The implications of Guillimans return for the Imperium.

[ronin_cse]

I honestly think he's going to be like Augustus when he took power. He will do it while maintaining an illusion that the High Lords are still in charge.

 

Well to be fair that is basically what happened in Imperium Secundus. Sanguinius was basically just a figure head with Guilliman being the one who was actually in charge.

[Brother Captain Ed]

Isn't one of the honorary titles for one of the highlord positions "Roboute Guilliman" anyways?

 

 

Lord Guilliman.

I think they did away that after the War of the Beast, though.

[Sete]

Can't remember the end of the series, was really poor (my opinion) and coming from Guy Haley :/

[Demigod]

As far as I remember the head of the councils title is actually Lord Guiliman and he represents no institution. So he would just taking the place with his own name on it.

 

The thing is I don't see how any of the other primarchs when they return will see this in a positive light. 60% of the SM chapters are Ultramarines descendants, RG has a position with his own name on it and will probably act like the de-facto ruler of the Imperium. Russ,Lion,Dorn and Corax would have some serious issues with this.

 

I truly hope that GW does not go and do some stupid thing like the other primarchs returning and just going off to fight battles like the good soldiers they are while RG and the ultramarines rule.

[ronin_cse]

 

Isn't one of the honorary titles for one of the highlord positions "Roboute Guilliman" anyways?

 

 

Lord Guilliman.

I think they did away that after the War of the Beast, though.

 

 

I could have sworn that I had read that title in some other book before reading The Beast Arises series, can't remember which book though so might not be the case

As far as I remember the head of the councils title is actually Lord Guiliman and he represents no institution. So he would just taking the place with his own name on it.

 

The thing is I don't see how any of the other primarchs when they return will see this in a positive light. 60% of the SM chapters are Ultramarines descendants, RG has a position with his own name on it and will probably act like the de-facto ruler of the Imperium. Russ,Lion,Dorn and Corax would have some serious issues with this.

 

I truly hope that GW does not go and do some stupid thing like the other primarchs returning and just going off to fight battles like the good soldiers they are while RG and the ultramarines rule.

 

Well considering most of the possibly surviving primarchs are just lost in the warp fighting their own battles I'd say it's their fault for not returning sooner :p

[Sete]

I don't think Dorn would have an issue.

He is a soldier first and foremost, not a politic.

 

Black Templar dogma in the other hand...

[Captain Idaho]

That's general established lore. A random chapter master of the Space Marines is sent to represent the Astartes on the table of the High Lords.

 

Are you mistaking the Inquisitorial Representative for the Space Marines one, because Codex Imperialis, which to my knowledge is the only source on the subject, makes no mention of the Space Marines Chapters?

[Ishagu]

I may have!

 

however...

 

 

 

**Spoiler from Beast Arises**

 

 

 

 

The chapter master of the Imperial Fists does take a seat amongst the High Lords in M32 during the War of the Beast.

 

[ronin_cse]

I may have!

 

however...

 

 

 

**Spoiler from Beast Arises**

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The chapter master of the Imperial Fists does take a seat amongst the High Lords in M32 during the War of the Beast.

 

 

Didn't spoil me since I'm past that part, but maybe consider putting stuff like that in spoiler tags like I just did? ;)

[Ishagu]

I would but I'm on my phone :-/

[Captain Idaho]

That's not the same thing though. He's not representative of all Chapters but stepping into Guilliman's old seat on the council I believe.

 

Implies it's still an available post if someone does indeed hold it.

[Claws and Effect]

The thing is I don't see how any of the other primarchs when they return will see this in a positive light. 60% of the SM chapters are Ultramarines descendants, RG has a position with his own name on it and will probably act like the de-facto ruler of the Imperium. Russ,Lion,Dorn and Corax would have some serious issues with this.

 

I truly hope that GW does not go and do some stupid thing like the other primarchs returning and just going off to fight battles like the good soldiers they are while RG and the ultramarines rule.

Corax's response would be determined by how Guilliman went about it. If he simply took a seat on the High Lords council and worked to undo ten millennia of corruption and incompetence, he'd probably be more or less okay with it as long as Roboute sought input from his brothers.

 

If he became a tyrant, however, Corax and the Raven Guard, and probably most of their successor chapters, would go renegade almost immediately.

 

Lion and Russ would be the ones whose response I'd worry about.

[Marshal Rohr]

 

The thing is I don't see how any of the other primarchs when they return will see this in a positive light. 60% of the SM chapters are Ultramarines descendants, RG has a position with his own name on it and will probably act like the de-facto ruler of the Imperium. Russ,Lion,Dorn and Corax would have some serious issues with this.

 

I truly hope that GW does not go and do some stupid thing like the other primarchs returning and just going off to fight battles like the good soldiers they are while RG and the ultramarines rule.

Corax's response would be determined by how Guilliman went about it. If he simply took a seat on the High Lords council and worked to undo ten millennia of corruption and incompetence, he'd probably be more or less okay with it as long as Roboute sought input from his brothers.

 

If he became a tyrant, however, Corax and the Raven Guard, and probably most of their successor chapters, would go renegade almost immediately.

 

Lion and Russ would be the ones whose response I'd worry about.

 

 

More tyrannical than the Emperor's own regime during the time he was alive? What would that even be like? 

[the jeske]

That's not the same thing though. He's not representative of all Chapters but stepping into Guilliman's old seat on the council I believe.

 

Implies it's still an available post if someone does indeed hold it.

True. Plus it is impossible to take someones place in the empire while they live. That is why there was no second emperor elected or why G-man didn't get a replacment.

[Enaleth]

Aren't the Chapter Masters allowed to take a High Lord seat when they want? II think they never do because it takes so long just to get there and that meanwhile you can't dispatch your brothers around, but I always remebered that they could if they wanted.

 

I also wonder what will happen with Calgar. Will Guilliman lead the Imperium from Terra while Calgar lead what's left of the Ultramarines? Or will he use the Ultra as bodyguards/wardogs/bullies?

[Viridia]

I believe that somewhere in the grim darkness of one of the older rulebooks (be it fifth or fourth), it discusses the different positions in the High Lords of Terra and mentions that among the lower bands of lords who are sometimes promoted in, one is the representative of the Adeptus Astartes, but that for obvious reasons, both sides try to minimise this (the Astartes because it's less xenos-cleansing time, the rest of the High Lords because the Heresy is apparently still proof that Astartes can't be trusted with wider-scale power (gently ignoring Vangorich, Cardinal Bucharis, Goge Vandire, the saint from the Abyssal Crusade))

 

 

I do wonder if Guillimann's old position got completely dropped after the War of the Beast, with no-one willing to step into Vulkan/Koorland/Thane's ceramite shoes and hence why the master of the Imperial Estates General or the Administratum chief is the top-dog.

 

[Urriak Urruk]

Now this is BoLS (I read it only for the editorials I swear) but they are confirming several rumors UNTRUE.

 

 

-Abaddon will not die.

-The Emperor will not die.

-Cypher will not reveal identity.

 

 

 

BoLS must have a copy of GSIII and thinks debunking the craziest rumors won't get them in trouble. Fair assessment, though ironic considering they spread around many of these rumors themselves.

 

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/03/rumor-control-rise-primarch.html

[Ishagu]

They don't have the book. It's just more guessing, imo.

[Volt]

Now this is BoLS (I read it only for the editorials I swear) but they are confirming several rumors UNTRUE.

 

 

-Abaddon will not die.

-The Emperor will not die.

-Cypher will not reveal identity.

 

 

 

BoLS must have a copy of GSIII and thinks debunking the craziest rumors won't get them in trouble. Fair assessment, though ironic considering they spread around many of these rumors themselves.

 

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2017/03/rumor-control-rise-primarch.html

They're covering all their bases so they can point and say they were right all along.

[totgeboren]

I believe that somewhere in the grim darkness of one of the older rulebooks (be it fifth or fourth), it discusses the different positions in the High Lords of Terra and mentions that among the lower bands of lords who are sometimes promoted in, one is the representative of the Adeptus Astartes, but that for obvious reasons, both sides try to minimise this (the Astartes because it's less xenos-cleansing time, the rest of the High Lords because the Heresy is apparently still proof that Astartes can't be trusted with wider-scale power (gently ignoring Vangorich, Cardinal Bucharis, Goge Vandire, the saint from the Abyssal Crusade))

 

 

I do wonder if Guillimann's old position got completely dropped after the War of the Beast, with no-one willing to step into Vulkan/Koorland/Thane's ceramite shoes and hence why the master of the Imperial Estates General or the Administratum chief is the top-dog.

 

One of the ideas behind the Council of Terra, the forerunner of the High Lords, was to keep the rule of the Imperium of Man in strictly human hands. No legion dudes allowed!

A lot of things have happened since then, but I personally don't like the idea of an Astartes as a High Lord. They should be out smiting the enemies of man, not become bogged down in centuries long political plots and scheming (unless they are AL dudes in disguise ofc!)

A primarch is a completely different thing though, and in many ways i think RG would make a much larger difference as the head of the Council than as a beefed-up SM Chapter Master.

[Captain Idaho]

It's silly to think a single Chapter Master can speak for them all anyway.

 

Calgar... it's possible he's died by the time of Gulliman's revival. He's not a plastic model after all.

 

I like the idea of 2 Ultramarines forces though; the old Chapter and the new one raised to crusade with Guilliman. Doubt it'll go that way though.

[Brother Aiwass]

The thing is I don't see how any of the other primarchs when they return will see this in a positive light. 60% of the SM chapters are Ultramarines descendants, RG has a position with his own name on it and will probably act like the de-facto ruler of the Imperium. Russ,Lion,Dorn and Corax would have some serious issues with this.

I truly hope that GW does not go and do some stupid thing like the other primarchs returning and just going off to fight battles like the good soldiers they are while RG and the ultramarines rule.

Corax's response would be determined by how Guilliman went about it. If he simply took a seat on the High Lords council and worked to undo ten millennia of corruption and incompetence, he'd probably be more or less okay with it as long as Roboute sought input from his brothers.

If he became a tyrant, however, Corax and the Raven Guard, and probably most of their successor chapters, would go renegade almost immediately.

Lion and Russ would be the ones whose response I'd worry about.

More tyrannical than the Emperor's own regime during the time he was alive? What would that even be like?

Like most of the imperial citizen are actually slaves? Like having =][= running around doing their stuff? The fact that if you don't think Emps is a God now you'll be executed? There is no freedom of action or speech.

In RPG terms, the 30k empire was Legal Good, now it's (mostly) Legal Evil.

Edit:

Sorry, couldn't resist xD

[Marshal Rohr]

The thing is I don't see how any of the other primarchs when they return will see this in a positive light. 60% of the SM chapters are Ultramarines descendants, RG has a position with his own name on it and will probably act like the de-facto ruler of the Imperium. Russ,Lion,Dorn and Corax would have some serious issues with this.

I truly hope that GW does not go and do some stupid thing like the other primarchs returning and just going off to fight battles like the good soldiers they are while RG and the ultramarines rule.

Corax's response would be determined by how Guilliman went about it. If he simply took a seat on the High Lords council and worked to undo ten millennia of corruption and incompetence, he'd probably be more or less okay with it as long as Roboute sought input from his brothers.

If he became a tyrant, however, Corax and the Raven Guard, and probably most of their successor chapters, would go renegade almost immediately.

Lion and Russ would be the ones whose response I'd worry about.

More tyrannical than the Emperor's own regime during the time he was alive? What would that even be like?

Like most of the imperial citizen are actually slaves? Like having =][= running around doing their stuff? The fact that if you don't think Emps is a God now you'll be executed? There is no freedom of action or speech.

In RPG terms, the 30k empire was Legal Good, now it's (mostly) Legal Evil.

Edit:

Sorry, couldn't resist xD

Uh oh, it appears your meme has a racist joke in it. How unfortunate.

[Brother Aiwass]

How so?

[Enaleth]

I don't think that's how they would do it. I better picture them and sitting to discuss a very specific topic.

I don't think they'd come as representatives, more as advisors or as a plaintiff/petitioner/claimant (my legal English is broken, take the best pick for someone that has a request)

Anyway, apparently RG is having a hard one getting over how is the Imperium:

GW Facebook

Edit: Sorry, I did not thought it was considered cussing this way, it will not happen again.