State of the Union (Heresy)

[Spagunk]

The kratos is giving me Hercules tank vibes from original Titanicus:

 

Yeah, that silhouette very closely matches this artwork. Great find imo.

[Dark Legionnare]

Slips you're right, I think ceramite might be dead. The predator leak from earlier doesn't have it either, though could certainly just be these two units

Or perhaps they keep a "Standardized" equipment list. IE, like searchlights and the like, and ceramite is in there. Perhaps it's a standardized equipment that can only be taken on "Vehicle, Reinforced" units?

 

I would certainly like meltas to see more love in HH.  They currently stand as dread & infantry hunters for the most part for me. Light-Med AV is done well by autocannon dreads, flanking missiles, etc... while the melta can't really hunt heavies, given they're pretty much 99% of the time, ceramited up.

 

 At the same time, I can understand why having ceramite still exist on the REALLY expensive stuff like spartans, these kratos, etc... would be a valid need, while perhaps being removed from LR's except the achilles?  Giving the melta's some AV14 to hunt finally.

[Slips]

 

Slips you're right, I think ceramite might be dead. The predator leak from earlier doesn't have it either, though could certainly just be these two units

Or perhaps they keep a "Standardized" equipment list. IE, like searchlights and the like, and ceramite is in there. Perhaps it's a standardized equipment that can only be taken on "Vehicle, Reinforced" units?

 

I would certainly like meltas to see more love in HH.  They currently stand as dread & infantry hunters for the most part for me. Light-Med AV is done well by autocannon dreads, flanking missiles, etc... while the melta can't really hunt heavies, given they're pretty much 99% of the time, ceramited up.

 

 At the same time, I can understand why having ceramite still exist on the REALLY expensive stuff like spartans, these kratos, etc... would be a valid need, while perhaps being removed from LR's except the achilles?  Giving the melta's some AV14 to hunt finally.

 

TBH, even the Achilles doesnt really need AC since it had a 4++ vs melta which is arguably better.

[Astartes Consul]

Praetor will almost certainly be starter set only - pretty sure the fuzzy outline from the leaked box images last year match it. 

 

 

 

IMO there isn't much point in trying to guess the scale of new minis or make choices based on that guess yet. There has been so much talk about scale creep, re-scaling etc. over the last year or so and about half the time, concerns have been largely unfounded.

Even with similar promo images, we have no idea how the perspective and scaling of the photo itself have been edited in order to create a final, high definition promotional shot for use online. Overlaying different photos onto that Mk VI marine can help is guess, but ultimately it could simply be that the miniature has been blown up slightly or the photo of it taken from a different distance than other images etc.

If we're going to do photo wizardy, lets try and get as many shots of the Kratos from the trailer as possible

When you can align the 32mm bases 1:1 then you can do the overlays fine.

The scale is very much in line with tortuga bay/recent plastic can. Very much out of line with the original resin sculpts and can lead to a huge disparity.

 

 

True, this at least makes the comparison vaguely sensible. But I honestly think even then, it isn't going to give you a full picture. The new FW legion specific Praetors that I've bought - admittedly I don't have all of them - are all in the same ball park scale wise with my existing minis. Similarly, the plastic MKIII & IV kits are proportioned slightly differently from the FW MKII, III & IV variants, leg alone the MK VI FW kit which is positively skinny. But in mixed units or side by side, I can't say I've ever noticed a difference without really looking hard. 

 

Basically, I don't think scale creep is going to be a major issue. 

[DesuVult]

We might finally see standalone plastic 30k Ahriman.

[Kenzaburo]

We might finally see standalone plastic 30k Ahriman.

Speaking of which, how do Ahriman and Geigor compare to recent sculpts like Fafnir or the praetors?

[Astartes Consul]

The kratos is giving me Hercules tank vibes from original Titanicus:

 

 

 

First the Sabre Strike Tank and now this from the depths of GW history. Great find!

[Brofist]

I do think melta will be pretty solid in 2.0. With plasma only hitting AP2 half the time you're better off using melta for hard targets and deleting multi wound models.

 

I also wonder if the 2W terminators are statline or gearline buffs. Gearline would be pretty cool since it would let you tweak ICs more, but I get statline for simplicity sake.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Praetor will almost certainly be starter set only - pretty sure the fuzzy outline from the leaked box images last year match it.

 

 

 

 

IMO there isn't much point in trying to guess the scale of new minis or make choices based on that guess yet. There has been so much talk about scale creep, re-scaling etc. over the last year or so and about half the time, concerns have been largely unfounded.

 

Even with similar promo images, we have no idea how the perspective and scaling of the photo itself have been edited in order to create a final, high definition promotional shot for use online. Overlaying different photos onto that Mk VI marine can help is guess, but ultimately it could simply be that the miniature has been blown up slightly or the photo of it taken from a different distance than other images etc.

 

If we're going to do photo wizardy, lets try and get as many shots of the Kratos from the trailer as possible

When you can align the 32mm bases 1:1 then you can do the overlays fine.

 

The scale is very much in line with tortuga bay/recent plastic can. Very much out of line with the original resin sculpts and can lead to a huge disparity.

True, this at least makes the comparison vaguely sensible. But I honestly think even then, it isn't going to give you a full picture. The new FW legion specific Praetors that I've bought - admittedly I don't have all of them - are all in the same ball park scale wise with my existing minis. Similarly, the plastic MKIII & IV kits are proportioned slightly differently from the FW MKII, III & IV variants, leg alone the MK VI FW kit which is positively skinny. But in mixed units or side by side, I can't say I've ever noticed a difference without really looking hard.

 

Basically, I don't think scale creep is going to be a major issue.

You've touched on it a bit, but it can definitely matter. My night lords have a lot of resin mk3 in it. I was going to do scars with about ~20 mk2 I have and the new box, but the difference is going to be far too much because of the skinny limb nature.

 

But an army that mostly used the plastic versions should hopefully integrate in a bit better. But the overlay that has the mk4 be a head shorter is still troubling.

 

And those fist praetors are way out of line lol.

Edited March 24, 2022 by SkimaskMohawk

[zedmeister]

 

 

First the Sabre Strike Tank and now this from the depths of GW history. Great find!

 

 

Thanks, it jogged something in my memory. Looks like there's several different variants we could possibly see. Transport variant along with the heavy tank variant

Edited March 24, 2022 by zedmeister

[Noserenda]

Yeah ive seen a side by side that has the Fist terminator Praetor barely shorter than Dorn, which is ridiculous.

Ultimately its a personal taste thing but i wouldnt want to mix the scales.

[The Scorpion]

Yeah ive seen a side by side that has the Fist terminator Praetor barely shorter than Dorn, which is ridiculous.

 

Ultimately its a personal taste thing but i wouldnt want to mix the scales.

The Fist Praetor isn't that bad since the newest Character sculpts are 3D printed, and FW can thus change the size at any time. Shame that most of the chars use classic moulds.

[Astartes Consul]

 

Praetor will almost certainly be starter set only - pretty sure the fuzzy outline from the leaked box images last year match it.

 

 

IMO there isn't much point in trying to guess the scale of new minis or make choices based on that guess yet. There has been so much talk about scale creep, re-scaling etc. over the last year or so and about half the time, concerns have been largely unfounded.

 

Even with similar promo images, we have no idea how the perspective and scaling of the photo itself have been edited in order to create a final, high definition promotional shot for use online. Overlaying different photos onto that Mk VI marine can help is guess, but ultimately it could simply be that the miniature has been blown up slightly or the photo of it taken from a different distance than other images etc.

 

If we're going to do photo wizardy, lets try and get as many shots of the Kratos from the trailer as possible

When you can align the 32mm bases 1:1 then you can do the overlays fine.

 

The scale is very much in line with tortuga bay/recent plastic can. Very much out of line with the original resin sculpts and can lead to a huge disparity.

True, this at least makes the comparison vaguely sensible. But I honestly think even then, it isn't going to give you a full picture. The new FW legion specific Praetors that I've bought - admittedly I don't have all of them - are all in the same ball park scale wise with my existing minis. Similarly, the plastic MKIII & IV kits are proportioned slightly differently from the FW MKII, III & IV variants, leg alone the MK VI FW kit which is positively skinny. But in mixed units or side by side, I can't say I've ever noticed a difference without really looking hard.

 

Basically, I don't think scale creep is going to be a major issue.

You've touched on it a bit, but it can definitely matter. My night lords have a lot of resin mk3 in it. I was going to do scars with about ~20 mk2 I have and the new box, but the difference is going to be far too much because of the skinny limb nature.

 

But an army that mostly used the plastic versions should hopefully integrate in a bit better. But the overlay that has the mk4 be a head shorter is still troubling.

 

And those fist praetors are way out of line lol.

 

 

Oh yeah, that Fist one was/is an absolute wild one. Sort of assumed / hope that was an outlier. 

 

Regarding Mk II, while I don't think we'll see them in plastic because of technical issues, I do think there is a decent change of a return to them in resin & presumably less skinny legged.

[MegaVolt87]

We already have that in the, albeit, extremely nerfed Malcador. Or the Spartan. By the time you load this up for bear you're looking at a ~400pt model which makes it compete with super heavies.

 

Upgrades? Nah I want two of these stock loadout for 585 points instead in one slot for my IW's. 

Edited March 24, 2022 by MegaVolt87

[Lord Marshal]

[OttoVonAwesome]

I just 3d printed mk4 replacement bodies in the new scale they look incredible, bigger than humans yet smaller than deathguard or primaris marines. The mark 6's the fist preator the soh preator, rann and zephon are all 36 mm like new chaos marines up from 32mm. They will make older models look dated but it's not as harsh as a contrast as primaris vs old 32mm marines. Also I love the Traitor Preator I shall name him Yhorm the Giant. 

[Brofist]

Falchion is now a total monster. I bet it costs like 700pts haha Edited March 24, 2022 by Brofist

[MegaVolt87]

Falchion is now a total monster. I bet it costs like 700pts haha

 

Plot twist- GW has points cuts instead, forcing us to buy more models to meet our old points limits. 

[DesuVult]

Does any one location have all the leaks now consolidated?

[SkimaskMohawk]

Does any one location have all the leaks now consolidated?

I can tell you this, it's certainly not the crusade and heresy Facebook page lmao.

[Torvak Kyre]

So I can place all of those weapons apart from the regular lascannon array (unless the quad lascannon has been renamed) and the neutron wave cannon. Anyone able to point out what uses them?

[Darkwrath121]

So I can place all of those weapons apart from the regular lascannon array (unless the quad lascannon has been renamed) and the neutron wave cannon. Anyone able to point out what uses them?

The array is the quad lascannon, the wave... Not sure!

I suspect it's a new weapon option for the Falchion, which could/can previously take a Neutron Wave Capacitor to gain shockpulse and such.

 

If so, that's an interesting idea. No longer instant-deathing T6-7, but gain shock pulse.

Edited March 25, 2022 by Darkwrath121

[DesuVult]

It now occurs to me. If sonic shrieked are unchanged they will be beyond terrifying.

[Corswain]

 

We might finally see standalone plastic 30k Ahriman.

 

Speaking of which, how do Ahriman and Geigor compare to recent sculpts like Fafnir or the praetors?

I put a helmet on Rann so it might change the height a little but he is maybe a touch taller than Ahriman. Differences in pose obviously adds some height to Ahriman (tactical dead guy?) but there is no problem having them stand next to each other. Or Geigor.

[Noserenda]

Now that feels like a super redundant list :D Unique guns for everyone!

Generally good stuff from what we know though, glad they are using higher strengths rather than the awful S:D bodge, well, hopefully anyhow because the destroyer rule is still there...