The Castigators

[Commissar Molotov]

Hrrm, we seem to be having difficulties with some of the coding in posts from before the upgrade. It's still fine in the Librarium though. I'll check for a solution. The only way may be to put it into another post.

 

Hrm, weird. I'll try it at some stage, but I would've figured that the old posts would change to the new system once the "edit" button was clicked.

 

If you don't want to put the additional info into the IA, maybe make a new article/topic with an expansion on the Castigators fluff. Maybe from the viewpoint of an Inquisitorial database?

 

Looking into it. The Inquisitorial idea has merit, but then there's a couple of other concepts and ideas I'm working on. I'll try to keep people updated.

 

Nice to see more of these guys. Who knows, maybe some of the V-brethren will rise from their slumber? :)

 

I've been talking to Darrell about it (before his last disappearance) and there's certainly some potential. We had discussed the possibility of using the Harvesters almost as an anti-purity, repudiating everything they once stood for. We wouldn't be able to have a singular, massive campaign like the Akkaddian one, but as they're fleet-based it'd be far more difficult for the Vocates (and the Honour Company) to hunt them down. On the bright side, we wouldn't be limited to trawling the Maelstrom, and there'd be a bunch of Hive Worlds (and billions of mutants) for the Vocates Chapters to chew through... it'd need more discussion, and this isn't really the place for it, but detailing and finishing up the Vocates would certainly be a great achievement.

[Commissar Molotov]

Hrm, interesting. I did a full edit this time (as opposed to the quick edit I did before) and the post snapped back to the old/new sidebars, so they're not as messed up as they were before. I've embarked upon some minor cosmetic changes to the article. I'm considering removing the picture of Hero-Captain Lycidius as it's not really contributing - and it takes up a great deal of space.

[krieger haggoroth]

Not had a chance to read over the IA in great detail left (I will get to it sometimes after class today), but i do think you should keep all of the art it. It makes the article seem a lot more professional and "real". More from me in a while...

[Commissar Molotov]

Hrm. Well, alright. I accidentally managed to delete the sidebar detailing the Redemptors and Contemptors, so if anyone has that, let me know! :devil:

[krieger haggoroth]

Great work, as usual. Three points that i would like to poke at, however:

 

-With all of the chapter's stringentcy on purity, and coupled with the method of recruitment, it seems that the chapter would be well understrength almost always. How many of the world's inhabitants actually take these suicidal quests? How many actually survive their missions to be recruited by the chapter, then of those how many are "pure" enough to join the chapter, then of those how many survive the process of becoming a marine? I'm just thinking that with your wording, it seems as if missions to hunt the mutants are very rare, and that the chapter would have nearly no influx of new recruits.

 

-You say that they tolerate navigators and astropaths, but not Librarians. The Legion Librarius' were also sanctioned and created by the Emperor (the original organizer of the original legions), so I'm not sure i see the reasoning here. Librarians aren't allowed, but navigators and astropaths are?

 

-You mentiond layout earlier. The one thing i'd point out is that some of the pics (namely the chapter symbol) could be sized down to help with aesthetics.

[Kurgan the Lurker]

EDIT: I made a minor edit to the IA article in the first post of this thread, and now all the captions and formatting have been thrown off slightly. The edit I made (as far as I know) didn't effect any of the coding relating to the captions... have the captions changed? Should I be using different codes? Let me know.

 

The only BBCode currently not working are those related to the Caslon Antique (40k Font) Library. The Library hasn't been loaded onto the new server as of yet and as such those particular codes won't work. Everything else should be working.

[Commissar Molotov]

Yeah, thanks, Kurgan. It seemed to fix itself after I edited it in 'full edit' mode rather than 'quick edit' mode. Either way, it's not really an issue now, though I do appreciate you posting.

 

----

 

Krieger, you have some points, but some of them are irrelevant. After all, few Chapters are ever really at full strength. I mention in the gene-seed section that there have been few times in recent years where the Chapter has approached full strength. I see that the reserve companies would typically be smaller, as every effort would be taken in order to keep the battle companies, the fighting strength of the Chapter, at full strength.

 

For the Losancans, you need to consider that this is a people who believes that the existance of the mutants is the only thing preventing the Emperor from returning to the mortal plane. So yes, some of them do go. Does it need to be that regular, when many Chapters seem to recruit every decade, at most? The Space Marines are all about cutting the wheat from the chaff. If you think about it, all Marine Chapters should reruit from Hive Worlds. Some of those planets have trillions of people living on them. But yet they don't. There's a suspension of disbelief issue there, I think.

 

Regarding the Emperor, it really depends. In some versions of the fluff, the Emperor actually outlawed Librarians, but the Heresy happened before the dictate could be enforced, and it never was. Either way, it's mostly irrelevant. The Castigators don't have Librarians. But they couldn't function without navigators and astropaths. Neither could the Black Templars. Ultimately, it's one of those contradictions in belief that make fools of religious zealots. I've said before the Castigators have influences from Nazi Germany, or from religious zealots of all stripes. The point is that zealots have remarkable ways of ignoring the obvious flaws that undermine their arguments. They hate psykers? The Emperor is a psyker. It's a funny issue that is part of the dark and tragic ironies that really define the Imperium.

 

EDIT: I edited the IA, rearranged some of the pictures, and reduced the Chapter symbol in size.

[Commissar Molotov]

Hrm, well I've extensively altered the article layout; I've altered the picture of Renatus, removed the picture of Lycidius, added in another picture that looks pretty cool; on the whole it should be interesting, so check it out.

 

 

Warning: Not only is this post pic-heavy, it's probably five minutes of your life you won't get back. Proceed with caution! :P

 

 

Now for another, slightly more existential angsty crisis: What colour are the Castigators?

 

 

The first picture of the Castigators was this one, drawn by Penitent Dreadnought and coloured by Tubal:

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/Castigator07.gif

 

After that, Tiberius drew the pic of Renatus and the Chapter symbol:

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/Renatus2.pnghttp://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/castigatorbadge9yf.jpg

 

As you can see, these are two very different reds. The one Tubal used is perhaps closer to red gore, a more 'purple' red.

 

I was looking at this, by Scally, featuring the Castigators and their Oathbrethren, the Judicators:

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/JuCas.png

 

As you can see, Scally's kept closer to Tubal's colours in this, although not here:

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g119/Scallyscanlon/Castigators/CastigatorsRhinoTransport.gif

 

I was fiddling around and altered the saturation on the Castigators/Judicators pic, and came up with this:

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/JuCas1.png

 

As you can see, slightly different:

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/hues.png

 

Though perhaps closer to Tiberius' version:

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/huesbadge1.png

 

To further complicate the issue, Fabricator-General seems to've gone with a different red for his Castigators:

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v369/Cormack/Castigators/DSCF1898.jpg

 

Whilst Aerion and JTDemon have different reds for their Castigators:

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v414/jtdemon/caetrus2.jpg

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d61/aerion_the_faithful/SergeantCaetrus-Finished.jpg

 

So I'm thoughtful, here, and I'd like your considered opinions. Crimson? Scarlet? Blood-red? What colour are the Castigators? Is a lighter red too reminiscent of the Blood Angels?

[Espada Azul]

I think I prefer the neutral red used in Scally's presentation. The bright red paint job does remind me too much of the Blood Angels, however, if you do it too dark I get reminded of the Blood Ravens instead.

[utilityzero]

i like the early sort of subdued red, the 'more purple' red i think you said. it's different and it i just think it looks good.

[Tyrannicide]

I like the scarlet clad warriors, the Castigators should be.

 

My vote would go to Aerion's style red.

[Guest Mordray]

I personally think the darker red of the first image is the better choice as it gives a much more unique feel instead of just 'yet another crimson/red chapter' as typically, imho, most of the brighter/lighter reds are over used.

[Aerion the Faithful]

Well...

Its been ages since I've posted on a thread here in the boards (and one that isn't mine even!), but this caught my eye, as there is art posted here that I've done for the Castigators ^_^.

As I was tellung Molotov just this afternoon I also advocate for the darker red, as the brighter one reminds me too much of the Blood Angels, and The Emperor knows there's a lot fo those around... the problem, as I see it, lies in the rendering of such dark red. I understand Molotov's concern about it becoming 'purpl-ish', because that's what often happens when you mix pigments, instead of light. When you're working traditionally, the pigments used in markers, pencils, or even watercolours are all derived from the earth one way or another, and that tends to mutate the clours when you mix them; especially when mixing a colour AND black or white, which are tones.

Note that, when working with digital, you're mixing light, throuh a monitor, and thus can achieve a darker red without going purple. Thus, the question is: what colour should the castigators be if we want to translate that colour as faithfully as we can both in light and pigment colouring? Personally, and speaking as a traditional artist, I still say the dark red. I've found ways around the muted mixes and I can now achieve a better red, that doesn't turn 'purple' when mixing it with gray and I think that can be done too when painting miniatures, depending on the skill of the painter, so...

 

That's my two cents.

 

I don't know if I made sense, but, bottom line: dark red. Totally.

 

Until soon.

 

Aerion the Faithful

[krieger haggoroth]

I like the Fabricator General one, and the aerion the faithful one. Somewhere in between perhaps? I don't realy like the idea of the purple-ish red on these guys. The way i see it, the castiagtors are an extremist chapter, and i think a more solid color (aka, not a mix of purple and red) is in order.

[SeerBrun]

I'm going to have to throw in my vote with the darker shade of red, though the only thing I have (yet) to contribute to this chapter is in grey-scale!

 

PS: I need to come up with a name for that guy too... something impressive, since he probably will be drawn again. B)

[Commissar Molotov]

I'm going to have to throw in my vote with the darker shade of red, though the only thing I have (yet) to contribute to this chapter is in grey-scale!

 

PS: I need to come up with a name for that guy too... something impressive, since he probably will be drawn again. :)

 

He was Hero-Captain Lycidius, as I understood it. B) I wrote up a background for him.

[SeerBrun]

I'm going to have to throw in my vote with the darker shade of red, though the only thing I have (yet) to contribute to this chapter is in grey-scale!

 

PS: I need to come up with a name for that guy too... something impressive, since he probably will be drawn again. :D

 

He was Hero-Captain Lycidius, as I understood it. :) I wrote up a background for him.

Oh, the last time I was at your page (when it was up) I didn't notice him as having been named and here you've named him and killed him all in one fell stroke. Is there a year of his death? I was rather planning on using him for something... I think you know what I mean. Hostile challenge. If it was relatively "recent" that would be cool.

 

I did read a bit about his exploits though. Is there more?

[Commissar Molotov]

Well, he could be Captain Caphius, noted zealot and current Captain of the Second Company, in which case he'd be very much 'recent'. :P

[SeerBrun]

Well... I'd prefer an actual date and then I can work with it and figure out what I need to do from there. What I have planned isn't in 'modern' time. Its fairly close to it. I will figure something out either way.

[Commissar Molotov]

Ah, right. Well as I said, Caphius is the 'current' (999.M41) Captain of the Second Company. It'd make more sense if you told me what time your IE stuff is set (or PM me whatever you don't want people to read) and I can arrange things accordingly.

[Commissar Molotov]

Scally's helped to solve my problems regarding the colour schemes. He sent me this example of a Castigator Veteran, based off this earlier drawing by Colrouphobic:

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/Castigators/CastigatorsVeteran.gif

 

In other news, the Caphius/Lycidius split is resolved:

 

This is Captain Caphius, Second Company Captain of the Castigators, and Master of the Watch.

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/Castigators/Caphius.jpg

 

And this is Hero-Captain Lycidius, Martyr of the Castigators.

 

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z121/mnesimache/Castigators/CaptainLycidius.jpg

 

Thanks to SeerBrun for the pictures.

 

Caphius is a member of the Old Guard, the oldest currently-serving Captain in the Chapter. He adheres rigidly to the doctrines of older, zealous Castigators such as Hero-Captain Lycidius. He sees his Company as a furious weapon in the arsenal of the Imperium, and has hand-picked the most faithful and furious Marines from the reserve Companies to supplement his forces. In battle, Caphius leads from the front, knowing that his Sergeants and their Marines are each as devoted to the cause as he. The Second Company is known to use a high proportion of flamer weapons in order to ensure heretics and recidivists receive no succour. Brash, egotistical and bombastic, Caphius attempts to ensure he is in Command of any operation to which he is assigned.

 

Lycidius is one of the major heroes of the Castigators. A zealot. He was awarded the status of "Hero" after his death. He was never "Hero-Captain" until after his death. I've never fully detailed his history, but on the old Castigators site I had a mention of his defense of a colony called 'Aeteron Point' against Dark Eldar. He also emerged triumphant from a vicious campaign known as the Cheng Exculpation.

 

This is what I managed to recover from the old site:

 

635.M37: The Defense of Aeteron Point

The small and recently-established colony of Aeteron Point fell victim to a string of raids by Dark Eldar corsairs in early 635.M37. Jetbikes shrieked through the sky, harrassing the beleagured PDF forces whilst raiders laden with prisoners returned to the orbiting vessels.

 

It was at this point that the Castigator Strike Cruiser Inviolate broke out of the warp and attacked the Dark Eldar. The Castigators' Second Company, under Captain Lycidius had been returning home after its victories in the Cheng Exculpation. Due to the vagaries of astropathic communication, the Inviolate had actually received the colony's distress call a week before it was sent. The Company was understrength and underequipped, but Lycidius was determined to assist the colony. He had a keen tactical mind, and knew of the formidable agility, barbarism and strength of the Dark Eldar. He also knew that their greatest weakness would be their arrogance and complete disdain towards humans. Assigning the veterans under his command to board and cripple the slave-ships in orbit, the Captain led his depleted company to the surface. Many Marines wounded in the Cheng Exculpation took to the battlefield, ignoring their injuries.

 

Lycidius had determined that the key to victory lay in forcing the Eldar into a trap, where they would lose their precious mobility. He deployed his forces to a landmark known as the Iron Valley, interposing the Second Company between the Colony and the returning Raiders. Establishing overlapping fields of fire and secreting a battery of Whirlwinds out of sight of the aliens, he deployed a small force of Marines openly to bait the Eldar into attacking. The understrength force seemed easy pray to the overconfident pirates, flush with victory. It is said that captured Astartes fetch a high price in the slave-markets of their hellish realm.

 

The Captain's gambit worked. The Space Marine forces withdrew as the Eldar approached, drawing the fragile enemy craft within range of the Whirlwinds' artillery guns. Under a withering hail of fire, the Castigators attacked, eradicating their foes. Captain Lycidius dispatched the Eldar Archon himself in single combat. With the slave-ships in orbit crippled and the remaining Dark Eldar forces routed, the colonists of Aeteron Point were spared the terrible fate of living as slaves in the service of the torturous aliens. The prisoners taken were returned to the colony and the Castigators returned home in glory.

 

Please do me a favour and go check out this thread!

[Commissar Molotov]

I've been working quite a bit on the Castigators after Darth Potato inspired me. I've been working on some of the various personalities within the Chapters (especially the Battle-Company Captains, Caphius, Sirius, Timon and Anteas). Stuff that probably wouldn't matter that much to you guys, but stuff which is solidifying and tying up many of the disparate concepts I've invested in the Castigators.

 

I'm also (re)working on a piece of Castigators fiction called Machinery of Hate which is told from the point of view of Acastus, the Librarian attached to the Fifth Company. It's a story that features the Second and Fifth Companies.

 

I'm fervently hoping to get a new Castigators site up and operational as soon as possible, because I've had a great deal of cool ideas that'll hopefully interest some of you.

 

I've also been planning to detail the Castigators' homeworld a bit more - I've been drawing on a previous quote from Barret:

 

[Perhaps] similarly to the Twi'leks, they live primarly in the twilight zone (dun dun dunnnn) between night and day, staying out of the radiated day side, but far enough out of the night side to avoid freezing. In my mind, that last would make their plight much more dramatic and precarious, literaly caught between the light and dark, between mutation and freezing doom. I really like this, and I think it's a very iconic element of the 40k universe. Freedom and liberty are the doom of mankind and, here, daylight is death and nighttime little safer.

 

I had the idea of some of the raiding parties that assault the mutants, venturing from the twilight zones to the day-side, wrapped in rags much like a Tusken Raider to avoid the worst of the heat and radiation. My thought was that the Chaplains watch these parties fighting the mutants, and on their way back home, they stop them, taking those children that prove to be of a suitable age. In return perhaps the Losancans receive some measure of technology or supplies to make their lives that little bit easier.

 

More rambling will commence at a later date, I'm sure.

 

EDIT:

 

A few of you will've seen Chaplain Karakalla. Awesome picture, undoubtedly, but it presented me with a few problems (dang artists taking liberties! ;)) - his name, Karakalla, isn't a Castigator name at all. All the Castigators take Latinesque names. And he's adorned with a huge Crux Terminatus on his breastplate.

 

So I've decided to try to justify these discrepancies. Chaplain Renatus, who was previously my First Company Chaplain alongside First-Captain Escalus, will now be the Chapter's Master of Sanctity. Karakalla will be the First Company Chaplain.

 

Now, with regards to the name... I decided that it might well be a title of some sorts - I've decided to link it back to my Dark Claws. I wrote this in one of my notebooks:

 

'Karakalla means "Heavy Heart" in the primitive tongue of Kal Tunivor, the homeworld of the Dark Claws Chapter. It was given to Castigator Chaplain Coratus during the War of Woes, a campaign where the two Chapters served together.'

 

Sounds good... I just need to detail the War of Woes, I guess. My thought is that someone notable died, and so Coratus was stricken by grief.

 

---

 

Talking of titles: Has anyone ever gone to the trouble of giving titles to their characters? For example, Ezekiel is "Holder of the Keys" - Azrael is "Keeper of the Truth" and so on. Even titles like "Master of the Fleet", "Master of the Watch" and such. The Apocalypse rulebook mentions how the master of the Blood Angels fleet is 'Lord of the Angelic Host' and such.

 

If you have, let me know. I'm looking into titles and honorifics that really suit the Castigators. All ideas welcome.

[Tyrannicide]

I like the changes Mol. ^_^ Particularly PURIFY.

 

As for honorific titles, none come to mind... for now.

[krieger haggoroth]

I've used a number of honorific titles in my chapters

 

Storm Falcons

-Chapter Master Haytham: Commander of the Faithful

-Captain Akam: Commander of the Just

-al-Sahari(Chief librarian) Kallam: Commander of the Cursed

-Chaplain Mada'mil: Commander of the Pure

 

Crimson Praetorians

-Evocatti

-Chapter Master Suetonii: Praetor Tyrannus

-Sanguinary Priest Avarras: Guardian of the Lost

 

Reprisors

-Facilitators of Change, Pleasure, Rage, and Rot

-Chapter Master Matthias Desalo: Arch Facilitator of Chaos Ascendant

-Strike-Group Captain

 

Usually, i just find that a title tends to be just that, it describes something that they do in a short phrase somehow. Castigators seem like they'd have titles that have to do with zealotry and the like: Commander of the Pious, Lord Purgator, etc. etc.

[Commissar Molotov]

I like the changes Mol. :) Particularly PURIFY.

 

As for honorific titles, none come to mind... for now.

 

Yeah, the purify was (in part) for you. Figured you'd appreciate it.

 

I could help you out with the titles if I ever catch you on MSN, Mol. Not that I've ever been an expert with them, or close to it, but it seems like a fun brainstorming exercise.

 

Yeah, I'm not online all too much these days, I'm having trouble with my internet connection. I am aiming to catch you soon, though, because I've got Vocates stuff to mention to you.

 

I've used a number of honorific titles in my chapters

 

Storm Falcons

-Chapter Master Haytham: Commander of the Faithful

-Captain Akam: Commander of the Just

-al-Sahari(Chief librarian) Kallam: Commander of the Cursed

-Chaplain Mada'mil: Commander of the Pure

 

Crimson Praetorians

-Evocatti

-Chapter Master Suetonii: Praetor Tyrannus

-Sanguinary Priest Avarras: Guardian of the Lost

 

Reprisors

-Facilitators of Change, Pleasure, Rage, and Rot

-Chapter Master Matthias Desalo: Arch Facilitator of Chaos Ascendant

-Strike-Group Captain

 

Usually, i just find that a title tends to be just that, it describes something that they do in a short phrase somehow. Castigators seem like they'd have titles that have to do with zealotry and the like: Commander of the Pious, Lord Purgator, etc. etc.

 

Isn't 'Guardian of the Lost' used in the Flesh Tearers, too? I'm pretty sure I've heard it somewhere before. Still, you have some interesting ideas, though I don't tend to go for the proliferation of pseudo-latin all over the place (it's a light-hearted argument that Aerion the Faithful and I have).

 

Although you seem to be mentioning special ranks in there too. I have a few of those - the Veteran Captain being called First-Captain and the Terminator Squad leaders being called Battle-Captain... but I was thinking more of ceremonial titles and the like. I'm still fiddling around with them, though you're certainly right that purity would likely figure heavily.

 

I'll give it some thought.