[HH1.0] 30k Ultramarines tactics

[Sete]

The only thing IF has is Sigismund. Despite the good rules tho. xD

[Hesh Kadesh]

And Deep Striking Terminators. I think too many people write them off because they want to load up on Sweeping Storm Shields. But A Deep Striking Combi Plasma Squad is 225pts of pain.

[Ishagu]

To be fair, if you don't like the exclusive units the IF are probably better... :-/

[Frater Cornelius]

With me returning to the hobby and currently building B@C Marines I am also eyeing UM. Especially Primarch's Chosen with Big G and plenty of Dakka. However, what I am missing with UM is a bit of aggressive play. Having and mid to long ranged army with impressive dakka may be effective, but it does not feel very Space Marine-y to me. Fists offer a bit of fine action with deep striking TDA and even that Hammerfell RoW. You can really crank a good Power/Heavy Metal tune while loads of IF units teleport on to punch the enemy. "Like thunder from the sky, sworn to fight and die!" and so forth.

 

So yeah, while I prefer almost everything about UM, I am missing such awesome breakneck visuals like mass deep striking supported by heavy tanks, preferably without the Orbital Assault RoW.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Scoring Troops Suzerains in Dreadclaws, backed with Locutarus for a 2+ Save Army.

Back up with Implacable Advance Rapiers to gib transports, and trigger rerolls for your Quad Mortars and Plasma Loc's.

[Frater Cornelius]

Uh, now that sounds pretty awesome. Hm, it appears that Big G is extremely pivotal for UM at 2k and beyond, eh?

[Charlo]

Not Pivotal, he just provides so much for the points and keeps them running at full efficiency!

[Frater Cornelius]

Well, good thing Primarch's Chosen has been introduced :D

[Hesh Kadesh]

He's very helpful for force manipulation.

 

In this instance, you get 2-4 helpfully placed static units which score, your elite killy CC units which now stop your troops being a tax, Dreadclaws (either as Terminator Troops DT's, or FA), Deep Striking Locutarus which can help get the charge rerolls for other units, and heavy support as points remains, like Medusa or Predators (I have a thing for Heavy Conversion Beamers at the mo), or Leviathans.

[Frater Cornelius]

He's very helpful for force manipulation.

 

In this instance, you get 2-4 helpfully placed static units which score, your elite killy CC units which now stop your troops being a tax, Dreadclaws (either as Terminator Troops DT's, or FA), Deep Striking Locutarus which can help get the charge rerolls for other units, and heavy support as points remains, like Medusa or Predators (I have a thing for Heavy Conversion Beamers at the mo), or Leviathans.

 

What compulsory HQ would you recommend to unlock Big G? You know, in order to make use of Termiantors and Suzies are your compulsory troops. Or can they be taken as compulsory troops in Primarch's Chosen as well?

[Hesh Kadesh]

Primarch's Chosen, so none necessary.

 

If i had to, Forge Lord for an Augury Scanner for Interceptor and no infiltrate and to let Thallax be taken as HS for their no infiltrate too

Edited February 22, 2016 by Hesh Kadesh

[Frater Cornelius]

Primarch's Chosen, so none necessary.

 

If i had to, Forge Lord for an Augury Scanner for Interceptor and no infiltrate and to let Thallax be taken as HS for their no infiltrate too

 

Ah, I thought just the regular Vets were actual compulsory troops and the rest were non-compulsory in Primarch's Chosen. Good to know.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Immersturm

[Charlo]

Forge Lords are just overall beasts anyway. Rad nades, boarding shield, cyber familiar etc.

 

If you don't mind not sweeping with his unit you can give him a 3++ with Cataphracti and a familiar then challenge people with servo arm and thunder hammer attacks, almost guaranteeing instant death with rad nades. Keeps Guilliman out of drawn out challenges and into smashing up units.

[Hesh Kadesh]

 

 

Primarch's Chosen, so none necessary.

 

If i had to, Forge Lord for an Augury Scanner for Interceptor and no infiltrate and to let Thallax be taken as HS for their no infiltrate too

Ah, I thought just the regular Vets were actual compulsory troops and the rest were non-compulsory in Primarch's Chosen. Good to know.

I'll have to double check, i'm AFB, so cannot clarify.

[Caillum]

"Primarch's Chosen" does nothing for Ultramarines really. It locks you into Veterans and Terminators as your compulsory Troops, when Guilliman can naturally bring Suzerains, Terminators or any of the 3 normal Troops choices. It also has "Price of Failure Plus" and restricts your army selection.

 

No Rite of War would be better with Guilliman, or going for something different like Vigil Opertii Mission (for interesting Militia allies) or Armoured Breakthrough (for Fast 3 HP Tanks).

 

It's great for other Legions! For Ultramarines, all it does is allows Guilliman under 2k.

[Frater Cornelius]

Well, if that is the case, then Primarch's Chosen is actually more of a hinderance, unless you are talking fluff. The additional points you pay for Vets over Tacs (or in addition to the Suzies) are more than for the one compulsory HQ to unlock Guilliman at 2k. Playing him below 2k isn't really worth it, as he and his boys eat points way too fast at that point.

[caladancid]

Well, if that is the case, then Primarch's Chosen is actually more of a hinderance, unless you are talking fluff. The additional points you pay for Vets over Tacs (or in addition to the Suzies) are more than for the one compulsory HQ to unlock Guilliman at 2k. Playing him below 2k isn't really worth it, as he and his boys eat points way too fast at that point.

 

I think this is correct. Also most of the lists I have been making for Guilliman have been coming in at 2.5k for the minimum fun stuff.

 

In terms of your earlier question about HQ, I have been using a jump pack chaplain with the Locutarus.

[Hesh Kadesh]

"Primarch's Chosen" does nothing for Ultramarines really. It locks you into Veterans and Terminators as your compulsory Troops, when Guilliman can naturally bring Suzerains, Terminators or any of the 3 normal Troops choices. It also has "Price of Failure Plus" and restricts your army selection.

 

No Rite of War would be better with Guilliman, or going for something different like Vigil Opertii Mission (for interesting Militia allies) or Armoured Breakthrough (for Fast 3 HP Tanks).

 

It's great for other Legions! For Ultramarines, all it does is allows Guilliman under 2k.

Doesn't cost 130pts in tac.

[Ishagu]

I actually think a basic Chaplain consul, no upgrades, is great as an add-on to Guilliman's unit.

 

Face it, the guy can smash a vehicle or character in cc with ease, but his one weakness is lack of attacks. Having someone to provide the Zealot rule is the best way to maximise the quality attacks G man has.

 

He already has Shred on his blade, and with re-roll to hit he becomes even deadlier. The Chaplain is only 85 points too :-)

 

I would also argue, that as the Suzerains do automatic wounds on rolls to hit of 6+, regardless of Toughness, that a re roll on their misses might land you a few more wounds against the enemy.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Ishagu

[Frater Cornelius]

Chaplain seems like a good way to go. I will magnetize him to be able to put a JP on him to go with the Locutarii when Big G and the Invictarii feel like they need to do some bureaucracy for a change :D

 

Speaking of Invictarii. What is a solid number for these guys? Leave it at 5? Or more? With Big G it will be 5 due to cost and space in the transport, but what about without the G man? I am just wondering how many to build beyond the standard 5. They aren't exactly cheap :/

[shandwen]

I personally am a fan of the idea of eight or so (with a banner from being used as a command squad). I wish I had that many of them but the five I have will have to do.

[Charlo]

40k honour guard models will work and add some variety for a cheaper option :)

[shandwen]

40k honour guard models will work and add some variety for a cheaper option :)

That is rather brilliant. I had thought to grab the banner guy before, but grabing all of them (and digging up a couple boarding shields) will work to add to my squad.

[caladancid]

Chaplain seems like a good way to go. I will magnetize him to be able to put a JP on him to go with the Locutarii when Big G and the Invictarii feel like they need to do some bureaucracy for a change

 

Speaking of Invictarii. What is a solid number for these guys? Leave it at 5? Or more? With Big G it will be 5 due to cost and space in the transport, but what about without the G man? I am just wondering how many to build beyond the standard 5. They aren't exactly cheap :/

 

In terms of maximizing units while not spending way too much (is there such a thing?), I use units of 8 and 7. Guilliman goes with the 8 usually, but I have been thinking about switching that around and having him in the unit of 7. Both units are in LRs.

[Frater Cornelius]

Another thing. Is it worth it to build around the LA rule of UM? It seems rather inconsequential and demand infantry-heavy builds. I prefer to mix my infantry with a few Tanks and Dreads, making it harder to use the rule. Then there is the question of cost-effective infantry to use that rule to begin with. The UM RoW also seem universally useless for me.

 

It seems like other alternatives are almost superior. IF give you a more consistent bonus, more wargear, teleporting TDA and Polux, quite a sooid character. Ravenguard give you an alternative play style with very solid RoW.

 

Having said that, UM sport some of the best special unit on this side of Terra. I absolutely love Invictarii, Locutarii and to some extend even the Fulmentarii and their special Dread. Big G is an awesome fella as well.

 

So, when ignoring my bias towards UM, is it worth playing UM outside of their special units compared to IF and RG?