Speculation on the Horus Heresy Road Map?

[Dezron]

My bet is on 30k Admech going full plastic. 

 

But my other wild crazy guess is... 

 

Imperial Army. 

 

Not Solaris Auxilia, not Militia. 

 

Just Imperial Army. Few Infantry options and few new (Old) vehicles that till now were just mentioned and maybe new Baneblade variant to fill up the chart. 

 

[oldhat]

Aside from Dark Mech and Imperial Army - both of which feel somewhat redundant, but also offer good chances to create new plastic lines - are there any other Heresy-era relevant factions they can even do?

[Dezron]

1 minute ago, oldhat said:

Aside from Dark Mech and Imperial Army - both of which feel somewhat redundant, but also offer good chances to create new plastic lines - are there any other Heresy-era relevant factions they can even do?

 

Daemons, but I feel they will get Militia treatment (Look at whole Chaos range and dare to tell me it's small). 

 

Other is Solar Auxilia moving into plastic. 

 

Third is Blackshields, but again I feel they will get Militia treatment. 

 

That's all armies that I can think of. 

[spessmarine]

9 hours ago, Xenith said:

LoW's are probably the cerastus and the retooled marine tanks - again, someone told me that they said the other cerastus variants will depend on the reception to the cerastus.

That doesn't make sense. Knight-Lancer is out summer while the LoWs in Autumn and are in the plastics row. The other variants are to the knight body what Typhon/Cerberus are to the Spartan chassis. 

[Noserenda]

See, neither Mechanicum or Daemon makes any sense to me due to scale, we are looking at 3, maybe 4 plastic kits at a push, less if they need big frames and both ranges are just too diverse to work in a reasonable manner, with essentially no crossover between units except in a very limited sense and whilst big robots will probably sell, whats the USP of a fifth range of daemons thats going to make plastic level sales?

The reason Auxilla and Sisters work well for a launch like this is most of their units are the same infantry with different weapon loadouts, which could be in box or easily done as a resin upgrade. 

I think we will eventually see Mechanicum in plastic, there is definitely crossover and a derth of big robots in 40k to fill if nothing else, but i dont think they will be in one quarter/a couple of months, i think theyll be over a longer period, probably once Legion basics are wrapped up and lead with a Mars book or something, its what they deserve certainly.

[Doctor Perils]

While I love the Solar Auxilia design, perhaps crossing it with the navis breacher might make more sense for GW.

 

I'd prefer sisters or dark mech though

[Brother Sutek]

4 hours ago, Petitioner's City said:

 

Thank you for answering and i get what you mean with the Shadowspear minis. It's funny as the rest of Shadowspear was so much better. Anyway, regarding the venomcrawler, or the later nasty man on scorpion thing, yeah I am not a fan of them - but then, heresy provided comparable beasties in the form of Scoria - a much superior, but still "cartoony", miniature that is dignified by a much better paint job than that given to the Shadowspear miniatures. And I do agree on the obliterators, they are such disappointments. I think as a concept all of the iterations just haven't served it well, going back to 1999. 

 

But overall i really love the chaotic Realms of Chaos feel of the DG range, and that madness is part of the heresy - this is what people are falling too, increasingly, until the full climactic explosion of chaos unbound at Terra - that utter corruption of the legion that has been central to their narrative since Lost and the Damned. The flat and bright nature of studio paint really doesn't do Death Guard any benefit (just as this doesn't do many heresy minis much benefit), but when you see what Maxime Pastourel did with Death Guard prior to sculpting the new line, you can see that a fleshy chaotic approach can feel 100% a piece with a "heresy" style.

 

But also, as I said, that fleshy-madness corruption goes back to The Lost and the Damned and its comedic-cum-depressing representation of Nurgle and the Death Guard. LatD tells us that following their corruption in the warp "their appearance changed into the disgusting form they still bear today. Now the once tall and erect Space Marines of the Death Guard are the Plague Marines of Nurgle. Their flesh bubbles with corruption, their innards spill through lesions in their putrid skin, and their bodies ooze with stick slime" (p. 256). Later, this is emphasized again: "The Death Guard Space Marines have now mutated to a degree where there corpulent and repulsive forms are hardly recognisable as human." Similarly, the descriptions of Codex Chaos in 1996 seem well-served by the fleshy excess of Pastourel's work: "Plague Marines are hideous and nauseating to behold. They swollen, decaying flesh is barely contained by their corrdoed, slime-encrusted armour. Such human carrion barely feels pain any longer [...]". Overall, it's hard to argue that those ugly bulbous death guard marines really capture the representation of plague marines and death guard going back decades? 

 

Anyway, thanks for explaining; overall i think the studio isn't cartoony - but there are some miniatures which just don't work, and you are right, the obliterators (and several of the daemon engines) really don't :) 

One major reason. I don't care for most of the new Death Guard models is they are top busy. There is little to no negative space which makes them feel, to me, far too cluttered. The obliteraters are just terrible but back to the Death Guard.  I love the 3rd edition metal models, they have excellent character to them but you can work with them. I like the older mono pose for the pure character even if they aren't the most well scaled models. The plague marine pointing with his power fist is still in my top ten of favorites.  The new models just seem like a new artist got hold of the CAD program and was told to push the limits and they went with the most over the top results. It's annoying because if you cut back about half of the extras the models are decent.

[oldhat]

4 hours ago, Dezron said:

 

Daemons, but I feel they will get Militia treatment (Look at whole Chaos range and dare to tell me it's small). 

 

Other is Solar Auxilia moving into plastic. 

 

Third is Blackshields, but again I feel they will get Militia treatment. 

 

That's all armies that I can think of. 

 

Yeah, Daemons are kinda already there with a range to draw from. SA moving to plastic? I have my doubts. Blackshields are already kinda so niche, they wouldn't really be a whole army unto themselves, imo.

 

Very curious what it winds up being.

[Dezron]

If they do 30k Admech it will probably similiar to 30k Legions. 

 

Space Marine Legions have the same foundations, similiar to Admech (split between traitors and heretics is too recent for them to be diffrent enough to split them like 40k Chaos and 40k Imperium).

 

Just replace (insert name) Legion with (insert name) Forgeworld. Add some traitor and loyalist exclusive units/characters and faction is ready. Plus plastic basic kits of course. 

 

 

[Noserenda]

Theyve said its definitely not space marines, hold out blackshields and shattered legions :/ 

[Marshal Mittens]

40k Admech codex, and the main 4 robots having uses in 4 30k factions and maybe 2 40k factions would give them good returns.

[Petitioner's City]

1 hour ago, Brother Sutek said:

One major reason. I don't care for most of the new Death Guard models is they are top busy. There is little to no negative space which makes them feel, to me, far too cluttered. The obliteraters are just terrible but back to the Death Guard.  I love the 3rd edition metal models, they have excellent character to them but you can work with them. I like the older mono pose for the pure character even if they aren't the most well scaled models. The plague marine pointing with his power fist is still in my top ten of favorites.  The new models just seem like a new artist got hold of the CAD program and was told to push the limits and they went with the most over the top results. It's annoying because if you cut back about half of the extras the models are decent.

 

Oh I love the 2nd edition metals (still own a few!), but I still am partial to the death guard by Pastourel. I think Eternal Hunt captured it well when they said the modern Death Guard leaned into a medieval style, which itself connotes to me things like Blanche and Gibbon's art in the 96 Codex Chaos, or the mesh of fantasy and science fiction of the Realms of Chaos books and indeed the 96 Codex.

 

But if you want to you, you can read Maxime's blog about creating them, or if you can find it back in twitch from 2017, an interview with him about designing Mortarion.

[Brofist]

53 minutes ago, Marshal Mittens said:

40k Admech codex, and the main 4 robots having uses in 4 30k factions and maybe 2 40k factions would give them good returns.

 

god I hope not, between not liking those models and how crap robots currently are

[Dezron]

49 minutes ago, Marshal Mittens said:

40k Admech codex, and the main 4 robots having uses in 4 30k factions and maybe 2 40k factions would give them good returns.

 

Understatment, 30k Admech units also usable in 40k.

 

Plus some 40k units (like Skitarii) being usable in 30k could make them tons of money. 

 

Man, I forgot the fact that they said that each new codex will get some new models release alongside them. 

 

I'm like 99% it will be Admech. 

 

1% is betting Imperial Army though, GW already reveled Squats on Aprill Fools Day, anything is possible at this point. 

 

 

[Noserenda]

The whole, glaring problem with assuming the two entirely separate teams will coordinate tightly to promote synergy of course, is they have been fairly notoriously bad at synergy, deliberately bad at synergy even, in the past. If anything, a Ad mech release at the same time makes it less likely to be Mechanicum :D 

There is a very large weathervane to see if thats changed of course, the Indexes at the opening of 10th edition, if the space marine index has integrated all the plastic Heresy release over the last year or so and especially the Knights index with the Lancer, it significantly boosts the odds of a Mechanicum release. I suspect a lot of it will be relegated to a forgeworld compendium again though, and some of the Q&A answers seem to support that.

What might be productive than half the people here picking one faction or just ignoring 3 or 4 obvious choices entirely, which kits would you produce? Say 2 Plastic squads, a Vehicle and some resin upgrades/characters? 

[Dezron]

9 minutes ago, Noserenda said:

What might be productive than half the people here picking one faction or just ignoring 3 or 4 obvious choices entirely, which kits would you produce? Say 2 Plastic squads, a Vehicle and some resin upgrades/characters? 

 

Custodes, Sisters of Silence and Solaris Auxilia are also viable. 

 

Daemons aren't very likely, from what I remember they were like Militia in terms of customizability and they have only got one not-character unit released for long time. 

 

And like I said earlier Dark Admech isn't diffrent enough from regular Admech to need anything more them couple of traitor-only units and characters.  

[Gorgoff]

I my add that they confirmed in the Q&A that demons wikl get a PDF and are not the coming new army. 

[Dezron]

That leaves:

• Custodes
• Sisters of Silence 
• Admech
• Solaris Auxilia 
• Imperial Army

Besides that we have left Knights (unlikely) and... 

 

Titan Legions... (hahaha, yeah right like that would ever happen outside of Epic). 

 

That's all for non-Marine factions. 

Edited May 3, 2023 by Dezron

[spessmarine]

Well, it doesn't say "Mystery new army release" in the roadmap.

The above discussion about the interplay between 40k and 30k is true. There is no guarantee yet of further cross-over, could even step back to inexplicable disconnect of the past between 30k and 40k teams.

 

SoS feels like a real solid contender given the obvious bunch of units they've got added while other people got units pruned in the no models, no rules modus operandi.

[WrathOfTheLion]

Sisters of Silence are a good possibility, although Mechanicum is a significantly popular army. So the guess for something Mechanicum has merit simply on those grounds.

 

Whether those units match up to a 40k army isn't relevant, on similar grounds to using that to dismiss Mechanicum, you can dismiss Sisters of Silence, as the Custodes codex is not too far out either from that timeframe.

Edited May 4, 2023 by WrathOfTheLion

[Noserenda]

3 hours ago, Dezron said:

 

And like I said earlier Dark Admech isn't diffrent enough from regular Admech to need anything more them couple of traitor-only units and characters.  

Thats a super limited view of the Dark Mech's potential, if it was just Mechanicum + daemons we would have seen it years ago, but the fluff text around them, leaks and frequent delays point to something a lot bigger and more interesting, like i said above, Mechanicum at its peak with the brakes off, all kinds of daemonic, xeno and dark age tech doing all kinds of weird things, and the perfect ally to Iron hands gone mad to boot :D 
 

1 hour ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

 

 

Whether those units match up to a 40k army isn't relevant, on similar grounds to using that to dismiss Mechanicum, you can dismiss Sisters of Silence, as the Custodes codex is not too far out either from that timeframe.

Not really, im dismissing the probable cooincidence of Codex Adeptus Mechanicus getting released in the same quarter as evidence of a Mechanicum release. A Custode codex possibly 3 months later is well into cooincidence territory and i dont think anyone is arguing otherwise. 

Though i do hope we get a Knight Centura kit at least if its one of the Codexes just getting a hero & book. :D 

[MegaVolt87]

13 hours ago, Gorgoff said:

I would love to add some Skitarii to my armies but Dark mechanicum cross compatible to 40k sounds like toylike jump over the shark miniatures we see in 40k and I don't like that in general.

 

The HH 2.0 re-launch has basically been a stealth setup for cross selling to 40k players at this point. The emphasis on mk VI, the priority on vehicles and LoW, along with plastic infantry releases being a low priority for a game that has been designed with an infantry focus. I feel I will be vindicated when the 40k 10th Ed SM, mechanicum and knights codexes release, along with the next arc of 40k campaign books. The mk III redesign is for new people who bemone the existing kits as "squat marines". The next armour mark after mk III will certainly be mk IV redesign, just wait and see. 

[Gorgoff]

2 hours ago, MegaVolt87 said:

 

The HH 2.0 re-launch has basically been a stealth setup for cross selling to 40k players at this point. The emphasis on mk VI, the priority on vehicles and LoW, along with plastic infantry releases being a low priority for a game that has been designed with an infantry focus. I feel I will be vindicated when the 40k 10th Ed SM, mechanicum and knights codexes release, along with the next arc of 40k campaign books. The mk III redesign is for new people who bemone the existing kits as "squat marines". The next armour mark after mk III will certainly be mk IV redesign, just wait and see. 

That would be qonderful because in my book MK4 in plastics looked not very good from the beginning. And I like it very much so that would be great.

Like him:

 

Edit: the term "mysterious" army would describe SoS perfectly by the way and they got a lot of new units so that is my new bet.

Edited May 4, 2023 by Gorgoff

[MegaVolt87]

Sisters of Silence would be an interesting twist as the new army. Definitely the one few are expecting. 

[Dezron]

8 hours ago, Noserenda said:

Thats a super limited view of the Dark Mech's potential, if it was just Mechanicum + daemons we would have seen it years ago, but the fluff text around them, leaks and frequent delays point to something a lot bigger and more interesting, like i said above, Mechanicum at its peak with the brakes off, all kinds of daemonic, xeno and dark age tech doing all kinds of weird things, and the perfect ally to Iron hands gone mad to boot :D 

 

Are you sure you're not mixing 30k and 40k Dark Admech together? 

 

Also current Liber Mechanicus has Traitor characters in it. So I really wouldn't hype myself up for big 30k Dark Admech release.