Dark Angels rumors. update: Codex leaks, pg 28

[Corswain]

This all looks pretty good. I realy wanted to see DW Knights become the fabled 2 wound terminators though. Its fluffy enough, these are future company masters in TDA, they should be able to take a hit. Oh well, i shall still love them and build many more than i could possibly need.

[Olataro]

The rules look solid, but it seems the art direction continues down the garbage chute.

I dunno about you, but I like the new art. Everything has its pros and cons. If we are talking about the same art, I would say it help ppl form ideas on how to paint their units and how would the unit normally look.

[Tygwyn]

Half the number of their Strike Cruisers no-less. That ratio should be more in the ballpark of 1:4, not 1:2 lol. I seriously wonder what the hell they're doing with those ships, considering a single battle barge can house around three companies of marines.

All those extra ships are carrying the extra Deathwing / Ravenwing that we don't admit exist.

Then that's a lot of auxiliary forces, considering that fleet could support a force of forty companies of Astartes.

I'm extremely curious as to what they need that many Battle Barges for (or even strike cruisers!), and how they manage to deploy them.

It has NOTHING to do with anything like being a Legion. Anyone who says otherwise is a Heretic.

Move along folks, nothing to see here...

[Tygwyn]

Unless I've missed something, Vengeful Strike is gone which is a bit of a downer.

I like you am worried that I have missed it - has it been rolled into the "Deathwing" SR?

[JeffJedi]

I will miss my beloved RAD grenades, but Vortex will make up for it. Sableclaw a chariot?? Gideon will ride again!

 

The Dark Angels are back with a Vengeance!

[Wraith776]

Unless I've missed something, Vengeful Strike is gone which is a bit of a downer.

I like you am worried that I have missed it - has it been rolled into the "Deathwing" SR?

I can't seem to find it anywhere either. It's not rolled into the deathwing rule, which is fearless and hatred:CSM, plus Belial doesn't have it. Really hope it's not gone, I really like that rule

[Master Avoghai]

Do you guys think there's any chance the RW and DW detachments would be able to be run without Sammael and Belial respectively? With all of the cool RW/DW rules being folded into the formations instead of the units, it seems that the detachments will be the only way to get anything meaningful out of RW/DW. But if those detachments come with a ~400 point tax for two very underwhelming special characters, then we're in a lot of trouble.

Actually, we already know we can, just by using the DW formation on the gladius formation. Don't forget those may be taken separatly. Of course you won't get the bonus of ovewatch, but all the inbuilt bonus of the formations

 

Play it with any TDA character

Include 2-5 termi squads with transports

Play 1 CS and/or 1 Knight squad if you want and you'll get a nice force

 

You can even put an additional character by using the inner circle formation.

 

 

@ Shabadoo : don't forget we also get a formation bonus that allow us to jink at first turn and not suffering from the effects of snap shots if we do so, hence the sacrifice is not THAT strong...

[Frater Cornelius]

Do not forget that against some weaponry you will jink regardless.. Actually, against most weaponry that would fire on a RWBK unit. Having 2+ rerollable when in Dark Shroud range is very solid and Snapshots are mitigated by their decent melee ability and twin linked. Dark Shroud with 3 HP and also re-rolling jink?

 

You know, I think that bonus is tied to some Formation, because this sounds too good to be true.

[Saphrael]

That's my point Immerstrum, that all the fancy stuff is tied to unwieldy RW or DW formations and so it'll be tough to field them together.

 

@Avoghai, I know we can field the units together in some fashion (hell, even CAD allows that), my point is that the native DW bonuses aren't that great (Fearless and Hatred: CSM) and while we haven't confirmed the native RW bonuses, I suspect they don't include Scout (else why would Sammael need it mentioned seperately?).

 

Also don't forget that jinking removes the Focused Fire part of Grim Resolve, dimishing its--already subpar--utility, not to mention the utility of Ravenshield.

[Chaplain Lucifer]

My suggestions would be waiting for the Codex before actually starting to fear the worse.

The DW formation doesn't look so unwieldy. Belial and 2 DW squads should clock at 700 points. Even playing at 1500 still gives points for a RW formation or a RW detachment plus extra DW stuff.

I would say first we get the Codex and then worry. It's not like DW was brilliant in the still current codex so I'm sure that with points drop and a few gadgets, they won't be worse even if they lose something.

[Saphrael]

Totally agree Lucy, and I stated earlier that I'd hold off on the worst of my naysaying... this is me being restrained ;)

 

That said, there's some new info at BoK:

 

http://bloodofkitten...ak-compilation/

 

As I just said in the N&R thread (so sorry for the double post) most notable for me is that my pessimism was well founded: only RW native benefit is rerolling jink saves, which means it's likely that most RW units have lost Scout (else why wouldn't it just be included with the RW rule). Kinda funny that we finally got Attack Bike Squadrons, only to lose outflanking for them.

[Chaplain Lucifer]

But is scout so essential? I mean, we lost suicide squads coming in from the opponents boards edge... but what we gain (and we are still waiting to see the full spectrum of gains) isn't much better than relying on an unreliable technique?

I remember my old RW did well even without scout, I'm not too worried. Check the Raven Guard section. They lost Scout too, got something else, and I would say tehy are adapting fine.

[JeffJedi]

Anyone know the stats for the Antenna Cannon in the Land Speeder Vengeance art?

[Master Avoghai]

The DW formation doesn't look so unwieldy. Belial and 2 DW squads should clock at 700 points.

Moreover, it is even more flexible cos you can have any TDA HQ and not only Belial.

[Interrogator Stobz]

Anyone know the stats for the Antenna Cannon in the Land Speeder Vengeance art?

 

:unsure::blink::ph34r:

Range 36" S1 AP- Heavy 12, VORTEX OF SOLITUDE, Rending

 

VORTEX OF SOLITUDE: Every model hit by a shot from this weapon suffers side splitting seizures and the incapacitating lolz of rolling on the floor laughing. They count as Monstrous Creatures until the beginning of their next turn.

[Frater Cornelius]

 

Anyone know the stats for the Antenna Cannon in the Land Speeder Vengeance art?

 

:unsure::blink::ph34r:

Range 36" S1 AP- Heavy 12, VORTEX OF SOLITUDE, Rending

 

VORTEX OF SOLITUDE: Every model hit by a shot from this weapon suffers side splitting seizures and the incapacitating lolz of rolling on the floor laughing. They count as Monstrous Creatures until the beginning of their next turn.

Not gargantuan? I am disappointed.

[Saphrael]

 

The DW formation doesn't look so unwieldy. Belial and 2 DW squads should clock at 700 points.

Moreover, it is even more flexible cos you can have any TDA HQ and not only Belial.

Sure, but that's one little formation and we don't know which of the DW special rules apply to it. I suspect the good ones (e.g. run and shoot or shoot and run after DS) are tied up to the DW detachment, not the DWRF.

[shabbadoo]

@ Shabadoo : don't forget we also get a formation bonus that allow us to jink at first turn and not suffering from the effects of snap shots if we do so, hence the sacrifice is not THAT strong...

Turn 1 is not quite when you don't want to shoot the enemy- especially if you go second. The Formation benefit lessens the blow a bit, but it is still a trade-off, and remains an issue for what is a smaller elite force. Still, I am cautiously optimistic.

[Chaplain Lucifer]

@Saphreal :So basically  you're telling me you are "Jon Snow"ing it and yet you prefer to be pessimist despite the avalanche of confirmed good stuff? To each it's own.

Cheers!

[Tygwyn]

I will miss my beloved RAD grenades, but Vortex will make up for it. Sableclaw a chariot?? Gideon will ride again!

 

The Dark Angels are back with a Vengeance!

What has (exactly) happened to Rad? I've missed that too...

[Master Avoghai]

They passed from -1 T to 2W on a 6 to wound...

[beastrouille]

which means it's likely that most RW units have lost Scout (else why wouldn't it just be included with the RW rule)

As far as I remember, Support squadrons never had scout... This is reason enough not to include Scout to the RW special rule.

You cannot tell yet if it's been removed anyway.

 

Edit for below:

You make a point here, didn't think of it that way. But still we'll have to wait for the book or for leaks to make sure. BTW Sammael has scout, so who knows ?

[Chaplain Lucifer]

And let's face it, with rules like Ravenshield , that lets every RW unit (vehicles included) within 24" fire on overwatch against a RW unit that is being assaulted, you could pull very nasty tricks if you had scout.  Basically you would just push everything forward with scout and you would either be shot, re-rolling the jink, or be assaulted , firing like crazy.. with standard of devastation it would be almost insane.  Then Hit n Run.. rinse and repeat. Not saying OTT or Eldar, but close. So we can lose scout because we will have other mechanisms. Cheers!

[3DJutsu]

Bah, I kept searching through the iBook preview and Couldn't find special issue ammo. Not a deal breaker for me since all these other rules im seeing got my hype levels set to heights unknown, but still sad that the first legion's company veterans still do not have access to kraken, hellfire, or vengeance rounds. Ah well, can't win 'em all.

 

But dat Darktalon though... So glad I bought one

[MoonPhoenix]

 

with standard of devastation it would be almost insane

 

we don't have standart of devastation any more.