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Starting out: Rangers or Vanguard?


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Well in my case I am close combat oriented towards the end. With that said, my first 2 turns are my main shooting turns. 

In the first turn I used the +3 BS doctrina. The -2 to WS for me is important to get rid of asap. 

Turn 2, the +2 BS doctrina for the same reason above. 

 

Now, in turn 3 assaults will start playing a small part for me. Here I'll either use the +1 WS or +1 BS doctrina. In this way I do not give any negative effects to the other units. 

Turn 4 as turn 3. What ever I didn't use I'll use this turn instead. The difference here might be that I am in close combat more than expected. The of course I'll switch to +3 WS if needed. 

 

For me, charging in with the Skitarii has proven to pay off. The Vanguards ability to lower the toughness with 1 is really good. It levels the playing field against marines. Add that before the Vanguards charge in, they shoot with their assault 3 rad weapons. 

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Yah tell me about it. a full 10 man squad lays out so many wounds its ridiculous. 

If I decide to expand my skitarii force beyond 2500 pts, I'll probably start buying in more Skitarii Vanguards and Rangers. No upgrades on them. Keep them cheap and single purpose. 

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Yah tell me about it. a full 10 man squad lays out so many wounds its ridiculous. 

If I decide to expand my skitarii force beyond 2500 pts, I'll probably start buying in more Skitarii Vanguards and Rangers. No upgrades on them. Keep them cheap and single purpose. 

I'm tempted to just get a load of the fw ones.

 

 

 

 

 http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/DefaultFW/large/thralls-laslocks-10.jpg

 

or

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/DefaultFW/large/thralls-mitralocks-10.jpg

 

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you know.... I do kinda like the Thralls more as a "classic" design of the basic line trooper skitarii. come to think of it we havn't had just the foot soldier version, just one that is the stalker/ special forces (rangers) and the other that is the "nuke Everything" kind of trooper. I hope in the big book they have the guardsmen version for our basic troops.

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I don't know if they will do a basic line trooper. The Skitarii I read about in Titanicus had arm mounted guns and definitely resembled those thralls more tho. I was kind of let down when I found the Vanguard and Rangers looked a little to fancy with their tech priest robes, so I also hope there's a more basic trooper with arm mounted guns.

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I don't know if they will do a basic line trooper. The Skitarii I read about in Titanicus had arm mounted guns and definitely resembled those thralls more tho. I was kind of let down when I found the Vanguard and Rangers looked a little to fancy with their tech priest robes, so I also hope there's a more basic trooper with arm mounted guns.

I thought the same. However, I kind of interpreted Codex: Skitarii to be like a sort of AdMech advanced recon force or shock troops - that is what vanguard typically refers to - and so the elites the work ahead of the main force (therefore Rangers and Vanguard with fast support vehicles).

 

If there is a full codex it therefore seems likely that there will be a 'lesser' troops unit with Rangers and Vanguard either sharing that space or moving to elites (like MT/AM Scions).

 

Just my thoughts but made me feel better about it so hopefully it will do the same for you :)

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Well Militarum Tempestus came out first, then Astra Militarum. 

Harlequins too... came out before the Eldar Codex.

 

So we could expect to see a Adeptus Mechanicus codex in the future. Around here the Skitarii have been a pretty good success. People buy them just to paint them. Other have them as allies of some kind, and some like me go all bananas and go for them as the main force. 

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Well Militarum Tempestus came out first, then Astra Militarum.

Harlequins too... came out before the Eldar Codex.

So we could expect to see a Adeptus Mechanicus codex in the future. Around here the Skitarii have been a pretty good success. People buy them just to paint them. Other have them as allies of some kind, and some like me go all bananas and go for them as the main force.

... your not the only one there msn-wink.gif i believe rashbold is going full skitarii too...actually i bet there's a large amount of full Skitarii armies here now that it's been out a few weeks.

and Vash i like how you doctrina choice flows...very logical !

Mithril

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Well Militarum Tempestus came out first, then Astra Militarum.

Harlequins too... came out before the Eldar Codex.

So we could expect to see a Adeptus Mechanicus codex in the future. Around here the Skitarii have been a pretty good success. People buy them just to paint them. Other have them as allies of some kind, and some like me go all bananas and go for them as the main force.

... your not the only one there msn-wink.gif i believe rashbold is going full skitarii too...actually i bet there's a large amount of full Skitarii armies here now that it's been out a few weeks.

and Vash i like how you doctrina choice flows...very logical !

Mithril

He he :D

Well good thing I am not alone.

But I do fear the day the full codex arrives... There might actually be transports in there!

Thats one thing I had to combine with Blood Angles, Flesh Tearers Strike force detachment.

The Doctrina flow is not set in stone, but is a general idea I have of how it could play out. It worked in the game I played so far.

I have now bought most of the units I need. What I am missing is one more Drop pod, one Ironstrider, 15 skitarii and one Magus Dominus (will represent the Flesh tearer librarian on bike).

The GW products I can't buy at the moment as the two local stores are all out (partially because of me...). We actually only have one local store, but that store has one more in a city next to mine. Of course I traveled there to sack their shelves.

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Man, I'm really struggling to figure out how to compose my army. I keep vacillating between footslogging Rangers and mechanised Vanguard as the core of my infantry; the Rangers' basic weapon has more kick and better range, but they don't synergise really well with any of the special weapons and they're exceptionally squishy, while the Vanguard can put out a ridiculous volume of fire with their standard gun at ranges that work well with the two better specials, plus their debuff aura and increased survivability from rent-a-Rhinos, but to really take advantage of them I feel obliged to build the rest of the army around the Assault phase and I generally prefer shooty builds.

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Man, I'm really struggling to figure out how to compose my army. I keep vacillating between footslogging Rangers and mechanised Vanguard as the core of my infantry; the Rangers' basic weapon has more kick and better range, but they don't synergise really well with any of the special weapons and they're exceptionally squishy, while the Vanguard can put out a ridiculous volume of fire with their standard gun at ranges that work well with the two better specials, plus their debuff aura and increased survivability from rent-a-Rhinos, but to really take advantage of them I feel obliged to build the rest of the army around the Assault phase and I generally prefer shooty builds.

A combination of both sounds like your game. 

They have different roles to play. I my self use them both. 

The rangers do well in the back and moving around my own lines to grab objectives.

 

Rangers in Drop pods (in the future at least) to get up close and personal with their high volume fire weapons. Rushing into combat, lead by an inquisitor (equipped with rad grenades) in the later stages. 

 

Considering the Doctrinas we have, close combat is something we should consider, since we do get a nice buff to our WS with it. 

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Rangers Vanguard in Drop pods (in the future at least) to get up close and personal with their high volume fire weapons. Rushing into combat, lead by an inquisitor (equipped with rad grenades) in the later stages. 

 

Considering the Doctrinas we have, close combat is something we should consider, since we do get a nice buff to our WS with it. 

 

Fixed for you...

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They both have their uses. 

I don't think a pure Skitarii force should chose between them, but instead use them both. 

On the other hand, when taking them as a combined detachment with another army, one can start to think of the Skitarii's role. Shooting support, or mid range support with clean up in close combat (support here too, for dedicated close combat units with their debuff ability). 

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Right, but if he's looking to "rush into combat, lead by an inquisitor (equipped with rad grenades) in the later stages" then the Vanguard are the best option.  Plus, I'm pretty sure that the Inquisitor's Rad Grenades can stack with the Vanguard's ability from a rules-as-written standpoint.  Charging in with -2 T on your enemy is rather nasty.

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Right, but if he's looking to "rush into combat, lead by an inquisitor (equipped with rad grenades) in the later stages" then the Vanguard are the best option.  Plus, I'm pretty sure that the Inquisitor's Rad Grenades can stack with the Vanguard's ability from a rules-as-written standpoint.  Charging in with -2 T on your enemy is rather nasty.

Sounds like something I wrote :D

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No worries!  I'm not sure about Rad Grenades and Rad Poisoning stacking, otherwise it wouldn't be as good of an effect.  The two of them together would drop Space Marine characters to T2, allowing for some hilarious Instant Death opportunities.

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Well Militarum Tempestus came out first, then Astra Militarum.

Harlequins too... came out before the Eldar Codex.

So we could expect to see a Adeptus Mechanicus codex in the future. Around here the Skitarii have been a pretty good success. People buy them just to paint them. Other have them as allies of some kind, and some like me go all bananas and go for them as the main force.

... your not the only one there msn-wink.gif i believe rashbold is going full skitarii too...actually i bet there's a large amount of full Skitarii armies here now that it's been out a few weeks.

and Vash i like how you doctrina choice flows...very logical !

Mithril

I am also liquidating my original combined imperial collection to collect a themed mechanicus/space marine etc army, with mechanicus being the core. My original collection was using imperial guard units as skitarii or forge world conscripted units.

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