[HH1.0] Emperor's Children Tactica

[Terminus]

Coils at 1500 has too high a troop tax, you have barely any points left for the good stuff. They are also a lot worse without the initiative and sweep bonuses they get from being EC. They are significantly diminished when copied by Alphas. Edited May 20, 2016 by Terminus

[Kizzdougs]

Coils at 1500 has too high a troop tax, you have barely any points left for the good stuff. They are also a lot worse without the initiative and sweep bonuses they get from being EC. They are significantly diminished when copied by Alphas.

True. He'd probably be much better off with a Command Squad or Veteran Tactical Squad and changing Coils for PotL (or no Rite of War).

[Resonance]

I do know that it's a pretty dumb list. I have other lists ready to go. But wanted to see what I could do with palatine blades as I love the models and the idea of it.

[Slips]

The best use for Palatine Blades would be to use them in an Actual Emperors Children Army since thats where all the Synergy Is.

 

For AL Purposes, you want a unit that can stand on its own hence Firedrakes and Suzerians being good choices since their Legiones Astartes Rule has pretty much no effect on how they operate.

[GorgeousGoat]

Honestly - I've found Palatine Blades really miss unless you make a big cost sink to get to actual cc (Spartan/Storm Eagle etc).

 

OR

 

You jump pack them and try to get to combat with what's left. 

 

Maru Skara for them is my view, as then they can be a scary jump pack unit outflanking that requires some attention. However, I am open to how players have used and had success with them, as they are some my favourite models but just too overpriced and glassy. 

[Terminus]

You can still use the models and call them stolen, it's all in the painting and presentation. For rules, you have lots of options.

 

 

 

5x Command Squad - 210 points

2x combat shields/power fists, 3x power weapons

 

2 base attacks each, WS5, can all challenge, 2+ save (powerfists have 6++ too), forces disorganized charges, consistent S8 AP2 attacks in subsequent combat rounds, fearless bubble

 

vs.

 

6x Palatines - 210 points

2x phoenix spears, 4x power swords, sonic shriekers, melta-bomb on sgt.

 

2 base attacks each, WS5, can all challenge, 3+ save with 2+ sgt, initiative AP2 during charge rounds but just power swords afterwards, counter attack, sonic shriekers

 

 

So one has more staying power and consistent damage output, while putting out a fearless bubble. The other has more volume of attacks on the charge with at initiative AP2.  I pray that FW's new legion book makes the command squad characters so they can take Legion equipment, because then Alphas will have a real terror of a unit of power fists and daggers in artificer armour.

[Slips]

Combat Shields arent Boarding Shields.

 

Only the latter forces disorganized charges. Both, however, give you a 6++ vs shooting and a 5++ in CC.

 

The Combat Shield, however, doesnt limit the user for having 2 CCW like the Boarding and Storm Shields would.

[Terminus]

Oh man, that's even better.  Thanks for that, I'll give up "defensive grenades" for an extra pip in invuln save in melee any day of the week.

 

So the above-mentioned command squad would be 225 points and basically be 5 tartaros terminators who aren't bulky and the guys without power fists get an extra attack. Plus the chosen warriors, WS5, and fearless. EC (just to keep this on topic), could definitely abuse this unit for some WS5* I5 power swords.

 

Assuming command squads get the okay, you could do obnoxious stuff like this.

 

Emperor's Children Command Squad - 240

5x combat shields, 3x phoenix spears, 2x power fists

 

All get AP2 attacks first round, 3 at initiative plus powerfists which are rare in EC lists from what I can see, all have 2+/5++ saves, which is equivalent to Phoenix Guard for less.

 

With Alpha Legion, I'd be tempted to give them all fists and daggers, but would probably do it only to three, and give the other two axes just for variety and cost savings (so the unit would only be 5 points more).

Edited May 20, 2016 by Terminus

[Resonance]

That would definitely be great all those power fists would be tasty.

 

One thing about the palatine blades is the coolness factor. As they super nice models!

[GriffonI92]

Ignorant to all the ins and outs of 30K but how do Daemon Allies from Codex Daemons work?

 

Doing 3rd Company Elite and was thinking off the top of my head if their was a way to add a psycher, using a Slaanesh Pyschic Power, to buff the effects of the Kakophoni. (Side note: I chose an army with some complicated words to spell....)

 

As I am typing this it came to mind maybe taking cultist...is their a cultist pyscher?

 

Anyone else thought about or tried anything like this out? 

[Slips]

Only Word Bearers Get Daemon Allies right now and you either need their RoW or Erebus.

[Terminus]

Or Zardu, their best HQ choice overall, he can take allied daemon detachments and cast malefic daemonology sans risk.

[Unknown Legionnaire]

 

As I am typing this it came to mind maybe taking cultist...is their a cultist pyscher?

 

 

There's rogue psykers in the Warp Cult / Militia list, yeah.

Since you need a Force Commander in a Cult list, you'd have to take the psykers as 2nd and / or 3rd HQ choices.

Which collides with using them as an allied detachment because allies get only 1 HQ slot.

 

So if you wanted to include psykers in this way, you'd have to run Warp Cult as your primary and EC as your allied detachment.

[Terminus]

If you run the EC as allies, you can't run the III company since it's for primary detachments only like all of the new Legion-specific Rites of War.

 

At that point you may as well run an Army of Dark Compliance or Sacrificial Offering.

[GriffonI92]

Sorry if this is the wrong place, mainly lore wise, but has anyone found out if Emperor's Children used Chaplains or not? Or was it limited. I know they had Charmosian from the novels but I don't really see them being of use to the Emperor's Children doctrine really. 

 

With this, what about Librarians? Again, am not finding a lot on Emperor's Children using them. 

[Marshal Loss]

Well as you identified, they definitely had Chaplains. It hasn't really been touched upon other than the inclusion of Charmosian, but maybe think of them as officers who enforce the purity and strict standards that the EC value. Perfection of the mind as well as of the body.

 

Prior to Isstvan they would have obeyed the edict of Nikea without question and had no Librarians in their ranks. Afterwards, with the Legion going full Slaanesh, anything goes. In Path of Heaven there is an Apothecary who is dabbling in sorcery and daemon summoning, even if they didn't have a formal Librarius in the midst of the craziness if you used one to represent a Sorcerer after they begun their rapid descent it would make perfect sense to me.

[Flint13]

Traditionally the 3rd legion didn't have psykers bc they saw it as an imperfect mutation. They didn't have a librarius conclave much like the Post Mortarion Deathguard.

 

But... That's more a discussion for outside a tactics thread ^_^

[GriffonI92]

 In Path of Heaven there is an Apothecary who is dabbling in sorcery and daemon summoning, even if they didn't have a formal Librarius in the midst of the craziness if you used one to represent a Sorcerer after they begun their rapid descent it would make perfect sense to me.

Didn't catch that Novel, Path of Heaven. Is it worth it for an EC fan?

[Terminus]

It's worth it for anyone, Christ Wraight has been knocking it out of the park.

[Marshal Loss]

What Terminus said - easily the best depiction of the EC in any Heresy novel, imo.

[Talyriel]

Hey everyone, after some time lurking I decided to make an account and officially get on the heresy train! So far for my Emperors Children I got the B@C box and just got Eidolon a few days ago. And was wondering if I could get some recommendations as to what to get, what I want to try and have is a force with some good firepower to soften the enemy, and then have units that can quickly get into assault and use our special rules to win the day.

[Flint13]

A couple of ways you could go for new aquisitions.

 

The B@C box gives you a solid bunch of tacticals or veterans which is plenty for a good base of firepower. 

 

In short, I'd look at either a squad of Phoenix Guard or some Palentine Blades and a transport for them next. They are excellent counter assault units and will get work done for you. They're both especially nasty after the last red book update. 

[Caustic63]

Hey everyone, after some time lurking I decided to make an account and officially get on the heresy train! So far for my Emperors Children I got the B@C box and just got Eidolon a few days ago. And was wondering if I could get some recommendations as to what to get, what I want to try and have is a force with some good firepower to soften the enemy, and then have units that can quickly get into assault and use our special rules to win the day.

 

You seem to have a very good grip of Emperor's Children strategy already. If you don't have Book 6 I'd strongly recommend you pick it up because 3rd Company Elite is a pretty strong Rite of War for the legion, as are the other choices it unlocks such as the new Consuls and units. If you are looking to get the best use out of your new B@C kit, you can create Kakophoni Troops by simply buying a few Noise Marine Weapons kits from GW and using them on your Legion marines. Back this up with a unit of Palatine Blades in a Dreadclaw (along with a Chaplain or Eidolon) as your close combat powerhouse and you have a solid looking list. It should look something like this:

 

Eidolon - HQ - 3rd Company Elite

Palatine Blades (x9) + Phoenix Spears (x3) + MBs + Sonic Shriekers [in Dreadclaw]

Kakophoni (x10) + Rhino - Troops

Kakophoni (x10) + Rhino - Troops

Dreadclaw - FA

+ Some anti-tank like Quad Rapiers & Laser Vindicators in Elites & Heavy Support

[Talyriel]

A couple of ways you could go for new aquisitions.

 

The B@C box gives you a solid bunch of tacticals or veterans which is plenty for a good base of firepower. 

 

In short, I'd look at either a squad of Phoenix Guard or some Palentine Blades and a transport for them next. They are excellent counter assault units and will get work done for you. They're both especially nasty after the last red book update. 

 

 

 

Hey everyone, after some time lurking I decided to make an account and officially get on the heresy train! So far for my Emperors Children I got the B@C box and just got Eidolon a few days ago. And was wondering if I could get some recommendations as to what to get, what I want to try and have is a force with some good firepower to soften the enemy, and then have units that can quickly get into assault and use our special rules to win the day.

 

You seem to have a very good grip of Emperor's Children strategy already. If you don't have Book 6 I'd strongly recommend you pick it up because 3rd Company Elite is a pretty strong Rite of War for the legion, as are the other choices it unlocks such as the new Consuls and units. If you are looking to get the best use out of your new B@C kit, you can create Kakophoni Troops by simply buying a few Noise Marine Weapons kits from GW and using them on your Legion marines. Back this up with a unit of Palatine Blades in a Dreadclaw (along with a Chaplain or Eidolon) as your close combat powerhouse and you have a solid looking list. It should look something like this:

 

Eidolon - HQ - 3rd Company Elite

Palatine Blades (x9) + Phoenix Spears (x3) + MBs + Sonic Shriekers [in Dreadclaw]

Kakophoni (x10) + Rhino - Troops

Kakophoni (x10) + Rhino - Troops

Dreadclaw - FA

+ Some anti-tank like Quad Rapiers & Laser Vindicators in Elites & Heavy Support

 

Ok thanks for the tips, I was wanting to some Palatine Blades for awhile now, now I just have more reasons to pick them up. And thanks Caustic for saying to use the noise marine upgrade pack, more money saved on my part  .

[heptus]

I'm so happy to see 3rd Company RoW as a long-time kakophoni gatherer (though I still have no idea of Gets Hot! on sonic weaponry).

 

I've read all comments in this thread for days. Most of fellow EC players here seem to use either palatines or phoenix guards. But again, as a kakophoni gatherer, I'd like to make my 3rd Company as a mechanized infantry army including at least 30 kakophonie embarking in rhinos in addition to some EC-style fast units like bikes and land speeder variants.

 

A question is, which unit do you recommend for EC heavy slots? I bought a venator from my friend who, sadly, retreats from this hobby. Is this enough or do I need to buy more? Tanks? Dreadnoughts? Flyers?

Edited June 1, 2016 by heptus