mega_marines Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Loved the book but found the treatment of Krole to be the pretty unacceptable and incredibly lackluster. Honestly the worst point of the book for me.How so? Mind putting your thoughts in spoilers? I found this deeply disappointing. Not even a good show or anything. Feels very fridged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpAcEGhOsT095 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Can't say I'm that enthusiastic about this new book. Abnett being Abnett is why I dread him writing the last one. Will ADB write a good book? Of course. But it's the last one that will define this series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Really going to town with the s word I see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allart01 Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) Does Krole really go down like that?Now that Is a shocking death, to be honest.The execution feels... Cynical. Can't wait to receive my book tomorrow. Edited March 22, 2020 by The_Bloody lordhellblade 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 kinda cool tbh. Hope they carry on the trend with other characters in the rest of the series Tyrannicide 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) ...I am a bit disappointed tbh given how hyped Krole is. Although tbh Khârn has been one of my least favorite parts of the Siege since every book in the Siege since he showed up has had the authors rushing to service him, singling out Abnett for what feels like a studio note is not really fair, it'd be like being mad over him ganking Celestine. How ridiculously well he did with Angron and his rather pointless attention in LatD and his ridiculousness in First Wall have admittedly deadened me to it. Its gotten to the point where I kind of want him gone from the setting, but I kind of hate the World Eaters in general so there is that. Granted, the hate is not entirely reasonable due to my own bad experiences with their fans both online and irl so its hardly fair strictly speaking. Granted Khorne is a bit of a self-contained tumor in the setting as a whole and I've always seen him as the Chaos God of edginess and plot armor moreso than Blood and War so I again the worst judge for him. Edited March 22, 2020 by StrangerOrders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mega_marines Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 ...I am a bit disappointed tbh given how hyped Krole is. Although tbh Khârn has been one of my least favorite parts of the Siege since every book in the Siege since he showed up has had the authors rushing to service him. Its gotten to the point where I kind of want him gone from the setting, but I kind of hate the World Eaters in general so there is that. Granted, the hate is not entirely reasonable due to my own bad experiences with their fans both online and irl so its hardly fair strictly speaking. My issue stems with the fact that Khârn deserves to be a monster at this point, but fridging others for the sake of his power feels cheap and does nothing but crap on long established characters elsewhere. Having characters built up for literally nothing, not even something absolutely infinitesimal, only to be removed feels very bad. StrangerOrders and DarkChaplain 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) Does Krole really go down like that?Now that Is a shocking death, to be honest. The execution feels... Cynical. Can't wait to receive my book tomorrow. i'd call it brutal, but still a good showing and really nicely executed (pardon the pun) Edited March 22, 2020 by mc warhammer StrangerOrders and Tyrannicide 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 *steeples his hands in concentration* Our Lord and Savior Kharneth, finds your lack of faith disturbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 Does Krole really go down like that?Now that Is a shocking death, to be honest. The execution feels... Cynical. Can't wait to receive my book tomorrow. i'd call it brutal, but still a good showing and really nicely executed (pardon the pun) Of all the things you can say about Abnett, poor execution isn't one of them. Wouldn't call it a nice execution though, in fact this setting seems to have a shockingly hard time executing prisoners Heck its even a plot point that Malc is so bad at it that he indirectly caused the loss of the Phalanx and the undermining of Sol's defenses with how poorly his execution of Mercedi went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 My issue stems with the fact that Khârn deserves to be a monster at this point, but fridging others for the sake of his power feels cheap and does nothing but crap on long established characters elsewhere. this doesn't fit any definition of fridging that i'm aware of Having characters built up for literally nothing, not even something absolutely infinitesimal, only to be removed feels very bad. *cries in red viper* StrangerOrders 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 My issue stems with the fact that Khârn deserves to be a monster at this point, but fridging others for the sake of his power feels cheap and does nothing but crap on long established characters elsewhere. this doesn't fit any definition of fridging that i'm aware of Having characters built up for literally nothing, not even something absolutely infinitesimal, only to be removed feels very bad. *cries in red viper* Sadly there isn't much potential for that with the Traitors despite the excess of fancy names. Literally everyone not called Tormageddon and Little Horus is confirmed to be alive and quite well in 40k. Not sure how none of the writers realized this and they all collectively kept recycling them. They even ignored FW's help in this. There was a huge chance when the Legions became 100k average, you had room to create a ton of Traitors to build up and kill dramatically after long arcs. Instead they just kept using the same damned names. So we keep losing loyalists but we know that next to no significant traitor will die except the less interesting half of the Mournival (which isnt even a high bar), and even that depends on Torm either getting drowned in Sisters or picking the worst fight in history with Big E. Granted, this isn't on Abnett alone. The BL Writers just seemed to be engaged in a collective derp-fest. Doesn't help that Corporate crushed ADB's lone voice to at least kill Lorgar. mc warhammer, nagashnee and SpAcEGhOsT095 3 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) i can agree @strangerorders, definitely. part of what makes ASoIaF books fun is the apparent lack of plot armour for all the characters. conversely, almost any non-name chaos marine in the HH is almost a sure death, which is part and parcel of telling a "historical" story. they have managed to come up with things like the painted count though, and the fact that adb suggested lorgar demise at the siege during a writer's summit suggests they are aware of the "issue" and trying to come up with ways to address it. alternatives may have been suggested and implemented...so who knows what future books might do? Edited March 22, 2020 by mc warhammer StrangerOrders 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 i can agree @strangerorders, definitely. part of what makes ASoIaF books fun is the apparent lack of plot armour for all the characters. conversely, almost any non-name chaos marine in the HH is almost a sure death, which is part and parcel of telling a "historical" story. they have managed to come up with things like the painted count though, and the fact that adb suggested lorgar demise at the siege during a writer's summit suggests they are aware of the "issue" and trying to come up with ways to address it. alternatives may have been suggested and implemented...so who knows what future books might do? Problem with the Painted Count is that they followed that up by releasing him again as a Daemon Prince rampaging successfully in 40k, nullifying their one success there since Tal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 i can agree @strangerorders, definitely. part of what makes ASoIaF books fun is the apparent lack of plot armour for all the characters. conversely, almost any non-name chaos marine in the HH is almost a sure death, which is part and parcel of telling a "historical" story. they have managed to come up with things like the painted count though, and the fact that adb suggested lorgar demise at the siege during a writer's summit suggests they are aware of the "issue" and trying to come up with ways to address it. alternatives may have been suggested and implemented...so who knows what future books might do? Problem with the Painted Count is that they followed that up by releasing him again as a Daemon Prince rampaging successfully in 40k, nullifying their one success there since Tal i'm not as up to date as a lot of you, but wasn't that their success? that the count existed in 40k, so the character had to endure till then... so they "killed" and imprisoned him in torment, re-emerging in 40k. isn't it possible that 40k count isn't even the original gendor skraivok? and even if he is, his 30k fate is nowhere near as obvious as abaddon's, Khârn's, lucius', ahriman, forrix etc. it seemed like a pretty clever way for them to have cake and eat it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 i can agree @strangerorders, definitely. part of what makes ASoIaF books fun is the apparent lack of plot armour for all the characters. conversely, almost any non-name chaos marine in the HH is almost a sure death, which is part and parcel of telling a "historical" story. they have managed to come up with things like the painted count though, and the fact that adb suggested lorgar demise at the siege during a writer's summit suggests they are aware of the "issue" and trying to come up with ways to address it. alternatives may have been suggested and implemented...so who knows what future books might do? Problem with the Painted Count is that they followed that up by releasing him again as a Daemon Prince rampaging successfully in 40k, nullifying their one success there since Tal i'm not as up to date as a lot of you, but wasn't that their success? that the count existed in 40k, so the character had to endure till then... so they "killed" and imprisoned him in torment, re-emerging in 40k. isn't it possible that 40k count isn't even the original gendor skraivok? and even if he is, his 30k fate is nowhere near as obvious as abaddon's, Khârn's, lucius', ahriman, forrix etc. it seemed like a pretty clever way for them to have cake and eat it. Eh fair enough, but I am getting a wee bit tired of Daemonhood being a get out of jail free pass. Its one of the reasons I am glad things like Asurman, Sisters of Silence, Divining Blades and the Emp's sword exists. Its hard to be invested in characters that are literally invincible. mc warhammer 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 I prefer to look at it as they (Daemon Princes and the like) have already failed. They are not invincible, they are slaves and dont really know it. They already lost. Lord_Caerolion 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 (edited) Jenetia Krole, like every other SoS, is a physically unaugmented woman (highly trained but not a post-human)... The fact that she one-hit-one-kills several juiced-up WE before falling to the legendary killer who quite easily dismantled Sigismund (and previously toyed with Erebus) is a sufficiently impressive showing in my view EDIT: @ Scammel "For me, the most efficient answer is... why not both? She could well be the one to compromise the psychic shielding or serve as some form of conduit, but the scattering of the Primarchs clearly has a design to it beyond mortal scope. She could simply be the oblivious instrument of a plan to get Magnus to Prospero, or Mortarion to Barbarus etc." I think the key here is that Erda was a bit befuddled by how the Emperor just let her get away with it, almost as if he wasn't bothered by it Edited March 23, 2020 by b1soul Ubiquitous1984 and Scribe 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 (edited) Jenetia Krole, like every other SoS, is a physically unaugmented woman (highly trained but not a post-human)... The fact that she one-hit-one-kills several several juiced-up WE before falling to the legendary guy who quite easily dismantled Sigismund (and previously toyed with Erebus) is a sufficiently impressive showing in my view only thing that would make it better is if her last lines were: I see Khârn coming, Khârn, First Captain. I raise my sword, Veracity. I speak in Khârn's language. I I see him bounce. Really high It's like he has an agreement with gravity I Edited March 23, 2020 by mc warhammer StrangerOrders, Tyrannicide and Scammel 3 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 (edited) EDIT: @ Scammel "For me, the most efficient answer is... why not both? She could well be the one to compromise the psychic shielding or serve as some form of conduit, but the scattering of the Primarchs clearly has a design to it beyond mortal scope. She could simply be the oblivious instrument of a plan to get Magnus to Prospero, or Mortarion to Barbarus etc." I think the key here is that Erda was a bit befuddled by how the Emperor just let her get away with it, almost as if he wasn't bothered by it that's the other part, isn't it? still fits with the theory that the emp planned it ™ Edited March 23, 2020 by mc warhammer StrangerOrders 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 Yes, either that... or he knew that the true guiding force antogonising his efforts was the Primordial Annhilator I'd wait for my details before accusing Abnett of having some random lady show up the Emperor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mc warhammer Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 even with the details, i imagine that there's probably enough wiggle room for everyone's pet theories to survive. it could be an "answer" that answers nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 So far is I'm reading this book right, it holds the greatest irony of all time. Dorn accidentally creating the Inquisition out of the Remembrancers would be the most sublime thing to ever happen. It would also fit their later pomposity to rewrite history to glorify themselves. Indefragable, Preliminary Bombardment and Cerbero666 3 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 Little quote snipit around that? The Last Remembrancer is one of the greatest pieces of the Heresy, turning them into the inquisition would be...something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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