Leagues of Votann Initial 1st April 2022 reveal, new lore & articles discussion

[Vogon]

I’m definitely hoping for gyrocopters.

I have a couple of wings in Epic and I’d love to see them realised in 40K scale.

They had some fun and funky stuff in Epic and I really hope that they do them justice.

 

Cheers

 

Vogon

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

 

To me is just more power armor at this point .

 

Nice assumption based on 1 model when it looks more like carapace. When have you ever seen power armour only cover a small portion of the body?

 

Just another dig at stuff. No offense but I'm intrigued as to what joy you derive from 40k when all you do is moan or pass snide remarks. 

 

He looks like a baby Aggressor that suffered frostbite to me.

[MagicHat]

Kharadon Overlords convinced me that they could do Squats, but I am not sure this is it.

 

It is to clean IMO. No personal customization on the weapon and armour, and it looks like you can't put kharadon helmets on them.

[Toxichobbit]

 

An emphasis on tunnellers would also be thematic and fairly unique as outside of the fw termite there isn’t one in 40K. Very exciting.

 

And Trygons, Mawlocs, Rippers, Raveners and the entire Genestealer Cult codex. Tunnellers is already explored in 40k, just not for Imperials.

[Khornestar]

Please stay on topic, everyone: the reveal of squats.

 

Personal digs and references to those of the past are not the topic of this or any thread. If you don’t like the squat, cool. If you like the squat, cool. Please leave it at that.

Edited April 3, 2022 by Khornestar

[Chaplain Lucifer]

Objection your honour. It's not a squat, it's a height challenged abhuman.

 

I dig the look. Not too intricate to be mistaken for dwarves from other eras, just sci-fi enough. Looks like it will be a carapace equivalent for the line troops but I totally expect to see a power armour or even a terminator armour equivalent.

[Kastor Krieg]

He looks like a baby Aggressor that suffered frostbite to me.

I literally could not roll my eyes harder.

[Angry Banana]

I wonder if we'll see more of these guys as part of this army?

 

[jimbo1701]

 

 

 

An emphasis on tunnellers would also be thematic and fairly unique as outside of the fw termite there isn’t one in 40K. Very exciting.

And Trygons, Mawlocs, Rippers, Raveners and the entire Genestealer Cult codex. Tunnellers is already explored in 40k, just not for Imperials.

Tunnelling transports was the intention behind the statement, they were collectively known as tunnellers back in the day, hence mention of the termite as the only example in 40K.

[Asbestress]

I wonder if we'll see more of these guys as part of this army?

 

They did mention the Leagues emerged from the Age of Strife with far more of their ancient technology intact, including some infamous advances the Imperium would consider extremely heretical. in the article...

[Sete]

This could just be the start of a few new factions like for AoS. Edited April 3, 2022 by Sete

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

Do we really need another faction I at least would of preferred another interesting xenos army instead of just dwarves in space

Wonder how they crowbar them into the setting lorewise and I really hope they don't play as a space marine style force

Being small heavily armored squads with high powered weapons no doubt woth the usual highly unique-1D

Their line Infantry also should only be 1W otherwise what's the point of marines

 

You don't need a crowbar for something that is returning. It literally already has a backstory. What's tough is figuring out how make something like Hrud work on the table top.

 

I think they're going have good toughness and a bad move value. Marines are actually pretty fast in the scheme of things and without a lot of speed these guys won't be nearly as good in CC. It's also going to make the current mission structure pretty tough for them because they're going to have to commit to getting them across the board. They won't play the same.

 

 

 

To me is just more power armor at this point .

Nice assumption based on 1 model when it looks more like carapace. When have you ever seen power armour only cover a small portion of the body?

 

 

I have a theory that armor is going to be somewhat of status symbol for the fraction so the elite units & HQs will be more armored based on the silhouettes we saw in the trailer. I do wonder if some of the armor styles that primaris have are going to be attributed to Cawl trying to copy their designs.

 

This could just be the start of a few new factions like for AoS.

 

The community article said the model was part of the advance force for them. I actually hope that they're in the next starter set. I don't think you can always just shove marines in it. More so with 3 year windows, I just don't need more primaris troops lol. Legion would be an elite army that could serve as the protagonists.  

[Dr. Clock]

 

 

I think they're going have good toughness and a bad move value. Marines are actually pretty fast in the scheme of things and without a lot of speed these guys won't be nearly as good in CC. It's also going to make the current mission structure pretty tough for them because they're going to have to commit to getting them across the board. They won't play the same.

 

 

 

Nice assumption based on 1 model when it looks more like carapace. When have you ever seen power armour only cover a small portion of the body?

 

 

I have a theory that armor is going to be somewhat of status symbol for the fraction so the elite units & HQs will be more armored based on the silhouettes we saw in the trailer. I do wonder if some of the armor styles that primaris have are going to be attributed to Cawl trying to copy their designs.

Re: stat-lines and keeping it distinct, they do seem likely to be the slowest faction... the problem seems to become that a 'basic unit' that walks 5" maybe shouldn't also be advancing up to 6"... and certainly a 12" charge is beyond the pale? A faction with a distinctive disadvantage in movement hasn't really happened before other than DG, but 40k right now is very much a movement game, so you can't take it too far. 

 

I think as a starting point, I'd probably say 5" move, -1 to Advance rolls, -2 to charge rolls would be something you'd need to think about and build around, but not completely break the game. Another option is to 'hard-lock' movement ranges so that they're easier to plan around - the reliability of '5" + 'always 4" advance" + "always 7" charge' might be kind of interesting. I'd expect them to ignore modifiers to movement/charges as well at that point for sure.

 

Beyond basic infantry, I like the idea of them running the gamut in terms of T, W and Sv based as you say on 'status of armour'. Make their infantry strongly graduated 'up the ranks' from Troops T4, 1W 4+, Elites/FA T5, 2W, 3+, to heavy T6, 3W, 2+ for a full exo-armour. Make the FA vehicles alot more like 'lunar rovers' than mad max plz.

 

Vehicles should also all have Fly and Deep-strike IMO; Sure, they can tunnel, but upping both the skimmer and teleportation tech above AdMech or even Astartes levels would make sense. So basically Air Cav teleportation dwarves would be my druthers. 5" move will only work when you are able to plan around some kind of forward placement... and AdMech have to go with Lucius to get any real teleportation going, while only marine Termies and occasionally Deathwatch use it for Marines, really.

 

I realize that the 'all vehicles fly' thing gets ... real close to Kharadron, but I... would prefer that tbh.

 

Main hope at this point is that the base infantry guys actually do have astronaut dome helm options for some retro Space Age flavour. Thinking kinda like the one you get on Atalan Jackals...

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[Doghouse]

I'm glad that the squats are coming back but not entirely convinced we need another army, I would have done them as Tau allies or something.

[Slave to Darkness]

Low movement could also depend on how GW wants the army to 'play', back in 1st ed they were the slowest army but there were ways to work around that, other than lacking a lot of the nasty units we have these days so they didnt die after a slight breeze they had access to rhinos that helped a lot, and if you didnt use those there was always the 'ram a load of bikers down their throat as a distraction whilst your heavy weapons and thud guns were keeping their heads down' option. So transports (flying or tunnelling) or fast vehicle types and some damn big guns should do the job. But again that depends on if GW want new Squats to play like old Squats. 

[Slave to Darkness]

 I would have done them as Tau allies or something.

 

May many short bearded people invade your personal space my good man. 

 

[excelite]

Some guy made a 28 and 25 mm mock-up.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/tvfqc9/leagues_of_votann_size_comparison_with_both/

 

25 seems quite small

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

Dr Clock I think they're going to be move 4. Maybe with some sort of march rule replacing advance (so slow but consistent). It just seems to be a defining feature for Dwarves in AoS.

 

I'm glad that the squats are coming back but not entirely convinced we need another army, I would have done them as Tau allies or something.

 

I think new armies are good overall for hobbyists. The issue is GW not being sure what they want 40k to be, if it's a beer & pretzel game the more the merrier. If it's a tournament game than yeah, they've proven they can't balance what they have (which is a pretty big issue if they want to sell to chapter approved every year).

 

Some guy made a 28 and 25 mm mock-up.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/tvfqc9/leagues_of_votann_size_comparison_with_both/

25 seems quite small

 

Yeah, but it lines up with the AoS models quite well. Plus it would make them pretty distinct on the tabletop which is a plus. 

 

[excelite]

Tbh, I think it’s a 28 model, looking at the height of the base, the 25 one looks just way too small

[spessmarine]

Some guy made a 28 and 25 mm mock-up.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/tvfqc9/leagues_of_votann_size_comparison_with_both/

 

25 seems quite small

Sisters/Primaris/Krieg are the new scale I'd say for humans, exceptional/astartes/normal respectively. 28 mm fits fine for that, but it makes them look weird compared to the fantasy ones.

[mel_danes]

Some guy made a 28 and 25 mm mock-up.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/tvfqc9/leagues_of_votann_size_comparison_with_both/

 

25 seems quite small

I'd love them this size, like really lethal grots. You could hide a phalanx behind 1 ruin. Edited April 4, 2022 by mel_danes

[01RTB01]

I'm glad that the squats are coming back but not entirely convinced we need another army, I would have done them as Tau allies or something.

Whats wrong with new armies?...

 

Based on that we'd never have had necrons, tau, etc.

 

After however many decades it's been new stuff is nice. Especially when it's a classic returning.

[MithrilForge]

WOW.... Just WOW.... Something old is now something New! 

 

And Here I thought the New Eldar was the pinnacle of this year (for me) and here we have GW just smashing the ceiling of my hopes  .in a good way 

 

I know some don't But I love the Colours! 

 

Mithril 

 

++EDIT++

 

"Leagues of Votann" is cool sounding and very neatly avoids being Politically incorrect 

Edited April 4, 2022 by mithrilforge

[Dr. Clock]

 

Some guy made a 28 and 25 mm mock-up.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/tvfqc9/leagues_of_votann_size_comparison_with_both/

 

25 seems quite small

I'd love them this size, like really lethal grots. You could hide a phalanx behind 1 ruin.

 

True enough lol. I think 'lethal grots' is just ratlings innit?

 

In all seriousness I think they may try and keep the 40k and AoS offerings quite distinct indeed, to (unfortunately) disincentivize 'double dipping' one army in both systems... and anything that's t4 or a 3+ sv makes best sense on 28mm minimum IMO.

 

What that means in practice is possibly just rebasing my 20 Kharadron up a size while maybe adding a few more greebles, but that's a reasonable change if they end up closer to 15 pts each than 10 for me.

 

[sitnam]

I don’t think GW shirks away from double dipping, it would actually incentivize sales. Thousand Sons and AoS Tzeentch share a few units, the entire Chaos Daemon range can go both ways, GSC and Chaos Cults can be played in Necromudna, etc. Edited April 4, 2022 by sitnam