Ventrillian Kill Team

[Expendable_Aquanaut]

Hi all,

I decided to start a new thread just for some kill team battle reports. I'll try and keep them relatively short and sweet. So here's the first one!

Mission Parameters:

1v1v1 (Necrons, Chaos proxied with sisters of battle, and the Ventrillian Nobles)

There were five objectives in the middle of the field, each worth one point every battle round that they were held. Besides that, if there was only one unbroken team at the end, they would win.

I deployed in/around the center ruins, the necrons in the ruins on the right (where they sat for the entire game) and chaos deployed in the ruins on the far side of the photo. I took a 39 point melee specialist lord commissar, a level three leader (special weapons guardsman), a level three guardsman medic and a level 2 Veteran specialist (Tempestor). I've found that the lord commissar, a tempestor, and a sergeant supported by the medic can be a quite effective close combat squad.

Necrons deployment:

Chaos deployment:

My turn one positioning:

Oh and I forgot to mention, since we have all of these mausoleums floating around... Zombies come out at random. They had pox walker stats and were a fun addition to the game even though they didn't really do too much.

So on turn two I decided to throw my Lord Commissar into the middle of the chaos kill team. The chaos commander was a level 2 melee specialist chaos lord. Because this is apparently a thing that you can do, I ordered my commissar to fight in the shooting phase. He split his attacks between the chaos lord and her friend with the chainsword. The chainsword lady was summarily krumped but the chaos lord managed to hang on with a flesh wound.

Then the fight phase happened. I think the chaos lord attacked first for some reason. Either way, the Lord Commissar took 5 wounds from her power claw (counts as power fist). I saved a whopping 0 wounds with my invuln but the medic that is just out of this shot gave me a 6plus feel no pain and I made 2 of them. Commissar survives with one wound and swings back, squashing the chaos commander. Pretty excellent fight actually.

As the commander fight swung my way, the rest of my forces started advancing on objectives. Chaos was leading by one for most of the game, the necrons (still in the ruins) had nothing. The plasma gunner in this photo had just killed two charging zombies and a charging cultist before he was charged by this possessed sister of battle. He did manage to tag her with some plasma but unfortunately it was just a flesh wound.

The brave plasma gunner gets krumped by the sister and the scion is shot out of action by the necrons but my lord commissar chops his way towards the objective and gets revenge for those poor dead guardsmen.

At this point I was holding three objectives and had tied the chaos player on points. The necron player finally brought out two of his models and claimed one objective. We rolled and the game ended. Because there was a tie on points we decided that the guardsmen were likely victorious as their commander was still standing.

Here are the survivors of my team. We started with 15 guys. Acceptable casualties? I think so.

And here is a closer shot of the interior of this terrain piece. I'm pretty happy with how it turned out. I stole the posters from Peachy's article on Warhammer Community.

It's still a bit of a WIP but It's playable. I haven't glued the building to the base yet so there may be a bit of a gap. The building was secondhand and let's just say that it was built pretty quickly.

Let me know what you think!

[WarriorFish]

Table set up is good, worthy of your Nobles :tu: KT is a lot of fun and plays quite differently, I'm still getting the hang of my Guard list (thinking of trying more Scions).

[Expendable_Aquanaut]

Thanks! Still working on terrain but it's getting there. Will eventually buy some sort of battle mat I think.

 

I can vouch for the benefits of using a few scions in kill team. The better ballistics and improved survivability mean that you can generally count on them to do some heavy lifting. Haven't used hotshot lasguns much but I love the volley guns and have had great success with meltas even though people seem to favor plasma pretty heavily. Being able to assault with them is great. Especially with a heavy specialist. You can get in some pretty cheeky shots hitting on twos and rerolling ones with the proper support. I've been running one melta one plasma and two volley guns. Seems to be a good all-comers type deal.

[WarriorFish]

I've used a few and they did quite well, I'm wondering about how a full Scion KT will perform. They're good but I found the shorter range on the hotshots a real pain as that -1BS at long range hurts them. Not for long though as the enemy close so quickly, but that just means you miss the turn 1 chances that much more :confused:

 

My melta Scion has done well too, a good way to stack the odds in your favour of removing a model outright :) Volleyguns are on my list...

[The Titanz0r]

Having almost finished a Kill Team Campaign at my FLGS, I can offer some personal experience.

Scions work extremely well when you give them proper weaponry. Ignore the hot-shot lasguns entirely. Their range and damage make their contribution negligible. Regular lasguns, however, will surprise you. Most people ignore standard guardsmen, which leaves them open to rapid fire range more often than not. I've scored more than a few lucky kills this way. The scions, you want to give plasma guns or hot-shot volley guns. I give the flamers and meltaguns to my regular guardsmen, and I've never even bothered with grenade launchers.

 

My Kill Team is set up with a Scion Heavy with Hot-Shot Volley Gun (obviously), and a Scion Sniper with a Plasma Gun. My Comms is just a Vox Guardsman, and my Leader is a Tempestor. I haven't decided if it's worth it to have the Tempestor over a Sergeant, since I always keep him away from combat anyway. The extra five points could give you another Guardsman, which may be more useful. I've got two more Scion jabronies with Plasma Guns, and four Special Weapons Guardsmen. Two of the Guardsmen have Lasguns, and two have Meltaguns or Flamers, depending on who I'm facing.

 

What I've found is that people tend to be worried about the plasma guns most, but see the meltaguns as the bigger threat for whatever reason. I tend to move the gunners in two-man teams, with the lasgun covering the meltagun. This will get them into range to make the one melta shot, and seems to force my opponent to focus on the two Joes. Having your opponent focusing on the 8-point meltagunner takes the threat away from your 13-point or more Scion Plasma gunners, especially the Sniper. The Sniper's default ability, re-roll shots of 1, allows you to supercharge with near impunity right away. Having the Comms around, or the sniper tactic, gives you a +1 to hit as needed. The Heavy Hot-Shot Volley Gun, with the tactic, throws 5 shots at whatever you need, which is good for volume of fire, forcing your opponent to make saves and inevitably fail them. I've usually set up the Sniper and Heavy on opposing sides of the field, trying to keep the Comms in the center of them, within the six inch range to give the +1 to hit. The Leader I keep nearby as well, giving whatever order is needed (Though I've found I used 'Fix Bayonets!' more than any other order, oddly enough. Usually on the meltagunners that get charged).

 

The idea is that the meltagun fireteams can move around easily toward whatever the biggest threat is (Say, a Deathwatch Fragcannon, or a Plague Marine with Flail of Corruption). If the meltagun gets a shot off, he's got a 50/50 chance to hit, and almost guarantees at least a flesh wound if it does hit. If he gets a kill, he's usually more than doubled his points return, and if he doesn't, you're out 8 points while your opponent's killer specialist is out of position and wasting his turn getting him elsewhere. This also usually leaves them open to take fire from your plasma guns or hot-shot volley gun.

 

Another interesting thing I've found is that Guardsmen will surprise the hell out of your opponent if you do something crazy with them. Don't be afraid to make a gambit, like charge some big threat. I once had a lowly lasgunner charge two Primaris Reivers that were going for my Sniper and Comms. He succeeded, and kept them both tied up for at least two turns. Weak as they are, Guardsmen can survive surprisingly well. Your opponent will need to hit, wound, and roll injury. as most melee hits at AP 0, you still generally get that 5+ save, which can help. The flesh wounds will work in your favor, too. Even at two flesh wounds, that nameless hero is holding his ground in melee and tying up those models.

 

The other thing I've found, is that most people tend to want to go for the kill, while sometimes ignoring the objective entirely to do so. Being an objective-based game, this is pretty detrimental. I've won several of my games with over half my team gone, but had my surviving Joes on the objectives. Don't be afraid to flip the script on your intentions, either. If you have some big threat you don't know how to deal with, just ignore it. Fall back and deny that asset from your opponent. An example of that is a Deathwatch opponent I faced that had a Fragcannon and Infernus Heavy Bolter. I just kept moving my guys out of range or line of sight of them, and denied his ability to even shoot for the majority of the game.

 

The most frustrating teams I faced were Death Guard and Genestealer Cult. The Death Guard, just because they're so damned difficult to wound. The Genestealer Cult gave me my only loss so far, mostly because their entire strategy is to dash across the field into melee. It didn't help any that the game I lost against that opponent was Take Prisoners. The only way to score being to do the thing my team specifically doesn't want to do, against a the team that is made specifically to do just that.

 

So, in short, the Scions are best with a few plasma guns and hot-shot volley guns. Most everything else will do with basic Guardsmen. Just remember to do what the Guard do best: Hold the line.

[Expendable_Aquanaut]

That's an interesting take. I'm not sure I would put a meltagun on a normal guardsman though. I try and give them as many shots as possible to mitigate the poor ballistics skill. I haven't tried it yet though so I shouldn't knock it. If it's been working for you I might give it a try.

 

I tend to run a couple grenade launchers (as you can see in the photos above), and they do well. They're pretty good at clearing out things like cultists and other chaff. They aren't as powerful as a melta or a plasma but they're cheaper and they should reliably put out more shots, which is really the only way to make sure that something connects. It helps break up the monotony of plasma spam too.

 

Have you tried commanders yet? I think it really changes a few things for guard lists. Mainly, I think we can be viable in melee now too: something we were really missing earlier. I'm interested to hear what you all think about lord commissars. I think that if they're properly supported they might be one of the best melee units in the game (points for points). In the battle report I mentioned that I ordered my commissar to fight in the shooting phase when he charged the enemy commander. This is a pretty huge advantage for guard commanders. Our commanders get to fight first any time they are in combat and within 12 of a leader, plus if they charged they can fight first again in the fight phase.

[The Titanz0r]

My thinking is that within 12" is too close for decent survivability. You're also taking that -1 if you're not within 6" anyway. Giving the meltagun to the Guardsman allows me to rush it up to whatever the biggest threat is and give about a 50/50 chance to delete it (within 6"), then not be concerned with what happens to that Guardsman. Scions, I find, are too valuable to be throwing into melee/charge range. I want them as far back as possible, making the most of that BS 3.

 

I've never used grenade launchers, though I've thought about using them. I just haven't had the chance to swap out my meltaguns or flamers to give me the chance. Now that the campaign at my FLGS is over, I might try giving my Scion fire team a couple of those, to see how they do.

 

I have not tried Commander yet, though I do have the book. Looking through it, it seems the Lord Commissar gives the Guard some much needed help in the melee department. Being able to order him to essentially have two fighting phases is pretty strong, as well. I'll put a team together and see what I find.

[Beams]

I've had the experience of being hit by frag grenades, so I'll chime in and say they are worth the points.

 

They can reliably put out a ton of hits, so I find myself focusing on Grenade Launchers before meltas or plasma, since they tend to have 1 or 2 shots, and a -1 or worse to hit makes it hard for them to land a hit.

[Expendable_Aquanaut]

Yeah I tend to equip scions with the better, more expensive weapons, and the grenade launchers are reserved for guardsmen but it might work out the other way around. Especially when it comes to landing a hit with a krak grenade. Let me know how it goes!

[Expendable_Aquanaut]

My gaming group have decided to start a bit of a campaign. We decided to do a mix of kill team and small combat patrol type battles to keep things fresh. The combat patrol battles are using cities of death rules (for the most part) with alternating activations like kill team.

Here is a quick write-up of a bit of a test game between my radical inquisitor, her band of stormtroopers, and some sisters of battle. The background was that my inquisitor had found some xenos tech and was planning on repurposing it, when the local sisters of battle caught wind of it and tried to put a stop to this possible heresy. The relic was in a brown building in my deployment zone and my opponent had to come take it and bring it to his deployment zone. Admittedly a tougher task for him than for me but I guess that's the way it goes sometimes.

Here is my deployment and below the photo, my list.

My 300 point list:

HQ - Lord Commissar with boltgun and blade of conquest (As I couldn't really take a patrol detachment with an inquisitor and stormtroopers this is what my inquisitor counted as)

Troops

1. Scion squad with 2 hot shot volley guns, plasma pistol, power fist

2. Scion squad with 2 plasma guns, plasma pistol, power fist

Elites

1. Crusader squad (5-man)

2. Astropath with laspistol

My vague recollection of my opponent's list:

HQ - Cannoness with power sword and boltgun?

Troops - Two battle sister squads with assorted storm bolters, heavy bolters

Elites - Seraphim squad with melta pistols and mistress of repentance with the power whip

Turn 1:

My crusaders use their act of faith to move twice and make it to the middle of the board. Unfortunately they are stuck there in range of all of my opponents guns. The upside is that I managed to cast my only successful psychic power of the game and gave them a 2 plus invulnerable save with psychic barrier.

Turn 2:

My crusaders survived the shooting phase last turn and manage to start a bit of a melee in the opponent's side of the board. I had never used crusaders before and I wasn't sure how they were going to work out but they managed to cause enough of a pain in the backfield to keep a lot of pressure off of my scion squads. This let them keep shooting at full force for most of the game.

Turn 3:

My plasma squad moves up to get in range of a squad of sisters who are commandeering a searchlight. They end up advancing to the base of the tower, out of sight of the squad above.

Turn 4:

The crusaders put up a good fight but finally go down in the face of overwhelming odds. They held off a seraphim squad, cannoness, and mistress of repentance for a solid three turns.

My plasma squad charges into the sisters squad that is holding the searchlight tower. It looks pretty bleak in this shot but the rest of the squad is right behind the tempestor, on the ladder. "Hey sarge, we're right behind you, I promise!"

The scions manage to take out 3 of the sisters this turn, and one more the following turn. They take three casualties themselves but hold strong. The power fist on the tempestor is not always worth the 8 points but it can do some damage when it connects.

Turn 5:

The seraphim squad manages to land near the relic and catch my hot shot volley gun squad off guard. With a well-placed frag grenade and height advantage, the two sisters manage to take out 4 scions. Cities of death rules make grenades worth throwing by maxing the number of hits and making height advantage annul the effects of cover. Honestly, even though it was my squad getting blown to bits it seemed to make sense that if a grenade was dropped on top of them they wouldn't fare too well. Anyway, although he survives the initial onslaught the tempestor is melta pistoled in the face at the beginning of next turn. My psyker also fails to smite the seraphim and suffers perils of the warp. He survives but almost gets blammed by the inquisitor / commissar.

Turn 6:

The final turn. My psyker and inquisitor move up to confront the seraphim and we agree to call the game. Barring any more perils issues, it looks like the seraphim are in a tough spot. Maybe the inquisitor will show them some mercy. With a little reconditioning they might turn out to be some useful acolytes.

All in all, a pretty fun game. The cities of death rules are a fun addition and it was interesting to play with so few points. It goes pretty quickly. Maybe as fast as kill team. I can't decide if I will be taking a radical inquisitor for the campaign or if I'm going to swap her out for a tempestor prime. If we expand the point values I guess I can always fit him in later. Since my crusaders are basically scions with shields I think having a prime lead them still makes sense. I'm open to suggestions! I'll post some updates and a more narrative battle report once we get started with the campaign. I've also ordered part of the sector imperialis realm of battle board so hopefully we can get some games on something a bit nicer looking.

More to come soon!

[Beams]

Nice report! Looking forward to reading more!