General Discussion Secundus

[Sigismund229]

 

 

The Wardens haven't used their bonus and I don't think they need it. They are one if the only legions regaining their DoR Numbers and mildy increase them even. It has some benefits to stay out of a full scale brotherwar.

How many marines can you create in 20 years? Possible candidates arrive with the refugees.

When I was doing SWAGs for the loyalist legions, I guessed the WoL could create 19,000 legionaries in 19 years, taking into account the refugees.

Okay. I thought 30k was realistic. So the wardens get close to rheir former numbers. So if they return to the frontlines we have about 156.000 marines on the march.

Actually, this seems like a good time to ask a question I had when doing those SWAGs. How many legionaries does each of the loyalist legions lose on the DoR?

[MikhalLeNoir]

The Wardens of Night lose about 20-25k Marines. The whole 11th fleet is reduced to ash by the Eagle Warriors. Only a few could escape

[Kelborn]

Well, the Bloodlords were already separated when the DoR occured. They went nuts, ravaging through the Imperium until they were chased down by their own brothers.

 

I'd say 10K Bloodlords and some thousands loyal Predators. Maybe 15 - 17K in total.

[TheBlindPrimarch]

Right, looking at your suggestions Blind, here's my feedback

 

- We do actually have a BotL member devoted to Slaanesh, it's the Drowned

 

-I don't think we should have a Macharius character just yet because, apart from anything else, he'd be overshadowed by the primarchs still whereas a Macharius character should, IMO, dominate the stage. Perhaps, rather than a Macharius figure, we could tie this into Alex releasing the Lectitio Divinatus and turn Xander's successor into an especially devout preacher who is able to inspire the Imperial Army and perhaps spawns a radical sect of the Imperial faith?

 

- I'd have no problem with the Heredes being the most numerous Imperial Army units from a single system. Although perhaps their pride in their abilities and their self proclaimed preeminence in the anti-astartes field could rub a lot of their fellow Imperial Army regiments the wrong way, in the same kind of way as US troops are known for sometimes doing.

 

- Agreed on the importance of showing how vital the Imperial Army is to the war efforts of both sides. Speaking of which, I agree with blunt. Perhaps we should orient some of the sub-books towards the efforts not just of the Heredes but of the Imperial Army as a whole. However, wrt the having the gear to fight the legions, I think you can go too far with that. We need to keep in mind that the Imperial Army is arming tens, if not hundreds, of millions of pretty hastily raised troops, probably conscripts in a lot of cases, whose life expectancy won't be brilliant, especially not going up against legionaries. So the gear they're going to be given will be cheap and easy to maintain, ruling out the fancier bits of gear.

 

Now a suggestion:

- A relatively unsnowflakey way of raising the Heredes up to be something more than a typical group of regiments would be if they were 100% volunteer. I imagine that after the opening few years of the Insurrection volunteers would be hard to come by and so the vast majority of troops would be conscripted. If the Heredes stayed volunteer, that would help show their fanatical loyalty to the Emperor as well as provide a reason for them being a relatively elite group of regiments(they're better motivated). I'd liken it to the ANZACs, Irish, South Africans and Indians in the British army in WW1. While they weren't as numerous as "mainland" British troops, they had a better reputation for their ability as soldiers due to the fact that unlike the British(after 1916 at any rate) they were all still volunteers.

 

Point for point

-Didn't realize the Drowned were Slaanesh, for some reason I thought they were Nurgle. Dropping that idea then, though I still think Xander would have been well suited to the role.

 

-I agree in this regard, Simi had suggested once a while ago that the Heredes and Vasalius could serve as a strong hub for the Imperial Faith. The character I mentioned is still in rough concept but I've got a pretty good idea of what I'm looking for.

 

-As a US Marine all I'm going to say is you can't blame us for the truth rubbing people the wrong way lol. As far as the Heredes are concerned, I think my idea was misunderstood. (or I didn't explain it properly) Vasalius can churn out regiments because like Cadia the Vasalians are fanatically nationalistic and everyone is culturally expected to serve in the Homeguard, Vasalius' version of a PDF.( It is almost unheard of for someone to refuse to do so.) The Heredes regiments are numerous, but what I actually said was that they are well known and widely deployed. Unlike some Imperial Army regiments and Auxillas that only serve in limited theaters, the Heredes answers the call wherever they are sent.

 

-The Heredes are not the standard Imperial Army. They're more akin to the Solar Auxilla. They are extremely well trained, highly motivated and fanatically loyal to the Emperor. Most of the weapons and equipment they use in battle are manufactured on Vasalius, which is essentially a forge world in everything but name, but on top of that is a fairly wealthy world and as such is capable of equipping their troops with the best they have to offer. Honestly this is a misconception of the Heredes you've made before so hopefully this explains where they differ.

 

-As to your suggestion, If I didn't illustrate this well enoughthen my bad but yes, the Heredes are 100% volunteer. Exceptional members of the Homeguard are approached by recruiters for the Heredes and asked if they want to join. To date not one Vasalian has refused such an honor. Every Vasalian that joins the Heredes has they name added to a memorial located at the very same location the Emperor first stepped foot on Vasalius.

 

 

- ...in the same kind of way as US troops are known for sometimes doing.

 

Hey! We can't help but be awesome!

 

Anyway, I mostly agree with Sig's points. What I do want to clarify is my idea involving Travier. Instead of simply being executed by Raktra at the end of Carrion Hill, Travier arranges Purechild to become an ingredient in his ritual to create a Daemon Prince. I didn't actually suggest that Purechild embraces Chaos, only that his death comes with much more pain, ritual, and purpose. 

 

Also, I think the Battle of Carrion Hill could be Book 2B in the Blood Crusade trilogy, if you're welling, Sig.

 

 

Could you explain what you mean by ingredient? I don't mind him being used in this way just wondering how important of an ingredient are we talking?

[Sigismund229]

As a member of a military family, all I can say is whatever helps you sleep blind :P although in all seriousness, I was using it as an example. Didn't mean to offend.

 

Also, noted. Heredes=Solar Auxilia not Imperial Army.

[MikhalLeNoir]

Why nit having him falling to slaanesh? Representing another aspect. There are always more than one champions. Je could become a greater daemon nontheless.

[simison]

Well, to create the 'Black Rage' bomb in the Blood Angels 30k novel, the daemons had captured a Blood Angels captain and then tortured his spirit endlessly to provide material or the explosive. So, I was imagining something akin to that, except Purechild would be a bit more ritualistic, and then tie it to Travier's 'Daemon Primarch' spell.

 

 

Why nit having him falling to slaanesh? Representing another aspect. There are always more than one champions. Je could become a greater daemon nontheless.

 

It's a possibility, I was just explaining what my original idea was. 

[Nomus Sardauk]

Well, you had fun. That reminds me about the theological perspectives about the Primarchs I had started way back. I should remember to finish that before we finish the Scouring.

Found'em for ya, all the way back on Page 17. I wanted to re-read them again anyways once you mentioned them so I thought I might as well help you find them. :)

 

Have more theological concepts, for I am still erratic for another two more weeks:

Sorrowsworn Morro - The Soul-Eater, Monster of the Deep, Champion of Slaanesh - Morro is the sole Primarch to become a devil among both Humanity and the Eldar for his horrid deeds. The Daemon Primarch is said to be consumed by an insatiable hunger for the souls of others, stalking them from beneath the waves until he strikes. Like K'awil he is another aspect of the dangers of straying too far from the light of Humanity. Unlike K'awil, he is not associated with the dark so much as 'bottomless' depths. It is said that he can only be summoned in the deeps.

Koschei Kharkovic - The Pestilence, Bringer of Sorrows, Nurgle's Champion - Koschei is held up as a cautionary tale of not merely holding steady to one's beliefs, but holding true to the right principles. It is taught that he alone among his monstrous brothers regrets his choices in life. Now, his soul and heart are consumed by a bitterness that renders him a plague to Mankind as that same bitterness manifests as a virulent disease that consumes all he approaches, forever denying him the hope of connection.

The Misguided

Nomus Sardauk - The Inhuman, Purveyor of Knowledge, The Ghost in the Shell - Nomus, along with the other Suzerainty Primarchs, occupy an odd space among the Ecclesiarchy's teachings. Although once Traitors, the Suzerainty Primarchs escaped the Path of Damnation but aren't truly counted among the Blessed Sons. Nomus in particular is treated as the Sophmore, the 'Wise Fool'. It is said that he possesses most of the information in the entire galaxy, but doesn't truly know what to do with it. To be referred as a 'Nomus' means to be incredibly intelligent but lacking deeper wisdom. At worst, it is used as an insult for being blind to important truths.

The Jade General - The Warrior, The Inquisitive Lord, The Fallen One - While Nomus may represent the folly of not having wisdom, Jade is an example of intelligence put to poor use. Forever known as the Primarch who was slain by his own creation, it is through him that the Ecclessiarchy teaches temperance is important in the field of academics, not just life. Likewise, the Mechanicum too use the General as the reason why their ways involve thoroughness and caution.

Kozja Darzalas - The Ruler, Heir of Arrogance, The Reckless One - It is taught that Kozja's ultimately flaw was not his mind but his heart. Kozja is spoken that for all of his brilliance, he could not truly master his emotions. So, his emotions were the master of him and would cost him his body and leave him in a state of stasis for the length of existence. It is debated among some priests that Kozja may be restored to his former self if he were to surrender his arrogance and paid penance to the God-Emperor of Mankind.

Gwalchavad - The Two-Natured, The Masked One, The Traitor-in-Hiding - Out of all of the Primarchs who fought in service to the Imperium, only Gwalchavad is denied a place among the Blessed. This is due in no doubt to his seemingly last-minute decision to enter the Insurrection. As such, not even Icarion is subjected to more controversy and debate over the nature of Gwalchavad and the nature of his actions. In the worst light, he is a villain, an opportunistic warlord who waited until he knew which side would benefit him the most. In the best light, he is a mistaken knight, constantly trying to stand up for the right principles only to learn how poor his choices were until far later. For his detractors, the moral lesson typically revolves around integrity and transparency, to be honest toward your fellow Man. For his supporters, the lesson becomes the importance of recognizing one's nature. To war against one's own nature is to invite ruin.

 

[Also, between Azus and Yucahu, which would commit more war crimes and which would resist harder against the rising Imperial Cult?]

[simison]

Thank you, San. I'm glad they hold up pretty well half a year later. I wonder if I had covered Andezo, who will probably be counted among the Damned.

[Big Bad Squig]

Hi all,

Just poking my head in to say I'm still here - I've been out of time recently as I've just gotten back to school a few weeks ago and I've had to change computers so it's all been a bit hectic.  I should be back to regular posting now (or as regular as Squig gets).  I'm also having to collect all the files for the DS chapter again with the computer switch but once I've sorted that and rewritten the bits of material that I lost (if there are any) I'll start dropping the new material into the DS thread.

[simison]

Good to hear from you, Squig. I'm looking forward to seeing you more active in BotL.

[Nomus Sardauk]

Thank you, San. I'm glad they hold up pretty well half a year later. I wonder if I had covered Andezo, who will probably be counted among the Damned.

 

Duty is it's own reward, but you're welcome nonetheless brother. 

 

 

Hi all,

Just poking my head in to say I'm still here - I've been out of time recently as I've just gotten back to school a few weeks ago and I've had to change computers so it's all been a bit hectic.  I should be back to regular posting now (or as regular as Squig gets).  I'm also having to collect all the files for the DS chapter again with the computer switch but once I've sorted that and rewritten the bits of material that I lost (if there are any) I'll start dropping the new material into the DS thread.

 

Welcome back brother!  It's good to hear from you again, I'm looking forward to seeing what you have in store for us. 

[simison]

[i blame you, San. Here's the entire list as it now stands. Primarchs are ranked accordingly to how despised to how favoured they are in the various Ecclesiarchal branches. I only have 4 Primarchs to go.]

 

The Damned

 

Alexos Travier - The Arch-Heretic, The Corrupter/Tempter, The Trickster - Name is blotted out by most branches of the Ecclesiarchy, considered the worst of the fallen Primarchs.

 

Icarion Anasem - The Arch-Traitor, The Fool, The Fallen Star - Highly controversial, due to his last act of self-sacrifice. Spectrum opinions range that he redeemed himself to belief that his act of redemption was merely a false rumor. What adds further conflict to the debate is the actions of his sons, few of whom have returned to the Emperor's light while the worst continue to haunt the Imperium, especially Raiden. 

 

Raktra Akarro - The Destroyer, The Tormentor, Khorne's Champion - Feared in both life and in unlife, the Ecclesiarchy teaches that those who are needlessly cruel to others, are doomed to die and become slaves and suffer a thousand forms of torture at Raktra's claws. As for the Primarch himself, he is seen as the ultimate embodiment of physical, bloody destruction among his brothers. 

 

K'awil Pakal - The Terror, Master of Darkness, The Slain Devil - Due to being a Pariah and truly dying, K'awil, ironically, is much more featured in sermons and over writings due to the lack of any chance of inadvertently strengthening him, unlike Travier and Akarro. By the time of 40k, K'awil has taken equal portions as feared boogeyman told as warnings against misbehaving children and as an example of the danger of walking too long in darkness from both a physical and metaphysical viewpoint. 

 

Sorrowsworn Morro - The Soul-Eater, Monster of the Deep, Champion of Slaanesh - Morro is the sole Primarch to become a devil among both Humanity and the Eldar for his horrid deeds. The Daemon Primarch is said to be consumed by an insatiable hunger for the souls of others, stalking them from beneath the waves until he strikes. Like K'awil he is another aspect of the dangers of straying too far from the light of Humanity. Unlike K'awil, he is not associated with the dark so much as 'bottomless' depths. It is said that he can only be summoned in the deeps. 

 

Koschei Kharkovic - The Pestilence, Bringer of Sorrows, Nurgle's Champion - Koschei is held up as a cautionary tale of not merely holding steady to one's beliefs, but holding true to the right principles. It is taught that he alone among his monstrous brothers regrets his choices in life. Now, his soul and heart are consumed by a bitterness that renders him a plague to Mankind as that same bitterness manifests as a virulent disease that consumes all he approaches, forever denying him the hope of connection. 

 

Andezo Sambedi - The Blind One, The Deserter, The Missing Son - Unlike Gwalchavad, Andezo's late betrayal has sealed his fate as being counted as one of the Damned. His first title refers not to just his physical disability, but his blindness of spirit. It was this that led to him heretically investing his trust in Icarion. He is an especially popular figure among the Inquisition, who hold him up as the danger of seeking victory against Chaos through treachery and evil. His last title is much more prosaic as few know his final fate, given that he abruptly disappeared at the end of the Insurrection. 

 

The Misguided

 

Nomus Sardauk - The Inhuman, Purveyor of Knowledge, The Ghost in the Shell - Nomus, along with the other Suzerainty Primarchs, occupy an odd space among the Ecclesiarchy's teachings. Although once Traitors, the Suzerainty Primarchs escaped the Path of Damnation but aren't truly counted among the Blessed Sons. Nomus in particular is treated as the Sophmore, the 'Wise Fool'. It is said that he possesses most of the information in the entire galaxy, but doesn't truly know what to do with it. To be referred as a 'Nomus' means to be incredibly intelligent but lacking deeper wisdom. At worst, it is used as an insult for being blind to important truths.

 

The Jade General - The Warrior, The Inquisitive Lord, The Fallen One - While Nomus may represent the folly of not having wisdom, Jade is an example of intelligence put to poor use. Forever known as the Primarch who was slain by his own creation, it is through him that the Ecclessiarchy teaches temperance is important in the field of academics, not just life. Likewise, the Mechanicum too use the General as the reason why their ways involve thoroughness and caution.

 

Kozja Darzalas - The Ruler, Heir of Arrogance, The Reckless One - It is taught that Kozja's ultimately flaw was not his mind but his heart. Kozja is spoken that for all of his brilliance, he could not truly master his emotions. So, his emotions were the master of him and would cost him his body and leave him in a state of stasis for the length of existence. It is debated among some priests that Kozja may be restored to his former self if he were to surrender his arrogance and paid penance to the God-Emperor of Mankind.

 

Gwalchavad - The Two-Natured, The Masked One, The Traitor-in-Hiding - Out of all of the Primarchs who fought in service to the Imperium, only Gwalchavad is denied a place among the Blessed. This is due in no doubt to his seemingly last-minute decision to enter the Insurrection. As such, not even Icarion is subjected to more controversy and debate over the nature of Gwalchavad and the nature of his actions. In the worst light, he is a villain, an opportunistic warlord who waited until he knew which side would benefit him the most. In the best light, he is a mistaken knight, constantly trying to stand up for the right principles only to learn how poor his choices were until far later. For his detractors, the moral lesson typically revolves around integrity and transparency, to be honest toward your fellow Man. For his supporters, the lesson becomes the importance of recognizing one's nature. To war against one's own nature is to invite ruin.

 

The Blessed

 

Azus Bahumat - The Shadowed One, Demigod of the East, The Third Martyr - Rightly or wrongly, many branches of the Ecclesiarchy consider Azus the least among the Blessed Sons. He avoided the typical inspirational victories of glory. He did not defend Holy Terra at the apex of the Insurrection. He fought most of the war in the Far East. Finally, he treated the growing Imperial Creed with vague distance. All of these factors lead most preachers and Ecclesiarchs to rank Azus the lowest, though they take care to do so privately. Contrary to his low opinion in most of the galaxy, Azus is upheld as a symbol and a nigh-patron saint of the East, especially in Segmentum Atlanticus. Finally, he enjoys great though subtle popularity among the Inquisition, who often places him in opposite to his brother Andezo.

 

Yucahu Sumakutaa - The Traveler, The Merciless Angel, Demigod of the Void - Although history recounts Yucahu having nothing but disdain and hostility to the new Imperial Creed, since his mission to travel to a new galaxy, he has since been fully adopted into the Ecclessiarchy against the wishes of early Void Eagles. Across the Imperium, he receives prayers and devotions from sailors and voyagers who wish to cross dangerous seas of the Warp. He is upheld as the ultimate example of a Rogue Trader, ever searching out the unknown and has shrines dedicated to him in orbital stations and other void-based civilizations. As humanity's fate continues to take darker turns with the passing millennia, it is a common prayer that Yucahu returns from the stars to deliver the Imperium's people. 

 

Pionus Santor - The Twice-Born, Demigod of Medicine, Guardian of the Seas - Pionus is unusual in that his second form crosses two species: human and Aeldari. As such, Ecclessiarchy branches tend to be polarized in view depending on how accepting they are of the Munetari. Those who favor the Munetari, naturally are supportive of Pionus, while those against the Munetari tend to view Pionus as corrupted or broken. What is universal is his worship among physicians, healers, and apothecaries. It is not unusual for apothecarions and hospitals to feature Pionus in one of his two aspects on the walls or to post one of his beloved sayings. Finally, Pionus is often contrasted with his Damned brother Morro. Ever since his disappearance, many myths and 'sightings' proclaim that Pionus has traveled into the deep waters to do battle with his kin and to hold him there to protect humanity.

Edited September 12, 2017 by simison

[bluntblade]

I'd put Gwal somewhere around Yucahu and Azus' tier.

 

As for Pionus, originally the plan was that the Scions enforced a policy of total secrecy regarding what was in that machine. We could have some fun with it along the lines of "in M33 a sect appeared claiming that it was a melding of human and Eldar technology. Those making the claims were charged with Heresy and executed."

[simison]

Not sure about the executions, but I can definitely modify the segment.

 

And I'd rather not. There should be a penalty for that long period of neutrality. Even then, Gwal is at the top of the Misguided. Only barely missing the Blessed status.

[bluntblade]

That's me totally missing the section with Gwal. All good now I've taken stock

[bluntblade]

Are the Drowned involved in our Rangdan Xenocides? I realised that Raktra's discovery pushes them (or the Second, perhaps, with the First being bad but not apocalyptic) further back, circa 935-40 M30. Which could work as the point at which the Drowned first operate as a single entity. Edited September 13, 2017 by bluntblade

[simison]

[i was under the impression they were. Here are the remaining four and Pionus' tweaked entry.]

 

Pionus Santor - The Twice-Born, Demigod of Medicine, Guardian of the Seas - Pionus is unusual in that he has survived death once in a new form. No other Primarch has managed to survive death's door besides him, making him a popular figure in worship warding away disease.  Additionally, he is beloved among physicians, healers, and apothecaries. It is not unusual for apothecarions and hospitals to feature Pionus in one of his two aspects on the walls or to post one of his beloved sayings. Of less certainty are the rumors that he is touched by the Aeldari in some vague meaning or form. Finally, Pionus is often contrasted with his Damned brother Morro. Ever since his disappearance, many myths and 'sightings' proclaim that Pionus has traveled into the deep waters to do battle with his kin and to hold him there to protect humanity.

 

Hectarion Mycenor - The Vanguard, Demigod of Vengeance, The Second Warmaster - It is only because of Hectarion's resistance against the Ecclessiarchy that he is not higher within the informal pantheon. For he is greatly worshipped for his part in the holy Scouring that sent the Traitors fleeing into the Warp and slain many daemons. The Cult of Hectarion flourishes among all warriors and soldiers, but especially for those who are first into the battle. In another aspect, it is his rage and hatred that is often invoked in the war against Chaos. His Cult only grows stronger with each sighting of the mysterious one-eyed prophet, who many believe is an angel of some sorts for the vaunted Demigod. 

 

Daer'dd Niimkiikaa - The Pillar, The First Martyr, Demigod of Metal - Although dead long before the Ecclessiarchy's founding, due to how vigorously the Iron Bears have embraced the Imperial Creed, Daerr'd enjoys retroactive significance. Among his brothers, he is invoked by those who wish to emulate is steadfastness and sheer physical strength. Surprisingly, he has been adopted by the Orgyn as their deity, equaling the importance of the Emperor. Among the rest of the Imperium, he is celebrated for his craftsmanship, many artisans will invoke blessings of Daer'dd over their work. Whenever the Godslayers reappear to spread their sickness in realspace, his name is often invoked in vengeance against them.

 

Niklaas - The Forger, Tester of Faith, Demigod of Fire - For a great deal of time, Niklaas was the Ecclessiarchy. Assuming control over it not long after the end of the Insurrection, Niklaas proved to be an exacting demigod, measuring the various branches and cults that arose in the aftermath. Those that did not meet his mysterious standards were cast down or brought into the fold through more correct teachings. Many of the mannerisms and beliefs to have survived that period have only done so with Niklaas' support and approval. Outside the Ecclessiarchy, any defender who finds himself under siege or any who wish to build grand fortresses will invoke blessings in his name. Fire is his element bar none, and it sees much usage in the Ecclessiarchy and against the daemonic legions.

 

Alexandros Darshan VonSalim - The Defender, Divinity of Sanctity, The Warmaster - While cults existed previously, it would be Alexandros' Divinatus that would lend intellectual strength and direction, eventually sparking unprecedented growth. By revealing himself as its author and proclaiming the Emperor's and his true nature, he solidified his position among mortals. Through his sacrifice, evil was denied, and humanity was saved. Only the Emperor, who is at the center of the Imperial Creed outshines Alexandros in the minds of the faithful. All this and the on-going records of miracles ensure Alexandros' importance remains undiminished over the millennia.

[TheBlindPrimarch]

As a member of a military family, all I can say is whatever helps you sleep blind although in all seriousness, I was using it as an example. Didn't mean to offend.

 

Also, noted. Heredes=Solar Auxilia not Imperial Army.

lol no offense taken...

[Kelborn]

Guys, got a question.

 

Although I'm joined the team for quite a while now, I'm still kind of struggeling to understand a handful of our Primarchs and their concepts. ^^"

 

That is when I came up with the idea of having something like a behind the scenes thing. What do I mean by that?

 

How about each and everyone of use sums up the idea behind their respective Primarch?

Cultural influences? Certain historical or fictional figure on which they are basing on? Generel idea? Something like that.

 

I could implement these in our "Here to start" thread as it would give new members / interested people a summary of our pantheon of awesomeness. As Primarchs are the main protagonists and antagonists in every fanbased project, this could be turn into a decent source of understanding them.

 

Just my two cents.

Edited September 14, 2017 by Kelborn

[TheBlindPrimarch]

I second this idea, especially for those of us in the project that aren't the creators of one of the BotL Primarchs that still want to contribute to this amazing project. Writing literature for a faction you didn't have a hand in creating can be difficult, especially when it's hard to get a firm grasp on the concepts behind the characters that play a pivotal role in the narrative.

[TheBlindPrimarch]

And I think we can all agree that it's a right pain in the neck to flip through page after page looking for one tid bit of information that might not even be where your looking.

[bluntblade]

Kel, maybe pop the example marines poster in Here To Start as well?

[Kelborn]

Oh yeah.

Great idea, Blunt. :)

 

Will add it when I'm back home.

 

Further, I will make use of spoiler tags in order to prevent a MASSIVE post. Could be intimidating at first. ^^

[Chief Captain Redd]

I support this idea.