Phalanx Warder Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Somebody say Breachers? Here the valiant Breachers of the Iron VII deal the Death Guard a solid blow! And again against the Iron Warriors: One Breacher filled with enough Zeal to make Sigismund proud, though the Tech Marines want words with him for sharpening the edge of his shield: Currently up to 35 with 5 to build. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dallo Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Liking that last ZEAL filled breacher. I've been trying a similar conversion with my Emperor's Children breachers, but am struggling to get it to "pop". May need to go back to the drawing board. Dallo Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252141 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted December 14, 2015 Author Share Posted December 14, 2015 Are the Invectarus Suzerains counted as breachers? :-P Artillery does indeed hurt infantry in this game, but it just means you need to make good use of Heavy Support to thin out the enemy's vehicles that could hurt your troops... Are the Invectarus Suzerains counted as breachers? :-P Artillery does indeed hurt infantry in this game, but it just means you need to make good use of Heavy Support to thin out the enemy's vehicles that could hurt your troops... Hmm I'd say not really. They're an uber assault unit really. Breachers are Breachers. ;) I'm not above discourse on Breacher themes of course. Speaking of which; in an army with 2 big Breacher squads, does anyone have experience foot slogging Suzerains with a Praetor and a void harness? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252184 Share on other sites More sharing options...
God-Potato of Mankind Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 OH MY OH MY, what a conveniently timed thread. Just as I finished up (bar re-doing the shields) my very first Breacher squad! Represent, Eighteenth Legion! http://i.imgur.com/NJHQ0Q0.jpg Have at ye, Twelfth legion cur! http://i.imgur.com/07ODbV6.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252207 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I'd maybe let them get to reroll failed saves against shooting attacks. I don't know why a single breacher shield would give a 4+ Invulnerable Save against an Orbital Bombardment. The -1 Strength thing isn't a massive thing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252259 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 It would make Iron Hands Breachers preeeeety strong at -2S from shooting... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252262 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 How about a 2k list of breachers? Hq have to have boarding shields. Think it would be genius Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
God-Potato of Mankind Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I really want to run a two Spartan megalist of breachers with Covenant of Fire for MC Meltas and melta bombs. 40 Breachers is likely the most cost ineffective thing ever, but by Vulkan it would look badass. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252277 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raktra Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 It would make Iron Hands Breachers preeeeety strong at -2S from shooting... Quiet, you, let me have this. I might make more lists with some Immortals in. Yeah they're overcosted as hell, but they won't be dying anytime quick at the points levels I'm stuck at. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252286 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Starter for 10 Now here's some maths and list building: Siege breaker, boarding shield, hammer, aa, 3× phosphex, attached to 20 breachers, 4 X graviton, aa, vexilla, thunder hammer. Forgelord with rad, shield, thunder hammer, familiar, combi gun, attached to 20 X breachers, 4x chargers, breaching charge, aa, vexilla, thunder hammer = 1170 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252393 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted December 14, 2015 Author Share Posted December 14, 2015 I'd maybe let them get to reroll failed saves against shooting attacks. I don't know why a single breacher shield would give a 4+ Invulnerable Save against an Orbital Bombardment. The -1 Strength thing isn't a massive thing. It would make Iron Hands Breachers preeeeety strong at -2S from shooting... Well -2S but only for templates, which are a coward's weapon anyway. The 4+ invulnerable save won't help against other shooting. Just reduce effectiveness of cheese weapons. Sure, an orbital bombardment won't care about a guy with shield, but game balance could do with less armies of template doom... Any other, out of the box suggestions? Rerolls sounds good but won't help against those silly Typhons etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252409 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 What purpose does putting a Boarding Shield with Boarding Shield serves? I know we're the Breacher Team, but we're not needlessly stupid. We leave that for the Imperial Fists. No real need for 3 Phosphex. You're unlikely to ever really need more than 2. The Graviton's inability to move and fire is a PITA. Could theoretically use a Cataphractii guy to give them SnP RAW, but good luck getting anyone to actually let you play that. You'd do better with a Vigilator with Combat Shield if you need a shield, or a "relic shield" in the form of a Refractor. Talking of game balance about template blasts of doom - mech up. That's the answer. If you insist on running MEQ's into MEQ chewing weapons, then it kind of is to be expected to have your guys chewed up. I don't personally think they need to be changed. They need a bit of finessing is all. They are a unit you put in your enemies grill and make them hard to shift. Melee has been an answer to Iron Hands spamming 20 Man Tactical Blobs who used their FNP against S8 or lower to good effect post Betrayal. I still fail to see what 3" thick slab of adamantium is going to do against a Cannon Shot from a Typhon, Orbital Laser, Meltacannon, or Phosphex. A slab is something to interpose between something. Such as how they're used today. You don't use Riot Shields to counter M1 Abrams. You use it to block against Small Arms fire within a narrow area. Breachers have Hardened Armour, which makes them more resilient against Blasts, due to the nature of the Armour. A Breacher Shield gives you a small invulnerable save - it's that representation of hiding behind the shield which is represented by the Invulnerable, or the odd person being able to plant their shield into the ground to prevent being blown away like the nuclear explosion at the end of Pacific Rim. A flat 4+ Save is ridiculous. I honestly don't have a problem with how they are applied already in game (with the exclusion of the Blind Grenade nonsense). I find them to be perfectly capable. Maybe a reduction in points (20-35pts), or the option to take Rhino's. Outside of that? That said, I'd personally drop the stupid stupid stupid points bloat applied to all legion forces ignored by every other army in 30K. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252410 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 It would make Iron Hands Breachers preeeeety strong at -2S from shooting... I would completely support this if TDA models could get breach shields... I really like my Cataphractii Jarl Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252432 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 There's the alpha legion, infiltrate, siege breaker allows grav to reroll ones for the vehicle damage via tank hunter, I think that's blooming marvellous. Especially as you'd pretty much be in range. Team breacher it's fluffy that's why. And you always take odd numbers, it looks nicer aesthetically. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252433 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 I keep forgetting Alpha Legion can infiltrate, I tend to run Tank Hunters anyway and give them Scout via Vigilator. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252437 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I think you're onto something about small arms and Shields Hesh... Currently the Shield offers nothing against bolters, when really that's what they'd be used to defend against. Maybe rapid fire weapons are -1S against them or something? That covers plasma and bolters and maybe a few other random things and won't affect mad instant death thresholds. Or, actually, you could impose a -1 to hit for all weapons outside of 12 inches or something as you are more likely to hit a shield than an actual marine. Maybe only if they are ranked up though, sure they're then vulnerable to Typhons but what infantry isn't? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252525 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesh Kadesh Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Perhaps just keep it as simple as a +1 bonus to Armour Save rolls taken against ranged weapons if the unit has not ran in the previous phase. It means that AP3 or better doesn't lose it's lethality, but against AP4 or worse, they become moderately more tough provided they don't choose to move quick. It would help make the Imperial Fist Rite of War quite resilient (but still kind of suckish). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252533 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raktra Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Why not make them like the 40k Siege Mantlets? They're pretty much the same damn thing after all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252540 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brofist Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 So far the tweaks in our league have been good- 200 points base, move-through-cover, and re-rolls for failed invuln saves. For Iron Hands we also ammended the rules for immortals- dropped the price on the squad, cheaper melta bombs, scoring, 1 power weapon for every 5models, and ability to re-roll all failed saves of 1 if they pass a leadership check at the start of a game turn. Combined with the breacher changes it's turned them into a reliable generalist. Very hard to shift and a tough midfield unit most units want to avoid getting bogged down fighting. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I am dowm for -1 strength. Even though it makes iron hands nearly immune to bolters, I mean who isn't? Plus a battle cannon still hurts the same. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MHPS3000 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Anyone have the general dimensions for either style of boarding shield? Planning on scratchbuilding some shields with the BaC tacticals as a base. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252622 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomMarine Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 My breachers http://i1382.photobucket.com/albums/ah274/mortiscorax29/Ironhands%2030k/IMG_20151028_094018_1_zps1riupqqx.jpg http://i1382.photobucket.com/albums/ah274/mortiscorax29/Ironhands%2030k/IMG_20151028_094008_1_zpsjxv6fc65.jpg http://i1382.photobucket.com/albums/ah274/mortiscorax29/Ironhands%2030k/IMG_20151028_093904_1_zpsmh755wzx.jpg http://i1382.photobucket.com/albums/ah274/mortiscorax29/Ironhands%2030k/IMG_20151028_093856_1_zpsk4keerne.jpg http://i1382.photobucket.com/albums/ah274/mortiscorax29/Ironhands%2030k/IMG_20151028_093846_1_zpszr7gu0hb.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252651 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted December 15, 2015 Author Share Posted December 15, 2015 I fail to see how a 4+ invulnerable save against blasts is ridiculous yet a storm shield having a 3+ save is okay! But I'm all for toning down. 5+ against blasts would still work wonders. Stock FNP is easy too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252671 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted December 15, 2015 Author Share Posted December 15, 2015 Some amazing examples there folk. There's a lot of Breacher fans out there. Thought we were a minority but it seems like we might outnumber the Martian Death Ray Fan Club. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252672 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caillum Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Thought we were a minority but it seems like we might outnumber the Martian Death Ray Fan Club. Ooooh! Shots fired! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/317087-team-breacher/page/4/#findComment-4252677 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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