++ Gods of the Arena - A World Eaters Community ++

[Commissar K.]

 

 

Well why not both...one Juggerlord with Axe and one with a Powerfist.

Heheh! Why not!  Though Combi Weaponry isnt a half bad alternative either and in some cases might be prefered.

 

The thing is that the Berzerker Champion does a ton of leverage with his Power Fist also so usually the Strenght 10 melee attack department is covered well enough for my liking. To the point where some specific 'almost auto-hits' become the next relevant part.

 

It's still funny how the World Eater Berzerker Champion in many cases is more of a bad ass as the HQ we're working with

 

Only until you guys get your own Berzerker HQs.

 

Mwehhh hope is good but don't think that will happen anytime soon  

 

Frankly speaking though as a fan of EC and WE I do feel we're blessed allready. Knowing that Thousand Sons and Death Guard will have their fancy books and integrated designs and such I do like the massive flexability Codex Chaos Space Marines offers. To the point where I'm certain that TS and DG players will pick up this Codex also (even if its digitally) because the way different detachments can fill in completely different roles is actually very good. 

 

The best thing for all obviously remains that EC and WE can provide a relatively cheap and very potent backbone that will also grand you a bucket of CP AND has "elite troops" grabbing those objectives. No matter the preforance of Legion this is a really strong asset truely unique to us. 

 

I always feel that the ultimate units in 40K are the units who can "do it all" and WE Berzerkers and EC Noise Marines come very close to that. To the point where "stronger HQ" even becomes less relevant as this extremely good Troop choice.

Edited August 21, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Panzer]

Yeah I certainly can't complain about the EC rules now that Noise Marines are back to being Troops!

And I too doubt we'll see our own Codex anytime soon (and wouldn't be overly surprised if GW eventually decides against doing them as much as it would suck). But a man can dream....I need my HQ with Noise weaponry after all! :D

[Berzerker88]

I know some people are going to hate me for saying this, but the Exalted Champion is actually a very good option for the Axe of Blind Fury. Since he can re-roll to wound you start getting even closer to a power fist in damage, and all for merely 80 points.

 

EDIT: Did GW ever confirm a KDK codex? I know they're technically not World Eaters, but they did say every army would get a new dex right?

Edited August 21, 2017 by Berzerker88

[Panzer]

EDIT: Did GW ever confirm a KDK codex? I know they're technically not World Eaters, but they did say every army would get a new dex right?

GW only said that our armies would be playeable with the new rules. KDK are playeable thanks to the faction keyword system. Just without the Bloodtithe system but other armies lost lots of their depth with the Index as well.

I honestly doubt they'll do KDK the way it was before. They already said long time ago that releasing a KDK Codex was a mistake they don't want to repeat and was only a snap decision.

 

However what I can imagine they might be doing is bringing something similar to the Bloodtithe system for the Daemon Codex eventually. 110% speculation on that part tho

 

EDIT: god damn those typos when it's getting late lol

Edited August 21, 2017 by sfPanzer

[Commissar K.]

Haha! Hey if you want to play an Exalted Champion you should play an exalted champion, I'm the beardy guy who tries to sneak in Sorcerers every time I get the chance so play however you want it my man! 

I don't think Games Workshop will do another Khorne Daemonkin to be honest because in all fairness it was a cool choice but under the current rules you could easily re-create it once Codex Daemons of Chaos is out. Simply go for a Khorne CSM Detachment (however you like it) and Khorne Daemon Detachment. 

Ive been in and out 40K for years so I cant really say if current lore clasifies Khorne Daemonkin as a seperate army. The way I initally took up that lore was to have a sort of 40K Hordes of Chaos book (they did this also in AoS called Blades of Khorne) where mortals and daemons meet for the sake of it being model ranges that look awesome together. I cannot recall any lore on them before 7th and now they are not mentioned in 8th either. As a result I think the best way to represent KDK is to play Khorne, Daemons and Mortals alike. Cool as the Blood Tithe system is I do not think it will return for 40K. By large because of Stratagems.

Edited August 21, 2017 by Commissar K.

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

They could have "daemonkin" for all 4 gods just by having keyword <god> Strategems usable by both Heretic Astartes and Daemons with that god's keyword. I'd be pretty surprised if something like this didn't make an appearance at some point.

Edited August 21, 2017 by OPTIMVSCHRISTVS

[Prot]

Guys, thanks for the feedback on the Berzerkers and Obliterators ( I currently try to keep them in my Renegades but I'm going to break from tradition here).

 

Can anyone elaborate on the Spartan? I've tried running Khârn and Zerkers in a landraider and I can't make it to the frontlines of conscript blobs without usually taking too much Medusa/basilisk/ indirect fire and blowing up. What configuration should I consider. I have very few Forgeworld pieces and don't typically play them in my World Eaters.

 

Also further to Forgeworld I just received my Decimator. I haven't glued the arms on so this is a two fold question:

 

1 Should I use the Decimator with my WE or would it be better served in my Thousand Sons? ( considering unit cost and role)

 

2 Should I go with 2 Soulburner Petards? Or 1 Soulburner petard and a claw? ( I can't see magnetizing the elbows, it's so brittle and finicky)?

 

Thoughts?

[Bloody Legionnaire]

I know some people are going to hate me for saying this, but the Exalted Champion is actually a very good option for the Axe of Blind Fury. Since he can re-roll to wound you start getting even closer to a power fist in damage, and all for merely 80 points.

 

EDIT: Did GW ever confirm a KDK codex? I know they're technically not World Eaters, but they did say every army would get a new dex right?

 

Considering Khorne Daemonkin is no longer an Army listed on GWs site my guess is they are gone as a standalone Army/Codex like they were. As others have said a KDK style list with Daemons and CSM units is possible. 

[Sagentus]

Any thoughts on a squad of dual LC termis?

 

I already have the combi-melta group with heavy flamer support. Was tempted for something different.

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

Guys, thanks for the feedback on the Berzerkers and Obliterators ( I currently try to keep them in my Renegades but I'm going to break from tradition here).

 

Can anyone elaborate on the Spartan? I've tried running Khârn and Zerkers in a landraider and I can't make it to the frontlines of conscript blobs without usually taking too much Medusa/basilisk/ indirect fire and blowing up. What configuration should I consider. I have very few Forgeworld pieces and don't typically play them in my World Eaters.

 

Also further to Forgeworld I just received my Decimator. I haven't glued the arms on so this is a two fold question:

 

1 Should I use the Decimator with my WE or would it be better served in my Thousand Sons? ( considering unit cost and role)

 

2 Should I go with 2 Soulburner Petards? Or 1 Soulburner petard and a claw? ( I can't see magnetizing the elbows, it's so brittle and finicky)?

 

Thoughts?

The Spartan is a bit harder to kill than the Raider thanks to the extra wounds, but the ability to cram multiple squads into it and get them where they're needed is where he's really invaluable. At the very least, if he does die to shooting, his dismounts should be close enough to walk into charging range- so at the end of the day, he's done his job and gotten probably half your troops and HQs into combat (even more likely in your case if you're playing Renegade Berzerkers with that advance and charge). At least, that's been my experience so far.

 

As to making them work, I think it's a matter of tactics. In order for Spartans and Land Raiders to really work for us, we need to flood the board with other threats- you really aren't taking down a Spartan unless you really focus fire on him. If your opponent also has to think about also killing, say, several Rhinos that are also filled with Berzerkers and are far more likely to die, chances are those will eat quite a bit of the fire that would otherwise be going to the Spartan. Ditto of you have things like Contemptors sprinting towards their lines, or as you alude to, some Decimators.

 

One of the big things he brings to the table is the ability to reduce your number of drops and give you a much greater chance of going first, as I could see going second versus a shooty army really hamstringing it.

 

Consider also maybe popping smoke on your first turn, especially if you're fighting Guard- forcing all those Guard units to hit him on 5s will really, really make your opponent think twice about potentially wasting shots on him that will probably miss anyway and that he could very well could fail to wound with (or better yet, that you could save on a 4+ or 5+ thanks to your 2+ armor save).

 

It's all very situational, because his shooting is also very nasty, especially combined with our move and shoot heavy weaps with no penalty strategem and Khârn sprinting alongside him to keep him in the reroll bubble (obviously don't bother with this if you're planning on popping smoke)

 

As to your question re: Decimators, I do plan on picking up a couple myself and plan on running them with dual soulburners- the claw does seem like a tempting option for us, too, given the legion trait and also plays toward flooding the board with threats trying to get in close. Really, you'd end up with what is effectively a poor man's claw/burner Contemptor which I think could be quite nice.

[Brother Heinrich]

So did I miss an FAQ or is it still possible to take a Hellforged Landraider Proteus with 3 dual Lascannons?

[Bloody Legionnaire]

Guys, thanks for the feedback on the Berzerkers and Obliterators ( I currently try to keep them in my Renegades but I'm going to break from tradition here).

 

Can anyone elaborate on the Spartan? I've tried running Khârn and Zerkers in a landraider and I can't make it to the frontlines of conscript blobs without usually taking too much Medusa/basilisk/ indirect fire and blowing up. What configuration should I consider. I have very few Forgeworld pieces and don't typically play them in my World Eaters.

 

Also further to Forgeworld I just received my Decimator. I haven't glued the arms on so this is a two fold question:

 

1 Should I use the Decimator with my WE or would it be better served in my Thousand Sons? ( considering unit cost and role)

 

2 Should I go with 2 Soulburner Petards? Or 1 Soulburner petard and a claw? ( I can't see magnetizing the elbows, it's so brittle and finicky)?

 

Thoughts?

Disclaimer: I, myself, have not played a game of 8th yet so all of this is my opinion on how units work based on the video batreps I have seen and reading rules/dataslates. 

 

That said..  

 

Prot, I think you'll need to run something similar to KDK if utilizing the Spartan.. a bunch of fast units going full throttle towards the enemy. Give the opponent all the reason to not focus all of his shooting on only one of yours. I really feel like we have a lot more options now than we did with KDK and I'm very happy with that prospect and I feel it almost makes up for not having all of the special rules from bloodthithe. Being able to drop Terminators and Raptors exactly where you need them without fear of mishap or scatter is something I could have only dreamed about having for KDK last edition. Add in all of the shooting units we couldn't take advantage of at all and being able to assault out of Rhinos or have arriving as reinforcements is awesome. 

 

I really feel like the aura effects and buffs this edition is forcing us player to do something really frowned upon in previous editions and that is dedicating a lot of resources to one unit to get the most productivity out of them. In the past there was a very strict way of looking at units as efficient or inefficient. If a unit required too much support it was inefficient and not worth taking. In 8th edition on the other hand the auras and buffs are about capitalizing on these winning combinations. CSM armies that can use Sorcerers to cast warptime on a nasty close combat unit you really want to hit the enemy early is something I really wish WEs could take advantage of... on the other hand I am satisfied with the fact that it's so much easier for us to be in a position to charge than it used to be so I guess that makes up for it. 

 

It would get pretty expensive pretty quick but I'm thinking a couple of Bloodthirsters and a Spartan full of Berzerking baddies would definitely have a lot of impact (pun intended) and would be very scary for the opponent to face. 

[Khornestar]

As far as KDK, there's a blurb in the new CSM codex describing them on page 51. I think that's all they're ever gonna get in 8th edition. I'm happy enough switching over to World Eaters. Blood is blood. 

[Prot]

Oh I'm happy switching to World Eaters... it's where I started, but it just flat out didn't work n 7th and we had something special and interesting in 8ty with KDK.

 

Also this caused me to buy and pant multiple Daemon units I never would have bought if it wasn't for KDK... Bloodthirsters, Khorne Cannons, hounds, letters, crushers... most of that stuff really isn't working for me in 8th anyway. It kind of stinks, but the reality is slowly coming around and I'm looking at Sorcs, Oblits, amd other units I considered out of bounds because of my old school associations with 'World Eaters'.

[Commissar K.]

Can anyone elaborate on the Spartan? I've tried running Khârn and Zerkers in a landraider and I can't make it to the frontlines of conscript blobs without usually taking too much Medusa/basilisk/ indirect fire and blowing up. What configuration should I consider. I have very few Forgeworld pieces and don't typically play them in my World Eaters.

 

Also further to Forgeworld I just received my Decimator. I haven't glued the arms on so this is a two fold question:

 

1 Should I use the Decimator with my WE or would it be better served in my Thousand Sons? ( considering unit cost and role)

 

2 Should I go with 2 Soulburner Petards? Or 1 Soulburner petard and a claw? ( I can't see magnetizing the elbows, it's so brittle and finicky)?

 

Thoughts?

The Spartan has quite a few advantages over the Land Raider, the most important being:

- Can transport 20 regular Marines

- Has 4 more wounds

- Has fewer attacks but WS 5+

- Has the option to heal itself

- Has the option to fall back and still shoot or charge 

- Has the double whammy of quad Lascannon

In general I think it's a really good choice for us because of the simple transport + anti tank role. It's the ideal combination for us as a melee orientated army that needs it's key ranged support to ensure not all our Berzerkers instantly die to ranged fire.

 

The Decimator in my opinion adds less in World Eaters, it's a nice sidegrade from the Helbrute in my opinion. Two Soulburners are nice but overal speaking I don't think it will give you any particular competitive edge perse. Not that that's needed offcourse, get what you visually like.

 

At the same time I do believe a Helforged Deredeo does give significant World Eater support, largely due to it's weaponry options. Hellfire Veil for example is one of the few attrition support options we have acces to. 

 

In general I believe the World Eater ABC is melee orientated combat, transport and gun support, the latter ideally forces your opponent to close into you aswell. A lot of the melee orientated combat roles can be filled with our HQ and Troops, many Walkers or Tanks are neat but having a ton of Troop choices in my opinion gives us an edge in Objective orientated play anyway.

 

They could have "daemonkin" for all 4 gods just by having keyword <god> Strategems usable by both Heretic Astartes and Daemons with that god's keyword. I'd be pretty surprised if something like this didn't make an appearance at some point.

You mean <Mark of Chaos> Keyword orientated Stratagems? Because we allready have that. I also expect them to show up in the Codex Daemons of Codex I dont think GW will do full round of Daemonkin in another form as just Daemons and still allowing us to mix Daemons with Chaos Space Marines as an army in and of itself.

 

Any thoughts on a squad of dual LC termis?

 

I already have the combi-melta group with heavy flamer support. Was tempted for something different.

Go for it if you feel like Berzerkers don't do the trick for you ;) I personally think that one unit of Terminators for the Combi-Melta purposes is more than sufficient and usually one of such a unit is enough at the 2K level. LC Termies are fun but also kind of stuck in my opinion the moment they maul their initial target. It's because of this that I actually largely prefer Berzerkers over Termies aswell... Which is suprisingly fitting with World Eater narrative. 

 

So did I miss an FAQ or is it still possible to take a Hellforged Landraider Proteus with 3 dual Lascannons?

That's still possible as the latest errata hasn't touched on it at all.

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/resources/PDF/Downloads/40K_8th_ed_Update_Imperial_Armour_Index_Forces_of_Chaos_ver_1.0.pdf

 

Cheers,

[Sagentus]

Cheers Commissar ... I only ask cos i have about 7 or 8 spare termi's atm and havent got a clue what to do with them =/

[Commissar K.]

Cheers Commissar ... I only ask cos i have about 7 or 8 spare termi's atm and havent got a clue what to do with them =/

Consider converting them to Obliterators.

 

Those lads are twice the spicey for the same price!

 

 

Edited August 22, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Sagentus]

I have considered it, just didnt think they were bulky enough ... I'll toy around with some ideas aver the weekend for them :) 

[Hathis]

Just wish it was the Dark apostle who made the daemon summoning  or am i alone on that thought?

[Brother Aiwass]

DA or sorc would have been great and fluffy.

[Commissar K.]

To be completely honest I feel that the relation between CSM and Daemons at this moment is odd anyway. However I also see how difficult it would be to really have it be a smooth synergy, by large because Games Workshop also has them as an army on their own so the moment you don't even want to include such characters because CSM rock your hitting a wall in terms of design.

In all honesty I feel Word Bearers in particular got the shaft in terms of Daemonic summonning and the likes. They do have their strategem but the fact that their Legion Trait doesn't do anything in particular with it feels odd. I've mentioned it in another topic also but I feel Word Bearers Legion Trait should have the additional note that Daemon Troops count as Shadowy Allies in a Word Bearer Detachment...

Age of Sigmar does have the part where Sorcerers are only able to summon Daemons, which feels odd also. So I really can't say how I feel about all characters in CSM being able to do it. What I do think would have been a nice and great addition would be that a Dark Apostle would allow for a re-roll for the Daemonic Summonning.
Again though, Daemons and CSM arn't as perfect as peanut butter and jelly but I feel they can't be either if you want to have them playable as a full army in itself.

Chaos Daemons in my opinion need what Tyranids and Orks also have, the option to make Hordes practicly immume to Morale. I hope this will come for them in their Codex. Which in turn makes a whole detachment of a single mark much more interesting. The real question is if they can do this at all as Morale seems to be one of the build in "weaknesses" in CSM.

[Berzerker88]

Guys, thanks for the feedback on the Berzerkers and Obliterators ( I currently try to keep them in my Renegades but I'm going to break from tradition here).

 

Can anyone elaborate on the Spartan? I've tried running Khârn and Zerkers in a landraider and I can't make it to the frontlines of conscript blobs without usually taking too much Medusa/basilisk/ indirect fire and blowing up. What configuration should I consider. I have very few Forgeworld pieces and don't typically play them in my World Eaters.

 

Also further to Forgeworld I just received my Decimator. I haven't glued the arms on so this is a two fold question:

 

1 Should I use the Decimator with my WE or would it be better served in my Thousand Sons? ( considering unit cost and role)

 

2 Should I go with 2 Soulburner Petards? Or 1 Soulburner petard and a claw? ( I can't see magnetizing the elbows, it's so brittle and finicky)?

 

Thoughts?

If it's any consolation, GW already recognized that conscripts are broken, and did say they would be nerfed in due time. If your oponent spams enough of them there really isn't much you can do.

[Brother Aiwass]

Maybe a rule like «support squad» like some units have in the HH would fix them if it also stop them from having obsec.

[Berzerker88]

Some have been suggesting the Commissar not affecting them, price increases, not being able to take orders, etc.

 

I think their main problem is how easily spammable they can be, WAAC players using them as a 'bubble wrapping' for the rest of their army. Since everything the Guard can field is already incredibly cheap, they can easily protect entire brigade detachments (that's a lot of command points) with hordes and hordes of conscripts immune to morale.

 

I think Berzerkers can wipe or inutilize a squad of conscripts very very fast, but that ability is irrelevant when you have over 2000pts in firepower (because their stuff is just that cheap) that can now shoot and decimate your army for yet another turn. Against such a setup, IMO it's best to bring a lot of big AV guns and hope to take out enough of their firepower to at least mitigate the storm a little while your Berzerkers wipe out the Conscript 'bubble wrapping'. But not even that will be enough against their cheesiest lists.

[Commissar K.]

Yeah the bubblewrapping of AM is what it makes but also gives a really easy strategy of small pockets of infantry acting as bumps for Vechicles. Frankly speaking I think not thaking Orders would be fitting, so would a price increase. At the same time I feel it is actually good for AM to be in a stronger position, years have gone by where they simply wern't too relevant. What suprises me to date however is that AoE's where completely removed from the game while specifically these "game pieces" are fantastic and thematic awnsers against bubblewraps. Body count too dense? Blow a hole in it.

One of the reasons as to why Obliterators excite me so much right now and why Terminators are also very relevant have to do with the AM match up specifically, as this is a good way to get into melee with tanks and the likes. At the same time one of the things I feel might be a little too strong as a Core rule is the unlimited ammount of theoretical Overwatches. Restricting it to 1 Overwatch per unit would actually make melee that little more relevant. While we don't need it, the game might...

As a topic shift, I'd love to know what you guys are eyeballing as Warlords right now! 

I'm certainly going to experiment with the previously mentioned:
- World Eater Daemon Prince of Khorne with wings (170)
- Malefic Talon (0)
- Daemonic Axe (10)
* Talisman of Burning Blood (0)
* Exalted Champion

The technical damage this guy can dish out is something I really like. It's a bit more expensive as Khârn but a whole lot faster and it's damage potential is great also. More importantly though I'm looking forward to read how you guys will use your Warlord Traits. While I didn't see a lot of talk on it just yet I also still really like the idea of experimenting with a Terminator Lord for the Chainfist. In general though Eternal Vendetta is a bit too linear for me, Flames of Spite might be interesting with a World Eater Talonprince and Unholy Fortitude is great but only with additional survival abilities. So Exalted Champion it is for me now.

So far especially because of the discussion above I also havn't found a great reason to thake the Axe of Blind Fury just yet. It's indeed a cheaper Power Fist for me basically, which is nice but due to having Berzerker Troops point never really feel that tight. (I'm also still super happy with that) 

In any case, Im looking forward to some creative Warlord designs :P