Kill Team Kill Team Termination GSC vs Votann

[AutumnEffect]

14 minutes ago, TheVoidDragon said:

Can someone explain why they dislike the ones with the closed coats? I've seen several dislike them but not really sure what the problem with them is.  It's definitely a pretty different feel to the others at least.

 

It makes them look chunky, IMO. I don't terribly mind it, but I do agree that the open coats look better than the closed ones. 

 

15 minutes ago, TheVoidDragon said:

Also it is a little disapointing that there doesn't seem to be any helmet options, maybe there will be that we haven't seen yet but it just seems a bit odd that they really don't want to give these lighter voidarmour Kin helmets - these, Pioneers, The Ironmaster and Thunderkin all have no options for helmets. If/when they do, hopefully they're not just more of the same ones the rest have.

 

GW tends not to give 'scouting' units helmets or give them fewer, see Space Marine Scouts, Catachans (to an extent), Tanith 1st and Only, Eldar Rangers (some helmets littered in but more bare heads). It's an easy-to-read visual shorthand, nothing more.

[Halandaar]

32 minutes ago, AutumnEffect said:

GW tends not to give 'scouting' units helmets or give them fewer, see Space Marine Scouts, Catachans (to an extent), Tanith 1st and Only, Eldar Rangers (some helmets littered in but more bare heads). It's an easy-to-read visual shorthand, nothing more.

 

It's by no means consistent; T'au Pathfinders are helmeted, as are SM Incursors. Eldar Rangers actually have more helmets in the kit (6) than bared heads (5), but even then, every modern Eldar kit allows you to build the entire squad either with helmets or without, regardless of it's battlefield role.

 

I'd debate Catachans being included at all, given they're just regular troops for whom not wearing helmets is part of their faction aesthetic (the same as it is for Orks, for example). So really the only unit where being unhelmeted is a deviation from the overall look of the faction is the SM Scouts.

[AutumnEffect]

1 minute ago, Halandaar said:

 

It's by no means consistent; T'au Pathfinders are helmeted, as are SM Incursors. Eldar Rangers actually have more helmets in the kit (6) than bared heads (5), but even then, every modern Eldar kit allows you to build the entire squad either with helmets or without, regardless of it's battlefield role.

 

I'd debate Catachans being included at all, given they're just regular troops for whom not wearing helmets is part of their faction aesthetic (the same as it is for Orks, for example). So really the only unit where being unhelmeted is a deviation from the overall look of the faction is the SM Scouts.

 

I never said it was consistent. I said 'tends' not 'always'.

I didn't include Tau Pathfinders because they are helmeted. I recognized that Catachans was questionable by saying 'to an extent'. The Imperial Guard still have it as a deviation in the Tanith First and Only. It's one character unit, but being pedantic cuts both ways.

[CL_Mission]

1 hour ago, TheVoidDragon said:

Can someone explain why they dislike the ones with the closed coats? I've seen several dislike them but not really sure what the problem with them is.  It's definitely a pretty different feel to the others at least.

I think they're just a little too short and chunky to pull it off and you can't see enough of the legs below the bottom of the coat. At best they look like a child wearing their father's jacket and at worst an up turned dust bin with a pair of boots sticking out. The open coats don't have this issue as you can see the full figure of the wearer.

I think the sniper with the cloak just about gets away with it though.

[Halandaar]

26 minutes ago, AutumnEffect said:

I never said it was consistent. I said 'tends' not 'always'.

 

What I'm saying is that there's no actual trend here, so it's not an "easy-to-read visual shorthand" at all. There are just as many helmeted infiltrator units as there are unhelmeted ones (among factions who wear helmets, that is) so it's just a subjective visual choice that seems to be made by GW on a unit-by-unit basis. 

 

26 minutes ago, AutumnEffect said:

The Imperial Guard still have it as a deviation in the Tanith First and Only. 

 

Even this isn't really a deviation though. Helmets in the guard is a regimental aesthetic thing, not a battlefield role thing. You don't look at a squad of Tallarn Desert Raiders and go "oh they don't have helmets they must be scouts/infiltrators". The fact that Tanith don't have them is because that's just how the whole regiment is designed to look, it's not specifically because they're a scouty/infiltratey unit.

Edited March 22 by Halandaar

[AutumnEffect]

22 minutes ago, Halandaar said:

What I'm saying is that there's no actual trend here, so it's not an "easy-to-read visual shorthand" at all. There are just as many helmeted infiltrator units as there are unhelmeted ones (among factions who wear helmets, that is) so it's just a subjective visual choice that seems to be made by GW on a unit-by-unit basis. 

 

You have corrected me, it isn't a trend. It was an offhand comment I took maybe a couple minutes thinking about.

I disagree that it isn't an easy-to-read visual shorthand for these space dwarf scouts to be easily recognizable as such though.

 

22 minutes ago, Halandaar said:

Even this isn't really a deviation though. Helmets in the guard is a regimental aesthetic thing, not a battlefield role thing. You don't look at a squad of Tallarn Desert Raiders and go "oh they don't have helmets they must be scouts/infiltrators". The fact that Tanith don't have them is because that's just how the whole regiment is designed to look, it's not specifically because they're a scouty/infiltratey unit.

 

Could the reason they were designed that way possibly be because they are a scouty/infiltratey unit?

Possibly the tallarn do not have helmets because their head wraps are an easy-to-read visual shorthand that they are from a hot, dry environment?

 

My man, I appreciate that you disagree with me but this is really petty stuff and I'm just not invested in it. If you are this eager for an argument win you can have it from me on this.

Edited March 22 by AutumnEffect

[TheVoidDragon]

2 hours ago, AutumnEffect said:

 

It makes them look chunky, IMO. I don't terribly mind it, but I do agree that the open coats look better than the closed ones. 

 

 

GW tends not to give 'scouting' units helmets or give them fewer, see Space Marine Scouts, Catachans (to an extent), Tanith 1st and Only, Eldar Rangers (some helmets littered in but more bare heads). It's an easy-to-read visual shorthand, nothing more.

 

It's not something that applies just to this unit though, they're using the same armour type as other non-scout units of the Leagues like the Brokkhyr. None of them have helmets for some reason.

 

 

 

 

[AutumnEffect]

9 minutes ago, TheVoidDragon said:

 

It's not something that applies just to this unit though, they're using the same armour type as other non-scout units of the Leagues like the Brokkhyr. None of them have helmets for some reason.

 

 

 

 

 

Yes. They have the same armour.

But they don't have the helmets and they are wearing the coats because it helps make them look different on the table.

 

 

[TheVoidDragon]

18 minutes ago, AutumnEffect said:

 

Yes. They have the same armour.

But they don't have the helmets and they are wearing the coats because it helps make them look different on the table.

 

 

 

My point was, for some strange reason they seem against giving any of the units that wear this type of armour a helmet. It's not just this specific unit or type of role that doesn't have them, it's all the Kin wearing this armour regardless of context, and the standard helmets can't even be used for their kits either. It just seems a bit odd that they don't want any of them to have a helmet option, this is the 4th unit without one.

Edited March 22 by TheVoidDragon

[Kastor Krieg]

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Nobody calls people out on this severe misunderstanding of tactical scouting garments? 

Those are not thin fashion oriented springwear trenchcoats, those are proper protective and warm greatcoats, ya heathens.

[Indy Techwisp]

33 minutes ago, Kastor Krieg said:

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Nobody calls people out on this severe misunderstanding of tactical scouting garments? 

Those are not thin fashion oriented springwear trenchcoats, those are proper protective and warm greatcoats, ya heathens.

 

A Greatcoat is heavier, insulated garment worn for protection against the cold.

A Trenchcoat is a lighter, waterproof garment which is worn for protection against wet weather.

 

But enough about the Yaegir, what are we thinking about the Brood Brothers?

I'm thinking what we've seen of the upgrade sprue looks like stuff recycled from the Neophytes and I'm hoping there's other head options we haven't seen yet.

[Zoatibix]

20 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

 

 

I'm thinking what we've seen of the upgrade sprue looks like stuff recycled from the Neophytes and I'm hoping there's other head options we haven't seen yet.

One can only hope so. I was hoping for something as cool and fulsome as the Cadian upgrade sprue after very small Drukhari upgrade sprue.

 

I’m a lot more interested in the Votann and I don’t even collect the army!

 

Regarding scout headgear. On the one hand, I think lots of different headgear fits the usual ‘scouts being less formal’ schtick. On the other, I was expecting more 1980s Parker coat hoods. 
 

 

[ThePenitentOne]

I'm a bit frustrated at having hybrid heads on a brood brother upgrade frame again. I get it- it's hard to communicate "GSC" without aliening-up the heads... But as I understand the lore, Brood Brothers do not actually undergo any externally visible changes after receiving the Genestealer curse.

[Indy Techwisp]

29 minutes ago, ThePenitentOne said:

I'm a bit frustrated at having hybrid heads on a brood brother upgrade frame again. I get it- it's hard to communicate "GSC" without aliening-up the heads... But as I understand the lore, Brood Brothers do not actually undergo any externally visible changes after receiving the Genestealer curse.

 

On the one hand, yeah the use of Neophyte heads is annoying (as are, imo, the "starting to grow 3 arms" parts a couple of the studio models have).

 

On the other, since this is just a Infantry Squad upgrade sprue there's already enough Helmeted heads and normal arms in the base kit already.

 

If I ever get around to playing GSC, I'll probably just use the non-obviously mutated bits so they still could feasibility hide in a guard Regiment.

Tho stuff like the Icons or extra GSC logos and stuff are fair game.

 

I do hope there are more "accessory" bits on the sprue, and a couple heads that are unhelmeted but with a cloth mask or something.

[Indy Techwisp]

Actually, speaking of the Brood Brothers Upgrade sprue, I wonder how many parts of the kit will get repurposed by actual Guard players?

 

I can see the Medic arms getting reused at least...

[sitnam]

1 hour ago, ThePenitentOne said:

I'm a bit frustrated at having hybrid heads on a brood brother upgrade frame again. I get it- it's hard to communicate "GSC" without aliening-up the heads... But as I understand the lore, Brood Brothers do not actually undergo any externally visible changes after receiving the Genestealer curse.

I think the kit, despite being called Brood Brothers, is supposed to represent those 4th gen’s that can pass as human. If you want more human looking guard, just use their standard heads

[TheVoidDragon]

Looking at the Hernkyn again...the ones with closed coats all have a belt wrapped around it, which looks to be the same belt they wear under it. So they're either carrying around a spare belt (that just isn't modelled with the open coats), or they're taking off the void suit belt to use it just to close their coats?

[Indy Techwisp]

14 minutes ago, TheVoidDragon said:

Looking at the Hernkyn again...the ones with closed coats all have a belt wrapped around it, which looks to be the same belt they wear under it. So they're either carrying around a spare belt (that just isn't modelled with the open coats), or they're taking off the void suit belt to use it just to close their coats?

 

It's not uncommon to fasten a trenchcoat with a belt, so I'd assume the Hernkyn wearing it over the shut coat have gotten a spare belt to shut the coat.
Hernkyn carry enough random gubbins in their packs and on their bikes that I'd be more surprised if there weren't spare belts available.

[Zoatibix]

15 hours ago, TheVoidDragon said:

Looking at the Hernkyn again...the ones with closed coats all have a belt wrapped around it, which looks to be the same belt they wear under it. So they're either carrying around a spare belt (that just isn't modelled with the open coats), or they're taking off the void suit belt to use it just to close their coats?

My understanding is that FW will be selling an Open Coat Belt Upgrade Pack…