BA and 9th Ed

[Majkhel]

Frankly, the more leaks of the rules I see, the more I want to just sit, paint what I have, play the games and enjoy myself with the hobby-as-is waiting until the new rulebook drops :)

[Blindhamster]

I eagerly await new toys. I love new toys

[SnorriSnorrison]

While I’m excited to see and get new models, the increases in point costs across the board also mean that I’ll be reluctant to buy heaps of models in one go before building some lists.

 

However, the rules I’ve read so far are exactly what 40k needed. Vehicles can move and shoot heavy weapons without penalty, can shoot when in combat (yes, sucks for us but it was so silly to tag vehicles infinitely that I don’t care), blast weapons being better when directed at hordes, etc.

 

Also, the new CP system is something I very much enjoy because it’s fair. In 8th, you wanted to build a single battalion list with your fluffy army? There you go, start with 8 CP and have probably around 2 left after your first turn.

Now, you can much more viably build themed, fluffy or competitive lists and actually focus on the synergies within your army instead of feeling the need to squeeze another 3 troops, heavy, fast choices in there for the CP.

 

So when the new boxed set comes around as rumoured, I’ll probably pick up the bikes from a mate if he buys it, then dust off my old assault squad (Ap-1 chain swords might actually make them viable, points allowing) and forget the time while giddily browsing BattleScribe on the can at work!

[Dont-Be-Haten]

So far my hot takes from this edition's rules reveals etc.

 

Infiltrators are pretty much going to be mandatory for competitive players. Incursors are still a solid secondary option, but with the changes to deployment and decreased board size they are going to force deployment options and outflank.

 

Changes to flyers and tanks is going to see a lot of parking lot armies circa 2008 5th edition. So plan your AV accordingly.

 

Melee armies in general have gotten better with decreased board sizes, BA's Forlorn Fury has become that much stronger for the above mentioned reasons.

 

You are going to see Battalion + patrol or Supreme command detachments for cheaper unlock options for additional HQs which is more than likely personal preference but I think it's definitely going to be a thing depending on CP costs and regeneration.

 

If the changes to melta is to be expected as rumored we may see our traditional melta-cide units make a resurgence.

 

I think the biggest uphill battles are going to be against Grey Knights, 1k sons, and Raven Guard from an astartes vs astartes game.

 

GK and thousand sons may be the new tier 1 armies with the changes to detachments etc. Though, only time will tell!*

 

On the Narrative driven side of things, I'm so happy to be rewarded for taking a single faction over allies again.

 

Although I'm worried about losing heroes to the Black Rage, I really want more info on that.

 

Overall I think BA are in a very optimistic place going forward.

 

*opinions from what I've researched into new content.

[Brother Cruoris]

I must have missed the Melta rumours. What changes are rumoured for melta weapons?

[BluejayJunior]

I haven't heard anything about changes to melta weapons. 

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

@DBH. Changes to Meltas?

[Dont-Be-Haten]

The reddit/discord folks have just said Melta is better than before. So take with salt.

 

It may not change at all.

[Indefragable]

Terrain rules seem alright based on preview ( https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/06/11/terrain-rules-and-line-of-sightgw-homepage-post-1/ ).

 

I'm trying to think of something that would qualify as Heavy Cover and not also Light Cover. Barbed Wire of some sort? Thick foliage? 

[Captain Caine 24th]

Hmmmm, looks like we'll have some memorization to do. If identifying terrain features is wholly a player decision (maybe tournaments could work it out beforehand) I suppose one might want to make up some lamenated chits/tokens to place on the battlefield, identifying the terrain traits--so it's not forgotten or disputed later.

 

Obstacles: INFANTRY benefits if the obstacle is deemed to have the 'light cover" 'trait' with the +1 save, (not affecting invulns). So, so death co. and sanguinary guard. Deeming it to have the 'heavy cover' 'trait' would add 1 to saving throw for melee attacks too. Hmmm, maybe get your backfield fire support deadnoughts or predators or screening intercessor units into some heavy cover as they might need help in melee anyway.

 

The obscuration 'trait' for cover is interesting. it appears you can shoot the unit inside the terrain, but not units outside the terrain (those who are obscured from the line of fire by the terrain). I suspect that might mean death company will be hopping about the table seeking obscuration as opposed to getting nestled in (typically not getting shot > getting hit and trying to save)... But it seems like, depending on the situation, there could be a tactical need to jump into the terrain (to get the save bonus for 'light cover') as multiple enemies close in.

 

In another way, line of sight (LOS) blocking seems to be much easier to achieve with obscuration. This could incentivize leaving the repulsor executioner at home as it may have less targets. However, the interaction of reserves is yet to be fully revealed--long range high firepower units might yet be able to come in and draw LOS from a different table edge.

 

I'm happy to see "area terrain" mentioned, I'm hoping that might be a bit of a throwback to user-friendly rules, and takes some guess work out of deciding what to call terrain.

 

5" height for terrain being a specific number seems odd, and I don't doubt some armies might somehow capitalize on that, but i suppose it's easy so as to resolve any disputes.

[BluejayJunior]

Tournaments (at least any decent ones) will have the terrain defined beforehand. And they have the rules for most of their own terrain pieces. So I don't think being player defined is going to be as big of a deal as many people are thinking. At least not any more different than it is now. Most pieces of terrain will probably slot easily into those predefined sets. Even 3rd party and homemade things. 

[Indefragable]

Yea I think these terrain rules will be absorbed like CP was when 8th came out: a game or two of wonkiness to figure out, but it will soon click with everyone and become as natural as rolling dice. 

 

As I mull over the Obscuration thing, but I thought is that they are trying to preserve some sort of "frontline" aspect to the game. Think of a city grid with buildings on either side of a street. If you want to protect a unit, you hide it a block away from the street, while in order to get LoS and guns on the enemy, you need to hold one of the buildings adjacent the street and then clear him out in order to cross the street etc... Units like bikes and jump packs are going to have an edge due to the ability to move into/through Obscuring terrain while still being out of LoS. 

 

 

So in games with anything like 33% + of the recommend amount of terrain will have a sort of defined effective "frontline" of combat while the areas in the rear become maneuver zones for other parts of your army to move up/attempt to flank. I'm imagining Reserves have been reworked to really influence this "backfield" area and thus really mess around with LoS blocking. Screening units holding Obscuring terrain become even more important because if enemy DS'ers are forced to land 9" back, not only are they distanced away from the juicy things to shoot, but they can only shoot the screening units in Obscuring terrain. 

[Xenith]

Hmmmm, looks like we'll have some memorization to do. If identifying terrain features is wholly a player decision

 

A little, but before all the standard GW terrain, this is what we did in 3rd/4th - go through all the terrain before the battle and say 'impassable; tank trap; fortification; area terrain; etc. If you class all ruins as the same, etc, it's very quick.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I really liked 5th edition terrain and how models worked.

 

You weren't penalized for cool conversions by adding banners, totems wings, or other neat extended bits to a model.

 

And terrain was very easily defined. Although I also enjoyed being able to Go to ground and stealth/shrouded bonuses too.

 

But the last few editions changed all that, and for the worst in my opinion. We will see how things change going forward.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

Double posted for some reason Edited June 12, 2020 by Dont-Be-Haten

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

Stormravens can Deep Strike!

[Jolemai]

:O

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

:O

Right? RIGHT!?

[FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants]

Bah deepstriking Stormraven be damned, we want deepstriking Landraiders. JK they died so easily due to unfortunate scatter. Always thought they should’ve counted as tak shocking enemy units as they came in, one guy I knew wanted them to be able to squash whatever they land on. Seriously, and been a long time since 5th edition, but IIRC, they could die from scattering on top of a grot. That’s one of the things I love about 8th/9th, and that’s no DS scttar/DS mis haps.

[Majkhel]

 

Right? RIGHT!?

 

Well, they are definitely 'AIRCRAFT', so they can leave the board and return as in DS. We do not know if they can arrive as Strategic Reinforcements, but it's hinted that they could: "In fact, your aircraft will be able to come and go as they please..."

[Cleon]

Interestingly the knee options on the Decal sheet in the new box doesn't match out heraldry spread in the 8th ed codex.

White skull for squads 1 & 2, fine

Black skulls for squad 12, nice, they weren't on any other sheets.

White blood drops, for squads 13 and 14 again nice and new

Black blood drops - not used in any of the 20 defined squads.

[beefeb]

I must have missed the Melta rumours. What changes are rumoured for melta weapons?

 

 

This probably comes from the new Primaris option of gravis armoured troops with the new melta rifles....these are longer ranged meltas.  Not sure what other changes damage or AP wise, but longer ranged, similar to the upgrade from bolter to bolt rifles.  Also note the volkite pistols are neo volkite...Cwl has been tinkering with everything so its 30k volkite....improved.

[Majkhel]

Sooooo, what do you think of the new buggy vehicle and heavy weapon turret?
Looks aside, mobile firepower suits us (interesting to see if the turret will be Fast Attack as current Tarantulas are :D )
If the autocanons keep their price at around 10pts/per gun (maybe even a little discount for twin-linked?), these could be pretty cheap and rival Suppressors. Las-talon will be another kind of beast entirely. Might be too pricey and too easy to take out on a 2-3 wounds platform like this. All speculation of course.

As for the models, I'm all excited for converting the buggies to have higher suspension. Also the Turret seems to be operated by a generic Techmarine!

[Panzer]

You can't pay me enough to use the buggy. It just looks too stupid. As for the mobile firepower ... eh. I have enough S4 and S5 shooting with my Primaris already. I rather keep taking my Inceptors, Redemptor Dreads or Repulsors. The Multi-Melta variant is way less interesting with the new supposedly long range Melta Gravis unit or Las-fusil Eliminators.

I think the leaked Land Speeder will be much more interesting.

 

The turret is okay-ish but fits better with chapters like IF or IH I'd say. I rather just take Suppressors instead, which with their Jump Packs are way more fitting for us anyway. The Las-Talon variant is only semi interesting as well since I could just take Las-fusil Eliminators or keep using my Repulsor or punch things in melee with hammers and fists as always. Or, again, the new supposedly long range Melta Gravis unit.

Another issue is that it seems to be a stationary unit. With the new terrain rules it should have lots of targeting issues unless you play on planet bowling ball.

Edited June 14, 2020 by Panzer

[beefeb]

I really like all the new models...yes even the ATV.  Its a nice and obvious evolution of the attack bike.  I had been intending to start a Raptors force, but these new models have too much bling to be raptors, so i think ill expand my existing BA force.

 

I hope theres an option to upgrade the assault intercessors to Death Company Assault Intercessors.  An obvious and potentially extremely powerful variant.