[HH1.0] Raven Guard Tactics

[Fangbanger]

The jetbike one is an interesting one for sure, something to consider. Not got my books as away but assuming you can take javs too?

 

I think you must take Maun in a flyer list, his re-roll is just too good for them

[defl0]

It's a really interesting thought to just take jet bikes as troops, stay far away as harrassers and redeploy when the planes come in.

 

Shame they can't take power weapons...

 

The only issue is that you don't really get an reserve manipulation, such decap strike and recon would give you and you can't take a democlese either.

 

On a similar note of talent troops you could take the armoured company row...

[Fangbanger]

Yeah not a fan if that r.o.w, seems a bit cheesy for my liking.

 

You can run Maun though, starting in a flyer guarantees it coming on but yeah, if rolls don't go your way, a few bike squads aren't going to last forever.

 

I think you would need to use squads of 6 bikes and grav speeders to Harass and spread the enemy's units.

 

Raven jetbikes look good too

[Fangbanger]

Something like:

 

Maun

 

8 x MOR Deythan, Combi weapons, Darkwing

8 x Mor Deythan, Combi weapons, Darkwing

 

5 x bikes, multi melta, sarge with MB

5 x bikes, multi melta, sarge with MB

5 x bikes, multi melta, sarge with MB

 

3 x speeders, grav gun, multi melta

3 x speeders, grav gun, multi melta

Lightning, 2 x Kraken, BBC, GTA

 

Fire raptor, Hellstrike, Assault Cannons

Fire raptor, Hellstrike, assault Cannons

 

I'm not sure how strong it would be but yeah, 5 flyers, plenty of Anti vehicle and 5 scoring units

 

Plus would look cool as :cuss

[Nusquam]

The jetbike one is an interesting one for sure, something to consider. Not got my books as away but assuming you can take javs too?

 

I think you must take Maun in a flyer list, his re-roll is just too good for them

 

Yeah skimmers and flyers so javs count. I always forget about those too. They're on my mental "Ridiculously expensive in real money for what they do." list alongside anvillus and kharybdis pods.

 

I personally always take Maun. I always have flyers, deepstrikers, and/or pods somehow. Plus I really like going first. He's also cheap enough you can get a beefy HQ and not worry about Slay the Warlord. After reading:

Grey Raven. It really did not like it, but it does introduce a Raven Guard gone Knight Errant Librarian.

 

I've been wanting to add a Knight Errant to my lists. Tried the Nemean Reaver once, did not regret it ha. I know I'm always going on about quad mortars, but for real though. Them with Kyr Vhalen to grant rerolls of shooting 1s and to counter charge are spooky. Plus the modelling opportunity. I've made three so far. A count-as Rubio and Reaver, and a generic jump pack one.

 

It's a really interesting thought to just take jet bikes as troops, stay far away as harrassers and redeploy when the planes come in.

 

Shame they can't take power weapons...

 

The only issue is that you don't really get an reserve manipulation, such decap strike and recon would give you and you can't take a democlese either.

 

On a similar note of talent troops you could take the armoured company row...

 

The Sarge can take a first for that sweet S9 on the charge.

 

Maun all the way. All the flyers get rerolls, and the bikes enter ongoing reserves so they come in automatically anyway.

 

As for the Armoured, so you just mean quality troops in general? Because infantry has to mounted in tanks if we're still talking all potential flyer-heavy lists. Not impossible to make flyer heavy, but you'd need a lot of tanks.

 

 

Yeah not a fan if that r.o.w, seems a bit cheesy for my liking.

 

You can run Maun though, starting in a flyer guarantees it coming on but yeah, if rolls don't go your way, a few bike squads aren't going to last forever.

 

I think you would need to use squads of 6 bikes and grav speeders to Harass and spread the enemy's units.

 

Raven jetbikes look good too

 

An 89% chance to pass with Maun is pretty great.

 

Edit: Here was my first draft of a Sky Hunter RoW

 

The Age of Darkness (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List v202) (3000pts)

• HQ (140pts)
  • Strike Captain Alvarex Maun
• Elites (1460pts)
  • Legion Veteran Tactical Squad

    Darkwing Storm Eagle, 9x Legion Veteran Space Marines, Veteran Tactics: Marksmen

    • Additional Wargear
      • Combi-weapon x10 (flamer prob)
    • Legion Veteran Sergeant

      Bolt Pistol, Bolter, Chainsword/Combat Blade

  • Mor Deythan Strike Squad

    8x Combi-weapon, Darkwing Storm Eagle(wont start in it though, just a freebie slotless flyer), 9x Mor Deythan, 2x Plasma gun

  • Mor Deythan Strike Squad

    7x Combi-weapon, 9x Mor Deythan, 3x Plasma gun

• Troops (700pts)
  • Legion Jetbike Sky Hunter Squadron

    3x Space Marine Sky Hunters, Volkite Culverin

    • Sky Hunter Sergeant

      Power Fist

  • Legion Jetbike Sky Hunter Squadron

    3x Space Marine Sky Hunters, Volkite Culverin

    • Sky Hunter Sergeant

      Power Fist

  • Legion Jetbike Sky Hunter Squadron

    3x Space Marine Sky Hunters, Volkite Culverin

    • Sky Hunter Sergeant

      Power Fist

  • Legion Jetbike Sky Hunter Squadron

    3x Space Marine Sky Hunters, Volkite Culverin

    • Sky Hunter Sergeant

      Power Fist

• Fast Attack (470pts)
  • Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod  for MD
  • Anvillus Pattern Dreadclaw Drop Pod  for MD
  • Primaris-Lightning Strike Fighter

    Battle Servitor Control, Ramjet Diffraction Grid, 2x Two Kraken penetrator heavy missiles

• Heavy Support (230pts)
  • Legion Fire Raptor Gunship

    Four Hellstrike Missiles, Reaper Autocannon battery

• Legion
  • Legiones Astartes

    XIX: Raven Guard, Loyalist

  • Rite of War

    Sky Hunter Phalanx

 

Bikes lurk and plink, jink if needed, or turbo boost to punch a tank in the rear turn 2. MD come down and flat out for a turn two punch. Turn two happens and everything flies on and unloads. Any bikes that jinked go into reserves for outflank, maybe more depending on the battlefield layout.

 

Rough draft, but it illustrates possibilities. 12 T5 2+ jinking bikes, especially if they deploy far back can last a turn.  Split across that many squads to force 'overkill' on one if theres a particularly nasty unit on the table. Would probably try for second turn so I can make sure i deploy out of range/Line of sight.

 

I can see a couple ways to refine it, like more bikes, fewer infantry. But it gets the point across.

Edited December 26, 2016 by Nusquam

[Fangbanger]

Anvilus are a good shout to getting people down fast and also allow Maun to use his flyer roll from T2 unlike him starting in the flyer.

 

Anvilus kit is horrible though (although I year the storm eagles are worse so I guess it's a mute point)

 

It's a good take on the flyer/bike style

[Withershadow]

 

Breachers need only one thing to be good. They need to throw away their weak sauce garbage armor and borrow some from the Auxilia. If they could reroll all saves vs blasts and templates instead of just armor, they would have some amazing uses. Behind an Aegis they would make for really durable anchors, and even outside of it getting a 6++ reroll vs Whirlwinds or Phosphex would make them very solid.

 

Then add pinning to sniper rifles and wowza, suddenly recon squads are great too.

 

Then make Destroyers 20 points a model with jump packs.

 

Done?

 

I feel liek Auxilia was a typo. I just want breachers to use their shields all the time like they should. Like the old siege mantlet rules from FW. Reroll armor saves against shooting attacks. Maybe make it so you can't have artificer armor and a boarding shield to prevent 2+ rerollable.

 

Sniper rifles do need pinning back.

 

Destroyers need to be 100 base, 15 per additional model, and like 50 for packs squad wide. They need an overhaul, but those price reductions would take them from "left behind and mediocre" to "every day average good".

It's not a typo, the Nemean Reaver has the same functional void hardened armor. If anything it's the Breachers' rules that are an oversight.

[Nusquam]

We can't prove it either way. It could be a few things. They could have just copy and pasted from Auxilia because it was newest, either because the rule was updated or it was a typo and they copy-pasted the typo. There's no evidence either way. I would like better breachers, don't get me wrong.

 

I've seen people say they were going to email FW but I never saw any responses.

[Withershadow]

The syntax is different so somebody wrote two sentences saying the same thing. I think it's more of a stretch to assume this labyrinthine series of errors and copy pasting.

 

Ive asked them about it, they never respond. The name of the rule is different for the two units, so it is what it is. Poor Breachers, outdone by basic mooks.

[Nusquam]

A ZM game with Infiltrated breachers with a vigilator for scout and camo in a Recon company would be awesome if they could reroll cover from the extra spooky ZM blast and templates.

 

FW is out until the new year so it'll be a while before we hear from them.

 

Edit: i looked at SA void armor, they have specially developed armor from sol that gives a 4+ and can be reinforced to give rerolls. So they have their own special human armor. The reaver too has special armor as well. Neither are generic void armor entries. The reavers looks more like reminder text though. But we cant tell for sure because FW doesnt have tight rules language.

Edited December 26, 2016 by Nusquam

[defl0]

I'm actually playing the zone mortalis event at adepticon this year. You guys have any suggestions? Haven't done too much ZM.

 

I'm thinking maybe going head hunting with liberation force.

 

Seems like I need a Leviathan plan, ways to carve through infantry and the ability to kill an hq.

Edited December 27, 2016 by defl0

[Fangbanger]

The obvious choice is flamer Deythans

[defl0]

Really? Without rhinos they seem difficult to get into flamer range, even with infiltrate and scout you don't quite make it to your target.

 

Combi flamer vets can at least use the rending re roll flamers in over watch and have rending bolters and rending frag missiles.

 

Interestingly, combi grenade launchers might be a good alpha strike.

 

Or maybe just naked seekers.

 

The other thought I had was Praevian with castellax seem nasty

Edited December 27, 2016 by defl0

[SkimaskMohawk]

Zone mortalis should be all about using the bends in the hallways to deny LOS right? Gives a lot more room for getting out of sight with MD.

 

That being said, seekers are brutal in ZM, the rapid fire blasts do work when they can barely scatter and reroll to wound.

 

praevians are always cool, id go for the vorax tho, cortex designator with b2 5 pumps out a lot of shots 

[Fangbanger]

Yeah seekers give that extra bit of range, however not sure how often it will come into play with all the ZM bends

[Nusquam]

I'm actually playing the zone mortalis event at adepticon this year. You guys have any suggestions? Haven't done too much ZM.

 

I'm thinking maybe going head hunting with liberation force.

 

Seems like I need a Leviathan plan, ways to carve through infantry and the ability to kill an hq.

 

I love ZM. Mor Deythan are aces in it. Infiltrate+Scout+Fleet for positioning is great. They obliterate objectives and can get to blind corners first; forcing your enemy to either go around or end their move in front of the corner and weather the storm. Even then fleet keeps them bouncing around to head off enemies. Then you can outflank if needed. If you're playing in Poisoned Air/Cold void do flamers all the way, they'd rend on a 5+. Otherwise I've had success with 6 bodies to unlock the second special, I usually run all combiplas and 2 plas, or combi flamer and 2 plas. Always get the 2+ on the sarge to tank.

 

Seekers are great too because we can infiltrate them to get them set up to use scorpius bolts. I've had success with that too. I used them to dominate a long hallway and kept Death Shroud at bay all game.

 

Infiltrating Castellax are champions too. Praevian with camo and a boarding shield. I equip mine with Darkfire to lay long range hate on termis and pop doors from afar. They controlled an entire table quarter. Only used them once though because I felt a bit bad after ha. This was before Vorax got poisoned rounds and automata could fire three weapons. So Vorax seem like a fantastic choice too.

 

I really want to try Dark Furies in ZM. Even though my MtC dreams were dashed, a Vigilator granting them scout after they infiltrate will get them into position for an ambush very well.

 

The key to ZM is positioning. With infiltrate alone you can more readily ambush your opponents and make sure you get to fire first.

 

Leviathans look like they would be wildly OP in ZM. Fortunately their phosphex is barrage so you can't use it in ZM. I'm surprised they didn't update the ZM rule to limit big walkers too. The shield Deredeo with Plasma was bad enough. But they best way to a levy is a Cortus with chainfist using the +1I to swing first.

 

What's the points limit?

[defl0]

Not sure actually. Originally it was posted at 500 pts. But the 40k version of the rules are at 750. I'm planning on 500 though, which is tight tight tight.

 

Kinda why I was thinking liberating force could be fun, as the d3 from slay the warlord is a hefty amount of points.

[Nusquam]

Using Nex with preferred enemy, since he doesnt have lone killer, from Decap strike to stack up to 3VPs seems more reliable. Plus you can benefit from more rules like army wide PE(IC) and reroll for first turn.

 

Liberation needs an ally to actually use most of it. Seems like a waste just for d3 VP.

Edited December 28, 2016 by Nusquam

[defl0]

Rules just came out. 500 pts. No named characters. No praetor. No dark ages relics.

 

Units of 10 plus can be split into combat squads.

 

2 lists using combatant org. One boarding team and one assault team for challenging terrain.

 

Definately want to run angels wrath with dark fury for assault team :)

[Nusquam]

It doesn't matter if they say no praetor ha, its under 1k. The Delegatus is the only MotL you can take under 1k normally. Which still gives you a RoW, if that's what they're trying to stop.

[Gyem]

 

I just watched a batrep today of AL vs RG. Pretty good, a few errors.

 

A few missed plays like hit and run for corax to shoot up alpharius' unit

 

Quirk is pretty bad rule wise. The RG player used Maun warlord trait to reroll the Dark Fury reserve roll (it's only flyer and drop pods) while Corax is in the list (so Maun can't be the warlord).

[Shrieker]

The humble land speeder

 

The biker/speeder list above pushed me to reread the 'normal' 30k landspeeder rules (graviton gun? really?) and they look amazing (plasma cannon AND culverin options... how did I miss it)

 

Nevertheless, perfect as they look to me, I can't see them used much - so wondered what XIX legion players made of them (on paper they -look- like a strong anti tank option, made in heaven for Decapitation Strike).

 

Is their rarity more a result of the javelin being better value in the slot - (added krak, no AV10 vulnerability to FoTL) albeit being more expensive?

Or am I missing something?

 

If you use them - are they good, how many is too many.  

If you don't - is there a specific reason why?

[Withershadow]

They are just super fragile and if you jink you can't use the plasma cannon or graviton gun.

 

There is the Javelin of course, and I find a T5 2+Sv jetbike is more survivable than AV10 2HP.

Edited December 30, 2016 by Withershadow

[Nusquam]

For me its a mix of already habing 3 flyers, monetary cost vs points, and fighting multiple sicarans recently.

 

They're fragile so you almost always want them in reserves. That way the come on and have a solid turn of shooting. Recon Company or Decap helps go first but im paranoid about getting seized on.

 

You can take 5 regular speeders in a slot. They're cheap and get grav guns. 5 with grav each is 275. Combo with maun, infiltrated voxii, or a damocles to deepstrike accurately tou can do a solid 5 HPs to something. Plus a HB and grav can harass infantry too after.

 

Javs are great because of outflank. Unloading 4 krak shots with strafing run into side AV can do some work. Plus you can get out of mortis dreads fire arcs and avoid interceptor more readily.

[Biscuittzz]

What is the size comparison between a javelin and say a landspeeder tempest? I really like the tempest and it would be easy to strap on lascannons somewhere I'd say. As in using the tempest model for javs.

 

Is the jav much bigger? To be honest I think the javelin is a horrendous looking model so will probably never take one.