Hymnblade Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 The 5+++ is still there. Here's the screenshot: https://imgur.com/ok2stWu Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570806 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Arthur Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 That is a much clearer image than I was looking at, thank you. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570841 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchomatic Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) So having some time to cool down and desalinate I’m still not happy that we lost individual die rerolls but comparing us to other melee chapters I think our chapter tactic is middle of the road at worst. I’m not sure I’d swap with the other chapters tactic for tactic. Maybe The blood angels tactic is better pure melee but ours is better/more useful for the game as a whole. White Scars might be better overall but I can’t begrudge them what they get because it’s so fluffy. Maybe we are undervaluing rerolls to advance too. Super useful to get up the board and for general mobility which has been a weakness for us for a long time. Black Templars: 1) reroll Advance and Charge rolls and 2) 5+ feel no pain against mortal wounds. Blood Angels: 1) +1 to wound when charging, charged or heroically intervening and 2) +1" to Advance and Charge rolls. Space Wolves: 1) +1 to hit in melee if the unit charged, was charged or heroically intervened and 2) units with this tactic can heroically intervene as if they were characters. White Scars: 1) can Charge after Advance or Fall Back and 2) can fire Assault with no penalty after an Advance move. Edited July 25, 2020 by Punchomatic Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570846 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Arthur Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 It’s not terrible by any means but I wonder what compelled them to change it. Our old tactic was in no way OP and the changes don’t really improve it so I don’t get what they’re trying to go for. Although I suppose it does mesh well with our advance and charge stratagem. Altogether, with the smaller boards charging won’t be as much an issue anyways. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570882 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchomatic Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 I’m not overly familiar with other chapters but it looks like there was a general softening of many tactics. I don’t like the loss of individual rerolls but I like the gain of rerolling advances. But really is our chapter tactic worse than others chapter tactics? No. Our issues lie elsewhere. This sucks and the loss of it makes it suck more but comparatively we are doing well on this one small issue. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570889 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medjugorje Posted July 25, 2020 Author Share Posted July 25, 2020 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570925 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sword Brother Adelard Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 I just think it's part of a general curb on rerolls. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5570960 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hymnblade Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Yeah, I think they're just generally moving away from rerolling single dice in a charge. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571093 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Laeroth Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 (edited) As I have said in numerous other places...this is not a nerf. It is a massive buff. Sure we lose 9% success rate of charging, but we gain so much from being able to reroll that advance roll. That is pure mobility. It makes The Emperor's Will and Devout Push nearly certain, rather than a gimmick. I cannot understand anyone taking this as anything but a pure upgrade. Edited July 26, 2020 by Marshal Laeroth Schlitzaf, Arbedark and Marshal Mattias 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571250 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Valkenhayn Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 I agree its a nice change. It makes terminator deepstrikes a little less certain, but we have a +1 to charge trait we can put on a captain if we really want it. Seems alright to me. Here's hoping that moving forward we get just as much support as the other boys folded into our book now. BT get mentioned a lot during streams and so on. We seem to be in the public consciousness. It'd be premature to get our hopes up, but we have the potential to benefit greatly from this. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571263 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phenatix Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 So having some time to cool down and desalinate I’m still not happy that we lost individual die rerolls but comparing us to other melee chapters I think our chapter tactic is middle of the road at worst. I’m not sure I’d swap with the other chapters tactic for tactic. Maybe The blood angels tactic is better pure melee but ours is better/more useful for the game as a whole. White Scars might be better overall but I can’t begrudge them what they get because it’s so fluffy. Maybe we are undervaluing rerolls to advance too. Super useful to get up the board and for general mobility which has been a weakness for us for a long time. Black Templars: 1) reroll Advance and Charge rolls and 2) 5+ feel no pain against mortal wounds. Blood Angels: 1) +1 to wound when charging, charged or heroically intervening and 2) +1" to Advance and Charge rolls. Space Wolves: 1) +1 to hit in melee if the unit charged, was charged or heroically intervened and 2) units with this tactic can heroically intervene as if they were characters. White Scars: 1) can Charge after Advance or Fall Back and 2) can fire Assault with no penalty after an Advance move. I’d just run them as White Scars tbh. Much more in line with what you’d like to be doing: move up the board, shoot, charge. Space Marines as a whole have a lot of good options for assault weapons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medjugorje Posted July 26, 2020 Author Share Posted July 26, 2020 As I have said in numerous other places...this is not a nerf. It is a massive buff. Sure we lose 16% success rate of charging, but we gain so much from being able to reroll that advance roll. That is pure mobility. It makes The Emperor's Will and Devout Push nearly certain, rather than a gimmick. I cannot understand anyone taking this as anything but a pure upgrade. hmm.... for a advance move you can take a reroll per stratagem if you need it. Its more CP intensive but a bit better in this situations but I think often the reroll for advancing is very important in the last games I had always confused if 3 units rolled a 4;5 or 6 and the last one rolled a 1. And we dont know the knew stratagems in the new codex yet. So maybe there are a few additional bonuses which give us an extremly advantage for chargerolls in addition so that we dont need the individual diceroll that often. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571276 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchomatic Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 As I have said in numerous other places...this is not a nerf. It is a massive buff. Sure we lose 16% success rate of charging, but we gain so much from being able to reroll that advance roll. That is pure mobility. It makes The Emperor's Will and Devout Push nearly certain, rather than a gimmick. I cannot understand anyone taking this as anything but a pure upgrade. Do you have numbers on our odds to make charges, specifically 9” charges, with a straight reroll? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571313 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Laeroth Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 (edited) As I have said in numerous other places...this is not a nerf. It is a massive buff. Sure we lose 16% success rate of charging, but we gain so much from being able to reroll that advance roll. That is pure mobility. It makes The Emperor's Will and Devout Push nearly certain, rather than a gimmick. I cannot understand anyone taking this as anything but a pure upgrade.Do you have numbers on our odds to make charges, specifically 9” charges, with a straight reroll?It's a 47.8% chance with rerolls, as opposed to a 27.7% chance without the rerolls. Edited July 26, 2020 by Marshal Laeroth Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchomatic Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 What was it with single die rerolls? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571324 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Laeroth Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 What was it with single die rerolls? I gave slightly incorrect info in last post...its corrected. To answer your question though, its 56.9% chance with successfully make a 9" charge rerolling one or both dice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAG Templar Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 Just played my first game of 9th. I didn’t have a single situation where I needed to make the standard 9 inch charge (which I relied on a lot in 8th) My army: Phobos Captain with 4++ shroud Chaplain on Bike (model proxy, with rules from internet) Assault intercessors in Impulsor Intercessors in Impulsor Intercessors 2x Eradicators squad 2x Outriders squad 2x Ven dread with las cannons 2x storm talons with las/ass Against Astra Militarum with 6 Leman Russ, 120 Guardsmen, various officers and some sentinels Black Templars outscored and out killed the guard (but having first turn helped). Marines feel super mobile, very killy, and with Templar strats, very durable. I know that Primaris Chaplain on a Bike isn’t a thing yet but he was an absolute star - very keen for the proper model. And the Ven dreads being able to move and shoot at full bs is very good. Storm Talons were the only unit to under perform but they did take out a Leman Russ before they died. Also, because very few people play Black Templars in my area the ‘can’t leave combat’ strat surprises a lot of people. Outriders great, especially buffed by (soon to be released) Chaplain. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571361 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medjugorje Posted July 26, 2020 Author Share Posted July 26, 2020 Grats and happy to see BT winning. I heard that against such shooty lists everything depends on how much Terrain is there. I will Play today with - Helbrecht as WL - Indomitus Castalan with aurelian shroud - MoS with Jump pack and ancient breviary (5+++ and range +3") - 2x5 Intercessors with Hammer - 1x5 - 1x10 Scouts - Judiciar with Relic (steadily +1 attack) - 2x Impulsor with shield - 2x4 Company veterans with Shield and one Lascannon - Drop Pod - 1x 5 Devastors with Grav I will test this list against Necrons which are played by repeated ETC Winner and I think his list will be very hard but I want to try everything out so wish me luck. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571375 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchomatic Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 Good luck! Smash the unclean! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571416 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirJyo Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 There's a cool art of primaris Templars on page 53 of the big rulebook Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5571914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLŒ FLY Posted July 27, 2020 Share Posted July 27, 2020 Hi everybody, Here’s my first crack at a list using mostly units from Indomnitus... Primaris Captain Primaris Lieutenant Primaris Chaplain Judicar Bladeguard Ancient 3x Bladeguard 5x Assault Intercessor 5x Assault Intercessor 10x Infiltrator 3x Outrider 3x Outrider Impulsor - Shield Dome Impulsor - Shield Dome Impulsor - Shield Dome I haven’t selected any ranged weapons for the transports yet - this is around 1500 points. Now I need some serious heavy support... I’m liking the new grav tanks and think they gel with this list (want to reach 2000 points). Thoughts and critiques are welcome. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5572002 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchomatic Posted July 27, 2020 Share Posted July 27, 2020 Page 80. Lost of space marine chapters. Of course the smurfs are first. Guess who is second. That’s right, our boys in black! And it’s not an alphabetical list by any means. redmapa, Medjugorje and templargdt 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5572003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted July 27, 2020 Share Posted July 27, 2020 Remember that kirioth rumour from last year? orks vs bt? Hear me out, that rumour did not include ghaz, and now in the teaser of things to come a new ork was, well, teased. If this follows the same pattern that AoS did, a few factions got an HQ on a vs box. Might be a stretch, but it could happen. templargdt 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5572123 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjulhu Posted July 27, 2020 Share Posted July 27, 2020 It could happen.But it is more likely going to be a repeat of the current pattern where they stay the red headed step children of Codex: Space Marines for a whole edition who eventually get an half arsed rules update or mention in a campaign book as the edition comes to a close and no new models (I still remember when Fall of Cadia was introduced as St Celestine at the head of a crusade of Sisters and Black Templar, what a bait and switch that became). painting.for.my.sanity and Sete 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5572147 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Loss Posted July 27, 2020 Share Posted July 27, 2020 Medjugorje, Champion Rawne, templargdt and 1 other 4 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/364086-the-big-9th-edition-room/page/30/#findComment-5572245 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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