the BIG 9th edition room

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

They are well worth it. You get four shotguns per kit.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

There is also neophyte heads wearing Oakleys !!

[Maritn]

and now I gotta decide if I want to run my guys as two squads of 10 or one squad of 20

 

Same here... still undecided how to equip the Neophytes from my second box. The first 4 have chainswords. Not being allowed to mix is quite annoying...

[Tiger9gamer]

I have some spare assault intercessors, so it would be easy as pie to build two sword brothers and swap the model for an intercessors when I wanna run big squads. Blasts are going to be scary, but hey if they are shooting at the crusaders it leaves my vanguard vets free!

[Brother Kraskor]

I'm not sure what to think about squads of 20. You'll never get them all in engagement range, so what is the squad size for - durability? Why not two squads of ten, more flexible, less prone to blasts. 

 

If they were shooting and you were buffing shooting somehow then the buff would become most efficient on a squad of 20 because they can all fire through each other. But their shooting isn't great and neither are our shooting buffs. 

 

I don't know, it feels fluffy and should be right but I think squads of ten are more flexible.

[CrystalSeer]

I'm not sure what to think about squads of 20. You'll never get them all in engagement range, so what is the squad size for - durability? Why not two squads of ten, more flexible, less prone to blasts.

 

If they were shooting and you were buffing shooting somehow then the buff would become most efficient on a squad of 20 because they can all fire through each other. But their shooting isn't great and neither are our shooting buffs.

 

I don't know, it feels fluffy and should be right but I think squads of ten are more flexible.

It's for durability and maximizing strats/litanies. Gets mortal wound generation and/or 5+++ on twice as many guys. Makes transhuman hit twice as many.

 

I plan on getting around the engagement range limitations by running them shooty.

[Brother Kraskor]

Yeah so like I said. Yes you get durability advantages. But for offense, if you run them ranged there's not much to write home about. Massed S4 AP0. 

 

If we could mix and match Litany disciplines you could take 5+++ and the +1 to wound with ranged litany, now then it would be interesting.

Edited December 18, 2021 by Brother Kraskor

[CrystalSeer]

Almost 50 shots if bolters, and I'm leaning in to the pyreblasters.

 

They take up a big chunk of space and are durable as hell, so I'm marching them up the mid field reinforced by grimaldus. If people are in midfield, hit them 40 something + 4d6 str4. If they get charged, be durable as hell, then hit them back with mortals. If someone deepstrikes to charge, 4d6 hits with auspex.

 

Not necessarily a hammer unit but very well suited to hold back to mid field and play zone defense.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Yeah so like I said. Yes you get durability advantages. But for offense, if you run them ranged there's not much to write home about. Massed S4 AP0. 

 

If we could mix and match Litany disciplines you could take 5+++ and the +1 to wound with ranged litany, now then it would be interesting.

 

Could be one of the rare situations where Accept comes into it's own, you can stay in Tac Doctrine for turns 2 and 3, and still get assault doctrine if anyone gets into you, you can also maximise the models in engagement range using Devout Push.

[Brother Kraskor]

Good point re: Devout Push! Though I think I'd rather keep 5++.

[SkimaskMohawk]

I just finished up a small, 6 person, 3 round event. I was warned it was skewed to very competitive lists in the past, and the majority of the players were dedicated tournament players (one of them rocked a 4 hour drive); I just took the same templar list I could field WYSIWYG from last time I played:

 

+++ Zeal (Warhammer 40,000 9th Edition) [105 PL, 8CP, 1,998pts] +++

 

++ Battalion Detachment 0CP (Imperium - Adeptus Astartes - Black Templars) ++

 

+ Configuration +

 

Battle Size: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)

 

Chapter Selection: Black Templars

 

Detachment Command Cost

 

+ Stratagems +

 

Strategem: Relics of the Chapter: 2x Number of Extra Relics

 

+ HQ +

 

Primaris Chaplain: 1. Litany of Divine Protection, 4. Fires of Devotion, Ancient Breviary, Chapter Command: Master of Sanctity, Litany of Hate

 

Primaris Chaplain on Bike: 3. Exhortation of Rage, Litany of Hate, Rites of War, Tannhauser's Bones, Warlord

 

Primaris Chapter Master: Chapter Command: Chapter Master

. . Auto-flamer and Master-crafted power sword: Auto-flamer, Master-crafted power sword

 

+ Troops +

 

Assault Intercessor Squad

. . 4x Assault Intercessor: 4x Astartes Chainsword, 4x Frag & Krak grenades, 4x Heavy Bolt Pistol

. . Assault Intercessor Sgt: Astartes Chainsword, Heavy Bolt Pistol

 

Assault Intercessor Squad

. . 4x Assault Intercessor: 4x Astartes Chainsword, 4x Frag & Krak grenades, 4x Heavy Bolt Pistol

. . Assault Intercessor Sgt: Astartes Chainsword, Heavy Bolt Pistol

 

Tactical Squad

. . 4x Space Marine: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Boltgun, 4x Frag & Krak grenades

. . Space Marine Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

 

+ Elites +

 

Apothecary: Chapter Command: Chief Apothecary, Selfless Healer, Stratagem: Hero of the Chapter, The Crusader's Helm

 

Bladeguard Veteran Squad: Icon of Heinmann

. . 5x Bladeguard Veteran: 5x Frag & Krak grenades, 5x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 5x Master-crafted power sword, 5x Storm Shield

. . Bladeguard Veteran Sergeant: Heavy Bolt Pistol

 

Invictor Tactical Warsuit: Twin ironhail autocannon

 

Redemptor Dreadnought: 2x Storm Bolters, Icarus Rocket Pod, Macro Plasma Incinerator, Onslaught Gatling Cannon

 

Redemptor Dreadnought: 2x Storm Bolters, Icarus Rocket Pod, Macro Plasma Incinerator, Onslaught Gatling Cannon

 

Terminator Assault Squad: The Crux Obsidian

. . Assault Terminator Sergeant: Champion of the Feast

. . . . Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield: Thunder hammer

. . 5x Assault Terminator w/THSS: 5x Storm shield, 5x Thunder hammer

 

+ Fast Attack +

 

Attack Bike Squad: Holy Orb

. . Attack Bike: Multi-melta

 

+ Dedicated Transport +

 

Impulsor: 2x Storm Bolters, Ironhail Skytalon Array, Multi-melta

 

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

 

I carpooled over with my main 9th buddy (where all my games with my templars have been put in) and another buddy.

 

In classic event fashion, I played the latter, who's list was freebootaz speed mob featuring 2 wazbommas, 4 koptas, 1 trike and the rest was buggies (3 of everything except the boosta blasta). Mission was vital intelligence.

 

He went first. The game ended on top of 3, 92 to 21 for him. Losing that hard went full circle into being hilarious, and I took the moral victory of not giving up full points.

 

The tradition of events continued with my second game going up against my first buddy's cult of time (I think) thousand sons. He had a brick of scarabs, another 5 man unit of them, Ahriman, some spawn, and roughly 35 rubrics and a couple rhinos. Mission was priority targets. After a quick question period of weapon profiles I decided to go Abhor for my vow.

 

He went first. And promptly moved up the board into me. His psychic powers and shooting crippled an invictor and a redemptor. In return, I disembarked blade guard from impulsor for an effective 12" and charged a brick of rubrics with them and the spawn with the chaplain and assault intercessors. I failed a stunning 6" charge with my fully buffed unit of assault terminators, who spent the rest of the game grinding down his brick of scarabs. His turn 2 saw him wiff a lot of psychic powers and fail a key charge from his 5 cross-board teleporting scarabs; I was able to snipe Ahriman with the bladeguard and start mopping his rubrics up. He picked the wrong secondary (grind instead of priority) because he felt like it was a waste to practice priority with the upcoming changes; he also screwed up his cabal point generation by not having a couple units on the board (in transports instead) and obviously got too close. We called it on turn 4 with 85-57 for me; reroll 1s to wound with thunderhammers or bladeguard are super nasty.

 

Game 3 was finally against a new opponent, who was also the event runner and a great host. He was playing pure leviathan with 2x 6 hive guard, a maleceptor, malanthrope, tervigon, 2x 11 genestealers, 2x 3 rippers, 2x 3 warriors, 2x 25 devil gaunts and 2 lictors. I know Tyranids are up there and are also obtuse to try and understand the multilayered buff system that results in big synergy. We played retrieval mission. After another question period, I decided to go with abhor again. I knew his gameplan was to castle, and he didn't have any reliable -3 and my obvious threats were all t7.

 

He went first. His hiveguard tiered on redemptor and killed my invictor; the -1 damage really came in handy, even with one unit being able to reroll damage. Similar to my previous game, I blasted up the board; my bike chaplain went into his unit of devil gaunts (but on the wrong side, so they piled on to the objective and claimed it from my rite of war blade guard lol), my impulsor dumped the bladeguard right on his doorstep on one of the outer objectives and I killed 10 gene stealers with shooting. His turn 2 saw him cripple the wounded redemptor on its last tier, but a double shoot round of hive guard was spent killing 4 blade guard; icon of heinman really stumped him. This allowed me to respond with clearing his last stealer and warriors, charging his rippers with the bgv, his hive guard touching the side wall of their building with my full-reroll redemptor and his front screening rippers with my terminators. The game quickly spiraled from there with the terminators fighting both units of hive guard and his genestealers and his maleceptor, the redemptor reducing the tervigon to 1 wound before getting killed and generally just some very good saves on my part. We talked it out after the dust settles on top of 4, resulting in 82 to 63 for me.

 

So a pretty good showing all things considered. My opponents made some pretty big mistakes in games I won, but I also don't play a ton of 9th so they definitely have the advantage. Standout move was push+abhor for the bonus 6", allowing for a lot of early charges. The terminators performed fantastically, and I'm going to say I was wrong about double brick and bgv; they're very good as an additional threat when combined with with the pressure of the bike chaplain on one side and the dreads+terminators going down the middle. I also remembered to use the holy orb in two games, skunking scarabs and stealers with it, so nice value there. The invictor was hilarious for how it was a fire magnet that distracts people from bruning down the actual threats. If it doesn't die turn 1, it dies turn 2, but either way, the infantry and real dreads get where they need to be.

 

As for my first, crushing loss. My opponent went on to crush the event; the 92 points he got against me was the lowest he scored, and the only person to earn more against him was another very strong ork list that got turn 1 and made a long bomb kill rig charge. And still got blasted off by turn 2. In the end, I got 3rd and I was only 19 vp off the killrig ork list; if the first turn went to the other person on my game 1 or their game 3, I could have easily placed second. Either way, very pleased with the templars when I expected 0-3 and hoped for 1-2.

Edited December 19, 2021 by SkimaskMohawk

[Urkh]

Jolly good show!

[Tiger9gamer]

I gotta get some games in but everything is getting in the way. it's good to hear from people though!

I still wanna get more info on my two powerfist crusader squads. I hope they are good after all the trouble I am going through getting them prepared!

[TheUnlikelyGamer84]

Deadly Cargo stratagem. What do we reckon to 5 Centurions riding in a LRC. The Centurions have a fairly reliable 20" threat range (LRC moves 10", Cents disembark 3", can re-roll charges so reliable 7" charge).

Did you try this out? I was also wondering about cents in LRC

[SirJyo]

*edit* nvm Edited December 20, 2021 by SirJyo

[Brother Kraskor]

 

Deadly Cargo stratagem. What do we reckon to 5 Centurions riding in a LRC. The Centurions have a fairly reliable 20" threat range (LRC moves 10", Cents disembark 3", can re-roll charges so reliable 7" charge).

Did you try this out? I was also wondering about cents in LRC

 

 

Feels like a lot eggs in one basket though. That's like 600pts easy.

[Brother Carpenter]

what is the squad size for - durability?.

Zeal

 

That's all there is to say.

[Tiger9gamer]

So outside of uphold the emperor’s honor, which vow looks to be the best? I am almost thinking suffer not would be the best against higher toughness units like orks or death guard, but I dunno

[Tokugawa]

Always uphold against DG. With -1t contagion, many DG weapons wound you on 2s.

[CrystalSeer]

Kind of depends; the passions make them all situational. I tend to think in terms of 'if I used Fervent Acclamation' what would I pick?'

 

I think I could see Abhor just for the 3" move. Paired with grimaldus, devout push, and crusaders, you could move 15"+D3 t1 and still be able to shoot assault weapons without penalty. That's pretty good for taking the mid-board. I'm tempted to try it with a 20 man blob and just own the center.

 

'Suffer Not' is probably good against Orks and Nidzilla, but it's not straight forward. It's passion is probably the least restrictive though.

 

'Accept' is a great bonus but the passion is terrible. I'd only consider it with very specific builds.

[Prot]

A lot of people don't play DG competitively. They've written them off, but I still think of them as that really weird match up that a LOT of close combat armies struggle with.

 

I have played and play against them regularly and it doesn't matter if I'm playing Scars, Chaos, Templars, Custodes, it all hits a brick wall with DG. Typically you are stuck in for much longer than you want to be, at a lower Toughness, and often robbed of re-rolls, damage, and freedom of movement.

 

I would look at Vows that help your list maintain speed, shooting superiority and this includes taking down Obsec (poxwalkers/etc).

[SkimaskMohawk]

Well it really comes down to list construction. A very real problem to run into is an over reliance on uphold to provide staying power and the list becoming rather fragile if the vow is swapped out. If you never intend on swapping, that's not really a problem, but if you do intend to try and tech your vow to the mission and opponent, then the list needs to stand on its own a bit.

 

Assuming that the weapon profiles just don't give you any use for taking uphold, and that they have a psyker to actually unlock Abhor, I'd have to say that Abhor is the most useful of the remaining three.

 

People tend to play (and act) out of routine. I told my one opponent, a guy I've played almost all my BT games against, that I was taking a different vow and what it did. He repeated the 3" benefits to himself as we deployed. He still moved forward turn 1 and forgot about it. Getting onto the objectives faster as a cohesive army, blocking movement with transports, threatening or charging turn 1 when they thought they'd have two turns before worrying about it are all great benefits.

 

Another thing that's pretty unique to Abhor; it kind of...has no passion. Now if you built your list for Rod, then it certainly does have a passion and it can be crippling to rod with abhor. But if you dont plan on taking it, their psyker presence is a backline buffing one, then the passion won't kick in.

[Tokugawa]

Another templar player got top in 30 players GT.

 

list:

 

++ Patrol Detachment 0CP (Imperium – Adeptus Astartes – Black Templars) [64 PL, 1,217pts, -1CP] ++

 

+ Configuration +

 

Chapter Selection: Black Templars

 

Detachment Command Cost

 

+ HQ +

 

Chaplain Grimaldus [7 PL, 140pts]: 1. Litany of Divine Protection, 4. Fires of Devotion, Litany of Hate

 

High Marshal Helbrecht [8 PL, 160pts]

 

+ Troops +

 

Primaris Crusader Squad [20 PL, 247pts]: Bolt Pistol and Astartes Chainsword

. 5x Primaris Initiate w/Chainsword & Heavy Bolt Pistol: 5x Astartes Chainsword, 5x Frag & Krak grenades, 5x Heavy Bolt Pistol

. 8x Primaris Neophytes: 8x Frag & Krak grenades

. Primaris Sword Brother: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Power axe

 

+ Elites +

 

Primaris Apothecary [5 PL, 115pts]: Chapter Command: Chief Apothecary, Selfless Healer, The Aurillian Shroud, Warlord

 

Redemptor Dreadnought [9 PL, 180pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launchers, Macro Plasma Incinerator, Onslaught Gatling Cannon

 

+ Fast Attack +

 

Inceptor Squad [15 PL, 375pts, -1CP]: Plasma Exterminator x2, The Crux Obsidian

. 5x Inceptor

. Inceptor Sergeant: Champion of the Feast

 

++ Patrol Detachment -2CP (Imperium – Adeptus Astartes – Black Templars) [45 PL, 782pts, 9CP] ++

 

+ Configuration +

 

Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)

 

Chapter Selection: Black Templars

 

Detachment Command Cost [-2CP]

 

+ Stratagems +

 

Strategem: Relics of the Chapter [-1CP]: Number of Extra Relics

 

+ HQ +

 

Primaris Chaplain [5 PL, 85pts]: 6. Canticle of Hate (Aura), Litany of Hate, The Crusader’s Helm

 

+ Troops +

 

Primaris Crusader Squad [20 PL, 247pts]: Bolt Pistol and Astartes Chainsword

. 5x Primaris Initiate w/Chainsword & Heavy Bolt Pistol: 5x Astartes Chainsword, 5x Frag & Krak grenades, 5x Heavy Bolt Pistol

. 8x Primaris Neophytes: 8x Frag & Krak grenades

. Primaris Sword Brother: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Power axe

 

+ Fast Attack +

 

Attack Bike Squad [6 PL, 180pts] .

Attack Bike: Multi-melta

. Attack Bike: Multi-melta

. Attack Bike: Multi-melta

 

+ Heavy Support +

 

Eradicator Squad [14 PL, 270pts]: Melta rifle

. 5x Eradicator: 5x Bolt pistol

. Eradicator Sgt

 

++ Total: [109 PL, 1,999pts, 8CP] ++

Edited December 22, 2021 by Tokugawa

[Brother Kraskor]

Interesting use of relic & Crux on the Inceptors, presumably to tank damage and then Apoc revives. 

 

Almost wonder if they'd be better off with Heinmann and using the +1 armour save strat. So the Champion is 2+ ignoring AP1 and 2. 

[Tokugawa]

Unyielding only work against dmg1 attacks. Once locked inceptor/eradicator in sight, your opponent will throw all the high dmg attacks at them. Not only dmg1 attacks. They have very high hostility.

 

Icon of heinmann should always pair with natural-born 2+ save units.