Dark Angels rumors. update: Codex leaks, pg 28

[Interrogator Stobz]

If you still want to field lots of termies, go unbound C:SM.

That's 9 squads for 1800 points, you just can't put shields in shooty squads (not much loss considering you have 45 termies on the table), the DW core rules are worth replacing with C:SM ones any day.

 

But RW and GW together will be excellent in this Dex.

[twopounder]

If you still want to field lots of termies, go unbound C:SM.

That's 9 squads for 1800 points, you just can't put shields in shooty squads (not much loss considering you have 45 termies on the table), the DW core rules are worth replacing with C:SM ones any day.

 

But RW and GW together will be excellent in this Dex.

 

If I wanted to play smurfs, I would play smurfs. I don't want to play smurfs. Ergo I'm Dark Angel. I'll probably use them as force multipliers for the fun of it. But as far as a serious list, can't see a use for them. Still overpriced for what they do, can't be taken as a standalone army, and Ravenwing just looks so much more fun.

[Olataro]

It's quite funny, some things clearly need an errata and yet various units are greatly improved. Sammael is a phenomenal HQ, especially now that his sword is ap2. Ravenwing are generally superb now, regular PA lists can be very strong too.

His sword has always been ap2........

[twopounder]

Another (I assume) typo is that the Ravenwing Support Squadron (all vehicles) gets Grim Resolve.

 

Stubborn is useless so the unit is able to overwatch like infantry? Or can all vehicles overwatch in 7th and I never noticed?

It's quite funny, some things clearly need an errata and yet various units are greatly improved. Sammael is a phenomenal HQ, especially now that his sword is ap2. Ravenwing are generally superb now, regular PA lists can be very strong too.

 

His sword has been AP2 since 6th edition and ignored all armor saves in 3rd edition.

[marti350]

Another (I assume) typo is that the Ravenwing Support Squadron (all vehicles) gets Grim Resolve.

Stubborn is useless so the unit is able to overwatch like infantry? Or can all vehicles overwatch in 7th and I never noticed?

Check the Ravenshield special rule right beneath those, it says those landspeeders get to overwatch for other ravenwing units getting charged within 24"

[SvenONE]

Lot to digest! thanks for the post! Will be back later after consuming vast amounts of images!

[3DJutsu]

Another (I assume) typo is that the Ravenwing Support Squadron (all vehicles) gets Grim Resolve.

 

Stubborn is useless so the unit is able to overwatch like infantry? Or can all vehicles overwatch in 7th and I never noticed?

EDIT: Ninja'd

[Retaliation]

I feel like the main thing wrong with the codex is the detachments meant to replace troop bikes/termies are screwy to the point of breaking (deathwing) or only barely workable (ravenwing). Save our special characters, most things got at least a noticeable boost while nothing really got worse.

[ValourousHeart]

What do you feel is barely workable with Ravenwing?

[marti350]

What do you feel is barely workable with Ravenwing?

I'm not a fan of the fact the only hq we can have is Sammael, if we want something else we need to pay a 2 troop tax with CAD or bring the lions blade

[Retaliation]

The reserve or don't reserve limitation and the requirement that the detachment be made of units with the ravenwing special rule.

 

The reserve limitation under strict interpretation prevents you from outflanking a portion of your army like attack bikes like you would be able to do in a normal army. It also prevents you from taking flyers in a pure ravenwing strike force because of the forced reserves and subsequent loss when you have no units on the board at the end of turn one. You need to take formations like the ravenwing attack and support squadrons to have board presence. 

 

The ravenwing special rule restriction prevents you from taking Forgeworld units that would ostensibly be ravenwing like their flyers and special land speeders, but that's more up to forgeworld to sort out. The bigger problem is that we're still forced to take sammael (one of the better special characters to be fair) and can't take any other HQ because no one has the ability to get the ravenwing special rule. 

[Interrogator Stobz]

 

If you still want to field lots of termies, go unbound C:SM.

That's 9 squads for 1800 points, you just can't put shields in shooty squads (not much loss considering you have 45 termies on the table), the DW core rules are worth replacing with C:SM ones any day.

 

But RW and GW together will be excellent in this Dex.

 

If I wanted to play smurfs, I would play smurfs. I don't want to play smurfs. Ergo I'm Dark Angel. I'll probably use them as force multipliers for the fun of it. But as far as a serious list, can't see a use for them. Still overpriced for what they do, can't be taken as a standalone army, and Ravenwing just looks so much more fun.

 

Me too, just trying to sound constructive. It is hard with the current info.

[SvenONE]

Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa.  Forget everything I ever said about White Scars being the better bikes.  Ravenwing are INCREDIBLE.  The book overall is just GOOD.

 

Just want to point out, if you bring a Lion's blade detachment with a RW Attack & Support Squadron as your Auxillaries, anyone who charges those bikes will be getting Overwatched by all of those Landspeeders at BS5.

 

They definitely screwed up with the RW Detachment and the HQs slot.

 

Also, Deathwing Vehicle completely gone? As well as dozer blades? They really shafted DW on this book.  If you want terminators, bring the psychic ones IMO.

[dalleron]

Im kind of miffed Azrael is more or less the same.  Buffed Dante a ton, buffed Calgar slightly if im correct, left Azrael the same.  Where's the consistency?  That's all I want.  He's clearly the worst of the big 4 Chapter Masters.  Yes I know they all serve different purposes but c'mon.  Still waffling on this codex at the moment.

[ValourousHeart]

Also, Deathwing Vehicle completely gone? As well as dozer blades? They really shafted DW on this book.  If you want terminators, bring the psychic ones IMO.

 

Dozer Blades aren't gone.  Page 154 under Vehicle Equipment there is a grey box... first item says Dozer Blade.

 

Ratchet it down Chicken Little, DW are not shafted with the loss of DW Vehicle.

 

It might be a case of you being so desperate to find something wrong that you are overlooking what is right in front of you.

(the dozer blade is the clearest example of that).

[Retaliation]

Also, Deathwing Vehicle completely gone? As well as dozer blades? They really shafted DW on this book. If you want terminators, bring the psychic ones IMO.

Dozer Blades aren't gone. Page 154 under Vehicle Equipment there is a grey box... first item says Dozer Blade.

Ratchet it down Chicken Little, DW are not shafted with the loss of DW Vehicle.

It might be a case of you being so desperate to find something wrong that you are overlooking what is right in front of you.

(the dozer blade is the clearest example of that).

Except the 4 next to dozer blade means it can't be taken by land raiders .

[twopounder]

There are some typos and oversights that make the ravenwing and deathwing CAD's unattractive. I think they put all the mojo into the lion's blade. I mean... what the heck, the whole army basically becomes immune to assault. Who the heck is going to charge anything when you can shoot back with half the army at BS4/5?

 

But on the whole, 95% of this codex is better, with about 30% being overwhelmingly superior to anything currently in print. I mean, seriously, 10 black knights with a rerollable 2++ cover that can still fire as normal and then overwatch at twin-linked BS2? And prevent all overwatch against them when they charge?

 

And on top of that they get +3" with the MOTRW.

 

I can't see a reason to hate on that. Yeah, they need to fix the wording, but really, it's not bad.

[Saphrael]

But on the whole, 95% of this codex is better, with about 30% being overwhelmingly superior to anything currently in print. I mean, seriously, 10 black knights with a rerollable 2++ cover that can still fire as normal and then overwatch at twin-linked BS2? And prevent all overwatch against them when they charge?

 

You're right, RW have gotten a lot of cool stuff. I'm still annoyed by the detachment/formation/typo issues already discussed though. Hopefully we'll get an errata soon (but I'm not holding my breath).

 

Also, a small nitpick: in the situation you describe above, the RWBKs wouldn't get to overwatch at BS2, since they need to jink to ge the rerollable cover save and jink cancels the overwatch benefit of Grim Resolve. Would also mean RW don't get improved overwatch when using Speed of the Raven, which is a shame, because that's when they'll likely need it.

 

Comparitvely minor issues I know, but still mean with RW you'll often be choosing between using one set of advantages or the other, rarely both.

[Stoic Raptor]

Ok yea....I think DA just got noticeably better. Taking one more special or heavy weapon per 10 man tac squad? Yes please. 

 

You may be misunderstanding the rule.  It's the same as it's always been: If you have fewer than 10 guys, you take either a Special or a Heavy; if you have 10 guys you take a Special and a Heavy.  You never get two of either, let alone 2 Specials and a Heavy.  So I'm not sure what you're thinking of.

[Duvakin]

So our codex is really good.i am really happy with the variety of lists u can build.there is also great synergy amongst the formations and detachments.all wings are boosted,especially the RW.they are now amazing.i believe the DW are very good at supporting the army with the deathwing strike force detachment.it allows you to take 2 elites and one HQ with the deathwing rule.(not necessarily terminator armor).i will go 100% of the times with the dwcs and take the apothecary.for 5 pts u get fnp for 2 termies squads??its great!!!and they come the turn the want if there is a RW strike force or RW attack squadron.the synergy is great.overally so pleased with this codex!!:)

[Solrac]

Unfortunately Duvakin if you read the text it says "One Deathwing Terminator in the army may be upgraded to an Apothecary".

 

So that's one per army not squad sadly.

 

I thought the same thing until I double checked the text.

[aura_enchanted]

I'm a little pissed captains lost their relic bearers

[Duvakin]

Unfortunately Duvakin if you read the text it says "One Deathwing Terminator in the army may be upgraded to an Apothecary".

So that's one per army not squad sadly.

I thought the same thing until I double checked the text.

You stole my hapiness! still i will play but one dwcs and one unit of deathwing knights!but not that great...

[EmptyVector]

As a 1st company player, I have to say this codex is in dire need of an FAQ and it isn't even released. I must ask, as DW units have the option to take Land Raiders as dedicated transports, can you use them to offset some of the difficulties with the fact the rest of your army has to deep strike? I usually run 2 Crusaders with my Deathwing and at current it's looking very likely I will be playing my current army unbound due to the poor 1st Company detachment rules.

[twopounder]

 

But on the whole, 95% of this codex is better, with about 30% being overwhelmingly superior to anything currently in print. I mean, seriously, 10 black knights with a rerollable 2++ cover that can still fire as normal and then overwatch at twin-linked BS2? And prevent all overwatch against them when they charge?

 

You're right, RW have gotten a lot of cool stuff. I'm still annoyed by the detachment/formation/typo issues already discussed though. Hopefully we'll get an errata soon (but I'm not holding my breath).

 

Also, a small nitpick: in the situation you describe above, the RWBKs wouldn't get to overwatch at BS2, since they need to jink to ge the rerollable cover save and jink cancels the overwatch benefit of Grim Resolve. Would also mean RW don't get improved overwatch when using Speed of the Raven, which is a shame, because that's when they'll likely need it.

 

Comparitvely minor issues I know, but still mean with RW you'll often be choosing between using one set of advantages or the other, rarely both.

 

 

 

I meant to separate the two. Aware you can't do both, but should be split in the middle. Run up and fire. Next turn can assault with impunity and/or overwatch. Only downside is that you don't get full BS with lion's blade.