[HH1.0] Thousand Sons tactica

[Nusquam]

I'm loving the new Sons. It's looking to me like a Damocles is going to be almost mandatory when running the Magnus Guard RoW. Assuming your Praetor/sekhmet are going to be Raptora, what's the best loadout? I think Cataphractii for the 3++. Maelstrom seems good. Less need for Levitation with the Damocles but still might be the best 2nd power to get out of the DS please template me formation.

 

Raptora Cataphractii with leviation and a shooting power. Deepstrike outside interceptor bubbles and levitate in.

 

 

Have people looked at any of the nice combos you can pull with various powers?

Telekinesis looks like a verrrry nice table to support shooting units.

 

Popping a character (master of signal?) with levitation in a unit of heavy weapons, or if the character got Telekinesis dome, it allows them cover on the go (or an invulnerable).

 

Plus assail is quite a nice power to have to slow the advance of any enemy unit too!

 

Master of signal, raptora, Telekinesis seems like a very nice utility piece for rapiers, vets, or heavy support squads too for that matter (and for the reasons mentioned)

 

Likewise a divination chaplain (the fluff is crying right now) would add all kinds of hurt to a melee unit. Especially a biomancy focused one (occult blades, I'm looking at you!)

 

You'd have to fish for Levitation and most of the powers are bad when compared to other powers from different disciplines. Plus it makes you count as having moved so you don't want that on your heavy weapons.

[StayThirstySD]

So questions about the new terminators. It says they MAY choose their powers from Telekinetics or Pyromancy. Does that mean that if they follow another cult they can roll on another discipline?

[Nusquam]

No, cults don't dictate powers, only if you have a bonus to them.

[Athrawes]

So questions about the new terminators. It says they MAY choose their powers from Telekinetics or Pyromancy. Does that mean that if they follow another cult they can roll on another discipline?

 

They can be any Arcana that you want (Corvidae, Pavoni, Pyrae, Raptora and Athanaean)

 

But no matter which cult you select, they may only choose powers from the Telekinesis and Pyromancy discipline. 

[Nusquam]

Thinking of ways to maximize on the Osiron Dread. First thoughts are in an anvillus with a Kheres and extra armor. Maybe roll on biomancy for smite, and buff forward Sekhet units in a Crimson RoW. Even Iron Arm would help if you got your sword blown off. Tempted to do a heavy conversion beamer or TLLC, Div, and sit back and buff the backfield too. Would be crazy good in Zone Mortalis.
 
Most TS things would be crazy good in ZM. The Achea psybots with aether fires screening things like Sekhmets and relaying powers through walls. Blade Cabals going full ham on anything short of a 2+. Breachers with a 5++ from shooting.
 
 
Also according to wikipedia:

 

In Egyptian mythology, Sekhmet (also spelled Sachmet, Sakhet, Sekmet, Sakhmet and Sekhet; and given the Greek name, Sacmis), was originally the warrior goddess of Upper Egypt. She is depicted as a lioness, the fiercest hunter known to the Egyptians.

Fitting.

[1ncarnadine]

Thinking of ways to maximize on the Osiron Dread. First thoughts are in an anvillus with a Kheres and extra armor. Maybe roll on biomancy for smite, and buff forward Sekhet units in a Crimson RoW. Even Iron Arm would help if you got your sword blown off. Tempted to do a heavy conversion beamer or TLLC, Div, and sit back and buff the backfield too. Would be crazy good in Zone Mortalis.

 

I was a little inspired by your thoughts and took a look at the rules in the book to help come up with ideas, and it turns out they actually can't take Biomancy :( Just Telekinesis, Telepathy, Pyromancy and Divination. 

 

The TL Culverin could be a good middle-of-the-road modeling option that can take advantage of any role, range or powers that you might end up with?

[Nusquam]

Ohhh so they can't Biomancy. Oh well, Divination or Telepathy are still good.

 

Culverins aren't bad. Kheres may have two more shots and rending, but a twinlinked Culverin at BS5 probably won't miss all game. Plus a little bit more range and deflag is never bad.

 

I want to run one with two psybots and see what happens. The psybots can take some serious hurt before going down and screen chainfists for the Osiron. Plus the mental image is awesome.

 

Anyone been making lists? Namely with the Crimson RoW? I keep making elite heavy lists, Sekhmet, tricked out vets, Blade Cabals, psybots, etc. I always feel like I don't have enough AA and only acceptable AT.

[Jarkaira]

Kheres kills MEQ/TEQ more efficiently and has a change to deal damage against vehicles too when compared to Volkite Culverin. Why choose Culverin when Kheres is available if not for the pew p... I mean CHOOOOM factor?

 

If you need numbers then Kheres kills 1.48 MEQ and 1.02 TEQ and Culverin kills 0.95 MEQ and 0.47 TEQ.

Edited February 5, 2017 by Jarkaira

[Nusquam]

45" vs 24"

 

In Zone Mort or with a pod I'd take the Kheres, but in a normal game footslogging I'd take a culverin.

[1ncarnadine]

Doesn't the culverin become rending in ZM too? It's still not bad there. But yeah, I'm going to be seeing more open boards so it's mostly the range for me.

[Nusquam]

If it's Cold Void or Poisoned Air it becomes rending, but those are additional optional rules.

[Excessus]

Well, you'd want to get closer anyway to use the force fist, at least when facing high T enemies. 

[Excessus]

Waaaait a minute...

 

Life leech gives back a wound to the model or a model within 6" per wound caused, right? 

 

Strength D life leech could potentially give back a crapton of wounds...

 

Magnus and a Sekhmet bodyguard...

[Neforon]

Would that work? I thought you had to keep counting wounds on the already wounded models? It would work for heroes, Magnus himself and one wounded Sekhmet, right? As you can't have more than one wounded normal guy. 

[Excessus]

Would that work? I thought you had to keep counting wounds on the already wounded models? It would work for heroes, Magnus himself and one wounded Sekhmet, right? As you can't have more than one wounded normal guy. 

 

Well, it won't work on regular 1W infantry, but for MCs, thallax and other multi-wound models...

[Halandaar]

 

I don't know what's the official stance of B&C beyond "no points costs".

Please let me know if I'm overstepping myself with the details and I'll edit accordingly.

 

But to summarize, so we can engage more easily in TS tactica:

Legiones Astartes: TS

• You must determine your Warlord first when creating an army. Warlord must be an IC with a ML of 1 or more and with the highest Ld value.
• Access to all BRB psychic disciplines except Malefic.
• HQ IC that are not psykers can buy ML1 + exchange power -> force weapon for 5 points
• Each unit must select an Arcana from one of five.
• Compulsory Troops MUST have the same Arcana as the Warlord.
• If Arcana = Psy discipline, then  the unit can harness Warp Charges on a 3+
• If a detachment unit suffers a wound from Perils, every unit in the force must test for pinning.
• If every IC in the detachment are killed, all remaining units suffer -1 Ld and cannot sweep.

 

Cult Arcana

• Pavoni, +1 to run and sweeping advance distances
• Raptora, 6++ Inv or augment existing Inv save by 1 to a maximum of 3++
• Corvidae, re-roll failed To-Hit of 1 if the unit has remained stationary in this turn's movement phase
• Athanean, immune to Fear and gets Adamantium Will
• Pyrae,  gain Hammer of Wrath, or if already has HoW gets a second HoW

 

Legion Special Doodads

• Praetors MUST buy ML 1 up to 3, and can do the power -> force swap.
• Veterans and Legion Termies can buy Brotherhood of Psykers ML1.
• IC can buy Arcane Litanies to ignore their first failed Perils.
• Aether-Fire Cannons are 36" S7 AP2 plasma cannons with Heavy 1, Blast, Soul Blaze, Gets Hot
• Asphyx Shells get Shred. IC can buy them for bolt pistol/gun, combi-bolters. Veterans and Legion Termies can also buy them. Rotor Cannon support squads can also buy them.

 

Osiron Dreadnoughts

• Any Contemptor Talon can pay for the Osiron upgrade.
• Gain Psychic Pilot ML1. Powers are generated from Telekinesis, Telepathy, Pyromancy or Divination.
• Gain Adamantium Will.
• Must exchange the CCW with: Dreadnought Force Blade, Sx2 AP2 Force with inbuilt combi-bolter and Asphyx Shells

 

Castellax-Achea

• Same stats as a Castellax, but unless noted they lose all special rules (e.g. cortex)
• Mauler Cannon with Asphyx Shells and Refractor Field.
• Can replace the Mauler with an Aether-Fire Cannon.
• As long as a LA: TS unit with at least ML1 is within 24", the unit behaves normally. Otherwise, no Charge, Run or Sweeping.
• Can fire 3 weapons.
• LA: TS psykers within 12" can use the Castellax to cast Witchfires and Maledictions; range and LoS measured from the Castellax.
• If ANYONE suffers a Perik (friend or foe) within 12", do a Ld test. Failure = d6 automatic wounds, no saves of any kind. Death from this effect result in maximum reactor blast.

Sekhmet Terminators

• Two wounds.
• Can be equipped with either Tartaros or Cataphractii armor. Your choice.
• Equipped with force weapon of your choice and combi-bolters with Asphyx shells.
• Brotherhood of Psykers ML2.
• Can take a Proteus DT if 5, or a Spartan if 6-10.
• Any replace the force weapon with a pfist PLUS a lightning claw or another pfist or a chainfist.
• Any can buy combi-weapons and retain the Asphyx Shells.

Khenetai Ocult Blades

• Elites, 5 strong in power armour with two force swords.
• Brotherhood ML1.
• If 3 or less in unit, +1A to everyone.
• If 4-8, +1A and +1 WS
• If 9-10, +2A and +2 WS

Ammitara Occult Intercession Cabal

• FA scoutrs, 5 strong, with sniper rifles.
• Brotherhood of Psykers ML1.
• For every 5, one can take a meltagun or plasma gun.
• Can have a Storm Eagle as a DT.
• Unique psy power: Mind Killer, allows re-rolling all failed To Hit and To Wound, and attacks Ignore Cover.

 

Thanks for the summary :D Are there any additional options on the Sekhmet Terminators (i.e. Heavy Weapons) or Khenetai Occult Blades (i.e. Jump packs) ? Just for the purposes of model planning.

[Withershadow]

^No heavy weapons and no jump packs. Blades basically have no options.

 

Not sure the Dreadnought is that great give its cost. The Contemptor Prime is already silly expensive before you jack it up to 225 without upgrades. Add a pair of guns and a drop pod, and you're almost at Leviathan points.

 

Fishing for a decent power among its disciplines is very hit or miss, so you're probably taking Divination, in which case I am thinking its best holding down your lines, buffing support elements and chasing off deep striking units.

 

Alternatively, give it chainfist and force blade with a pair of graviton guns for a twist on a classic? Then you would want an assault vehicle or outflank or something.

[1ncarnadine]

 ^Remember that the Osiron must take one arm with a Contemptor force weapon and a storm bolter with Asphyx rounds, so the other arm is its only option.

Edited February 5, 2017 by LetsYouDown

[Mango Polo]

I spoke with Alan and he confirmed that the "power claws" = power fists, on the Castellax-Achaen.

[Withershadow]

Uh, power FISTS? That's both good and terrible, lol. S10 all around but total waste of that I4.

 

^Remember that the Osiron must take one arm with a Contemptor force weapon and a storm bolter with Asphyx rounds, so the other arm is its only option.

A Contemptor can swap any arm bolters for another weapon. I do not see how you are locked into the asphyx bolter. Edited February 5, 2017 by Withershadow

[Mango Polo]

Power Fists on Monstrous Creatures ignore Unwieldy :P

So it is purely great, though the platform is stuck at WS3.

[Withershadow]

I'll take it! Holy balls. That's all I got to say.

[1ncarnadine]

Uh, power FISTS? That's both good and terrible, lol. S10 all around but total waste of that I4.

 

^Remember that the Osiron must take one arm with a Contemptor force weapon and a storm bolter with Asphyx rounds, so the other arm is its only option.

A Contemptor can swap any arm bolters for another weapon. I do not see how you are locked into the asphyx bolter.

 

 

 

Fair enough! My rigid thinking on that came from Asphyx shells not normally being available to Contemptors so some part of my information-addled brain was thinking of it as a different option, but I guess it's still a storm bolter at the end of the day.

[Withershadow]

Yeah the only reason you are stuck with the force claw, is because there's no option that says you can replace the force claw for something else. The bolter is still a bolter just with fancy rounds, and there's an option to replace any bolter for something else.

 

But yeah, so far we got Terminators = holy crap, Automata = very good, Blade Cabal = very good, Dreadnought = okay, Scouts = ok.

 

Plus the disciplines effectively give us special versions of every core choice. We're definitely the munchkin faction. :D

Edited February 5, 2017 by Withershadow

[Nusquam]

I missed that the Osiron is an HQ, it just uses contemptor options. Not a huge deal considering we have 3 slots.

 

Fists on the automata just gave TS a huge push for my summer project... They are pure gold at this point. S10 melee, I4, 3+/5++, IWND, easier to use, relaying powers, MC, rage, fearless, shredding bolts, soul blaze plasma cannons. Definitely worth the price tag.

 

I want to like the Ammitara. They're pretty awesome thematically, and I do love me Mor Deythan, but a few key 'crunch' aspects are preventing me. For one, they don't score. Recons and Mor Deythan do, so when you take rifles you can plop them on objectives. If the Ammitara scored I would consider them for putting bodies on objectives in a Crimson RoW to avoid being tabled. The second is only sniper rifles with a 1 per 5 special. It's weird that they can take a Storm Eagle as a DT crunch-wise, makes sense thematically, but with so many heavy weapons it'd be turn 4 before they became useful. Maybe they'll be able to swap for shotguns someday. Perhaps FW was too afraid of encroaching on both Mor Deythan and Head Hunters. They are the best snipers in the game, but unless you're fighting automata you have deadlier options. Plus the compete with anvillus and normal eagles for assault transports for Khenetai Blade Cabals and Sekhmets.