Alternate Legion - The Scions Hospitalier

[MikhalLeNoir]

 

Fair point, though I'm still curious about the fluff reason for the Turn 1 Deep Strike-Shroud ability. How does 30 points sound, Slips?

 

Moving onto the Iona-Pattern Narthecium Array...oh boy.

 

Pricing Nartheciums has always been awkward since you can't buy the item solo, it has to come in a package deal, either an Apothecary or a Primus Medicae. I price FNP at 15 points, so I'll use that as a base idea. 

 

When the Iona-Pattern was first imagined, it allows rerollable FNP saves for a Primus, and it causes successful Poison/Fleshbane wounds to be rerolled for either Primus or Apothecary. I like how it distinguished between the two ranks, but the costs confuse me. It's just 10 points for the Primus, but 30 points for the Apothecary? Shouldn't that be the other way around? 

 

Also, now that I'm getting a better grasp on the Scions' rules, it occurs to me that they are one of the fastest infantry legions we have. Need to remember that when I write fluff for them.

 

Obscura Pack at 30 is fine since its a Jump Pack+

 

Primus Upgrade over a Basic Consul is also 45 Points now. So, for an Apothecary (45), he totals out at 75 pre upgrades.

 

A Primus is 105 Points Pre-Upgrades and is a Non-Compulsory HQ (unless otherwise states). I'd be totally ok with just making it a flat +30 regardless of who takes it. So, +75 for a Consul to take an Iona-Pattern.

 

Growing up in the Crushing Depth of a High-Gravity Ocean World does that to people :p

High gravity means also that they will be rather small^^

[Slips]

 

 

Fair point, though I'm still curious about the fluff reason for the Turn 1 Deep Strike-Shroud ability. How does 30 points sound, Slips?

 

Moving onto the Iona-Pattern Narthecium Array...oh boy.

 

Pricing Nartheciums has always been awkward since you can't buy the item solo, it has to come in a package deal, either an Apothecary or a Primus Medicae. I price FNP at 15 points, so I'll use that as a base idea. 

 

When the Iona-Pattern was first imagined, it allows rerollable FNP saves for a Primus, and it causes successful Poison/Fleshbane wounds to be rerolled for either Primus or Apothecary. I like how it distinguished between the two ranks, but the costs confuse me. It's just 10 points for the Primus, but 30 points for the Apothecary? Shouldn't that be the other way around? 

 

Also, now that I'm getting a better grasp on the Scions' rules, it occurs to me that they are one of the fastest infantry legions we have. Need to remember that when I write fluff for them.

Obscura Pack at 30 is fine since its a Jump Pack+

 

Primus Upgrade over a Basic Consul is also 45 Points now. So, for an Apothecary (45), he totals out at 75 pre upgrades.

 

A Primus is 105 Points Pre-Upgrades and is a Non-Compulsory HQ (unless otherwise states). I'd be totally ok with just making it a flat +30 regardless of who takes it. So, +75 for a Consul to take an Iona-Pattern.

 

Growing up in the Crushing Depth of a High-Gravity Ocean World does that to people

High gravity means also that they will be rather small^^

 

Thats only if its 2-3+ times Earths Gravity and if there was Natural Evolution at play.

Edited December 9, 2016 by Slipstreams

[simison]

Actually, since only the Primus gets the rerollable FNP, I think it fair that the Primus has to buy the Iona-Pattern for 30 points, while apothecaries, who only get the forced reroll on Fleshbane/Poison, can buy it for 10 points. Does that sound fair, Slips?

[Slips]

Sure.

[simison]

So, the Wave Blade. A power sword with Rending (5+), Specialist Weapon, Duelist's Edge, Master-Crafted, and +2 Strength. All for 20 points.

 

Any revisions before we start pricing, Slips?

[bluntblade]

Perhaps it should be an optional upgrade to power weapons, as you can get axes and other sorts of waveblade

[Slips]

For the Wave Blade, Its a Thunderhammer Sidegrade so if the character can take one, they can take this. Otherwise, no go and as such costs the same.

 

Would probably reduce Rending back down to 6+ And lose Master-Crafted.

 

As for the upgrade over a power weapon idea, that just adds to the bookkeeping which is blah. Theyre already ambiguous enough in name so thats fine enough for me.

[simison]

A power weapon is 3 melta bombs. I price +2 Str at 10 points, Rending at 15 points, Duelist's Edge at 10 points, while Specialist Weapon is -5 points since it essentially is -1 A. 

 

All in all, that adds up to 45 points. Even if I chose to price Rending at 10, that's still a 40 point weapon, double its current cost. How does that 40-45 range sound, Slips?

[Slips]

Sure, sounds fine enough to me.

 

I am curious though, who would your chart rate a Thunder Hammer since its Sx2 Ap2, Concussive, Specialist Weapon.

Edited December 12, 2016 by Slipstreams

[simison]

If I was considering it an upgrade over a power weapon, 15 or 20 points for the double Str, +5 for 1 better AP, 10 for Concussive, -5 for Specialist, and -15 for Unwieldy. 

 

So, 25 or 30 points, if I was allowed to price a Thunder Hammer. 

[simison]

Alright, I've sent all the changes to wargear to Grifft, which means the Scions are now one step closer to completion. Onto RoWs! Both of them need a fluff paragraph, while Extraction Primus needs to be checked. I'll handle that in my next post. 

[simison]

Extraction Force Primus

 

Benefits

 

- On Wings of Steel: Land transports are swapped out for Storm Eagles, normal and Phaeton. (How much of a benefit is this?)

- Descent Pattern Alpha: Assault & Phantom Squads may take a Phaeton, but have to Rapid Insertion on arrival. (Does the Rapid Insertion rule need to be revised?)

- With All Speed: Reserve rolls allowed on Turn 1 & can reroll (Huge bonus)

- Defensive Perimeter: Scion Infantry & Dreadnoughts gain Counter Attack, Hit & Run, and Fleet on turn of arrival (Medium bonus)

- Into the Fray: Phantom Squads with 10 models can charge from Reserves, Depthstriders with 10 models gain twin-linked & pinning on their guns (Huge bonus)

 

Hindrances

 

- Apothecaries auto-take if possible. (Already a part of Legion tactics)

- Required two Primus with Ionas (Expensive; moderate penalty)

- Nobody who can't fly/Deep Strike (No tanks; Huge penalty)

- Everyone starts in Reserves (A null deployment? Is that wise?)

- Required additional Compulsary Troop unit (Minor penalty)

 

So, some things need to be tweaked from the get go. Slips, any revisions before we have at it?

[Slips]

• Replacing Land Based vehicles for equivalent or, in the case of Rhinos more expensive, flyers is kinda a null modifier. Its a benefit in that more units have access to dedicated flyers thus not eating Fast or Heavy Slots but is also a downside in that you're limited to using Flyers.
• Rapid Insertion is wonky-but-modified version of 40k's Stormraven rule. You're essentially jumping out of the Flyer the turn you arrive on the board with it.  So its basically an Alternate form of deepstriking the units in question.

Hindrances:

• If it overlaps with LA:SH, then possibly just remove it.
• Nulldeployment is fine. Its a buff vs some armies but a detriment vs others. Its a toss up really and if you're up against armies that modify reserves (think Alpha Legion) then you're in a rough spot. No tanks means no Land Raider Proteus with ETA or Damocles Command Rhino to help with Reserves either.

I wanted it to be a High-Risk, High-Investment with potential High-Reward.

Edited December 16, 2016 by Slipstreams

[Skalpynock]

Isn't "on wings of steel" already the name of a half-finished Void Eagles RoW?

[Slips]

Isn't "on wings of steel" already the name of a half-finished Void Eagles RoW?

I wouldnt know since I made this thing a whiiiiiiillleeee back.

[Skalpynock]

 

Isn't "on wings of steel" already the name of a half-finished Void Eagles RoW?

I wouldnt know since I made this thing a whiiiiiiillleeee back.

 

And I wouldn't either, since I made that far too long ago to remember correctly.

[simison]

So, it's almost all-or-nothing alpha strike since most of the bonuses only happen on the turn the unit arrives. And since everyone is coming in from Reserves, a few bad rolls and the army is coming in piecemeal. Now, I specifically asked about the Rapid Insertion rule because it literally starts with "This Rule acts like the Storm Raven's..." So, I know I'm dealing with an incomplete rule here, and it's a little confusing. Because in the third paragraph it says may be performed while zooming. Except that's how the rule has always worked, so I don't why it's mentioned. Basically, the whole rule needs to be written properly to go into the rulebook. Can terminators take a Storm Eagle?

 

Benefits

 

- Minor Benefit (1)

- Minor Benefit (1)

- Huge Benefit (3)

- Moderate Benefit (2)

- Huge Benefit (3)

 

(10)

 

Hindrances

 

- Moderate Penalty (2)

- Huge Penalty (3)

- Moderate Penalty (2)

- Minor penalty (1)

 

(8)

 

I think it's close to being balanced, but it needs to shave off just some in the Benefits. How about removing the reroll to Reserves? 

[bluntblade]

Perhaps we could call it Teeth of the Sea or similar if there is a clash. Or Arms of the Sea, I'm always up for a Textures reference.

[Nomus Sardauk]

How about Grasp of the Deep?

[Slips]

How about Grasp of the Deep?

A bit too Drowned.

 

Cool with removing the Reroll to reserves. As for the Skies of Fury thing. Whatever makes it work :p

[Nomus Sardauk]

 

How about Grasp of the Deep?

A bit too Drowned.

 

Cool with removing the Reroll to reserves. As for the Skies of Fury thing. Whatever makes it work :p

Hmm, good point. Welp, I'll throw that one in the Folder of Names for possible later use when we do the Drowned's RoWs.

[simison]

Barring any disagreements from Grifft, Hesh, or anyone else, the Scions' RoWs are good to go. We'll fix the Rapid Insertion rule when we reach the Phateon, as well.

 

Until that point, the Phantoms are up next. 

[Slips]

Coolios.

[Kelborn]

Slips?

Did the Scions operate in Segmentum Ultima during the Great Crusade and if so, at around which period on our timeline? Early on? Right befor the Day of Revelation?

 

Furthermore, could you give me a character, who led the forces responsible for inducting Kaijo and Tanya'ba into the Imperium? Number of strength, etc.? :D

[Slips]

Since they're originally from the Segmentum Tempestus and Segmentum Ultima is the largest and most densely populated by Celestial Bodies, thats more of a given. As such, they would have probably operated within (via at least 1 Expeditionary Fleet) the Segmentum throughout the Great Crusade up to the Mustering that occurred prior to them being ambushed by the Drowned.

 

As for a Character, I'd have to hash out details with Blunt on the who but I recall a Captain Gelen, 8th Captain, was the one we settled on being "at your disposal" the how many would probably be in the range of 10k - 15k Marines give or take.