1 per phase feels a bit arbitrary, are they really going to be that powerful? Or are the Sacred Rites bonuses enough to compensate?

[Commander Dawnstar]

What do Celestians do these days?

 

Are they still just overcosted battle sisters in an overcrowded elites section??

 

They're only 1 point more expensive than Battle Sisters now, reroll hit rolls while within 6" of a Canoness and have a 2CP stratagem to reroll hit and wound rolls in the shooting or fight phase.

[taikishi]

Ways to gain more MD, modify MD, take more Acts of Faith, or other things to spend MD on

 

* Triumph of St. Katherine - 1 at the start of each turn (not battle round) while it has the Ordered Martyr relic (gets 5, loses some as its profile degrades - you pick which it loses)

* Triumph of St. Katherine - can increase or decrease a miracle die's value by 1 when performing an Act of Faith (max 6, min 1. Also a relic). Not cumulative with the Dialogus

* Similacrum - unit can take an additional Act of Faith each phase

* Incensor Cherub - beginning of phase, remove it from play to gain 1 MD. Roll 2, pick the one you want. That MD must be used this phase with this unit.

* Repentia - when the unit is destroyed, gain a MD

* Dialogus - can increase or decrease the value of a MD when performing an AoF by 1 (max 6, min 1)

* Battle Sanctum - one per battle round if there's a friendly Ministorum unit within 6"

* Martyred Lady - one per phase in which any of your units were destroyed (cumulative with Sacrifice)

* Ebon Chalice - discard a MD before performing an AoF with a unit with this conviction: one MD spent performing the AoF is automatically a 6.

* Sacred Rose - when performing an AoF with a unit with this conviction, gain a MD on a 5+

* Moment of Grace (1CP) - after making a hit roll, wound roll, or save for a model with a SORORITAS unit in the army: discard 1-3 MD. Add 1 to the roll for each MD discarded.

* Divine Intervention (1CP) - discard 1-3 MD after a non-named SORORITAS character is destroyed. Return it to play with that many wounds, placed as close as possible to its previous position and > 1" from enemy models. No MD are gained for this model's destruction this turn. Usable once per character.

* Faith and Fury (2CP) - after performing an AoF on a hit roll, you may use the same Miracle Dice on the to-wound roll.

* Vessel - we've already seen from the previews

* Test of Faith (1CP) - after gaining a Miracle Die from Purity or Valor, gain an additional d3 Miracle Dice

* Beacon of Faith - +1MD at the start of your turn

* Terrible Knowledge (EC WL trait) - If Warlord is on the battlefield, Miracle Die gained at the start of the first battle round is automatically a 6 and you gain d3 CP.

* Light of the Emperor (SR WL trait) - when you perform an AoF with this warlord, gain 1MD; don't roll for this Warlord's order conviction

 

 

As for Celestians, they can re-roll hit rolls while within 6" of a Canoness. Bloody Rose's AP improvement for melee attacks is always active; they gain +1A the turn they charge, are charged, or perform a heroic intervention.